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Why do we have aim assist?

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Dauth Jenkins Ultramarine Corp 53	Posted - 2014.02.18 06:24:00 - [31] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: This isn't a rhetorical question or one that I was just going to answer myself to make a proposition, but seriously why do we have a mechanic that allows rapid fire spray and pray weapons to be deadly accurate? Wouldn't it make more sense to disallow this function and create a natural balance between weapons based on the aiming skill of the player? Because I cant aim worth a damn, and sometimes, a mass driver just isn't good enough. Oh, I use a assault scram rifle, and it is not deadly accurate. And taking off aim assist would just increase the disparity between mouse and keyboard and a controller. If everyone was forced to use a controller, or if everyone was forced to use a mouse and keyboard, then I would be all for it. Sees prototompers... Sees blueberries start to snipe... Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 1244	Posted - 2014.02.18 06:29:00 - [32] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: Because no one can aim? Lol would be hilarious the first week if they removed it... Would be a bunch of Stevie Wonder's with a gun wondering around trying to aim... Seriously though Why not have a *No Aim Assist Weekend Event* and actually see what DUST is like without Bullet Magnetism and Aim Magnetism. Almost EVERYONE who knows or gets explained to what Aim Magnetism and Bullet Magnetism is, Hates the idea the notion and its existence almost INSTANTLY.. Almost EVERYONE including some of the strongest Anti-Aim Assist proponents Agree and praise an Aim Assist focusing around Friction and Mild LDS centering.. or "Snaping" . Aim Friction So If you get your crosshair's roughly over an enemy area, the joystick input gets finer and easier to do the fine aim corrections from say the targets Shoulder, to a head... Allowing DS3 users to have a decent sensitivty option without loosing their fine aiming ability... But Having Aim Magnetism or "Sticky" Aim ... where its actively moving your aim without any input is rewarding players for what? Or Having Bullet Magnetism that will register bullets on target that are slightly off.. So the whole concept of missing a shot over someones shoulder while trying to aim for a head is gone.. Rewarding players for what? I Think players would rather EVERYONE be in the same boat with "Blue Shielding" then what we have.
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 454	Posted - 2014.02.18 06:37:00 - [33] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: So the real reason would be mouse and keyboard. It is because we have mouse and keyboard support. Which would be more of an argument if we were in Chromosome build, but Uprising mouse support made mkb a poor choice for competitive play. That doesn't mean that CCP is happy with mouse/keyboard either. They had an aim assist before, weren't happy with it, pull it, tried messing with m/kb, that didn't work, then they added aim assist back in right? I give CCP credit, they are trying to do something no one has ever done before, blend M/KB users with controller users on an even playing ground. As it is right now, the Mouse and keyboard are still incredibly superior for these types of gameplay: Sniping Forge gunning Shotgunning Tank driving I listed them in order of the most powerful KB/M advantage to the least. Anyway, the worst control scheme right now is PS Move =(..... It can be SO AWESOME too. Seriously, playing a shooting game with the playstation move is like being a kid again, stuff feels more intense and just all around much more fun. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
CUSE TOWN333 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 178	Posted - 2014.02.18 08:44:00 - [34] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: This isn't a rhetorical question or one that I was just going to answer myself to make a proposition, but seriously why do we have a mechanic that allows rapid fire spray and pray weapons to be deadly accurate? Wouldn't it make more sense to disallow this function and create a natural balance between weapons based on the aiming skill of the player? Because in dust unlike other fps games the aiming mechanic is crap. The clever combatant imposes his will on the enemy, but does not allow the enemy"s will to be imposed upon him. Sun Tzu
Altina McAlterson Pure Innocence. EoN. 879	Posted - 2014.02.18 09:11:00 - [35] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: I still haven't gotten an answer to my original question, why? This game didn't have aim assist, then it did, the game functioned fine before aim assist, why was it introduced? So far the only answer I've had is "well because...that's the way it's always been done, console FPS tradition blah blah blah"" I'm not sure I'd go quite that for..."fine" is not one of the words I would use to describe DUST's functionality. Even "functionality" is a bit of a stretch... But as for your question do you mean was there ever a particular event or issue that forced CCP to add Aim Assist? Then no, it was always intended to be in the game and the only reason they would remove it was because it didn't work. Then they would add it back but it still wouldn't work so they'd remove it again etc... Running a blaster tank in ambush is like bringing Anthrax to a pillow fight.
HYENAKILLER X Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 608	Posted - 2014.02.18 09:41:00 - [36] - Quote Reality is these games are pretty hard. And thats beside the fact game issues may hinder. Its so competitive not everyone could keep up. Without aim assist there would be huge skill gaps worse than we already have. Who ever thinks these games are better wuthout aim assist needs to do research. Tanks are for pussies.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 950	Posted - 2014.02.18 09:53:00 - [37] - Quote Jungian wrote: In DUST, the aim assist is not really aim assist. Its pure kill assist. Do the controls like MAG pls, ccp. Dexter307 wrote: Because controllers are not as accurate as a M/KB Aim assist is to make console shooters feel like thier pc counter parts. Aim assist is to make shooters feel like their pc counterparts? Your ignorant statement says alot about how many PC's youve played on with mouse and keyboard: None. Based off what info Your making up things to make an argument Fact: I have played PC shooters Fact: I choose to play console because its what my friends play
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 950	Posted - 2014.02.18 09:57:00 - [38] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Seriously though Why not have a *No Aim Assist Weekend Event* and actually see what DUST is like without Bullet Magnetism and Aim Magnetism. We had this It was called uprising 1.0 It was terrible and everyone complained the game was broken
Aeon Amadi Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4968	Posted - 2014.02.18 10:01:00 - [39] - Quote Trust me. It's not that bad. http://youtu.be/gKKc1LnJ-xA?t=32s Edit: Oh and the "plenty of time to mow you down" is bullshit. It's a fast paced game and they'll have plenty of time to lock on to you before you can shoot them if you're on the reactive. So, yeah, Dust 514 is not nearly that bad and Titanfall has a -LOT- of suspect hit detection. Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
meri jin Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 684	Posted - 2014.02.18 10:32:00 - [40] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: This isn't a rhetorical question or one that I was just going to answer myself to make a proposition, but seriously why do we have a mechanic that allows rapid fire spray and pray weapons to be deadly accurate? Wouldn't it make more sense to disallow this function and create a natural balance between weapons based on the aiming skill of the player? Stop crying please. (Aim Assist) You guys seems to forget something very important My EVE pilot have more ISK then your peon corp.

Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens League of Infamy 579	Posted - 2014.02.18 10:50:00 - [41] - Quote In my opinion, games will have it because you have to balance for skill. Auto-aim lets players who may not be overly familiar with a shooter to still be able to get kills. They feel strong for killing someone, even if auto-aim was turning the shots slightly. People who know the game will still be far more effective because they know the maps, how to flank, areas where the enemy will commonly hide, and know how to engage targets with their current weapon. But aim-assist means that the new player will still get a couple kills on the veterans. They won't have powerful ratio or have kills "as useful" (certain kills ARE more useful to your team at that moment than other; killing defenders at the point and causing a hack is more useful at that moment than killing a couple dudes as they come out of their Redline) as the veterans but they have a way of actually fighting back. You do have to make sure that auto-aim is done carefully though. Obviously you don't want to have a 1 foot leeway/snap-to distance, so it can be hard to get that dial right. In DUST, with native KB/M support, aim-assist is a leveling factor. Back in beta and early release, there were scores of threads about how much better KB/M was. Remove a couple of the bugs like being able to flat out run faster because of KB/M and to cap the turn speed, you have a lot of those complaint threads disappear. Add in auto-aim, something that KB/M doesn't get from my experience, and you have a trade up. Less precision but you get a leeway or more precision but you better be accurate. Just my opinion but I think it holds up.
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 605	Posted - 2014.02.18 11:03:00 - [42] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: Primary reasons would be because of framerate, lag, and hitbox issues. I guess it would make sense to compensate for stuff like this instead of trying to do the math on every bullet that comes out of a gun, but was there really that much of a problem with it in this game before aim assist came out? Precision aiming is hard to do when the very center of your control has a deadspace. The entire reason the mouse was invented was because joysticks had this deadspace in the center. If M/KB was removed from the game so that the deadspace would not be an issue, then the Sticky Aim may be turned off. Yes, what we have is STICKY aim, because it can only be pulled by a target that passes under the reticule, but looses grip after a while even if the target is still in the pull zone. It is not auto anything, which some people still have no clue what the difference is. Auto causes the cursor to preemptively snap to a target, and then pull along for as long as the target is in the pull zone. If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Chuckles Brown 55	Posted - 2014.02.18 11:10:00 - [43] - Quote Enough with this aim assist con garbage. Name a console shooter without it. The Official alt of 8213 Do you pub, brah?
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES 699	Posted - 2014.02.18 11:20:00 - [44] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Komodo Jones wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: Primary reasons would be because of framerate, lag, and hitbox issues. I guess it would make sense to compensate for stuff like this instead of trying to do the math on every bullet that comes out of a gun, but was there really that much of a problem with it in this game before aim assist came out? Precision aiming is hard to do when the very center of your control has a deadspace. The entire reason the mouse was invented was because joysticks had this deadspace in the center. If M/KB was removed from the game so that the deadspace would not be an issue, then the Sticky Aim may be turned off. Yes, what we have is STICKY aim, because it can only be pulled by a target that passes under the reticule, but looses grip after a while even if the target is still in the pull zone. It is not auto anything, which some people still have no clue what the difference is. Auto causes the cursor to preemptively snap to a target, and then pull along for as long as the target is in the pull zone. Then if you guys have sticky aim can we get a normal feel for our KB/M setup? The mouse aim is very sluggish. Not only that there are many bugs with general kb controls including the equipment / squad leader wheel, selecting spawns etc...
Jungian Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 328	Posted - 2014.02.18 11:37:00 - [45] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Jungian wrote: In DUST, the aim assist is not really aim assist. Its pure kill assist. Do the controls like MAG pls, ccp. Dexter307 wrote: Because controllers are not as accurate as a M/KB Aim assist is to make console shooters feel like thier pc counter parts. Aim assist is to make shooters feel like their pc counterparts? Your ignorant statement says alot about how many PC's youve played on with mouse and keyboard: None. Based off what info Your making up things to make an argument Fact: I have played PC shooters Fact: I choose to play console because its what my friends play Its fine that you choose to play what your friends/herd plays. You cant have played many PC shooters if you really stay by your statement which said that aim assist on consoles is to make them feel like their PC shooter counterparts. Aim assist doesnt happen on PC at all in shooters, so how could aim assist with a controller feel at all like playing with a mouse and keyboard on PC? Do you even realize what you said? MAG felt more like a proper PC game actually, and I did not play that with aim assist. http://www.twitch.tv/rnd_jungian/ In New Eden no one can hear you whine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FviNM
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 605	Posted - 2014.02.18 12:09:00 - [46] - Quote Jungian wrote: Do you even realize what you said? MAG felt more like a proper PC game actually, and I did not play that with aim assist. The assist in MAG is on 24/7... If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Scheherazade VII 215	Posted - 2014.02.18 12:18:00 - [47] - Quote Because people like me suck at aiming!
Scheherazade VII 215	Posted - 2014.02.18 12:20:00 - [48] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Jungian wrote: Do you even realize what you said? MAG felt more like a proper PC game actually, and I did not play that with aim assist. The assist in MAG is on 24/7... Just like the servers..... There was no aim assist in MAG even the software developer confirmed it, it was merely speculated by the players to give them more excuses for death. If anything the hit detection was off so it felt like bullets placed slightly to the side of your target were automatically readjusted a fraction in order to hit your opponent. For example just fire the rail from the hip in CQC and you'll notice it, although it's stronger because in DUST there actually is aim assist.
Zirzo Valcyn Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2014.02.18 12:24:00 - [49] - Quote so a later generation of scrubs to the game could rise to the top u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2997	Posted - 2014.02.18 12:35:00 - [50] - Quote Heavy handed aim assist is necessary for a decent experience on controller with this kind of strafe speed. If you don't want people killing you with aim assist, fit dampeners. It effectively turns off anyones aim assist who doesn't have you marked. That gives strafe monkeys options.

Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 3150	Posted - 2014.02.18 13:30:00 - [51] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: This isn't a rhetorical question or one that I was just going to answer myself to make a proposition, but seriously why do we have a mechanic that allows rapid fire spray and pray weapons to be deadly accurate? Wouldn't it make more sense to disallow this function and create a natural balance between weapons based on the aiming skill of the player? Because before we did, it was possible for two scouts to completely use up all their SMG ammo in a dance-off . . . I mean duel. No.
Sgt Buttscratch lcritMYpantS 1690	Posted - 2014.02.18 13:32:00 - [52] - Quote Aim assist and cross hairs removed is a move all shooters should go for. Play Crysis 3 in vet mode then try supersoldier, somuch better not having cross hairs and aim assist. I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
Flix Keptick Red Star. EoN. 3440	Posted - 2014.02.18 13:35:00 - [53] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote: Aim assist is fairly common in console FPS'es. Lol I know, but why, why does it exist and why was it introduced into the game at all? The game existed without it, what was the reason it was put in the game? Because aiming with a tiny joystick isn't the easiest thing ever. The community is the worst thing that ever happened to this game. Tank driver // specialized tank destroyer
sabre prime The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 87	Posted - 2014.02.18 13:51:00 - [54] - Quote Chuckles Brown wrote: Enough with this aim assist con garbage. Name a console shooter without it. Killzone: Shadow Fall (PS4). Desperate attempt to get BPOs
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4513	Posted - 2014.02.18 14:21:00 - [55] - Quote sabre prime wrote: Chuckles Brown wrote: Enough with this aim assist con garbage. Name a console shooter without it. Killzone: Shadow Fall (PS4). I know a couple of the old Killzone games advertised "no aim assist" to emphasise that they were the hardcore shooters compared with the other popular FPS games, but I also know they had aim friction. Not as strong as other FPS games, but it's always been there. I haven't found anything that explicitly states they changed this in Shadow Fall, and it definitely felt like I had aim friction when I was playing a pre-release build at a convention last year. If they really have NO aim assist of ANY kind, I'll be surprised.
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 1609	Posted - 2014.02.18 14:35:00 - [56] - Quote Try Metro: Last Light or Bioshock Infinite without aim assist and compare them to DUST without aim assist. The controls are so smooth and reliable in those two other games that the AA is not really needed. I believe that in DUST the situations is different: unassisted aiming is considerably rougher than these other titles. In DUST the AA serves two roles: firstly, it closes the players skill gap, secondly it masks a poor core FPR mechanic. Bioshock Infinite is using the same engine as DUST, so no excuses there. My feeling is that if we could tighten up and significantly inprove the feel of the controls in DUST we could turn down the AA quite a bit. Also, until KB/M is working better, we really can't justify AA with an input system balancing arguement. I support SP rollover.
Marc Rime 253	Posted - 2014.02.18 14:36:00 - [57] - Quote Because console controllers aren't very accurate.
Yeeeuuuupppp KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 97	Posted - 2014.02.18 14:49:00 - [58] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Try playing BF4...Aim assist in that is really noticeable...... however recoil balances that out.....no recoil in Dust. I keep forgetting about the recoil.. I just hold the button and go "Well **** I forgot that I have to burst fire or I start eventually shooting the sky" My Minnie is friendly.. don't worry, I don't bite. I slash. Novice incubus pilot. Feel the wrath of my troll.
Sgt Buttscratch lcritMYpantS 1690	Posted - 2014.02.18 14:49:00 - [59] - Quote cant aim...blames controller I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 1246	Posted - 2014.02.18 15:19:00 - [60] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Bethhy wrote: Seriously though Why not have a *No Aim Assist Weekend Event* and actually see what DUST is like without Bullet Magnetism and Aim Magnetism. We had this It was called uprising 1.0 It was terrible and everyone complained the game was broken Dont lie.... We had Unlimited Joystck acceleration... That's what made aiming terrible.... And there was no Aim friction... Your crosshairs would repel off target and continue to be slippery, was all over the forums....... instead of having friction that would make it easier for fine control inputs to keep on target.... It was like trying to Aim with a Big wet fish... Dexter you spend more time telling bold face lies about AA, makes me wonder...



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