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For the Love of God. Equipment isn't Getting Nerfed.

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God Hates Lags Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 710	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:09:00 - [1] - Quote Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. Doubles ISK
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 2736	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:11:00 - [2] - Quote Team? I didn't sign up for that. // Venge Captain // Matari Logistics / Scout / Pilot // @ReesNoturana
Mac Dac Wraith Shadow Guards D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 445	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:13:00 - [3] - Quote Well balanced teams? Did you forget Pubs. "We should take care not to make intellect our god; it has, of course, strong muscles, but no personality" Albert Einste
Athena Sentinel SOE Knights Templar 151	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:14:00 - [4] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. Because the CCp guy incharge is call CCP LOGI Bro. I know we need logi and you should be awarded for being logi. But guys top the charts with 1-5kills.
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 654	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:14:00 - [5] - Quote Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. Dropship Specialist Kills- Incubus: 4; Pythons: 2 Gêå1; Other DS: 28 Gêå1; Tanks: 29 Gêå2 1/20
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 8242	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:16:00 - [6] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: Because the CCp guy incharge is call CCP LOGI Bro. I know we need logi and you should be awarded for being logi. But guys top the charts with 1-5kills over guys with like 20-0...which do you think requires more skill to play? And who should be rewarded the most? Logibro is a community rep, not the guy in charge. And come on... Does it really matter who tops the charts? Scoreboards are meaningless. Level 8 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Disturbingly Bored The Strontium Asylum 1460	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:17:00 - [7] - Quote Just a personal thought: No logi should get a bonus to nanohives. Caldari should get get a bonus that allows needles to restore shield HP as well as armor HP on pickup instead. Would make it more interesting, methinks. I used to own the FAT GAT until this --> [ASCII Art removed - *draconian forum overlord* CCP Logibro]
Jackof All-Trades The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 354	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:18:00 - [8] - Quote Yeah, you get your normal equipment... after you maxed out your logi skills \|: sorry, but logis have the most SP intensive jobs already, that's really hard to ask for them to spec to level 5 in their suit to get normal equipment, let alone what happens to the rest of their equipment (logis need to use many pieces of equipment, not just their speciality!) "Pulvis et umbra sums." We are but dust and shadow GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace \ Omni-Specialist / Focus: Gallente
Athena Sentinel SOE Knights Templar 151	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:21:00 - [9] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. OR A decrease in the amount of points if placed within a certain distance of other equipment of the same type... what ever it is - equalize logi with combat styles.
Sgt Buttscratch 1377	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:24:00 - [10] - Quote crazy aint it, people are acting like ccp killed their pet cat, then sodomized its corpse. I think the new changes to logistics are fine tbo I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans

Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 579	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:25:00 - [11] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. And we here from another 'slayer" who can't stand that the number of kills he gets doesn't put him at the top of the board. Anyway, equipment should get a small bonus as you skill into it so dedicated logis that go to level 5 in a piece of equipment get more out of it than a guy with only 1 level in it, just like the guy with level 5 operation gets more out of his exile AR than someone at level 1.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1693	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:26:00 - [12] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. Where are you getting that they can't use all equipment effectively? 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 654	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:26:00 - [13] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: Athena Sentinel wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. And we here from another 'slayer" who can't stand that the number of kills he gets doesn't put him at the top of the board. Anyway, equipment should get a small bonus as you skill into it so dedicated logis that go to level 5 in a piece of equipment get more out of it than a guy with only 1 level in it, just like the guy with level 5 operation gets more out of his exile AR than someone at level 1. This would be acceptable. Dropship Specialist Kills- Incubus: 4; Pythons: 2 Gêå1; Other DS: 28 Gêå1; Tanks: 29 Gêå2 1/20
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1512	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:37:00 - [14] - Quote We should nerf ALL the Weapons' DPS by 25% and give the Assault suit a 25% DPS increase in ONLY their corresponding Racial Rifle. Same with heavies, the Amarr and Gall heavies will have to suck it up and wait. Then we should nerf biotics and electronics mods by 25%, then give each scout a 25% bonus to only 1 of them. THIS IS THE LOGIC YOU ARE SUPPORTING! STOP IT! Yours Truly, Reginald Fizzer94 Delafontaine III, Esquire
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 4112	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:42:00 - [15] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. Gonna have to disagree here, while yes the equipment is being changed this is in no way stopping anyone from using said equipment effectively, some units are better at certain types if logi work than others but it doesn't stop you from doing their jobs. Having bonuses to a suit's gear is a smart move on the DEVs part, it's called specialization for a reason, no suit should be the best at everything, something the current logi suits are at this moment to devastating effects. Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 4 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
Talos Alomar Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1993	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:43:00 - [16] - Quote The proposed fitting bonus to equipment lets logis use better equipment to compensate for any and all changes. Assaults are getting better at killing and equipment is becoming a bit more specialized. Try to kill it all you want CCP, I still <3 my laser.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1696	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:46:00 - [17] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: We should nerf ALL the Weapons' DPS by 25% and give the Assault suit a 25% DPS increase in ONLY their corresponding Racial Rifle. Same with heavies, the Amarr and Gall heavies will have to suck it up and wait. Then we should nerf biotics and electronics mods by 25%, then give each scout a 25% bonus to only 1 of them. THIS IS THE LOGIC YOU ARE SUPPORTING! STOP IT! Well 25% is obviously excessive, but if you wish to continue screaming and throwing a tantrum, I won't stop you. This is actually very much like how it works in EVE, where weapons are kind of awful unless you use the right weapon with the right ship and skill into it. This is working as intended. It encourages you to stick to a particular race for each fit in order to optimize benefits and minimize the built in disadvantages. Put a Laser on a Caldari ship and people will laugh and snowballs at you. Dust should be similar though perhaps not quite to the same extreme. The point being that the game should strongly encourage you to use the right weapons, gear, and equipment that have synergy with each other, while allowing you to use these items outside the intended role, but at a cost. And yes you do raise the point that much of this balancing is difficult when we do not have the racial versions of everything fleshed out quite yet. However, development should move as far as it can in this direction while those racial variants are being introduced as time goes on. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2738	Posted - 2014.01.22 22:48:00 - [18] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. OR A decrease in the amount of points if placed within a certain distance of other equipment of the same type... what ever it is - equalize logi with combat styles. Inactive equipment gives ZERO WPs. It must be used by someone to garner a reward! It's USAGE, not deployment that is rewarded. I can stack six hives, but will only get rewarded for what you need, not what I deploy. "Spamming" doesn't do diddly squat for a Logi. You want to limit Logi rewards? Then carry your own damn equipment and use that! Don't deploy on any uplink you didn't personally deploy and don't run to any hive either. Just stroll on den to the nearest SD, wherever that happens to be. If I'm getting points it's because people want what I'm offering. I'm not for forcing them to benefit from it.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1650	Posted - 2014.01.22 23:07:00 - [19] - Quote Sorry, but it IS getting nerfed. Not as bad as some people say it is, but it's definitely getting nerfed. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor! Forum Warrior lv.1
Nothing Certain Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 60	Posted - 2014.01.22 23:16:00 - [20] - Quote I guess I will wait and see, it looks like the changes might let logis be logis instead of everyone throwing down equipment and doing a half-assed job of it.

Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 551	Posted - 2014.01.22 23:52:00 - [21] - Quote Let's call the equipment less effective not ineffective. We'll do fine with the new equipment. Scanners were broken. Uplinks were way too fast, essentially killing CRUs and MCRUs. Rep tools and nanohives seemed fine but apparently CCP thinks the bonus would be too much. Results are still out on this one.
Athena Sentinel SOE Knights Templar 153	Posted - 2014.01.23 00:18:00 - [22] - Quote Nothing Certain wrote: I guess I will wait and see, it looks like the changes might let logis be logis instead of everyone throwing down equipment and doing a half-assed job of it. ^ This is so true. Its half-assed because it is very easy. Noobs love it and defend it because they would be baddies without the easy points. Easy fix - set up 2-3 copy suits add the different equipment changes suits at a SD as you drop spawn point and nano hivers...supply yourself team just like the logi. AND the added bonus of not being nano injected just to die again because 90% of logi are noobs or baddies that can't cut it in combat.
Athena Sentinel SOE Knights Templar 153	Posted - 2014.01.23 00:22:00 - [23] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: Athena Sentinel wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. And we hear from another 'slayer" who can't stand that the number of kills he gets doesn't put him at the top of the board. Sorry you don't think putting uplinks in places they don't get destroyed or spawn people into killing fields isn't important, but it often is more important to winning a game than your gun game. Anyway, equipment should get a small bonus as you skill into it so dedicated logis that go to level 5 in a piece of equipment get more out of it than a guy with only 1 level in it, just like the guy with level 5 operation gets more out of his exile AR than someone at level 1. You already get increase use from your equipment as you ugrade it. It lasts longer supplies more people and give you more points. Are you even a logi or just a troll?
Seigfried Warheit 126	Posted - 2014.01.23 00:23:00 - [24] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. Where are you getting that they can't use all equipment effectively? With the super omega nerf to equipment you cant throw the equipment down unless your that race apparently...
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 582	Posted - 2014.01.23 00:41:00 - [25] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: Zahle Undt wrote: Athena Sentinel wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. A. "combat" suits have bonus to only one weapon type. So yes they are effective with only one weapon type. B. They can only use one weapon at a time. equipment needs a nerf - there should maybe be a max allowed on the field. Or a decrease in the amount of points you get for usng equipment that is not active aka droping spawn points and nano hives. And we hear from another 'slayer" who can't stand that the number of kills he gets doesn't put him at the top of the board. Sorry you don't think putting uplinks in places they don't get destroyed or spawn people into killing fields isn't important, but it often is more important to winning a game than your gun game. Anyway, equipment should get a small bonus as you skill into it so dedicated logis that go to level 5 in a piece of equipment get more out of it than a guy with only 1 level in it, just like the guy with level 5 operation gets more out of his exile AR than someone at level 1. You already get increase use from your equipment as you ugrade it. It lasts longer supplies more people and give you more points. Are you even a logi or just a troll? Yeah I've been playing logi for a year and a half now in this game. Skilling into equipment lets you use better equipment only it does not improve your usage of that equipment. If I have level 1 or level 5 in nano circuitry my regular nanohives spit out the same amount of ammo at the same rate. If I have level 5 in AR operation my assault rifle has 25% less dispersion whether it is a Duvolle proto or an Exile BPO. See the difference there? What I and others are suggesting is that equipment get some sort of bonus tied to skill. For example: 3% per level to supply limit tied to nanocircuitry would mean if you fully skill into them all your nanohives last 15% longer whether they are standard or allotek proto. Most non logis are not going to spend the skill points if they aren't going to realy use the equipment and the only people I know who are fully skilled into all equipment are logibros so this would still differentiate the classes.
mollerz Minja Scouts 2084	Posted - 2014.01.23 00:42:00 - [26] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful) lolz You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
Talos Alomar Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1995	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:21:00 - [27] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: Yeah I've been playing logi for a year and a half now in this game. Skilling into equipment lets you use better equipment only it does not improve your usage of that equipment. If I have level 1 or level 5 in nano circuitry my regular nanohives spit out the same amount of ammo at the same rate. If I have level 5 in AR operation my assault rifle has 25% less dispersion whether it is a Duvolle proto or an Exile BPO. See the difference there? What I and others are suggesting is that equipment get some sort of bonus tied to skill. For example: 3% per level to supply limit tied to nanocircuitry would mean if you fully skill into them all your nanohives last 15% longer whether they are standard or allotek proto. Most non logis are not going to spend the skill points if they aren't going to realy use the equipment and the only people I know who are fully skilled into all equipment are logibros so this would still differentiate the classes. I use uplinks on every single logi fit I have. Heavily used skills like that should make you want to skill into them more for any sort of bonus, but I only have my uplink skill at 3 because I only need the r-9's. It's the same for every single other piece of equipment. Try to kill it all you want CCP, I still <3 my laser.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1710	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:14:00 - [28] - Quote Seigfried Warheit wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. Where are you getting that they can't use all equipment effectively? With the super omega nerf to equipment you cant throw the equipment down unless your that race apparently... Seems you're incredibly misinformed. All logistics get a massive reduction in the fitting cost of equipment, allowing them to use any equipment easily. Effectiveness of equipment is being reduced. Racial bonuses are boosting specific pieces of equipment back up to previous values +. You're perfectly capable of using a repair tool as an Amarr Logistics, but you just won't be as good as a Minmatar Logistics with it. Just like like the Minmatar Logistics can use the uplink, but not as well as the Amarr Logistics. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 977	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:35:00 - [29] - Quote Logis do need more racial equipment but I do believe people are blowing this out of proportion. Currently, everyone has capabilities with equipment other than actually fitting them on their specific suit. No one's complaining yet shouldn't the logis get a bonus in their racial equipment that makes it even better? If they keep the nerf the way it is for 1.8, the major thing happening is that everyone, except Logis, will be using all of the equipment with the same capabilities. Logis will pretty much be at the same capabilities they are right now with their racial equipment. Essentially, everyone's used to having their equipment work better than what the nerf is suggesting so they're not standing for it. There's no game-breaking concepts going down and in fact, in the long run this could help the game by stopping players from abusing certain mechanics(ex: grenade spamming with a nanohive). Again, I do believe logis need more racial equipment that they're the best at but they can still use other race's equipment for their own. Essentially, the whole game is getting a "nerf" with the equipment so I fail to see a clear argument outside of the lack of racial equipment thing. You'll be able to do your logi duties on the same level as other racial logis, like you currently can do, but you will be specialized in something. But bleh. If you ask a new logi who came in after 1.8 released about the change, it wouldn't matter that much to them. Not because they don't care but because they wouldn't feel the UP-ness that logis are complaining will happen. :/ I'm still gonna need you to supply me with ammo no matter if you're wearing a yellow Caldari medium frame or not. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5858	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:41:00 - [30] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: We should nerf ALL the Weapons' DPS by 25% and give the Assault suit a 25% DPS increase in ONLY their corresponding Racial Rifle. Same with heavies, the Amarr and Gall heavies will have to suck it up and wait. Then we should nerf biotics and electronics mods by 25%, then give each scout a 25% bonus to only 1 of them. THIS IS THE LOGIC YOU ARE SUPPORTING! STOP IT! Yeah only that DPS reduction affects every single unit that tries to use it with the exception of the unit that gets a bonus to it. Isn't that what logis wanted? To be the best units at using equipment? Now you got it without equipment becoming absurdly OP. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos

Johnny Guilt Algintal Core 456	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:41:00 - [31] - Quote Has anyone complained about logis spamming too many reps? If you have im sorry ,i shouldnt have repped you and just left you to die. A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1658	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:43:00 - [32] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: Has anyone complained about logis spamming too many reps? If you have im sorry ,i shouldnt have repped you and just left you to die. Yeah, of all the equipment nerfs, the change to the rep tool, specifically the range, makes the least amount of sense to me. I never used the core focused much already, I definitely won't once 1.8 hits. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor! Forum Warrior lv.1
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1710	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:46:00 - [33] - Quote The nerf effectively makes it so Logistics are the BEST at using equipment, it raises their value as support units over an Assault or Scout dropping equipment. The equipment specific bonus is to give every race's logi suit a specific benefit and make all 4 of them valuable in a unique way. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 1021	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:52:00 - [34] - Quote I lost track of the equipment stats thread. Can someone please link it for me? As to the "Eq nerf"... Meh. The only thing I was really concerned about was the compact nano and the allotek nano, since those are the only two I really use a lot. The compact wasn't even effected, if it had been, I would have been p***ed, lonewolf's best friend. The hit to the allotek just means that I'll have to start hiding my alloteks, like I do my compacts, from you little leaches. 48 x3 clusters is plenty enough for me. My proto scout is one thirsty sucker sometimes. {:)}{3GÇó>
Ku Shala Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 787	Posted - 2014.01.23 17:58:00 - [35] - Quote (deep breath for run on sentence)well 15 seconds after you get head shotted and you wait 14 seconds to spawn in only to have the enemy destroy your links and the single logi playing the map has to travel 600m to put a link that takes 15 more seconds to spawn in on then the assaults and heavys will be pouring tears all over the forum because the wont be able to spawn a vehicle to go the 600m to the fight because of the 6 tanks driving around(long exhale) SooNGäó 2B LogiH0B0 with a RR Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Apply today! The States Necromancer Caldari Loyalist Unite
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 4105	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:03:00 - [36] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. ??? Amarr Assault Bonus?
ReGnYuM Escrow Removal and Acquisition 1959	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:11:00 - [37] - Quote Logi Reaction to 1.8 equipment adjustment once again proves that the Logi role is the most selfish and entitled. Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset I Slay, for thy Empress Do you even PC... Brah
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 672	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:11:00 - [38] - Quote Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis.
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 672	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:15:00 - [39] - Quote ReGnYuM wrote: Logi Reaction to 1.8 equipment adjustment once again proves that the Logi role is the most selfish and entitled. Nothing selfish about blowing up supply depots so logis can't refill their nanohives that everyone seems to deplete in .1 second so he has to run around useless.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1711	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:15:00 - [40] - Quote RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP

Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 977	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:20:00 - [41] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1713	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:22:00 - [42] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. People just want to be good at everything, and they shouldn't be allowed to. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
NextDark Knight Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 144	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:34:00 - [43] - Quote Also, Will we be able to deploy supply depots? Forge Changes needed Officer Splash 3.0, Proto 2.7 Advanced 2.5 Standard 2.1. Original ROF needs to return!
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1713	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:41:00 - [44] - Quote NextDark Knight wrote: Also, Will we be able to deploy supply depots? Hopefully eventually, not in 1.8 though. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
THE GREY CARDINAL PSU GHOST SYNDICATE DARKSTAR ARMY 454	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:46:00 - [45] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: And who should be rewarded the most? The one's facilitating your pew pew with health, ammo and direct redeployment into battle. Electronic Warfare GOD in the making Proud Minmatar
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 672	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:57:00 - [46] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. It's not about being more effective. I have no idea how the game will play, but the question is if logis are really valuable compared to an extra gunplayer on the battlefield if assaults can take care of themselves and heavies can just be safe in a location after some hives are deployed. The value given between a support suit and battle suit seems even more biased to bringing firepower (and spam equipment and forgot about it).
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 1116	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:00:00 - [47] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Forcing logistics into making only one equipment effectively usable is like making assaults and commandos only able to use one type of weapon effectively. All logis need to be able to use all equipment effectively with bonuses to a specific one. Equipment usage was fine (aside from the scanner) and there was no need for nerfs. fail post.
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 1116	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:00:00 - [48] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. yeah, that one in particular is nonsensical.
ugg reset Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 450	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:06:00 - [49] - Quote Disturbingly Bored wrote: Just a personal thought: No logi should get a bonus to nanohives. Caldari should get get a bonus that allows needles to restore shield HP as well as armor HP on pickup instead. Would make it more interesting, methinks. better question, what does shield and armor regen stop when when you get dropped and then star up again? you would think it would be contestant regardless of the clones state. Thr33 is the magic number.
ugg reset Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 450	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:07:00 - [50] - Quote Sgt Buttscratch wrote: crazy aint it, people are acting like ccp killed their pet cat, then sodomized its corpse. I think the new changes to logistics are fine tbo yeah, that is something a scout would say Thr33 is the magic number.

DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 10294	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:08:00 - [51] - Quote If there's a respec, then you're kind of right. If not, then it's a nerf to everyone who doesn't use the particular suit that benefits their particular equipment. Videos / Fiction Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1713	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:25:00 - [52] - Quote RKKR wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. It's not about being more effective. I have no idea how the game will play, but the question is if logis are really valuable compared to an extra gunplayer on the battlefield if assaults can take care of themselves and heavies can just be safe in a location after some hives are deployed. The value given between a support suit and battle suit seems even more biased to bringing firepower (and spam equipment and forgot about it). But you also assume that the logi has no capacity to fight, which isn't true. A logi is trading slightly increased support effectiveness for slightly decreased combat effectiveness. The reverse it true for assaults, with slightly increased combat effectiveness for slightly decreased support effectiveness. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation Legacy Rising 77	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:39:00 - [53] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. 10/10 troll for making me reply. So you dont think having to invest 7.5 million sp in all the Logi suits to use equipment properly is a not a nerf. Sure when they make it so only a Proto assault gallente could use a AR, Proto assault caladari can use a Rail rifle, Proto assault amarr can use a scrambler rifle and proto assault Winmatar can use a Combat rifle come back and talk to me. Tell me how great it is to have every weapon that isn't racial crap. That if you want to use any weapon you have to specced into that suit full freaking proto just to use it at the same level as it is now. If you're Amarr and you like the Rail rifle, oops too bad, better spend 2.5 million SP on a caldari suit. On top of the SP for the rail rifle. And if you a logi and like droping uplings, well too bad if you didn't spend 2.5 million SP on an amarr logis suit. And until you drop 2.5 million on the other suits thats the only thing you can do competently. I can max grind about 300k a week. I'd have to grind out for 6 months just to use 3 pieces of equipment properly. Thats without the equipment SP of course. Thats a crippling blow. Losing the tactical advantage in 3 out of 4 things essential to being a logi because RACE is the Mjolnir of nerf hammers. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 672	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:45:00 - [54] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: RKKR wrote: Don't be suprised that you see more assaults on the field that each carries a different item to replace logis. Except they'll be dealing with higher fitting costs and their equipment will never be as good as a Logi doing the same thing. This. People are continuously trying to throw invalid arguments against the nerf but I haven't met any that made real sense. It's not about being more effective. I have no idea how the game will play, but the question is if logis are really valuable compared to an extra gunplayer on the battlefield if assaults can take care of themselves and heavies can just be safe in a location after some hives are deployed. The value given between a support suit and battle suit seems even more biased to bringing firepower (and spam equipment and forgot about it). But you also assume that the logi has no capacity to fight, which isn't true. A logi is trading slightly increased support effectiveness for slightly decreased combat effectiveness. The reverse it true for assaults, with slightly increased combat effectiveness for slightly decreased support effectiveness. I don't assume that...I'm just saying that the assault role will probably more valuable on the battlefield, how many logis do you see helping their team out now? Hell we even got someone claiming logis are the most selfish suits around... How will this improve if only 1 equipment will be as effective as now and the rest is different? I'm not saying logis will be completely useless, but why should I bring one? Even now I'm twirling around with my fingers because there is nothing to do or I'm out of hives,.... Spam equipment and forgot about it to focus on gunplay is still going to be the way to go to be competitive. I wisheid it was different, but I guess I can't be too entitled
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1713	Posted - 2014.01.23 20:01:00 - [55] - Quote Well don't throw all logis into the same equipment spam filled boat. I think the "pure support" logis are bad logis. They should be just as active as any assault, albeit more cautious and indirect, when it comes to actual combat. It shouldn't be just about "drop uplinks and print money", it should be about being able to carry higher level equipment and more of it, so the assaults can focus their fitting resources more on combat and less on carrying around equipment. Remember, we don't know if they're changing the resources on Assault suits...trying to carry decent equipment could make an assault suffer quite a bit, making Logistics far more valuable than you might think. In the end we'll have to see where the cards fall, but I wouldn't count the usefulness of the Logi suit out just yet. 1.8 Sentinels Damage Efficiency Effective HP
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1684	Posted - 2014.01.23 20:20:00 - [56] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. Because the CCp guy incharge is call CCP LOGI Bro. I know we need logi and you should be awarded for being logi. But guys top the charts with 1-5kills just spam droping spawn points randomly (spawn farming) over guys with like 20-0...which do you think requires more skill to play? And who should be rewarded the most? Somebody already complained that Logis get more WP than they do. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 672	Posted - 2014.01.23 22:45:00 - [57] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Well don't throw all logis into the same equipment spam filled boat. I think the "pure support" logis are bad logis. They should be just as active as any assault, albeit more cautious and indirect, when it comes to actual combat. It shouldn't be just about "drop uplinks and print money", it should be about being able to carry higher level equipment and more of it, so the assaults can focus their fitting resources more on combat and less on carrying around equipment. Remember, we don't know if they're changing the resources on Assault suits...trying to carry decent equipment could make an assault suffer quite a bit, making Logistics far more valuable than you might think. In the end we'll have to see where the cards fall, but I wouldn't count the usefulness of the Logi suit out just yet. Yes and don't worry I'm not throwing them in the same boat, but it just looks like that kind of gameplay is still being promoted.
Jake Bloodworth Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 286	Posted - 2014.01.23 22:52:00 - [58] - Quote The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums...
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation Legacy Rising 77	Posted - 2014.01.23 23:18:00 - [59] - Quote Jake Bloodworth wrote: The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums... 3 out of four items used by logis nerfed to **** because race. Youre not gonna be looking for a logi, you'll be b1tch1ing why is there no Amarr Logi with 3 second uplinks? Why is there no Minmatar Logi with decent reps (the reps you are enjoying right now)? Why is there no Caldari Logi with Hives? Scans...well its a crap bonus anyways. That logibro who was doing all of that right now, risking quite a bit of ISK and investing a ton of SP into, now cant hardly do any. You can choose between 3 of the following bonuses: low reps, low ammo, fighting blind, or waiting 12 seconds to spawn. Because race. Also because CPM frigging fought for it. Amazing that whatever SP equipment skill tree you dump 1 million+ SP into will be meaningless unless you dump another 2.5 million into that racial suit. But thats by OP logic and yours, balanced, of course. Spawn pads will rule in PC so expect a lot of slayer amarr logis. Cant beat a frigging 9 second spawn time advantage to that. Thats dying 4 times and respawning compared to uplinks dropped by any and all other suits in the game. Probably then reps because its the most practical career logi wise in terms of WP and saving friendlies in pubs, then hives then scans. Its not a system for rewarding you for sticking with 1 suit. Its a system punishing you for not using all 4. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
gbghg L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 4400	Posted - 2014.01.23 23:42:00 - [60] - Quote Athena Sentinel wrote: God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. Because the CCp guy incharge is call CCP LOGI Bro. I know we need logi and you should be awarded for being logi. But guys top the charts with 1-5kills just spam droping spawn points randomly (spawn farming) over guys with like 20-0...which do you think requires more skill to play? And who should be rewarded the most? i would put forth that he who enabled his team the most by ensuring relevant spawns should be compensated the most as his actions had the biggest effect on the battlefield. Lv 4 forum warrior Bringer of Bacon Knight of AMV's

Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 980	Posted - 2014.01.23 23:45:00 - [61] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. 10/10 troll for making me reply. So you dont think having to invest 7.5 million sp in all the Logi suits to use equipment properly is a not a nerf. Sure when they make it so only a Proto assault gallente could use a AR, Proto assault caladari can use a Rail rifle, Proto assault amarr can use a scrambler rifle and proto assault Winmatar can use a Combat rifle come back and talk to me. Tell me how great it is to have every weapon that isn't racial crap. That if you want to use any weapon you have to specced into that suit full freaking proto just to use it at the same level as it is now. If you're Amarr and you like the Rail rifle, oops too bad, better spend 2.5 million SP on a caldari suit. On top of the SP for the rail rifle. And if you a logi and like droping uplings, well too bad if you didn't spend 2.5 million SP on an amarr logis suit. And until you drop 2.5 million on the other suits thats the only thing you can do competently. I can max grind about 300k a week. I'd have to grind out for 6 months just to use 3 pieces of equipment properly. Thats without the equipment SP of course. Thats a crippling blow. Losing the tactical advantage in 3 out of 4 things essential to being a logi because RACE is the Mjolnir of nerf hammers. :/ Stepping in here. Hey! Well for starters, you will be able to properly use all of the equipment from the get go...You're looking at the nerf as a punishment instead of the re-balancing it is. Most classes(counting those with equipment slots) currently have the potential to use each equipment to the same effective level. In 1.8 this will not be the case, if the stats remain true from now. Come the update, everyone except the logis will be able to use equipment at the same level, while the logis are able to use a single piece of equipment better than the others. This doesn't mean you have to go out and get each suit. It means quite the opposite. You find your preferred logistics equipment and stick to it's race. The only issue Logis are having is that their equipment is getting nerf to a new standard despite the fact that Logis will still be better at it than other classes. There's no sense in "But the Logi will be useless since other classes can use equipment" or "Logis will die out because they're ineffective compared to other classes." because the only bonus of the Logi we had for equipment was extra equipment slots. No bonuses towards specific equipment or nothing. I essentially could work as effectively on support as my Logi counterpart if I used uplinks on my scout, or nanohives on my assaults aside from having only one slot. We're not hearing any QQing about this despite the fact that pretty much anybody can do a Logi's job as long as they have 1 equipment slot yet people decide that 1.8 is the time to QQ about Logis becoming ineffective when they're actually getting a bonus that will make them more effective at supporting than what others think. I would also argue that comparing assaults and their weapons with logis and equipment isn't a good argument. The only weapon bonus we had was for the Amarr's ScR and that's probably going to go. Everything else was fitting bonuses for them. Add on top of that, that you don't really need an assault suit currently for the best usage of the weapon and that argument is down right silly. Let's not forget that the Gal Logi and Cal Logi are considered better slayers than the actual assaults...In 1.8 Assaults won't be the best at using weapons anyway :/, it will be the Commandos. I haven't seen a mass QQ about this yet because it seems pretty fair. Again, you're just presenting an argument that don't holds no water. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 980	Posted - 2014.01.23 23:50:00 - [62] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Jake Bloodworth wrote: The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums... 3 out of four items used by logis nerfed to because race. Youre not gonna be looking for a logi, you'll be b1tch1ing why is there no Amarr Logi with 3 second uplinks? Why is there no Minmatar Logi with decent reps (the reps you are enjoying right now)? Why is there no Caldari Logi with Hives? Scans...well its a crap bonus anyways. That logibro who was doing all of that right now, risking quite a bit of ISK and investing a ton of SP into, now cant hardly do any. You can choose between 3 of the following bonuses: low reps, low ammo, fighting blind, or waiting 12 seconds to spawn. Because race. Also because CPM frigging fought for it. Amazing that whatever SP equipment skill tree you dump 1 million+ SP into will be meaningless unless you dump another 2.5 million into that racial suit. But thats by OP logic and yours, balanced, of course. Spawn pads will rule in PC so expect a lot of slayer amarr logis. Cant beat a frigging 9 second spawn time advantage to that. Thats dying 4 times and respawning compared to uplinks dropped by any and all other suits in the game. Probably then reps because its the most practical career logi wise in terms of WP and saving friendlies in pubs, then hives then scans. Its not a system for rewarding you for sticking with 1 suit. Its a system punishing you for not using all 4. Ugh. That's the ******* issue with all of this. You guys are so damn fixated on what we have now in terms of stats. If they change the stats for 1.8, everything will be the same outside of stats EXCEPT that the logi will be able to boost the capability of a certain type of equipment. HTFU. We'll still need ammo from you guys and reps and scans and then some. The fact that you guys will be able do it better than us means that we will more than likely be looking for you ANYWAY. Just Ugh. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1304	Posted - 2014.01.23 23:55:00 - [63] - Quote I'd be cool with the logi and equipment changes if they'd nerf all the rifles and give each assault a racial bonus to their races weapon. In my opinion making equipment suck for everyone except logis is one thing but making each logi suck less at only one type of equipment severely limits the logis support role. Why even give me 4 equipment slots if I'm only good at one thing, I'll just stack better weapons, armor plates, and damage mods. If they nerfed every rifle to the point that they were only useful by each races assault suit there would be an uproar. Where is my Gallente sidearm? 1.8? When is that? SoonGäó514
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 36	Posted - 2014.01.24 00:12:00 - [64] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful). If you're referring to Nanocircuitry I wholeheartedly disagree. Your forge gunners and mostly everyone will thank you for having ammo, and in key locations triage hives are vital. Let's not forget the 80% needle
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 980	Posted - 2014.01.24 00:31:00 - [65] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: I'd be cool with the logi and equipment changes if they'd nerf all the rifles and give each assault a racial bonus to their races weapon. In my opinion making equipment suck for everyone except logis is one thing but making each logi suck less at only one type of equipment severely limits the logis support role. Why even give me 4 equipment slots if I'm only good at one thing, I'll just stack better weapons, armor plates, and damage mods. If they nerfed every rifle to the point that they were only useful by each races assault suit there would be an uproar. Essentially Commandos are getting bonuses for rifles. If you want the best DPS you need them. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation Legacy Rising 77	Posted - 2014.01.24 00:53:00 - [66] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: Jake Bloodworth wrote: The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums... 3 out of four items used by logis nerfed to because race. Youre not gonna be looking for a logi, you'll be b1tch1ing why is there no Amarr Logi with 3 second uplinks? Why is there no Minmatar Logi with decent reps (the reps you are enjoying right now)? Why is there no Caldari Logi with Hives? Scans...well its a crap bonus anyways. That logibro who was doing all of that right now, risking quite a bit of ISK and investing a ton of SP into, now cant hardly do any. You can choose between 3 of the following bonuses: low reps, low ammo, fighting blind, or waiting 12 seconds to spawn. Because race. Also because CPM frigging fought for it. Amazing that whatever SP equipment skill tree you dump 1 million+ SP into will be meaningless unless you dump another 2.5 million into that racial suit. But thats by OP logic and yours, balanced, of course. Spawn pads will rule in PC so expect a lot of slayer amarr logis. Cant beat a frigging 9 second spawn time advantage to that. Thats dying 4 times and respawning compared to uplinks dropped by any and all other suits in the game. Probably then reps because its the most practical career logi wise in terms of WP and saving friendlies in pubs, then hives then scans. Its not a system for rewarding you for sticking with 1 suit. Its a system punishing you for not using all 4. Ugh. That's the ***** issue with all of this. You guys are so damn fixated on what we have now in terms of stats. If they change the stats for 1.8, everything will be the same outside of stats EXCEPT that the logi will be able to boost the capability of a certain type of equipment. HTFU. We'll still need ammo from you guys and reps and scans and then some. The fact that you guys will be able do it better than us means that we will more than likely be looking for you ANYWAY. Just Ugh. The idea you are skipping over is that only one logi suit will be able to do one of these things well, the other three logi suits will not. I have a proto minmatar logi. As of the stats released so far, my uplinks, hives and scans are all going to be nerfed, my rep tool is going to struggle to stay the same, and my hacking bonus is removed. All of my invested SP in equipment has gone Poof because Race. I have to select 1 task to do well and throw the rest in the bin. If they had instead changed the stats so every light weapon is nerfed except for the suit you are proto in and left equipment alone, would i just be as right in saying "HTFU you can still shoot people but to use any weapon you want means spending 2.5 million for a Pro assault suit. For each Race." Just to show how much it kills diversity, every single logi will be represented by one piece of equipment. Everyone who see mes will know right away my uplinks, hives and scans are **, proto level or not The only thing i can do so far to change that is to go proto in every logi suit. Because Race. Thats BS. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 981	Posted - 2014.01.24 00:59:00 - [67] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: Jake Bloodworth wrote: The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums... 3 out of four items used by logis nerfed to because race. Youre not gonna be looking for a logi, you'll be b1tch1ing why is there no Amarr Logi with 3 second uplinks? Why is there no Minmatar Logi with decent reps (the reps you are enjoying right now)? Why is there no Caldari Logi with Hives? Scans...well its a crap bonus anyways. That logibro who was doing all of that right now, risking quite a bit of ISK and investing a ton of SP into, now cant hardly do any. You can choose between 3 of the following bonuses: low reps, low ammo, fighting blind, or waiting 12 seconds to spawn. Because race. Also because CPM frigging fought for it. Amazing that whatever SP equipment skill tree you dump 1 million+ SP into will be meaningless unless you dump another 2.5 million into that racial suit. But thats by OP logic and yours, balanced, of course. Spawn pads will rule in PC so expect a lot of slayer amarr logis. Cant beat a frigging 9 second spawn time advantage to that. Thats dying 4 times and respawning compared to uplinks dropped by any and all other suits in the game. Probably then reps because its the most practical career logi wise in terms of WP and saving friendlies in pubs, then hives then scans. Its not a system for rewarding you for sticking with 1 suit. Its a system punishing you for not using all 4. Ugh. That's the ***** issue with all of this. You guys are so damn fixated on what we have now in terms of stats. If they change the stats for 1.8, everything will be the same outside of stats EXCEPT that the logi will be able to boost the capability of a certain type of equipment. HTFU. We'll still need ammo from you guys and reps and scans and then some. The fact that you guys will be able do it better than us means that we will more than likely be looking for you ANYWAY. Just Ugh. The idea you are skipping over is that only one logi suit will be able to do one of these things well, the other three logi suits will not. I have a proto minmatar logi. As of the stats released so far, my uplinks, hives and scans are all going to be nerfed, my rep tool is going to struggle to stay the same, and my hacking bonus is removed. All of my invested SP in equipment has gone Poof because Race. I have to select 1 task to do well and throw the rest in the bin. If they had instead changed the stats so every light weapon is nerfed except for the suit you are proto in and left equipment alone, would i just be as right in saying "HTFU you can still shoot people but to use any weapon you want means spending 2.5 million for a Pro assault suit. For each Race." Just to show how much it kills diversity, every single logi will be represented by one piece of equipment. Everyone who see mes will know right away my uplinks, hives and scans are , proto level or not The only thing i can do so far to change that is to go proto in every logi suit. Because Race. Thats BS. You fail to understand that everyone will be at the same level. The QQ about equipment being ** is only in comparison to current stats. When these stats hit they will be the normal equipment stats... The bonuses will be the boosted stats. Stop trying to compare the two instead of comparing the balances. Again. I will still need a Logi. You as a logo can support a specific kind of equipment better. I won't be bitter that we won't have the old stats. Idc as long as I'm restocked. :I. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation Legacy Rising 77	Posted - 2014.01.24 01:09:00 - [68] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: God Hates Lags wrote: Amarr Logis can still drop 3 second uplinks. Caldari Logis can still drop many long lasting amma/rep hives Gallente Logi can still scan down anything other than a Gallente Scout or a cloaked scout of any other variety. Minmatar Logi can still lay down 160 reps per second on a heavy from 40 meters away. It's just that now no SINGLE logi can do all those things. Now every Logi is important (except maybe Caldari, they're not all that useful), every logi is essential. No more domination by the gallante or minmatar logi. This is fair. The only true nerf to equipment was the scanner, which, let's face it - constant 360 degree scans was never working as intended. Other than that equipment stats WITH THE LOGI BONUSES are more or less the same. All of the changes are reasonable and make sense, except for perhaps the rep tool range nerf which was unnecessary, but the repair rate makes sense. Welcome to the new order of Logis. You're important, but you're on a team, no just with the people you support but with your fellow logis as well. This is now a heavily team reliant game. Having a well balanced team is essential. 10/10 troll for making me reply. So you dont think having to invest 7.5 million sp in all the Logi suits to use equipment properly is a not a nerf. Sure when they make it so only a Proto assault gallente could use a AR, Proto assault caladari can use a Rail rifle, Proto assault amarr can use a scrambler rifle and proto assault Winmatar can use a Combat rifle come back and talk to me. Tell me how great it is to have every weapon that isn't racial crap. That if you want to use any weapon you have to specced into that suit full freaking proto just to use it at the same level as it is now. If you're Amarr and you like the Rail rifle, oops too bad, better spend 2.5 million SP on a caldari suit. On top of the SP for the rail rifle. And if you a logi and like droping uplings, well too bad if you didn't spend 2.5 million SP on an amarr logis suit. And until you drop 2.5 million on the other suits thats the only thing you can do competently. I can max grind about 300k a week. I'd have to grind out for 6 months just to use 3 pieces of equipment properly. Thats without the equipment SP of course. Thats a crippling blow. Losing the tactical advantage in 3 out of 4 things essential to being a logi because RACE is the Mjolnir of nerf hammers. :/ Stepping in here. Hey! Well for starters, you will be able to properly use all of the equipment from the get go...You're looking at the nerf as a punishment instead of the re-balancing it is. Most classes(counting those with equipment slots) currently have the potential to use each equipment to the same effective level. In 1.8 this will not be the case, if the stats remain true from now. Come the update, everyone except the logis will be able to use equipment at the same level, while the logis are able to use a single piece of equipment better than the others. This doesn't mean you have to go out and get each suit. It means quite the opposite. You find your preferred logistics equipment and stick to it's race. The only issue Logis are having is that their equipment is getting nerf to a new standard despite the fact that Logis will still be better at it than other classes. There's no sense in "But the Logi will be useless since other classes can use equipment" or "Logis will die out because they're ineffective compared to other classes." because the only bonus of the Logi we had for equipment was extra equipment slots. No bonuses towards specific equipment or nothing. I essentially could work as effectively on support as my Logi counterpart if I used uplinks on my scout, or nanohives on my assaults aside from having only one slot. We're not hearing any QQing about this despite the fact that pretty much anybody can do a Logi's job as long as they have 1 equipment slot yet people decide that 1.8 is the time to QQ about Logis becoming ineffective when they're actually getting a bonus that will make them more effective at supporting than what others think. I would also argue that comparing assaults and their weapons with logis and equipment isn't a good argument. The only weapon bonus we had was for the Amarr's ScR and that's probably going to go. Everything else was fitting bonuses for them. Add on top of that, that you don't really need an assault suit currently for the best usage of the weapon and that argument is down right silly. Let's not forget that the Gal Logi and Cal Logi are considered better slayers than the actual assaults...In 1.8 Assaults won't be the best at using weapons anyway :/, it will be the Commandos. I haven't seen a mass QQ about this yet because it seems pretty fair. Again, you're just presenting an argument that don't holds no water. Sorry but it seems you haven't been following the changes to equipment. Plus if you think anybody can do a logis job with just 1 equipment slot....wow. Try sticking someone with a neddle, repping them, scanning the area clear and dropping a hive with one slot. Anyways, No i will not be able to properly use all of the equipment because they are all getting a blanket nerf. Our "bonus" is to use one piece of equipment at current rates. If having an assault suit for the best usage of weapon sounds silly, then why does its sound silly for logis and their equipment? Tell me what kind of renovated HP, PG and CPU drop suits stats in 1.8 will effect the difference in waiting 12 seconds to spawn in or 3? How will the cloak affect hive resupply? As far as we know CPP hasnt' changed the damage done, so TTK will still be the same. Dont get spawn killed because unless your side has a proto amarr logi, you could wait maybe 24 seconds instead of 6. Good luck holding an objective/ Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 981	Posted - 2014.01.24 01:25:00 - [69] - Quote ._. What? Are you ignoring what I'm saying? Anybody with an equipment slot could do some of a logi's job. The ONLY difference is that they don't have three equipment slots... Tell me what's the difference other than that, currently? Your statements don't make sense. With a blanket nerf you're going to still use it properly. :I Everyone will use the equipment to the same capability except the logi's. Btw currently the assaults don't have the most potential with weapons... The logi's do. Come 1.8 it'll be the Commandos. I don't understand your question at the end. What are you actually asking? "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Henchmen21 Planet Express LLC 454	Posted - 2014.01.24 01:29:00 - [70] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: Roy Ventus wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: Jake Bloodworth wrote: The OP has put forth far too logical of an explanation for these forums... 3 out of four items used by logis nerfed to because race. Youre not gonna be looking for a logi, you'll be b1tch1ing why is there no Amarr Logi with 3 second uplinks? Why is there no Minmatar Logi with decent reps (the reps you are enjoying right now)? Why is there no Caldari Logi with Hives? Scans...well its a crap bonus anyways. That logibro who was doing all of that right now, risking quite a bit of ISK and investing a ton of SP into, now cant hardly do any. You can choose between 3 of the following bonuses: low reps, low ammo, fighting blind, or waiting 12 seconds to spawn. Because race. Also because CPM frigging fought for it. Amazing that whatever SP equipment skill tree you dump 1 million+ SP into will be meaningless unless you dump another 2.5 million into that racial suit. But thats by OP logic and yours, balanced, of course. Spawn pads will rule in PC so expect a lot of slayer amarr logis. Cant beat a frigging 9 second spawn time advantage to that. Thats dying 4 times and respawning compared to uplinks dropped by any and all other suits in the game. Probably then reps because its the most practical career logi wise in terms of WP and saving friendlies in pubs, then hives then scans. Its not a system for rewarding you for sticking with 1 suit. Its a system punishing you for not using all 4. Ugh. That's the ***** issue with all of this. You guys are so damn fixated on what we have now in terms of stats. If they change the stats for 1.8, everything will be the same outside of stats EXCEPT that the logi will be able to boost the capability of a certain type of equipment. HTFU. We'll still need ammo from you guys and reps and scans and then some. The fact that you guys will be able do it better than us means that we will more than likely be looking for you ANYWAY. Just Ugh. The idea you are skipping over is that only one logi suit will be able to do one of these things well, the other three logi suits will not. I have a proto minmatar logi. As of the stats released so far, my uplinks, hives and scans are all going to be nerfed, my rep tool is going to struggle to stay the same, and my hacking bonus is removed. All of my invested SP in equipment has gone Poof because Race. I have to select 1 task to do well and throw the rest in the bin. If they had instead changed the stats so every light weapon is nerfed except for the suit you are proto in and left equipment alone, would i just be as right in saying "HTFU you can still shoot people but to use any weapon you want means spending 2.5 million for a Pro assault suit. For each Race." Just to show how much it kills diversity, every single logi will be represented by one piece of equipment. Everyone who see mes will know right away my uplinks, hives and scans are , proto level or not The only thing i can do so far to change that is to go proto in every logi suit. Because Race. Thats BS. You fail to understand that everyone will be at the same level. The QQ about equipment being is only in comparison to current stats. When these stats hit they will be the normal equipment stats... The bonuses will be the boosted stats. Stop trying to compare the two instead of comparing the balances. Again. I will still need a Logi. You as a logo can support a specific kind of equipment better. I won't be bitter that we won't have the old stats. Idc as long as I'm restocked. :I. Well considering I don't use the equipment my race has a bonus I am extra **** now aren't I? I don't consider chasing other players around getting torn to shreds so I can try to maintain a lock on them while losing ISK by the bucket full fun. My wallet stays closed to games I don't consider fun. Henchmen21: Infantry Gotyougood Ufkr: Vehicles

Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 646	Posted - 2014.01.24 01:55:00 - [71] - Quote The only bad thing I don't like is the Nanohive nerf, because the MD utterly depends on Hives to keep going. That with the rest of the indirect nerfs the weapon is going to hurt like hell in 1.8
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 981	Posted - 2014.01.24 01:59:00 - [72] - Quote So? You're not supposed to be repping if the conditions means you'll get ripped to shreds. It only works for Heavys. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus


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