DUST Search - Common Sense: Make the Assault class mirror the Logistics class

Drapedup Drippedout wrote:

CCP Remnant wrote:

I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot.

I don't get this at all? Why for assaults? Yeah it frees up fitting space for modules, but how does it help to set the class apart from the logis? It is an ASSAULT class, not a here, put whatever gun on whatever suit you want because it will cost a little less.

You take the Amarr Ak.0 where cpu/pg isn't really a problem, what good does this do? I'm a minmatar, we currently have the weakest assault suit out there and this bonus would be DOGSHIT. I fit the CR, the smallest CPU/PG hog in the game, Why would I want this bonus over a 10% ROF??? Hell, give me back my 100 SmG rnds/clip before you I get a fitting bonus to weapon and sidearm.

Look, unless there's something I'm missing where there will be a nerf to all suits' cpu/pg and running proto weaps will be hard to do...this bonus is pointless. If it doesn't help to distinguish the class from the other suits then why have it at all? A 10% ROF increase, and you will know an assault is on the field. It is a different class altogether. And within that class there are subtleties -- insert racial suits here.

If you just reduce light weapons fittings we will be right back in square one, watered down logistics suits as assault suits. I thought the whole point of this was to seperate the logi and the assault classes? Not just make a Logi suit with 1 equip slot???

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Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4835	Posted - 2014.01.10 17:59:00 - [61] - Quote I was going to say 5% zoom per level but thought 25% zoom might be too much, but in retrospect I suppose not. either way, there are better bonuses for rail weaponry ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4835	Posted - 2014.01.13 07:51:00 - [62] - Quote Giving this a bump since CCP Remnant is doing a lot of discussion about scout bonuses, so if devs are up to discussing suit bonuses . . . ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Happy Violentime L0ST PR0FITS 174	Posted - 2014.01.13 08:40:00 - [63] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: I would love this to hell. My min assault would be able to fit my Proto ACR and Flaylock, and be good with both of them! I LIKE IT. IT MAKES SENSE. CCP WILL NEVER DO IT. Your mini assault is CPU crippled and would need to fit a CPU extender in a low. Whereas op is giving CPU bonuses to suits with more than 2 lows giving them wildly more fitting options.

CCP Remnant C C P C C P Alliance 603	Posted - 2014.01.13 08:55:00 - [64] - Quote I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot.

The-Errorist 458	Posted - 2014.01.13 09:41:00 - [65] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won!
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5514	Posted - 2014.01.13 09:43:00 - [66] - Quote I support this thread just because I get to keep my fire rate. I don't want to lose the Assault fire rate bonus because I want to hear a duvolle fire at an extreme RPM higher than a balac Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos

CCP Remnant C C P C C P Alliance 613	Posted - 2014.01.13 09:46:00 - [67] - Quote The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress.

The-Errorist 458	Posted - 2014.01.13 09:46:00 - [68] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: I support this thread just because I get to keep my fire rate. I don't want to lose the Assault fire rate bonus because I want to hear a duvolle fire at an extreme RPM higher than a balac A balac will have an insane RoF then and sound even better.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4858	Posted - 2014.01.13 09:48:00 - [69] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. Glad you like the Assault role bonus. What do you think of the racial bonuses? Not necessarily the exact ones listed, but the idea that they should be bonuses aimed at making certain weapons operate better. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5518	Posted - 2014.01.13 10:00:00 - [70] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. Remnant, keep the 10% ROF for Gallente Assault please, I want to hear the Duvolle ROAR :3 Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos

Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4871	Posted - 2014.01.13 10:15:00 - [71] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. Remnant, keep the 10% ROF for Gallente Assault please, I want to hear the Duvolle ROAR :3 I see what you did there, but you're not fooling anyone. The bonus was 5% per level. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5520	Posted - 2014.01.13 10:18:00 - [72] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. Remnant, keep the 10% ROF for Gallente Assault please, I want to hear the Duvolle ROAR :3 I see what you did there, but you're not fooling anyone. The bonus was 5% per level. 2% per level, 10% at max level. But if you want to buff it to 5% per level be my guest Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4875	Posted - 2014.01.13 10:19:00 - [73] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Remnant, keep the 10% ROF for Gallente Assault please, I want to hear the Duvolle ROAR :3 I see what you did there, but you're not fooling anyone. The bonus was 5% per level. 2% per level, 10% at max level. But if you want to buff it to 5% per level be my guest D'oh, I've been up for too long ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 7834	Posted - 2014.01.13 11:01:00 - [74] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Remnant, keep the 10% ROF for Gallente Assault please, I want to hear the Duvolle ROAR :3 I see what you did there, but you're not fooling anyone. The bonus was 5% per level. 2% per level, 10% at max level. But if you want to buff it to 5% per level be my guest D'oh, I've been up for too long This seems like a good time to chime in on the Gallente bonus. 25% RoF is -ridiculously- powerful as a bonus. It probably shouldn't come in that high, as much as I'd love it. But more RoF would do wonders for the plasma rifle. Although once it was king due to being the only rifle the new ranges and rifles have relegated it to being one of the worst rifles. Any assault weapon can compete with it or outperform it in most ways, with the possible exception of the ARR. This bonus would change things. RoF is important in CQC and it would also give the plasma rifle the DPS it needs to actually outperform other rifles at CQC, as it should. As a blaster it should completely destroy things in close range. So the RoF bonus is something I would absolutely love to see on the PR. The numbers are something to quibble ove, of course, but that would be an excellent bonus for the PR that would give it some life. Level 7 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 904	Posted - 2014.01.13 14:33:00 - [75] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Please go for this, the RoF bonus cancels out the bonuses that the Sentinels and Commandos will soon have. Uprising 1.7 - TANKDOMINATION!!1!!1! LOL Commando LOL Plasma Cannon
Ghost Kaisar Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising 1837	Posted - 2014.01.13 14:35:00 - [76] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. \O/ Get over it. If you don't play to win in FW, then you're playing for Caldari. -Patrick57 Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
Maximus Stryker Who Are Those Guys 772	Posted - 2014.01.13 14:41:00 - [77] - Quote this is great and I like a lot. What are your thoughts on Sentinel, Commando and Scout? (same a purposed in other threads from data dump or did you have something else in mind?) *Faction Channels for FW Staging* PIE Ground Control \| Caldari Hierarchy \| Turalyon \| Chosen Matari
Drapedup Drippedout 0uter.Heaven 181	Posted - 2014.01.13 15:03:00 - [78] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. I don't get this at all? Why for assaults? Yeah it frees up fitting space for modules, but how does it help to set the class apart from the logis? It is an ASSAULT class, not a here, put whatever gun on whatever suit you want because it will cost a little less. You take the Amarr Ak.0 where cpu/pg isn't really a problem, what good does this do? I'm a minmatar, we currently have the weakest assault suit out there and this bonus would be DOGSHIT. I fit the CR, the smallest CPU/PG hog in the game, Why would I want this bonus over a 10% ROF??? Hell, give me back my 100 SmG rnds/clip before you I get a fitting bonus to weapon and sidearm. Look, unless there's something I'm missing where there will be a nerf to all suits' cpu/pg and running proto weaps will be hard to do...this bonus is pointless. If it doesn't help to distinguish the class from the other suits then why have it at all? A 10% ROF increase, and you will know an assault is on the field. It is a different class altogether. And within that class there are subtleties -- insert racial suits here. If you just reduce light weapons fittings we will be right back in square one, watered down logistics suits as assault suits. I thought the whole point of this was to seperate the logi and the assault classes? Not just make a Logi suit with 1 equip slot???
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4912	Posted - 2014.01.13 15:23:00 - [79] - Quote Drapedup Drippedout wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. I don't get this at all? Why for assaults? Yeah it frees up fitting space for modules, but how does it help to set the class apart from the logis? It is an ASSAULT class, not a here, put whatever gun on whatever suit you want because it will cost a little less. You take the Amarr Ak.0 where cpu/pg isn't really a problem, what good does this do? I'm a minmatar, we currently have the weakest assault suit out there and this bonus would be DOGSHIT. I fit the CR, the smallest CPU/PG hog in the game, Why would I want this bonus over a 10% ROF??? Hell, give me back my 100 SmG rnds/clip before you I get a fitting bonus to weapon and sidearm. Look, unless there's something I'm missing where there will be a nerf to all suits' cpu/pg and running proto weaps will be hard to do...this bonus is pointless. If it doesn't help to distinguish the class from the other suits then why have it at all? A 10% ROF increase, and you will know an assault is on the field. It is a different class altogether. And within that class there are subtleties -- insert racial suits here. If you just reduce light weapons fittings we will be right back in square one, watered down logistics suits as assault suits. I thought the whole point of this was to seperate the logi and the assault classes? Not just make a Logi suit with 1 equip slot??? You wouldn't go with the same stats as assault suits now, you would adjust them appropriately. And having a weaponry fitting reduction would help assaults the same way a fitting reduction for euipment helps logis. If done properly, Assaults would be the only role capable of running two prototype weapons without making sacrifices 10% ROF increase and it fails to account for quite a bit of frontline weaponry like the scrambler rifle. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Kaughst WarRavens League of Infamy 172	Posted - 2014.01.13 15:30:00 - [80] - Quote I came on the forums for the first time in a while to Like and say that I support a direction like this with suit bonuses. Step 1: Take Districts Step 2: ??? Step 3: Profit Cow for Kaughst

Severance Pay Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 1009	Posted - 2014.01.13 15:42:00 - [81] - Quote Seems commonsense to me that logis would mirror the heavy class and assaults would be some where in between. We few, we happy few, we band of brothers; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me Shall be my brother
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI 8020	Posted - 2014.01.13 16:32:00 - [82] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. I would strongly suggest having the assaults have bonuses that enhance their weapons. Assaults are about offense, the bonuses should reflect that. If you have a bonus like CPU/PG reduction that doesn't increase weapon performance, then I STRONGLY suggest having racial bonuses that do increase effectiveness of racial weapon. I would be fine with a crappy badly thought out role bonus, the more serious issue are the role bonuses you guys are thinking of implementing. I cannt emphasize enough that assaults should have bonuses to enhance their race's weapons (magazine size, heat buildup reduction, etc). Basically the racial bonuses are a much much bigger issue than the role bonus. Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 1872	Posted - 2014.01.13 16:36:00 - [83] - Quote CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Give me back my laser heat build reduction, please i beg of you. I love my Amarr Ass suit with scram rifle but i just do not see a reason to stick with the amarr assault suit without this bonus. Selling Templar BPO 300Mil Earn 50Mil+ ISK in Dust
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12011	Posted - 2014.01.13 16:58:00 - [84] - Quote Drapedup Drippedout wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. I don't get this at all? Why for assaults? Yeah it frees up fitting space for modules, but how does it help to set the class apart from the logis? It is an ASSAULT class, not a here, put whatever gun on whatever suit you want because it will cost a little less. You take the Amarr Ak.0 where cpu/pg isn't really a problem, what good does this do? I'm a minmatar, we currently have the weakest assault suit out there and this bonus would be DOGSHIT. I fit the CR, the smallest CPU/PG hog in the game, Why would I want this bonus over a 10% ROF??? Hell, give me back my 100 SmG rnds/clip before you I get a fitting bonus to weapon and sidearm. Look, unless there's something I'm missing where there will be a nerf to all suits' cpu/pg and running proto weaps will be hard to do...this bonus is pointless. If it doesn't help to distinguish the class from the other suits then why have it at all? A 10% ROF increase, and you will know an assault is on the field. It is a different class altogether. And within that class there are subtleties -- insert racial suits here. If you just reduce light weapons fittings we will be right back in square one, watered down logistics suits as assault suits. I thought the whole point of this was to seperate the logi and the assault classes? Not just make a Logi suit with 1 equip slot??? Lowered weapons (which typically eats the most cpu and grid of some of my fits. Allows me to fit heavier modules elsewhere such as damage mods, shields, biotics, and armor and many other things an assault find useful to get to the front lines and kill. This bonus also applies to all light weapons near perfectly useful where as the ROF only applies to full auto weapons which is only about a third of all weapons. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 4922	Posted - 2014.01.13 17:43:00 - [85] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. I would strongly suggest having the assaults have bonuses that enhance their weapons. Assaults are about offense, the bonuses should reflect that. If you have a bonus like CPU/PG reduction that doesn't increase weapon performance, then I STRONGLY suggest having racial bonuses that do increase effectiveness of racial weapon. I would be fine with a crappy badly thought out role bonus, the more serious issue are the role bonuses you guys are thinking of implementing. I cannt emphasize enough that assaults should have bonuses to enhance their race's weapons (magazine size, heat buildup reduction, etc). Basically the racial bonuses are a much much bigger issue than the role bonus. A CPU/PG reduction weaponry bonus is a bonus for offensive capabilities as it allows you to fit better weapons (without needing to make sacrifices). Definitely agree that the racial bonuses should also be bonuses aimed towards the effectiveness of racial weapons. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Ghost Kaisar Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising 1843	Posted - 2014.01.13 19:05:00 - [86] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: The-Errorist wrote: CCP Remnant wrote: I like the idea of a 5% reduction of CPU/PG of all light weapons and sidearms per level a lot. Common sense won! Common sense is a harsh mistress. I would strongly suggest having the assaults have bonuses that enhance their weapons. Assaults are about offense, the bonuses should reflect that. If you have a bonus like CPU/PG reduction that doesn't increase weapon performance, then I STRONGLY suggest having racial bonuses that do increase effectiveness of racial weapon. I would be fine with a crappy badly thought out role bonus, the more serious issue are the role bonuses you guys are thinking of implementing. I cannt emphasize enough that assaults should have bonuses to enhance their race's weapons (magazine size, heat buildup reduction, etc). Basically the racial bonuses are a much much bigger issue than the role bonus. A CPU/PG reduction weaponry bonus is a bonus for offensive capabilities as it allows you to fit better weapons (without needing to make sacrifices). Definitely agree that the racial bonuses should also be bonuses aimed towards the effectiveness of racial weapons. Yup Yup! I want my Minnie Assault to have bonuses toward it's racial weapons: The CR, MD, Flaylock, and MD. I would love to go full Winmatar, and trash anyone who dares use my weapons on another suit. Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face. Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
hgghyujh Expert Intervention Caldari State 217	Posted - 2014.01.14 00:32:00 - [87] - Quote +1 very well thought out, I am assuming you are lumping the scram in with lasers, if so you should clarify, if not well it should be. Also a 25% dps increase to ARs is a bit much Other wise very awesome. This is a much better Idea then turning them in to faster killers when most people think ttk is too low anyways.
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 2857	Posted - 2014.01.14 00:36:00 - [88] - Quote +all of the likes that have been given on this forum and any other forum in the history of forums That is pure genius!!!!! Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // D-Uni instructor
Zero Harpuia Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 1418	Posted - 2014.01.14 01:02:00 - [89] - Quote The Gallente and Caldari ones are pretty bad. The Minmatar one is also kinda iffy on a racial standpoint. The Gallente one is a direct increase to Damage Per Second, and also makes the recoil checks happen faster. If the Gallente weapons ever GET a decent recoil, that would make skilling into them detrimental as your sustained accuracy would decrease. The Caldari one is a tiny, tiny buff to the already miniscule charge period on RR, or a iffy buff on the balanced-to-it's-charge Charge Rifle. The only Rail weapons with charge times big enough to really feel are on the Heavy and vehicles, so it feels like a bit of a waste. The zoom is also iffy, because if you cannot manually adjust the zoom then getting a more powerful scope can screw over as often as help. It would force Caldari players to battle from farther and farther away, or to adjust their ADS sensitivity whenever they switched to Caldari. As for the Minmatar, explosives are NOT the Minmatar's thing, or not JUST their thing. Rockets and Missiles are more of a Caldari weapon, as evidenced by the Swarm Launcher. They manifest as a Minmatar weapon here because it was the only way to make a man-portable Artillery Turret was to make it a mortar/grenade launcher. As for the grenades and remote explosives, they are not only not 'weapons' on a slot-minded sense, but they are more of a racial checklist, handing out the initial equipment in a cycle to keep each race 'equal.' Also, the main point of the thread has a glaring issue. If you make the Assault suit equal to the Logistics suit, you make them equal. It sounds mental that way, but let me explain. If the suits are the same sans bonuses, with the only difference being an equipment slot or a sidearm slot, what's the difference? A 5% reduction to the fitting of a gun is about equal to the 5% reduction from equipment, so the two suits would be almost identical. Unlike EVE there isn't a huge role distinction because of huge competition for slots. I can't fire my sidearm and main weapon at the same time, so having two guns being able to fit on me isn't nearly as important as it would be on a Hurricane. Also, I don't have to chose 'weapon OR repair' for my high slots because of the differentiation of Weapon and Equip slots. Also, you can't really have a noncombat role in an FPS like you can in EVE, everyone is going to have as big a gun as they can get. So in short, why would you go Logi if a squad of Assaults can carry the equipment between themselves and have combat bonuses? Logi would need HUGE bonuses to the OUTPUT of their tools, as would Assaults. Maybe compensate by weakening the weapons or upping HP so that Assaults kill noticeably faster, and that other classes have a lower output with the same weaponry. Scouts compensate with their speed and closing power, so they can use more powerful weapons like Shotty or knives. Heavies have tons of HP and the strictly more powerful Heavy class of weapons. The Logi would end up being the weakest in combat because it would then share the same weapons as an Assault, but without any bonuses. This would make Logi players either use their tools to their fullest, with the huge role bonuses, or swap to Assault because it is the best Light weapon user. Anyway, I ramble. Shields as Weapons Zelda Dynasty Warriors is a real thing.
Auris Lionesse SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 55	Posted - 2014.01.14 01:08:00 - [90] - Quote Why does gallente get a useless bonus?



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