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KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3692	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:17:00 - [1] - Quote Stats thanks to (i think its written:) /--Shays--/ = https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByYUjq_P9RY0TnNPemxqb1BfZFk/edit?pli=1 So This post is to Analize better the Scouts suits mentioned above. The Amarrian one and the Gallente one. Lets check the stats (AT PROTO LEVEL): --------------------------------Gallente------------Amarr GÖª High / Low slots =-------2/4------------2/4 GÖª CPU/PG= -----------------330/74------------340/70 GÖª Shields= -------------------70------------60 GÖª Armor= --------------------130------------170 GÖª TOTAL HP= ---------------200------------ 230 GÖª Shield recharge rate=---30------------30 GÖªShield Depleted delay=---6------------6 GÖªArmor repari rate=--------3------------ 0 Movement/Sprt Speed=5.45/7.63------------5.25/7.35 So.From the Mere Stats we can conclude: Slots: They are both the same CPU/PG+ Gallente has 4 more PG at the cost of 10 CPU. Seems fair Shields= Gallente has the advantage with 70. Armor= Amarr has the advantage with 170 (Almost MED frame level ! XD) Total HP.Amarr wins for a mere 30EHP. Shield R/D rates= Both the same ARMOR REPAIR RATE=So, what made LOGIS OP before 1.8? remember? oh yeh we are still playing 1.7.Well they gave it to the Gallente scout. Movement/Sprt speed= Gallente wins while having SCOUT speed. While the Amarr looses in speed to a Minmatar Assault. So as it is.OVERALL, the amarr scout only has 30+ HP over the gallente scout.THATS THE ONLY ADVANTAGE Amarr scout has. 30HP. This is worth: 1 STD Assault Rifle bullet....1 (out of 3 consecutive) Combat Rifle bullets....etc... Now lets see the BONUSES: (you might also check Aero Yassavi's post on Scout Bonuses: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=136426&find=unread ) The Gallente Scout racial bonus is 5% scan radius per level and 5% profile signature reduction per level At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free standard range amplifier and one free complex profile dampener. The Amarr Scout racial bonus is 5% stamina recovery and max stamina per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of less than one basic cardiac regulator, and that's it. A basic cardiac regulator does 25% more stamina and 50% more stamina recovery. So.... If i want to be profile dampened and/or cloaks i can use the GAllente Scout as it already surpasses the amarr scout in both Speed AND Armor repair (which make a difference) in exchange for stamina and 30HP (which DONT make a difference). If i want to have ''More HP'' i can just use a Minmatar Assault, which will have Bigger HP values , Better bonus (efficiency to Damage mods) , better SPEED , and whith just equipping a Cx Profile Dampener , similar Profile dampening. So what EXACTLY is the purpose of this Amarr scout? Why SHOULD i use it over the other variants which are clearly superior? Taken From Aero's post the other bonuses: The Caldari Scout racial bonus is 5% scan radius per level and 5% scan precision per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free standard range amplifier and one free complex precision enhancer (actually a little more since complex precision enhancers are 20%) The Minmatar Scout racial bonus is 5% hacking speed and nova knife damage per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free complex code breaker and multiple free complex sidearm damage modifiers I've been waiting for a VERY LONG TIME , for the amarr scout, but i cant believe how BAD it is compared to the other scouts. I sure appreciate the fact it has the SAME SLOT COUNT than other scout suits, but Considering the REST of the scouts have ''Amarr scout CPU-PG'' then it breaks even..... What exactly was the thinking behind this? Yeah,lets make the Amarr scout Run all day, so they can run from one objective to another. YEAH LIKE I CANT just call in an LAV. The only POSSIBLE use i can find for this fit is SPEED TANK. Speed + Massive stamina for constant movement seem pretty good...IN THEORY.AA has made Speed tanking and Strafing useless and the only way to stay alive is HP and cover. SO PLEASE, enlighen me.... WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO with this amarr scout... PLEASE CCP. FIX this before its release. DO NOT , wait for 1.8 and see everyone saying its UP,and then wait a lot like with the commandos to fix them. FIX IT NOW, the numers are here.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Aisha Ctarl Pradox One Proficiency V. 2902	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:20:00 - [2] - Quote I noticed it too. It's definitely a head scratcher. Perhaps it's an overlook by CCP? Aisha Ctarl for CPM1
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1605	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:22:00 - [3] - Quote I'm with you on this one KC "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
Beck Weathers Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 300	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:25:00 - [4] - Quote I say give amarr scout a 1/5 slot layout muahahahhaahaah
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3700	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:30:00 - [5] - Quote Edited with Possible Solutions so i dont sound like a worthless ranter.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1606	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:31:00 - [6] - Quote I kinda just want the 25% to PD back for all scouts or just give the cloak a lore description saying why scout could use it better then any other suit. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 3302	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:32:00 - [7] - Quote I think the Amarr Scout was envisioned as the only Scout that could forgo speed and armor tank everything else to hell. With 25% CPU from electronics and 25% more PG from engineering you could potentially run 4 COMPLEX Ferroscale plates for 300 more HP or 4 basic reactive plates (no speed penalty) for 100 more and +4 rep. I think you are also undervaluing the ability to run a complex CPU mid and Complex PG Mod, you would be able to have everything at proto level and still have 2 low slots for dampening/biotics/armor. That +3 armor bonus means A LOT! My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3700	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:33:00 - [8] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: I kinda just want the 25% to PD back for all scouts or just give the cloak a lore description saying why scout could use it better then any other suit. Not necesary. SCOUT Profile Scan has been Brought down to 35 by default. Even a STD Scout can now avoid ADV active scanners. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Scout Registry 630	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:33:00 - [9] - Quote Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. @ CPM, Remnant, Wolfman ... Thank You
Bojo The Mighty L.O.T.I.S. 2750	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:37:00 - [10] - Quote 30 HP is the difference between Gallente and Minmatar and when you max out your armor skill you're going to have a hayday. My GalScout armor is at 162 innate think about how much it will be on an Amarr Also the suit is not gimped by lack of slots which I thought was customary amongst Amarr suits so there's something. But also think about the fitting requirements of a Basic Cardiac Regulator versus those of Profile Dampener + Range Amp. they cost nothing practically while you will have a severe stamina buff that although is less than a module, is given FREE. I'm not saying certain other aspects don't seem unnappealing but well, I think yall are putting things in too weird of context. 15 CPU per module versus 5 PG. Check out latest BSOTT Guide

Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2965	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:37:00 - [11] - Quote Scout Registry wrote: Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. Agreed. On paper all this might not seem like much but you'll be running for ~28 seconds innately and it'll take you 5 seconds to refill that pool. I don't think you guys are taking into consideration how useful running and jumping for a nearly infinite amount of time with a complex regulator will be. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Marc Rime 224	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:38:00 - [12] - Quote I don't want an Amarr scout anyway, but it does indeed appear to be lacking something. Not only compared to Gallente, but also compared to Minmatar and Caldari (although comparing to Gallente is obviously easier). The other three look pretty balanced amongst themselves, wouldn't you say?
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3705	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:39:00 - [13] - Quote Scout Registry wrote: Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. I dont think it really does. Well,it is significant,but not a HUGE factor as you mention. see: at level 5 stamina, the minimum a scout will be able to run is for around 21 seconds. Not only i cant really think of many situations i would need to run for more time than that BUT: GÖªWhile being the slowest i automatically have a disadvantage,having to USE one of my low slots for a Kinetic Cat. GÖªStamina is NOT a deterrent in whether one stays alive or not. HP/REGEN/SPEED/Dampening are .... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3705	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:44:00 - [14] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: 1- 30 HP is the difference between Gallente and Minmatar and when you max out your armor skill you're going to have a hayday. My GalScout armor is at 162 innate think about how much it will be on an Amarr 2-Also the suit is not gimped by lack of slots which I thought was customary amongst Amarr suits so there's something. 3-But also think about the fitting requirements of a Basic Cardiac Regulator versus those of Profile Dampener + Range Amp. they cost nothing practically while you will have a severe stamina buff that although is less than a module, is given FREE. I'm not saying certain other aspects don't seem unnappealing but well, I think yall are putting things in too weird of context. 15 CPU per module versus 5 PG. 1-212 HP.Increasing the Gap between GAllente and Amarr armor all the way up to 50.Now i can take 2 more Combat rifle bullets than you.LOL.If its so ''impressive'', let Gallentes take the HP difference and give US the 3 per sec armor repair....YEAH,dint think so.... 2-''customary amongst Amarr suits so there's something. '' You know what else is customary about Amarr suits? Having More CPU and PG than others, which the A.Scout does not. So no ,there is nothing... 3-You do have a point here, Kudos. But still, every other scout has a bonus that affects their capacity to survive or to attack. The amarr has stamina that affects neither terrain coverage...wich considering the amound of vehicles out there....doesnt sound very appealing. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2965	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:46:00 - [15] - Quote correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus in my opinion. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1607	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:46:00 - [16] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: I kinda just want the 25% to PD back for all scouts or just give the cloak a lore description saying why scout could use it better then any other suit. Not necesary. SCOUT Profile Scan has been Brought down to 35 by default. Even a STD Scout can now avoid ADV active scanners. Really? Could you possibly aid me by directing me to this information? "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3705	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:47:00 - [17] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: I kinda just want the 25% to PD back for all scouts or just give the cloak a lore description saying why scout could use it better then any other suit. Not necesary. SCOUT Profile Scan has been Brought down to 35 by default. Even a STD Scout can now avoid ADV active scanners. Really? Could you possibly aid me by directing me to this information? http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/news.control/65556/1/dropsuitsuprising18.jpg GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1609	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:50:00 - [18] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Im understanding what your saying and am slowly coming to accept it but I'm still pissed that the minmatar assault is at scout speed. I don't know if its just me but I truly think no assaults base states should be equal or rival any scouts speed. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3708	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:52:00 - [19] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Im understanding what you saying and am slowly coming to accept it but I'm still pissed that the minmatar assault is at scout speed. I don't know if its just me but I truly think no assault base states should be equal rival any scouts speed. AGreed with you Soul. PLUS,how many of you people saying the AMARR SCOUT IS ''FINE'' are actually going to SKILL INTO it? yeah...didnt think so... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 295	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:56:00 - [20] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Stats thanks to (i think its written:) /--Shays--/ = https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByYUjq_P9RY0TnNPemxqb1BfZFk/edit?pli=1 So This post is to Analize better the Scouts suits mentioned above. The Amarrian one and the Gallente one. Lets check the stats (AT PROTO LEVEL): --------------------------------Gallente------------Amarr GÖª High / Low slots =-------2/4------------2/4 GÖª CPU/PG= -----------------330/74------------340/70 GÖª Shields= -------------------70------------60 GÖª Armor= --------------------130------------170 GÖª TOTAL HP= ---------------200------------ 230 GÖª Shield recharge rate=---30------------30 GÖªShield Depleted delay=---6------------6 GÖªArmor repari rate=--------3------------ 0 Movement/Sprt Speed=5.45/7.63------------5.25/7.35 So.From the Mere Stats we can conclude: Slots: They are both the same CPU/PG+ Gallente has 4 more PG at the cost of 10 CPU. Seems fair Shields= Gallente has the advantage with 70. Armor= Amarr has the advantage with 170 (Almost MED frame level ! XD) Total HP.Amarr wins for a mere 30EHP. Shield R/D rates= Both the same ARMOR REPAIR RATE=So, what made LOGIS OP before 1.8? remember? oh yeh we are still playing 1.7.Well they gave it to the Gallente scout. Movement/Sprt speed= Gallente wins while having SCOUT speed. While the Amarr looses in speed to a Minmatar Assault. So as it is.OVERALL, the amarr scout only has 30+ HP over the gallente scout.THATS THE ONLY ADVANTAGE Amarr scout has. 30HP. This is worth: 1 STD Assault Rifle bullet....1 (out of 3 consecutive) Combat Rifle bullets....etc... Now lets see the BONUSES: (you might also check Aero Yassavi's post on Scout Bonuses: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=136426&find=unread ) The Gallente Scout racial bonus is 5% scan radius per level and 5% profile signature reduction per level At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free standard range amplifier and one free complex profile dampener. The Amarr Scout racial bonus is 5% stamina recovery and max stamina per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of less than one basic cardiac regulator, and that's it. A basic cardiac regulator does 25% more stamina and 50% more stamina recovery. So.... If i want to be profile dampened and/or cloaks i can use the GAllente Scout as it already surpasses the amarr scout in both Speed AND Armor repair (which make a difference) in exchange for stamina and 30HP (which DONT make a difference). If i want to have ''More HP'' i can just use a Minmatar Assault, which will have Bigger HP values , Better bonus (efficiency to Damage mods) , better SPEED , and whith just equipping a Cx Profile Dampener , similar Profile dampening. So what EXACTLY is the purpose of this Amarr scout? Why SHOULD i use it over the other variants which are clearly superior? Taken From Aero's post the other bonuses: The Caldari Scout racial bonus is 5% scan radius per level and 5% scan precision per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free standard range amplifier and one free complex precision enhancer (actually a little more since complex precision enhancers are 20%) The Minmatar Scout racial bonus is 5% hacking speed and nova knife damage per level. At level 5, this is the equivalent of one free complex code breaker and multiple free complex sidearm damage modifiers I've been waiting for a VERY LONG TIME , for the amarr scout, but i cant believe how BAD it is compared to the other scouts. I sure appreciate the fact it has the SAME SLOT COUNT than other scout suits, but Considering the REST of the scouts have ''Amarr scout CPU-PG'' then it breaks even..... What exactly was the thinking behind this? Yeah,lets make the Amarr scout Run all day, so they can run from one objective to another. YEAH LIKE I CANT just call in an LAV. The only POSSIBLE use i can find for this fit is SPEED TANK. Speed + Massive stamina for constant movement seem pretty good...IN THEORY.AA has made Speed tanking and Strafing useless and the only way to stay alive is HP and cover. SO PLEASE, enlighen me.... WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO with this amarr scout... PLEASE CCP. FIX this before its release. DO NOT , wait for 1.8 and see everyone saying its UP,and then wait a lot like with the commandos to fix them. FIX IT NOW, the numers are here.... /EDIT/= Possible Solutions: Increase the Bonus all the way up to the efficiency of an ENHANCED CARDIAC REGULATOR. ADD 5% Profile Dampening PER level. OR Increase the Bonus all the way up to the efficiency of an ENHANCED CARDIAC REGULATOR. ADD 5% Cloack Cooldown per level OR Replace the bonus but something that is not worthless..... AND an increase on some of the Base AMARR Scout stats. Giving the Amarr Scout a 3 Armor rep per sec same as the gallente wouldnt be taking it too far...Or giving them 80 Shields instead of 60 plus Minmatar Scout Melee damage.. I dont know...im out of ideas for now... 4PG against 10 CPU seems fair ? Seriously ? Solution : The bonus seems kinda nice iF some condition : First : Bring it to the level of an Complex Cardiac Regulator. All others bonus are a Complex Mod AND a ehanced or basic. And cardiac regulator are one of the easiest module to fit..... Second : Make the Amarr Melee weapon depending on the Stamina : The Max Stamina you have IS the melee damage bonus you have with + a little base damage. (50-100-150) 300 of stamina ? 400 of damage per hit with it. HUGE damage. (OHK when backstab a Heavy suit) No charge up. Single shot. BUT. Deplete your ENTIRE stamina bar every shot.

mollerz Minja Scouts 1970	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:56:00 - [21] - Quote It kind of seems to me that the amarr scout is designed to kill minjas. They are way tougher, and their inhuman stamina ultimately defeats our speed. You guys are like the storm troopers of dust. You come in and run your prey down until they are out of breath and then when they are corned and have to fight, you still have more in the tank, are way tougher, and now have the upper hand in every way. Now if there is a group of you, it's a force multiplier. You can literally run anything down. Sounds kind of evil to me! You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1609	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:56:00 - [22] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: I kinda just want the 25% to PD back for all scouts or just give the cloak a lore description saying why scout could use it better then any other suit. Not necesary. SCOUT Profile Scan has been Brought down to 35 by default. Even a STD Scout can now avoid ADV active scanners. Really? Could you possibly aid me by directing me to this information? http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/news.control/65556/1/dropsuitsuprising18.jpg ENJOY I actually saw this but I just wasn't looking for this specific piece of information. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3708	Posted - 2014.01.17 21:58:00 - [23] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg/hack bonus bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. 1-Are you still a scout? 2-WHAT SCOUT do you use, which one will you use.? and please dont lie,because i will find out..... I DONT REALLY think you REALLY think that about the Amarr Scout. I think, you will first have to have the MIN,GAL,CAL scouts before you EVEN consider having the Amarr scout, and you being an Amarrian born... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 295	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:00:00 - [24] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Im understanding what you saying and am slowly coming to accept it but I'm still pissed that the minmatar assault is at scout speed. I don't know if its just me but I truly think no assault base states should be equal rival any scouts speed. AGreed with you Soul. PLUS,how many of you people saying the AMARR SCOUT IS ''FINE'' are actually going to SKILL INTO it? yeah...didnt think so... CCP just HATE Amarrians right now..... Amarr weapons always takes twice more pG..... Amarr logi suit has always been the worse. (Its mine i know it.....) Every bonus CCP bring to Amarr just SUCKS. Rof ? Well with Laser rifle and SCR that's useless....... Armor repair ? That was useless on Logi Amarr that's still useless on Assault...... Bonus to shield and penality on amror ? Oh yeah....but armor is almost 3x higher than shield..... CCP start making great things (Commandos and Sentinel Amarr are not bad.) but damn this scout is.....so trash compaired to others......
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2972	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:02:00 - [25] - Quote I'll give it a month or two after Marauder has murdered entire teams and everyone starts speccing into Amarr scout and you'll guys go "yknow, this suit ain't so bad." Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3715	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:03:00 - [26] - Quote mollerz wrote: It kind of seems to me that the amarr scout is designed to kill minjas. They are way tougher, and their inhuman stamina ultimately defeats our speed. You guys are like the storm troopers of dust. You come in and run your prey down until they are out of breath and then when they are corned and have to fight, you still have more in the tank, are way tougher, and now have the upper hand in every way. Now if there is a group of you, it's a force multiplier. You can literally run anything down. Sounds kind of evil to me! Ok now MOLLERZ has a good way to put it. Nice, you found an use for the amarr scout. BUT. I can pretty much kill Mimjas without having to follow them. Its called Low TTK+AA+Rifle.... So..we are back to square one. WHat is the Amarr scout purpose....? GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
ResistanceGTA Valor Tactical Operations Immortal Coalition of New-Eden 98	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:03:00 - [27] - Quote Just keep voicing your opinions, you guys can probably get the bonus changed. Look at the initial bonuses the scouts had, now look at them. Hell, look at the Minny, it gained the hack bonus everyone asked for. Everyone, get together and come up with the one thing you really want and get all the support you can. And, no offense, but find someone else to type it up.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3715	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:04:00 - [28] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: I'll give it a month or two after Marauder has murdered entire teams and everyone starts speccing into Amarr scout and you'll guys go "yknow, this suit ain't so bad." 1st- Im speccing into Amarr scout, day one. 2nd-aint so bad =/= Good GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Marad''er Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 385	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:06:00 - [29] - Quote I'm going to skill into amarr scout regardless. However I agree with what you're saying. Amarr regardless of suit should have highest pg and CPU. At least pg. 4 pg equates to at LEAST 20 CPU!! And I really hope that change skill to equate to a full complex regulator at lv 5 GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢ Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà Forum Warrior LV. 4 \| Warframe is awesome! \| PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 295	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:08:00 - [30] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: I'll give it a month or two after Marauder has murdered entire teams and everyone starts speccing into Amarr scout and you'll guys go "yknow, this suit ain't so bad." 1st- Im speccing into Amarr scout, day one. 2nd-aint so bad =/= Good Maybe my alt but definitely not my Main. Right know nothing would make me spec into it. What the point about running for a long time if you run slow as hell ? CCP Bring Melee weapon based on stamina buff our bonus by AT LEAST 3 and THEN it will be useful. Amarr are the storm trooper ? Yes it dies from stick and stones and can't kill a single ennemy even if there is 20 stormtrooper against 1 ennemy.

Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2972	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:08:00 - [31] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg/hack bonus bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. 1-Are you still a scout? 2-WHAT SCOUT do you use, which one will you use.? and please dont lie,because i will find out..... I DONT REALLY think you REALLY think that about the Amarr Scout. I think, you will first have to have the MIN,GAL,CAL scouts before you EVEN consider having the Amarr scout, and you being an Amarrian born... Am I a scout still? You must be trolling. I am a Minnie and will remain a minnie. Of course I'm not going to play amarr because armor aint my thing. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3718	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:08:00 - [32] - Quote Marad''er wrote: I'm going to skill into amarr scout regardless. However I agree with what you're saying. Amarr regardless of suit should have highest pg and CPU. At least pg. 4 pg equates to at LEAST 30 CPU!! THANK YOU. Yeah im speccing into it becase ive waited so long and have so many useless crp already that whatever...But doesnt mean i cant post this and try to get it on equal grounds with the other scouts... I mean, AT LEAST ,add a 5% Profile scan per level next to the stamina bonus...AT LEAST.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.*
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3718	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:10:00 - [33] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg/hack bonus bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. 1-Are you still a scout? 2-WHAT SCOUT do you use, which one will you use.? and please dont lie,because i will find out..... I DONT REALLY think you REALLY think that about the Amarr Scout. I think, you will first have to have the MIN,GAL,CAL scouts before you EVEN consider having the Amarr scout, and you being an Amarrian born... Am I a scout still? You must be trolling. I am a Minnie and will remain a minnie. Of course I'm not going to play amarr because armor aint my thing. So then, please dont say the bonus is great and the scout is ''fine'' when its not. (BTW im not trolling,i havn met you ingame yet..i think..so i dont know the current situation of scouts as of today...) GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
mollerz Minja Scouts 1974	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:11:00 - [34] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: I can pretty much kill Mimjas without having to follow them. Its called Low TTK+AA+Rifle.... So..we are back to square one. WHat is the Amarr scout purpose....? I just thought it was cool that the amarrian scout has a defined role and that would be to hunt down and kill. I had never had to consider that there was a role to specifically counter my minja role out there before. I can't help but see what CCP was doing here, and I think it's worth pointing out cause, bonus specifics aside, that is pretty fuckin cool and a real positive sign that we are back on track. As far as the specifics of your bonuses, I am just a bystander and would totally encourage your success. However, I am going to watch it closely to make sure I know what expect! You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3718	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:13:00 - [35] - Quote ResistanceGTA wrote: Just keep voicing your opinions, you guys can probably get the bonus changed. Look at the initial bonuses the scouts had, now look at them. Hell, look at the Minny, it gained the hack bonus everyone asked for. Everyone, get together and come up with the one thing you really want and get all the support you can. And, no offense, but find someone else to type it up. Offense non taken. English is not my native language and without my corrector i make a LOT of typos. I'll fix in about an hour when i get to my computer.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 559	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:14:00 - [36] - Quote The 3hp/s is useless if you still die from 3 hits. This is going to be mostly for tanked scouts. The 30 hp is meh, but the extra stamina helps. I only have 1 skill in regulators, and those basic mods feel incredible. If you have level 5 scout for Amarr, you'll be able to sprint for about 2 or 3 more seconds than a Gallentean, which could makea difference. Slap on some kincats - maybe 1 more regulator - and you're good to go. Ironically, the Amarr are going to be speed tankers.
pseudosnipre 558	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:15:00 - [37] - Quote mollerz wrote: It kind of seems to me that the amarr scout is designed to kill minjas. They are way tougher, and their inhuman stamina ultimately defeats our speed. You guys are like the storm troopers of dust. You come in and run your prey down until they are out of breath and then when they are corned and have to fight, you still have more in the tank, are way tougher, and now have the upper hand in every way. Now if there is a group of you, it's a force multiplier. You can literally run anything down. Sounds kind of evil to me! This. You can catch fleeing slaves. For all the complaining you RPers have provided, I was expecting bonuses to be: +5% pious attitude/lvl -5% skirt length/lvl +5% more irritating on the forums/lvl On the bright side, stamina means you can chain multiple jumps together and quickly platform your way to better vantage points to drop uplink and unique angles of attack...and free from nova knife attack. Also, please keep in mind that the cloak and your stamina may have a synergy nobody could have predicted. And with armor stacking you will still be able to cover a LOT of ground quickly WITH a lot of tank and potentially while cloaked. Also, if used as-is in 1.8 and it turns out to be UP...I'm sure the Amarr community will cry out about this unfair oppression! In all seriousness though, I like the bonus but would rather see base stamina/regen higher. Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 3304	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:20:00 - [38] - Quote mollerz wrote: Sounds kind of evil to me! Sounds kind of human to me. A healthy adult human of average height and weight can.run down a horse. That's right a horse. The bipedal locomotion of our bodies allow us to be one of the best animals for endurance land travel. So even though now we are all a ton of lazy slobs that don't even like to run because we think it's silly, it was actually one of the things that kept us alive back in the day. The Amarr didn't invent a new method of battle, they just embraced Man's hunting method. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5625	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:21:00 - [39] - Quote 3hp/s didn't make logis OP. 5hp/s did, on a suit that already had more slots than any other suit, with a fuckton of CPU/PG. Remove that 5hp/s and logis would still be OP. Just a correction for you. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3718	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:23:00 - [40] - Quote Joel II X wrote: The 3hp/s is useless if you still die from 3 hits. This is going to be mostly for tanked scouts. The 30 hp is meh, but the extra stamina helps. I only have 1 skill in regulators, and those basic mods feel incredible. If you have level 5 scout for Amarr, you'll be able to sprint for about 2 or 3 more seconds than a Gallentean, which could makea difference. Slap on some kincats - maybe 1 more regulator - and you're good to go. Ironically, the Amarr are going to be speed tankers. 3 HP per sec is NOT useless. Lets you TANK massivley with a slow regen, or lets you have inmense HP regen . To put it in perspective: 1 Compex Repair mod repairs you 9.25 per second on a Gal Scout. Thats almost 10 per second with only 1 module. Thing only nowadays LOGIS can achieve... Plus ,you are even avoiding the the main issue, the BONUS. XD 3 armor rep per sec is OBVIOUSLY superiror to 30ish stamina, but also the Gallente has 2 GOOD bonuses , while the Amarr has 1 mediocre one. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.

KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3719	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:32:00 - [41] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: 3hp/s didn't make logis OP. 5hp/s did, on a suit that already had more slots than any other suit, with a fuckton of CPU/PG. Remove that 5hp/s and logis would still be OP. Just a correction for you. When logis dont have the innate 5HP per sec bonus, the next best thing IS 3HP per sec. And you are ignoring the fact that a Gallente Scout can already massivley tank. Think of, 2 Cx shield extender 1 Cx armor rep 3 armor plates that fit.... This is over 700HP ON A SCOUT, that has E-war advantages like scan range , profile damp etc... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
pseudosnipre 558	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:33:00 - [42] - Quote Joel II X wrote: The 3hp/s is useless if you still die from 3 hits. This is going to be mostly for tanked scouts. The 30 hp is meh, but the extra stamina helps. I only have 1 skill in regulators, and those basic mods feel incredible. If you have level 5 scout for Amarr, you'll be able to sprint for about 2 or 3 more seconds than a Gallentean, which could makea difference. Slap on some kincats - maybe 1 more regulator - and you're good to go. Ironically, the Amarr are going to be speed tankers. No, 3 hp/s is good for evasive scouts that get into their armor while escaping. It's not very useful for frequent skirmish or 1v1, but will let me get back to full hp after being grazed by a random sniper round. Also, expect a lot of new players to be drawn to the suit due to the higher ehp. Experienced Amarr scouts will tank armor and decloak in optimum laser/SR range and be the best flanker/light assault for squad support (and thus have access to a logi repper). Both these optimum ranges make scan bonuses useless. With level 5 passive armor and shields the amarr scout has 313 ehp, 4 slots for armor tanking (high slot), and stamina (high slot) to sprint everywhere...all while being hard to detect. Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
T8R Raid BIG BAD W0LVES 137	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:34:00 - [43] - Quote blink blink are we really discussing CCP's math? We KNOW they're terrible. Something HAS to be OP with CCP. They're worthless FPS developers. They've PROVEN this countless times, look at the flaylock, hmg, mass driver, logi, current militia tanks, and the rail rifle. They haven't a clue what they are doing, and are mucking it up more and more as time goes by. They're a joke in the FPS world. Even GTA (not a FPS) has adjustable door locks on the fly. Waiting 5 seconds to pick up squad mates is ridiculous. Setting your door locks to squad/friends WORKS. Although, that sounds like 5 years of coding for CCP. Unchecked dishonesty can promote the perception that one must cheat to remain competitive.
pseudosnipre 558	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:37:00 - [44] - Quote ResistanceGTA wrote: Just keep voicing your opinions, you guys can probably get the bonus changed. Look at the initial bonuses the scouts had, now look at them. Hell, look at the Minny, it gained the hack bonus everyone asked for. Everyone, get together and come up with the one thing you really want and get all the support you can. And, no offense, but find someone else to type it up. I'm not trying to troll above, just leading your responses somewhere realistic. Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 5346	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:37:00 - [45] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Let me just start off by saying that at Level V you will have a COMPLEX Cardiac Regulator and an enhanced armor repairer built in. I think the Amarr Scout was envisioned as the only Scout that could forgo speed and armor tank everything else to hell. With 25% CPU from electronics and 25% more PG from engineering you could potentially run 4 COMPLEX Ferroscale plates for 300 more HP or 4 basic reactive plates (no speed penalty) for 100 more and +4 rep. I think you are also undervaluing the ability to run a complex CPU mid and Complex PG Mod, you would be able to have everything at proto level and still have 2 low slots for dampening/biotics/armor. That +3 armor bonus means A LOT! Get your facts straight. At level 5 we'd have 25% more stamina and 25% more stamina recovery. A standard cardiac regulator is 25% more stamina and 50% more stamina recover, so we wouldn't even be getting a standard module! A complex cardiac regulator is 100% more stamina and 100% more stamina recover. And where is this enhanced armor repairer coming from? That is Gallente scout, not Amarr. And Gallente gets 4 lows as well. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3719	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:37:00 - [46] - Quote T8R Raid wrote: blink blink are we really discussing CCP's math? We KNOW they're terrible. Something HAS to be OP with CCP. They're worthless FPS developers. They've PROVEN this countless times, look at the flaylock, hmg, mass driver, logi, current militia tanks, and the rail rifle. They haven't a clue what they are doing, and are mucking it up more and more as time goes by. They're a joke in the FPS world. Even GTA (not a FPS) has adjustable door locks on the fly. Waiting 5 seconds to pick up squad mates is ridiculous. Setting your door locks to squad/friends WORKS. Although, that sounds like 5 years of coding for CCP. Thats why community members like myself try to help CCP with these balance issues instead of insulting them. ;) +1 to Aero. The fun thing is, how Most players saying the suit is fine and DEFENDING the Amarr scout current stats,DONT PLAN ON SKILLING INTO IT. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 5347	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:39:00 - [47] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Scout Registry wrote: Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. Agreed. On paper all this might not seem like much but you'll be running for ~28 seconds innately and it'll take you 5 seconds to refill that pool. I don't think you guys are taking into consideration how useful running and jumping for a near infinite amount of time with a complex regulator will be. Likewise, I don't think anyone is considering the actual values of standard, enhanced, and complex cardiac regulators and how easy it would be to mimic the Amarr scout. The Amarr scout bonus isn't even as good as a standard cardiac regulator, have you considered that? ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 5347	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:44:00 - [48] - Quote Mordecai Sanguine wrote: 4PG against 10 CPU seems fair ? Seriously ? Considering that 1 PG does not equal 1 CPU (go look at some suit stats and module stats, 1 PG is a lot more valuable than 1 CPU) then yes, it is fair. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3720	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:46:00 - [49] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Mordecai Sanguine wrote: 4PG against 10 CPU seems fair ? Seriously ? Considering that 1 PG does not equal 1 CPU (go look at some suit stats and module stats, 1 PG is a lot more valuable than 1 CPU) then yes, it is fair. well, fair-ish... they should at least give us 6 more CPU for it to be 100% fair. (at 4 CPU per 1 PG).. But that wouldnt make me as happy as a Bonus fix for the amarr scout. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 342	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:48:00 - [50] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Scout Registry wrote: Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. Agreed. On paper all this might not seem like much but you'll be running for ~28 seconds innately and it'll take you 5 seconds to refill that pool. I don't think you guys are taking into consideration how useful running and jumping for a near infinite amount of time with a complex regulator will be. Likewise, I don't think anyone is considering the actual values of standard, enhanced, and complex cardiac regulators and how easy it would be to mimic the Amarr scout. The Amarr scout bonus isn't even as good as a standard cardiac regulator, have you considered that? I wrote this up already but figured it fit here very nicely In order for the minmatar scout to match the amarrian scout stat-wise: 1 proto ferroscale plate 1 militia green pill Now the minnie scount has more speed, stamina, stamina regen, hacking speed, strafing, jumping, and more HP, oh and 4 free high-slots. In order for the amarr suit to attempt to match the minmatr suit: 1 complex code breaker 1 basic code breaker 3 complex damage mods (can't fit anymore than 2 anyway) 1 enhanced kincat Now the amarrian suit has comparible sprint speed (slower strafe/lower jumping) comparible hacking speed, and can't match the damage output due to not being able to fit enough damage mods, oh and 1 free low-slot. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.

KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3722	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:55:00 - [51] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Scout Registry wrote: Please keep stamina differences in mind. This is hugely significant. Agreed. On paper all this might not seem like much but you'll be running for ~28 seconds innately and it'll take you 5 seconds to refill that pool. I don't think you guys are taking into consideration how useful running and jumping for a near infinite amount of time with a complex regulator will be. Likewise, I don't think anyone is considering the actual values of standard, enhanced, and complex cardiac regulators and how easy it would be to mimic the Amarr scout. The Amarr scout bonus isn't even as good as a standard cardiac regulator, have you considered that? I wrote this up already but figured it fit here very nicely In order for the minmatar scout to match the amarrian scout stat-wise: 1 proto ferroscale plate 1 militia green pill Now the minnie scount has more speed, stamina, stamina regen, hacking speed, strafing, jumping, and more HP, oh and 4 free high-slots. In order for the amarr suit to attempt to match the minmatr suit: 1 complex code breaker 1 basic code breaker 3 complex damage mods (can't fit anymore than 2 anyway) 1 enhanced kincat Now the amarrian suit has comparible sprint speed (slower strafe/lower jumping) comparible hacking speed, and can't match the damage output due to not being able to fit enough damage mods, oh and 1 free low-slot. ACtually , the Minnie hacks faster too...its part of their bonus next to Melee/Nova knife damage.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2974	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:56:00 - [52] - Quote @aero just did the math I'm pretty sure it's balanced around regulators and not meant to be equipped without it just like the minmatar needs to equip either a codebreaker or knives to be very good at either of those things. A minmatar (seconds highest stamina)with a complex regulator will run for about 42 seconds requiring 14 cpu and 8 pg. An amar with an enhanced will run ~55 seconds and 9 cpu and 5 cpu. To catch an Amarr scout with one complex regulator (14 cpu/8 pg ~59 seconds) a minmatar would have to equip 2 complex regulators (28 cpu/16 pg ~84 seconds). Say you wanted to put two complex regulators (28 cpu/16 pg ~118 seconds). A gallente (the only one other suit that has enough low slots) would require 3 complex regulators requiring (42 cpu/24 pg ~160 seconds straight). If you put three on... well nobody is ever going to catch you. To make use of the bonus you have to equip a regulator like a minmatar has to equip a knife or a code breaker to really get use of it's bonuses. Again I'm not saying you guys are wrong. I'm just saying you're not really considering the usefulness of stamina when scouting. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 5350	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:59:00 - [53] - Quote Beck Weathers wrote: I say give amarr scout a 1/5 slot layout muahahahhaahaah Man I'd kill for that! And it'd help differentiate itself with the Gallente scout. But eh, I'd be fine if they just give the Amarr scout a racial bonus on par with the rest. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 530	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:01:00 - [54] - Quote Agreed that the Amarr scout needs a higher bonus or another bonus added like 25% to kin cat efficacy or something...goes really well with all those low slots. But there is comparison without thinking about the other bonuses either. The Caldari precision bonus is lackluster if active scanners are not fixed. Nor does the bonus compete with Gallentes whose scouts will be ghosts and logis scanning with their super scanners.
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 382	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:02:00 - [55] - Quote I was going to spec into the Amarr Scout, so I'm part of the target group here. - The 30 hp bonus is actually rather useful. All Amarr suits are 1-v-1 specialists and so should the scout. Everything else being equal the Gallente Scout will be dead when you still have 27 hp left. There's no repairing from that. You on the other hand can just drop a compact nanohive and walk away. - The lack of additional fitting resources is balanced by the lack of the reduced slot count. I'll just add a CPU or PG module and it'll be as before, just with more flexibility. - The reduction in movement speed is a very serious problem for a scout. It's just going to take that bit more time to get from cover to cover. If TTK stayed the same for 1.8 this would be a massive issue for me. I assume it's going to be a problem still, but I'll reserve the benefit of doubt for CCP. - I've been playing the Gallente Scout for a while now and I never considered exchanging a range amplification module for a cardiac regulator. Not even a complex cardiac for a basic range extender. Not even two complex cardiacs. In 1.7 we'd be talking about trading 11 meter scan range (that's 25% of my scan range with only one module) against ... I was going to write something, but then I realized I never run out of stamina in 1.7... Everything else seems acceptable, but the skill bonus is really bad. For all I care it wouldn't get better if the Amarr Scout had infinite stamina. I was originally hoping for a bonus that supported it's 1-v-1 power. E.g. a bonus to armor plate efficacy or a damage bonus to it's weapons. Stamina seems very useless. I guess I'll stick with my passive scanning Gallente Scout for 1.8.
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 344	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:04:00 - [56] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: @aero just did the math I'm pretty sure it's balanced around regulators and not meant to be equipped without it just like the minmatar needs to equip either a codebreaker or knives to be very good at either of those things. A minmatar (seconds highest stamina)with a complex regulator will run for about 42 seconds requiring 14 cpu and 8 pg. An amar with an enhanced will run ~55 seconds and 9 cpu and 5 cpu. To catch an Amarr scout with one complex regulator (14 cpu/8 pg ~59 seconds) a minmatar would have to equip 2 complex regulators (28 cpu/16 pg ~84 seconds). Say you wanted to put two complex regulators (28 cpu/16 pg ~118 seconds). A gallente (the only one other suit that has enough low slots) would require 3 complex regulators requiring (42 cpu/24 pg ~160 seconds straight). If you put three on... well nobody is ever going to catch you. To make use of the bonus you have to equip a regulator like a minmatar has to equip a knife or a code breaker to really get use of it's bonuses. This is not very good reasoning. The simpliest way to analyze the bonuses is with using modules, as modules effect the same exact stats. The minmatar hacking bonus (5% per lvl nd then the extra 5% inate bonus over other scouts) equates to 1 complex and 1 basic code breaker. This is 2 modules that any suit would have to fit just to catch up to the hacking bonus. The minmatar suit also gets 5% per lvl to nova knife damage. This is worth any other suit equipping 3 complex sidearm damage mods. This is 3 modules any suit would have to fit just to catch up to the nova knife bonus. Now if you look at the amarrian bonus. You would need to fit 1 militia cardiac regulator to not only catch up, but surpass (by double in the case of stamina recovery). Using this knowledge, we can clearly say that the minmatar bonuses are worth 5 modules, the amarrian scout bonus is not even worth 1. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2977	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:12:00 - [57] - Quote Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1611	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:23:00 - [58] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Two bonuses for two different mod compared to the same bonuses on 1 mod and have anyone actually tried steam regs your giving up tank just to run a bit longer that really doesn't suit the Amarr play style. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3725	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:26:00 - [59] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: I was going to spec into the Amarr Scout, so I'm part of the target group here. - The 30 hp bonus is actually rather useful. All Amarr suits are 1-v-1 specialists and so should the scout. Everything else being equal the Gallente Scout will be dead when you still have 27 hp left. There's no repairing from that. You on the other hand can just drop a compact nanohive and walk away. - The lack of additional fitting resources is balanced by the lack of the reduced slot count. I'll just add a CPU or PG module and it'll be as before, just with more flexibility. - The reduction in movement speed is a very serious problem for a scout. It's just going to take that bit more time to get from cover to cover. If TTK stayed the same for 1.8 this would be a massive issue for me. I assume it's going to be a problem still, but I'll reserve the benefit of doubt for CCP. - I've been playing the Gallente Scout for a while now and I never considered exchanging a range amplification module for a cardiac regulator. Not even a complex cardiac for a basic range extender. Not even two complex cardiacs. In 1.7 we'd be talking about trading 11 meter scan range (that's 25% of my scan range with only one module) against ... I was going to write something, but then I realized I never run out of stamina in 1.7... Everything else seems acceptable, but the skill bonus is really bad. For all I care it wouldn't get better if the Amarr Scout had infinite stamina. I was originally hoping for a bonus that supported it's 1-v-1 power. E.g. a bonus to armor plate efficacy or a damage bonus to it's weapons. Stamina seems very useless. I guess I'll stick with my passive scanning Gallente Scout for 1.8. Thats what im saying: Caldari and Gallente get E-war bonuses , that increase their chance of survival and sneak attacks The Minmatar has an Offensive and Sneaking bonus The amarr has a ... what? RUN... YOU CAN RUN.... >..> GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2979	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:27:00 - [60] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Two bonuses for two different mod compared to the same bonuses on 1 mod and have anyone actually tried steam regs your giving up tank just to run a bit longer that really doesn't suit the Amarr play style. You're a scout dude. You're not going to be standing and firing and if you want to you're going to have much more HP than any other scout and still be able to run longer. If you want to push for a very specific bonus feel free. There's a lot of good in a bonus to something that useful in most situations and still be able to tank well. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.

KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3727	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:31:00 - [61] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Ok then Moody you win. Just add to the stamina bonus 5% Scrambler Pistol damage per level and we are set. NO one will be able to complain.... since...and I QUOTE YOU:''The Pistol bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit'' GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2984	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:33:00 - [62] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Ok then Moody you win. Just add to the stamina bonus 5% Scrambler Pistol damage per level and we are set. NO one will be able to complain.... since...and I QUOTE YOU:''The Pistol bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit'' A damage bonus to something with the range and damage model of a scrambler pistol would be ridiculously overpowered. The scrambler pistol borders on overpowered as it is. Proficiency 4 in pistols before you ask. Sorry dude. Can't agree with you. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Onesimus Tarsus 857	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:34:00 - [63] - Quote mollerz wrote: It kind of seems to me that the amarr scout is designed to kill minjas. They are way tougher, and their inhuman stamina ultimately defeats our speed. You guys are like the storm troopers of dust. You come in and run your prey down until they are out of breath and then when they are corned and have to fight, you still have more in the tank, are way tougher, and now have the upper hand in every way. Now if there is a group of you, it's a force multiplier. You can literally run anything down. Sounds kind of evil to me! Geez, the visual you just painted... thrills me. A pack of scout hunters literally wolf packing a single suit into a corner and... I have to take a shower. I can only hope it's true. I am the worst player in DUST 514. Come clone me out.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3727	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:38:00 - [64] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Increasing that stamina bonus anymore is kind of moot. Your bonus is variety or lack of a specific bonus that requires a specific playstyle. The knife bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit. Regulators are useful in every situation. Knives are not. Hack bonus is useful for a specific situation. Again regulators are useful in EVERY situation. Just because it's boring and non specific doesn't mean it's bad or imbalanced. Ok then Moody you win. Just add to the stamina bonus 5% Scrambler Pistol damage per level and we are set. NO one will be able to complain.... since...and I QUOTE YOU:''The Pistol bonus is kind of a silly thing to poke at as it's a specific weapon with a specific playstyle requiring a specific suit'' A damage bonus to something with the range and damage model of a scrambler pistol would be ridiculously overpowered. The scrambler pistol borders on overpowered as it is. Proficiency 4 in pistols before you ask. Sorry dude. Can't agree with you. Sorry dude you cant complain,because its a Specific bonus and by your standards its a silly thing to poke at. ok.Since it has range im going to change it at 3% damage and RoF increase per level. I even posted it on my Main Thread.If it gets applied , remember its your fault... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
GRIM GEAR The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 164	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:39:00 - [65] - Quote Mordecai Sanguine wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: I'll give it a month or two after Marauder has murdered entire teams and everyone starts speccing into Amarr scout and you'll guys go "yknow, this suit ain't so bad." 1st- Im speccing into Amarr scout, day one. 2nd-aint so bad =/= Good Maybe my alt but definitely not my Main. Right know nothing would make me spec into it. What the point about running for a long time if you run slow as hell ? CCP Bring Melee weapon based on stamina buff our bonus by AT LEAST 3 and THEN it will be useful. Amarr are the storm trooper ? Yes it dies from stick and stones and can't kill a single ennemy even if there is 20 stormtrooper against 1 ennemy. Sounds like you are referring to all scouts? It's a bird! No it's a plane! Never mind it's just my shotgun in your face!
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3727	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:44:00 - [66] - Quote Freakn BUMP.I want CCP to READ this.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 2986	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:45:00 - [67] - Quote Again. Any damage bonus to scrambler pistols and a scout would be ridiculous over powered. A rate of fire bonus is moot as you can't even fire as fast as the ROF allows anything past the TT-3 unless you're using a modded controller. Also the frame rate in this game isn't even good enough for you feasibly fire any of the pistols past he TT-3 as fast as they can fire. Pistol bonus is simply ridiculous. You want a pistol bonus? Put on a commando suit. If you want a specific bonus pistol are not the thing to lobby for. That's all the arguing I've got for today. Toodles :3 Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3729	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:49:00 - [68] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Again. Any damage bonus to scrambler pistols and a scout would be ridiculous over powered. A rate of fire bonus is moot as you can't even fire as fast as the ROF allows anything past the TT-3 unless you're using a modded controller. Also the frame rate in this game isn't even good enough for you feasibly fire any of the pistols past he TT-3 as fast as they can fire. Pistol bonus is simply ridiculous. You want a pistol bonus? Put on a commando suit. If you want a specific bonus pistol are not the thing to lobby for. You know whats OP? 3 Complex damage mods worth in damage for Minny scouts or 3 armor rep on an armor suit while the Amarr scout gets a bonus worth LESS than a MILITIA Module.... AGAIN, its silly to poke at it moody. Its just so SPECIFIC..... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 348	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:49:00 - [69] - Quote So I m pretty convinced that some people in this thread either ; a) run minnie scouts and can't wait to become OMGWTFPWNAGE or b) have a grudge against amarr stuff To not see how completely horrible the amarrian bonus is (i.e. less than a militia module worth) is to be a bald face liar. To not be able to see how 5 modules worth of bonuses (i.e. 3 cmplx damage mods, 1 cmplx code breaker and 1 standard code breaker) is completely broken is to be a liar as well. It has been shown over and over again, in relative and quantitative terms how the scouts are currently unbalanced. This part of the discussion is OVER. CCP: I believe these values are basically fair: Minmatar- +2% sidearm damage per lvl (comes out to 1 free complex dmg mod) +3% hacking speed per lvl (comes out to an advance dmod) (the inate +5% hacking speed bonus then is the basic mod) Gallente: are fine, leave them alone Caldari: +5% dropsuit scan rdius per lvl (unchanged, basic mod equivalent) + 7% scan precision per lvl (complex and adv) Amarr : + 20% stamina/stamina recovery per lvl (makes 1 complex module) ??? +17 armor HP/lvl (this would make 1 basic and 1 adv ferroscale) This makes the minnie scout the infiltrator, the gallente scout the spy, the caldari scout the recon, and the amarrian scout the front-line scout. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3729	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:53:00 - [70] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: So I m pretty convinced that some people in this thread either ; a) run minnie scouts and can't wait to become OMGWTFPWNAGE or b) have a grudge against amarr stuff To not see how completely horrible the amarrian bonus is (i.e. less than a militia module worth) is to be a bald face liar. To not be able to see how 5 modules worth of bonuses (i.e. 3 cmplx damage mods, 1 cmplx code breaker and 1 standard code breaker) is completely broken is to be a liar as well. It has been shown over and over again, in relative and quantitative terms how the scouts are currently unbalanced. This part of the discussion is OVER. CCP: I believe these values are basically fair: Minmatar- +2% sidearm damage per lvl (comes out to 1 free complex dmg mod) +3% hacking speed per lvl (comes out to an advance dmod) (the inate +5% hacking speed bonus then is the basic mod) Gallente: are fine, leave them alone Caldari: +5% dropsuit scan rdius per lvl (unchanged, basic mod equivalent) + 7% scan precision per lvl (complex and adv) Amarr : + 20% stamina/stamina recovery per lvl (makes 1 complex module) ??? +17 armor HP/lvl (this would make 1 basic and 1 adv ferroscale) This makes the minnie scout the infiltrator, the gallente scout the spy, the caldari scout the recon, and the amarrian scout the front-line scout. Im stealing that bonus for my OP..... BTW,dont forget the GAllentes ALSO have an Enhanced Armor repair Module INCLUDED..... ;) GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.

Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 348	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:57:00 - [71] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: So I m pretty convinced that some people in this thread either ; a) run minnie scouts and can't wait to become OMGWTFPWNAGE or b) have a grudge against amarr stuff To not see how completely horrible the amarrian bonus is (i.e. less than a militia module worth) is to be a bald face liar. To not be able to see how 5 modules worth of bonuses (i.e. 3 cmplx damage mods, 1 cmplx code breaker and 1 standard code breaker) is completely broken is to be a liar as well. It has been shown over and over again, in relative and quantitative terms how the scouts are currently unbalanced. This part of the discussion is OVER. CCP: I believe these values are basically fair: Minmatar- +2% sidearm damage per lvl (comes out to 1 free complex dmg mod) +3% hacking speed per lvl (comes out to an advance dmod) (the inate +5% hacking speed bonus then is the basic mod) Gallente: are fine, leave them alone Caldari: +5% dropsuit scan rdius per lvl (unchanged, basic mod equivalent) + 7% scan precision per lvl (complex and adv) Amarr : + 20% stamina/stamina recovery per lvl (makes 1 complex module) ??? +17 armor HP/lvl (this would make 1 basic and 1 adv ferroscale) This makes the minnie scout the infiltrator, the gallente scout the spy, the caldari scout the recon, and the amarrian scout the front-line scout. Im stealing that bonus for my OP..... BTW,dont forget the GAllentes ALSO have an Enhanced Armor repair Module INCLUDED..... ;) oh I calculated for it The gallente have 1 complex mod (25% dampner) 1 enhanced mod (3 hp/sec) and 1 basic mod (25% scan radius) worth of bonuses, just like everyone else. If you look, I also increased the caldari scan precision to 7% per level to make it also equivelent to 1 complex and one enhanced mod. This would actually allow them to see all but the gallente scout without additional mods passively. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
GRIM GEAR The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 164	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:02:00 - [72] - Quote I just want to say I have lost count of how many times I have died as a result of running out of stamina while scouting. To be fair the Amarrian scout bonus is a little lack luster though KING CHECKMATE would you prefer to have the Nova Knives bonus on you're Amarr scout suit? Because I don't mind using the Amarr scout suit over the Minmatar scout suit if it has 5% added to Nova Knive damage per level. Infact according to you the current stamina bonus is useless let's trade the useless Amarr scout suit stamina bonus with the OVER POWERED Minmatar scout suit Nova Knives bonus. Would that make you happy no? I didn't think so. It's a bird! No it's a plane! Never mind it's just my shotgun in your face!
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 349	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:05:00 - [73] - Quote GRIM GEAR wrote: I just want to say I have lost count of how many times I have died as a result of running out of stamina while scouting. To be fair the Amarrian scout bonus is a little lack luster though KING CHECKMATE would you prefer to have the Nova Knives bonus on you're Amarr scout suit? Because I don't mind using the Amarr scout suit over the Minmatar scout suit if it has 5% added to Nova Knive damage per level. Infact according to you the current stamina bonus is useless let's trade the useless Amarr scout suit stamina bonus with the OVER POWERED Minmatar scout suit Nova Knives bonus. Would that make you happy no? I didn't think so. I guess nobody knows how to read a thread before they post in it do they? Minnie bonuses are worth 5 modules, the amarr bonus is not even worth one* *seriously, you can not find a module that gives you this small of a bonus to stamina/recovery in the game. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
Bojo The Mighty L.O.T.I.S. 2752	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:05:00 - [74] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: 1-212 HP.Increasing the Gap between GAllente and Amarr armor all the way up to 50.Now i can take 2 more Combat rifle bullets than you.LOL.If its so ''impressive'', let Gallentes take the HP difference and give US the 3 per sec armor repair....YEAH,dint think so.... 2-''customary amongst Amarr suits so there's something. '' You know what else is customary about Amarr suits? Having More CPU and PG than others, which the A.Scout does not. So no ,there is nothing... 3-You do have a point here, Kudos. But still, every other scout has a bonus that affects their capacity to survive or to attack. The amarr has stamina that affects neither terrain coverage...wich considering the amound of vehicles out there....doesnt sound very appealing. 1) it's not impressive by medium frame standards but we're talking scout here, where 10 HP difference means dead or alive. 2) Yeah that is weird I don't imagine why it's got more CPU but less PG. I think to know why we would need to know the intention of the Amarr Scout. But still, be happy you do not have 2 slots at basic. I think you just have to try it out because Stamina is such a weird concept to try and apply mentally when really the results speak for themselves on the battlefield rather than in a statistical readout. I don't know how the Amarr scout will turn out but I just don't think it will be dismal or worthless. It might prove to be over-situational but we'll see. Check out latest BSOTT Guide
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2010	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:12:00 - [75] - Quote Ohhhh, so ya want a war? Hey CCP! How come this "scout" doesn't have 3/3 set up? Give it a bonus to uplinks and a bunch of ehp. Really, you wanna fight with the original scout just so you can be better? Shame. King, I thought better of you. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3730	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:13:00 - [76] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: 1-212 HP.Increasing the Gap between GAllente and Amarr armor all the way up to 50.Now i can take 2 more Combat rifle bullets than you.LOL.If its so ''impressive'', let Gallentes take the HP difference and give US the 3 per sec armor repair....YEAH,dint think so.... 2-''customary amongst Amarr suits so there's something. '' You know what else is customary about Amarr suits? Having More CPU and PG than others, which the A.Scout does not. So no ,there is nothing... 3-You do have a point here, Kudos. But still, every other scout has a bonus that affects their capacity to survive or to attack. The amarr has stamina that affects neither terrain coverage...wich considering the amound of vehicles out there....doesnt sound very appealing. 1) it's not impressive by medium frame standards but we're talking scout here, where 10 HP difference means dead or alive. 2) Yeah that is weird I don't imagine why it's got more CPU but less PG. I think to know why we would need to know the intention of the Amarr Scout. But still, be happy you do not have 2 slots at basic. I think you just have to try it out because Stamina is such a weird concept to try and apply mentally when really the results speak for themselves on the battlefield rather than in a statistical readout. I don't know how the Amarr scout will turn out but I just don't think it will be dismal or worthless. It might prove to be over-situational but we'll see. I will skill into Amarr scout. Proto level. Day one regardless it even has a bonus or not... Im ALSO not saying its worthless. I will also,as always, if i find a way to use it ,share it. Im just saying at first glance, the Amarr Scout looks UNDERPOWERED compared to the other scouts suits. Unless... The AV Amarr blade is somehow related to Stamina............... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
GRIM GEAR The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 164	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:16:00 - [77] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: GRIM GEAR wrote: I just want to say I have lost count of how many times I have died as a result of running out of stamina while scouting. To be fair the Amarrian scout bonus is a little lack luster though KING CHECKMATE would you prefer to have the Nova Knives bonus on you're Amarr scout suit? Because I don't mind using the Amarr scout suit over the Minmatar scout suit if it has 5% added to Nova Knive damage per level. Infact according to you the current stamina bonus is useless let's trade the useless Amarr scout suit stamina bonus with the OVER POWERED Minmatar scout suit Nova Knives bonus. Would that make you happy no? I didn't think so. I guess nobody knows how to read a thread before they post in it do they? Minnie bonuses are worth 5 modules, the amarr bonus is not even worth one* *seriously, you can not find a module that gives you this small of a bonus to stamina/recovery in the game. Well Sir it seems as though you are the one who cannot read? If the Amarr scout suit traded its stamina bonus with the Minmatar Nova Knives bonus; the Amarr scout suit would have 2x complex & 1x Enhanced damage modules, 1x complex Ferroscale plate and with the higher base stamina compared to other scouts the Amarr scout suit practically has 1x basic cardio regulator. Eat them apples zucker. It's a bird! No it's a plane! Never mind it's just my shotgun in your face!
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3730	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:16:00 - [78] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: Ohhhh, so ya want a war? Hey CCP! How come this "scout" doesn't have 3/3 set up? Give it a bonus to uplinks and a bunch of ehp. Really, you wanna fight with the original scout just so you can be better? Shame. King, I thought better of you. I dont really know what you are implying here. Im saying the Amarr Scout is the WORST of them all,and im getting tired of this being the case always.... I yesterday went 50-4 with a M/1 series scout and a basic combat rifle, while playing SOLO in Dom.(For example) I dont need easy mode. I get r4ped sometimes, then i own sometimes. But requesting to put the Amarr scout to the other scout' level does not make me feel ashamed... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2012	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:20:00 - [79] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Ohhhh, so ya want a war? Hey CCP! How come this "scout" doesn't have 3/3 set up? Give it a bonus to uplinks and a bunch of ehp. Really, you wanna fight with the original scout just so you can be better? Shame. King, I thought better of you. I dont really know what you are implying here. Im saying the Amarr Scout is the WORST of them all,and im getting tired of this being the case always.... I yesterday went 50-4 with a M/1 series scout and a basic combat rifle, while playing SOLO in Dom.(For example) I dont need easy mode. I get r4ped sometimes, then i own sometimes. But requesting to put the Amarr scout to the other scout' level does not make me feel ashamed... Sir, I'm just being a little whiney gurl "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
GRIM GEAR The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:21:00 - [80] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Ohhhh, so ya want a war? Hey CCP! How come this "scout" doesn't have 3/3 set up? Give it a bonus to uplinks and a bunch of ehp. Really, you wanna fight with the original scout just so you can be better? Shame. King, I thought better of you. I dont really know what you are implying here. Im saying the Amarr Scout is the WORST of them all,and im getting tired of this being the case always.... I yesterday went 50-4 with a M/1 series scout and a basic combat rifle, while playing SOLO in Dom.(For example) I dont need easy mode. I get r4ped sometimes, then i own sometimes. But requesting to put the Amarr scout to the other scout' level does not make me feel ashamed... Sir, I'm just being a little whiney gurl It's a bird! No it's a plane! Never mind it's just my shotgun in your face!

KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3730	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:22:00 - [81] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: Sir, I'm just being a little whiney gurl Oh.i see...then ...moving on... XD GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
GRIM GEAR The Enclave Syndicate Dark Taboo 165	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:23:00 - [82] - Quote Bumping this o for awesome thread. Twice because I am that nice. No sarcasm here. It's a bird! No it's a plane! Never mind it's just my shotgun in your face!
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 3191	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:34:00 - [83] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Marad''er wrote: I'm going to skill into amarr scout regardless. However I agree with what you're saying. Amarr regardless of suit should have highest pg and CPU. At least pg. 4 pg equates to at LEAST 30 CPU!! THANK YOU. Yeah im speccing into it becase ive waited so long and have so many useless cr*p already that whatever...But doesnt mean i cant post this and try to get it on equal grounds with the other scouts... I mean, AT LEAST ,add a 5% Profile scan per level next to the stamina bonus...AT LEAST.... Across the scout suits at proto, the "average" ratio between the two is 1 PG for every 5.12 CPU. For the Amarr suit specifically, they have 1 PG for every 4.86 CPU. I'd generally assume that the Amarr would have higher PG than the other races because of the PG costs of laser weapons, if nothing else. The scout suit with the highest PG stat (Gallente) has weapons like the AR/Ion Pistol, the PRO PG reqs on those are 13/6 respectively, while the PG reqs on Amarr weaponry like SR/ScP are 20/8 at PRO. Gallente even have a 0 PG weapon (Plasma Cannon) that would be more demanding of CPU than anything else. Join my cult.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 3192	Posted - 2014.01.18 00:48:00 - [84] - Quote GRIM GEAR wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: GRIM GEAR wrote: I just want to say I have lost count of how many times I have died as a result of running out of stamina while scouting. To be fair the Amarrian scout bonus is a little lack luster though KING CHECKMATE would you prefer to have the Nova Knives bonus on you're Amarr scout suit? Because I don't mind using the Amarr scout suit over the Minmatar scout suit if it has 5% added to Nova Knive damage per level. Infact according to you the current stamina bonus is useless let's trade the useless Amarr scout suit stamina bonus with the OVER POWERED Minmatar scout suit Nova Knives bonus. Would that make you happy no? I didn't think so. I guess nobody knows how to read a thread before they post in it do they? Minnie bonuses are worth 5 modules, the amarr bonus is not even worth one* *seriously, you can not find a module that gives you this small of a bonus to stamina/recovery in the game. Well Sir it seems as though you are the one who cannot read? If the Amarr scout suit traded its stamina bonus with the Minmatar Nova Knives bonus; the Amarr scout suit would have 2x complex & 1x Enhanced damage modules, 1x complex Ferroscale plate and with the higher base stamina compared to other scouts the Amarr scout suit practically has 1x basic cardio regulator. Eat them apples zucker. It's literally impossible to make the Amarr even with the Minmatar suit with modules because there is no module that increases movement speed. A kinetic cat can only help sprint speed. So... priceless there. If you're just going on stat comparison as well, the Minmatar (even without the 5% per level suit skill hacking bonus) has a 5% hacking bonus over the Amarr. You'd also need modules to compensate for the shield recharge depleted delay difference (minny is faster) and shield recharge amount (minny is higher by 33% - higher than an ADV recharger, so a complex mod there). The base stamina difference between the scouts doesn't rise to the level a basic cardiac regulator either. The Amarr Commando can run 5 seconds longer than a Gallente/Caldari Commando. No bonuses involved. That's a stat difference. The Amarr Scout can run 1.5 seconds longer than the minmatar (with no bonuses). 2.5 seconds longer than the Caldari/Gallente. If the Amarr Scout actually had a base of 25% more stamina than the minmatar, they'd be able to run for 5.25 seconds longer.. they can't even do half that. Join my cult.
True Adamance Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 5858	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:01:00 - [85] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg/hack bonus bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Then I feel its fair to reduce the values of the other racial bonuses to bring them more in line with ADV modules. 25%, to my understanding, reduction in hacking time for scouts and your melee bonus? That doesn't seem a little rough to you does it? "My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3733	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:28:00 - [86] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: correction: with skills you'll be sprinting for 29.5 seconds straight innately. While this seems unappealing at a first glance, as a long time scout, you have no idea how much stamina affects play. If you run out of stamina you can't leap over rails to get away, you can't bunny hop and tap sprint to dodge fire. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but to me this is actually a very good bonus. While it seems bland and people keep talking about the minmatar's dmg/hack bonus bonus you need to consider this as well: we have to equip knives to use it. Knives are a 1.5 m weapon requiring skill to use and failure means instant death. The hacking bonus means we have to stand still and exposed to make use of it and failure means instant death. Two EXTREMELY specific bonuses that make the minmatar the most specialized scout. This large bonus to stamina gives you more utility in one suit. You don't have to build your suit/playstyle specifically to the suit allowing for more variety in one suit. I realize that it seems boring but trust me. This bonus is pretty good. Not exciting but all around pretty useful. Then I feel its fair to reduce the values of the other racial bonuses to bring them more in line with ADV modules. 25%, to my understanding, reduction in hacking time for scouts and your melee bonus? That doesn't seem a little rough to you does it? +1 GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
True Adamance Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 5863	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:44:00 - [87] - Quote ..... "My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1617	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:46:00 - [88] - Quote 80 replies with good information should get CCP's attention.... "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3735	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:50:00 - [89] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: 80 replies with good information should get CCP's attention.... Hopefully. Again. I do see how the Amarr scout is SUPERIOR to anything else scouts have had in the past. But this is not about my prefered class SCOUT,more about my Race, Amarr. i've waited for SO long its just a sour taste to see the suit has (yet again) a disappointing bonus. Why do i say yet again? Well removing the Laser weaponry heat buildup bonus from the Amarr assault? seriously? Amarr commando bonuses. >.> Sentinel laser weaponry bonus?WITHOUT heavy laser? Amarr always get the crappy bonuses.... :\| WHY CCP, Why CCP Wolfman? Y U DO DIS? GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1617	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:57:00 - [90] - Quote Ikr kinda like the Amarr scouts getting a bonus to uplinks it just doesn't go good with it. "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein

KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3736	Posted - 2014.01.18 02:00:00 - [91] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Ikr kinda like the Amarr scouts getting a bonus to uplinks it just doesn't go good with it. You know what would be cool? Since amarr are all about Laser weaponry and ranged combat...? a Bonus for laser rifles... Like 10% Range per level and 5% damage per level. XD Then the stamina would be of use,because these scouts would need to take higher positions to attack there by need the movement... If someone likes it i'll put it in the OP XD GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3745	Posted - 2014.01.18 22:30:00 - [92] - Quote Cof cof..im back.. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
pseudosnipre 570	Posted - 2014.01.20 19:50:00 - [93] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Cof cof..im back.. Do you come bearing constructive criticism? Stamina doesn't seem to be your thing. Without referring to other racial suits, can you suggest some bonuses that you would like to see included? Here are some of mine: +10 armor hp/lvl +2% dmg to SCR (charge-shot only)/lvl +1 carried (not deployed) uplink/lvl +5% fitting bonus to uplinks/lvl I've tried to think of things that would make my suit more effective in the above ideas: slightly more tank for retreats, higher alpha options, not running out of uplinks when I actually survive long enough to get into an ideal spot, and ease of fitting proto gear. By not thinking in terms of modules but instead in terms of non-module based perks, I'm sure you can think of something better than those I've suggested. o7 Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
Phazoid The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 237	Posted - 2014.01.20 21:04:00 - [94] - Quote hmmmm, i think i kind of agree with mollerz, the amarr while having lower speed can outrun everyone with that extra stamina, and if you put a complex cardiac regulator, i believe it stacks, a complex kinetic catalizer, the amarr is tankier and runs for a longer time, if we look at it the amarr scout is the suit that lasts the longest on the battlefield, with extended eHP and extended stamina, yes, maybe it is a little simple as a bonus, but the amarr also has the scout bonus, stamina is one of the most important things, i have died more than i care to admit because of lack of stamina, i will simplify this, the amarr scout is the hunter, capable of taking a hit, and doing multiple manouvers, and taking a couple hits, this scout will probably use a shotgun, he will take all the shortcuts, and have the stamina to jump and kill and dissapear thanks to the cloak, btw yes im a scout and i use gallente scout, and will skill all the way into caldari scout Dragons don't have friends. The nearest we can get to the idea is an enemy who is still alive.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3827	Posted - 2014.01.20 22:20:00 - [95] - Quote Phazoid wrote: hmmmm, i think i kind of agree with mollerz, the amarr while having lower speed can outrun everyone with that extra stamina, and if you put a complex cardiac regulator, i believe it stacks, a complex kinetic catalizer, the amarr is tankier and runs for a longer time, if we look at it the amarr scout is the suit that lasts the longest on the battlefield, with extended eHP and extended stamina, yes, maybe it is a little simple as a bonus, but the amarr also has the scout bonus, stamina is one of the most important things, i have died more than i care to admit because of lack of stamina, i will simplify this, the amarr scout is the hunter, capable of taking a hit, and doing multiple manouvers, and taking a couple hits, this scout will probably use a shotgun, he will take all the shortcuts, and have the stamina to jump and kill and dissapear thanks to the cloak, btw yes im a scout and i use gallente scout, and will skill all the way into caldari scout The problem is that the bonus does not have the same weight as the other scouts. If we keep stamina regen + Max stamina as a bonus,it should be 20% per level,for a total of 100% at level 5. GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Phazoid The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 238	Posted - 2014.01.20 23:51:00 - [96] - Quote honestly on paper it looks bland to me, but I dont know it may be a different story on the battlefield, maybe that extra stamina with the cloak can do wonders Dragons don't have friends. The nearest we can get to the idea is an enemy who is still alive.
KING CHECKMATE Ametat Security Amarr Empire 3832	Posted - 2014.01.20 23:54:00 - [97] - Quote Phazoid wrote: honestly on paper it looks bland to me, but I dont know it may be a different story on the battlefield, maybe that extra stamina with the cloak can do wonders Well. Any other scout can surpass easily the Amarr Scout stamina BONUS with a MLT cardiac regulator.So i doubt it is that impressive of a skill.... GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 936	Posted - 2014.01.21 00:00:00 - [98] - Quote So they should just raise it to 25% Stamina? "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
pseudosnipre 573	Posted - 2014.01.21 00:20:00 - [99] - Quote Roy Ventus wrote: So they should just raise it to 25% Stamina? Would rather see stamina recovery instantly at level 5 making perma-sprint and bunny hopping feasible AND it would take a lot of complex stamina mods to duplicate on other suits. Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.


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