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RevoL Frog
The Generals
EoN.
229
   |
Posted - 2013.11.24 09:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am ashamed at your slackery!
You all know that charged shot is simply ridiculous. It's TAC AR 2.0 out there. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10607
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 09:58:00 -
[2] - Quote
because bpo whining is more important.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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RevoL Frog
The Generals
EoN.
229
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 09:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
I submit evidence of my claim here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnXa5GZszk8&t=9 |
Zatara Rought
Fatal Absolution
1768
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
SMH, one thread uses this to argue the logi and specifically the gallente logi are OP, this one uses it to argue the Scr is OP.
Just a funny observation. 
Master naders: Geniuses at evening the odds.
Favorite
Skype: Zatara.Rought
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RevoL Frog
The Generals
EoN.
229
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Zatara Rought wrote:SMH, one thread uses this to argue the logi and specifically the gallente logi are OP, this one uses it to argue the Scr is OP. Just a funny observation.
Good player in the video. He's using everything possible to his advantage, and I salute his abilities.
I see the problem as not the suit, but as the weapon. Had he been using a DuVolle it would have been much different story on several occasions. The only thing that even remotely comes close to the performance of the Imperial Scrambler Rifle is the pre-nerf TAC AR, and we know how that turned out. |
Lea Silencio
0uter.Heaven
Proficiency V.
742
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
^ Haters gon' hate!
Purification.
It's what I do.
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
916
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
RevoL Frog wrote:Zatara Rought wrote:SMH, one thread uses this to argue the logi and specifically the gallente logi are OP, this one uses it to argue the Scr is OP. Just a funny observation. Good player in the video. He's using everything possible to his advantage, and I salute his abilities. I see the problem as not the suit, but as the weapon. Had he been using a DuVolle it would have been much different story on several occasions. The only thing that even remotely comes close to the performance of the Imperial Scrambler Rifle is the pre-nerf TAC AR, and we know how that turned out.
I just watched a man go 51-0 tonight with a Duvolle. Nerf ARs.
After weighing the Pros and Cons of the ScR, I have determined it to be worse than the pernerf TAC.
Honestly though, the ScR is no more OP than the AR. They are both disgustingly OP, but don't try to pretend ARs are balanced.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
REMOVE ALL BPOs
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Michael Arck
Anubis Prime Syndicate
1874
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
Simple. Because the majority of the community uses it or have friends who use it. It's a boys club thing. If you're in it, you speak nothing of the SCR but say everything bad about AR. |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
76
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 10:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Agreed i think the Scambler Rifles are overpowered (the single shot ones) but a more OP weapon and the one that transcends all is the Core Grenade. I have them i dont like having to use them but you have to in PC battles especially against people that sit on a nanohive and spam them. They need to be fixed I suggest removing the cook option and possibly setting a 3 sec timer. |
Himiko Kuronaga
The Generals
EoN.
2352
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 11:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
Gota disagree here.
The scrambler is meant to do exactly this. It is a 1v1 superiority weapon with checks and balances that keep it from killing everybody at once like the TAC did. All fights in that video were picked intelligently, and it is the enemy teams fault for coming at him one at a time like an old kung fu movie.
The TAC had no business doing that nonsense however. The AR is a medium to close range kill-everyone device. The TAC was meant to give some versatility to a weapon skill that was never intended as an broad-range dueling superiority weapon. It was abused to an extreme extent and had no checks or balances, thanks to the lack of overheat, it could solo the universe quite easily at any range it pleased.
If a semi-auto weapon is incapable of 1v1 or range superiority, it has no real value. |
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Scheherazade VII
179
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Posted - 2013.11.24 11:51:00 -
[11] - Quote
RevoL Frog wrote:I am ashamed at your slackery!
You all know that charged shot is simply ridiculous. It's TAC AR 2.0 out there.
nah man the scrambler rifle charge shot barely does any damage what are you on about?
GêÜGëêDUST VIDEOSGëêGêÜ
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Pvt Numnutz
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
298
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 11:54:00 -
[12] - Quote
And so it begins...... |
Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
923
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 11:57:00 -
[13] - Quote
Your link is broken.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
REMOVE ALL BPOs
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xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 11:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane |
Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
923
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane
Its 1200 DPS on paper, but in practice it is much lower, unless modded controllers are involved.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
REMOVE ALL BPOs
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Mortedeamor
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
833
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:15:00 -
[16] - Quote
u know it getting buffed right? |
Scheherazade VII
179
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:28:00 -
[17] - Quote
the scrambler rifle is an absolute joke
im going to use it so im not at a disadvantage to those that do.
It destroys starter fits in 3 rounds which is half a second.
it makes the AR TTK look like before they changed the TTK.
Just stack damage mods and armour and anybody running less won't be able to mathematically take you down
before you take them down.
it really is the FOTM and needs more threads to be made about it. I won't stop QQ'ing until CCP realises
it's destroying the game.
it's the new invincibility mode crutch for scrubs who have no gun-game
and need to compensate by making their SCR do 100 damage per shot just to **** on everybody else.
really this game is just about damage output and HP, it's mathematical, not tactical.
I wish it revolved around skill but it doesn't/
GêÜGëêDUST VIDEOSGëêGêÜ
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Himiko Kuronaga
Mannar Focused Warfare
Gallente Federation
2354
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:31:00 -
[18] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane
Where is the heat cooldown time in that equation?
Burst =/= DPS.
But thats a small point, as we both know the burst is enough to kill nearly everybody. And thats how it should be. The weapon is meant to be advantageous in 1v1.
If it wasnt, why the hell would you ever use it? Semi-auto weapons with a heating mechanic are trickier to use and if there is no superiority payoff then it has no worth. Smart money says that combat rifle ends up wrecking it, anyway. |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
its not that hard any decent gamer can fire quite rapidly especially with a mouse and modded controllers are common i have one on an alt with prof 4 and it is clearly OP fun to use and awesome but OP the same. I would be ok with allowing this op weapon to go unchecked but in pc i see full squads running it and theyre even more deadly than duvolles. I dont like the power of duvolles but this thing is insane. Again i really dont mind all that much its the core grenades that holds my upmost hate. |
Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
923
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:36:00 -
[20] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:its not that hard any decent gamer can fire quite rapidly especially with a mouse and modded controllers are common i have one on an alt with prof 4 and it is clearly OP fun to use and awesome but OP the same. I would be ok with allowing this op weapon to go unchecked but in pc i see full squads running it and theyre even more deadly than duvolles. I dont like the power of duvolles but this thing is insane. Again i really dont mind all that much its the core grenades that holds my upmost hate.
I highly doubt you can fire 12.25 rounds per second consistently. For most people, 9-10 is the average.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
REMOVE ALL BPOs
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
144
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:47:00 -
[21] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane
This is stupid.
Your duvolle is fully automatic wity no recoil.
SCR is semi auto and has a huge Heat factor you can't fire as you wish.
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xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:50:00 -
[22] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:its not that hard any decent gamer can fire quite rapidly especially with a mouse and modded controllers are common i have one on an alt with prof 4 and it is clearly OP fun to use and awesome but OP the same. I would be ok with allowing this op weapon to go unchecked but in pc i see full squads running it and theyre even more deadly than duvolles. I dont like the power of duvolles but this thing is insane. Again i really dont mind all that much its the core grenades that holds my upmost hate. I highly doubt you can fire 12.25 rounds per second consistently. For most people, 9-10 is the average.
so then you do around 900 to 1000 dps im sry but thank you, compared to a duvolles 600 thats a solid 50% advantage |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 12:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane This is stupid. Your duvolle is fully automatic wity no recoil. SCR is semi auto and has a huge Heat factor you can't fire as you wish.
LOL again my main is a HMG have alts with both Duvolle and Imperial Rifles and between the two i find that the imperial is easy mode |
Himiko Kuronaga
Mannar Focused Warfare
Gallente Federation
2355
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 13:17:00 -
[24] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:its not that hard any decent gamer can fire quite rapidly especially with a mouse and modded controllers are common i have one on an alt with prof 4 and it is clearly OP fun to use and awesome but OP the same. I would be ok with allowing this op weapon to go unchecked but in pc i see full squads running it and theyre even more deadly than duvolles. I dont like the power of duvolles but this thing is insane. Again i really dont mind all that much its the core grenades that holds my upmost hate. I highly doubt you can fire 12.25 rounds per second consistently. For most people, 9-10 is the average. so then you do around 900 to 1000 dps im sry but thank you, compared to a duvolles 600 thats a solid 50% advantage
Again, the DPS is not that high. The burst is. Overheating stops it from achieving greater DPS than the AR.
So you're complaining about the frontloaded burst. That is the scrambler rifles gimmick which is why it dominates in 1v1.
The only thing you could potentially do is nerf the charge on it, but if you do that it will lose to the AR.
One weapon is going to be better than the other when they butt heads, its unavoidable. It sounds to me like you just want that weapon to be the AR, always, no matter what. |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 13:30:00 -
[25] - Quote
Balance as a weapons range increases its dps decreases that is all, the HMG has high dps point blank, the duvolle which im not a fan of has lower dps but more range. Fine let it have that crazy dps but reduce the range you shouldnt be able to have everything in a weapon its just pointless. |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 13:41:00 -
[26] - Quote
And on dps really? every weapon has a dps regardless if its in 1 shot or 66 if it fires it has dps. Damage per second how much damage does a gun do in a second thats all your looking into it too much. You cant deny the dps of a scrambler it fires 15 shots before it overheats and fires 11.7 in a sec which means it can fire for about 1.4 seconds which means that the dps of 900-1000 is correct (assuming human input) the only way it would have less dps is if the scrambler rifle overheated before it fired 1 second worth of rounds. Hope i explained that better.
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xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 14:03:00 -
[27] - Quote
Overheating prevents it from having as long as a continuous fire as the AR but leaves dps unchanged unless your comparing the dps of the entire clip of both weapons in which the scrambler would have significantly less but we both know neither weapon requires an entire clip to kill really only till your reach about 1800hp worth of damage (maxed out heavy) really all dps in its truest form determines who will kill first.
Pro cal assualt 700 hp Imperial will kill in 7 shots leaves 8 to be missed
Pro cal assualt 700 hp duvolle takes 14 shots about
who will win most likely the imperial guy simply becasue he has a built in advantage of at least 50% and up to almpst 100%
and since they have almost the same range their is nowhere for the AR to win he cant outrange or dps
hmg beats ar in close but ar can outrange, ar can beat laser but laser can outrange, laser beats sniper but sniper can outrange notice a pattern scrambler takes a sh*t on this ar has no mechanical advantage like the others hell technically the scrambler beats everything it shares a range or has more than. it beats hmg, ar, and shotgun (assuming you can survive initial shotgun shot which most pro suits can) |
Your Absolut End
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
220
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 14:47:00 -
[28] - Quote
yeah Scr must be soooo uber-op thats the reason why you see it as only used weapon in pc.......
oh wait.... you dont see ot used in pc, its the ar you see all the time....
the scr has been like it is since it is released, I always could go 30+ in pubmatches with it.
So is it now cool to #scramblerrage or what?
goddamned hipsters.....
Everytime an Ar user dies to another weapon its terrible Op and whatsoever. 
another one bites the Dust...
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
444
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:11:00 -
[29] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Overheating prevents it from having as long as a continuous fire as the AR but leaves dps unchanged unless your comparing the dps of the entire clip of both weapons in which the scrambler would have significantly less but we both know neither weapon requires an entire clip to kill really only till your reach about 1800hp worth of damage (maxed out heavy) really all dps in its truest form determines who will kill first.
Pro cal assualt 700 hp Imperial will kill in 7 shots leaves 8 to be missed
Pro cal assualt 700 hp duvolle takes 14 shots about
who will win most likely the imperial guy simply becasue he has a built in advantage of at least 50% and up to almpst 100%
and since they have almost the same range their is nowhere for the AR to win he cant outrange or dps
hmg beats ar in close but ar can outrange, ar can beat laser but laser can outrange, laser beats sniper but sniper can outrange notice a pattern scrambler takes a sh*t on this ar has no mechanical advantage like the others hell technically the scrambler beats everything it shares a range or has more than. it beats hmg, ar, and shotgun (assuming you can survive initial shotgun shot which most pro suits can)
Cal assault is a bad example because the SR is basically designed to take down caldari shield tankers. I'm not so sure you come out the same going against a bricked-out Gallente suit. Which is weird if you think about it, you would have expected more "ScR is OP" threads when shield tanking was vastly better than armor tanking.
Plus, without a modded controller (which should be accounted for by CCP but not the sole basis for balance discussions) you're not likely to be able to fire 8 shots with a scrambler as fas as a duvolle, it has double the fire rate. This is why these "on paper" discussions are iffy, and you should never really compare the number of shots fired because that is completely apples vs oranges.
Regardless, it's a moot point for two reasons : One, the TTK is so low that it hardly matters whether you use an imperial or a duvolle, whoever gets the first shots off is going to win 99% of the time anyway. Hell, you can with a GEK, I do all the time.
Perhaps more importantly, two new rifles are coming out. It's basically impossible to have any meaningful (read: non-troll) balance discussion until they are out in the wild. It's not like it's a soonGäó thing where we are prepping for a theoretical weapon months down the line, we're talking about what, 2-3 weeks?
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Bethhy
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
355
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:16:00 -
[30] - Quote
Your Absolut End wrote:yeah Scr must be soooo uber-op thats the reason why you see it as only used weapon in pc....... oh wait.... you dont see ot used in pc, its the ar you see all the time.... the scr has been like it is since it is released, I always could go 30+ in pubmatches with it. So is it now cool to #scramblerrage or what? goddamned hipsters..... Everytime an Ar user dies to another weapon its terrible Op and whatsoever.
Ill save this post to reply to you in about a month when they are on the lip's of everyone on the forum's... it's pretty similar to the TAC AR issue... We have said this since 1.4... have watched certain merc's with this game one shot 12 people back to back in a very short period of time.
If our normal medium range gunnery is OHKO'ing Merc's in DUST... we are breaking a fundamental part of it. |
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Himiko Kuronaga
Mannar Focused Warfare
Gallente Federation
2356
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:19:00 -
[31] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Balance as a weapons range increases its dps decreases that is all, the HMG has high dps point blank, the duvolle which im not a fan of has lower dps but more range. Fine let it have that crazy dps but reduce the range you shouldnt be able to have everything in a weapon its just pointless.
You don't have everything in that weapon. You CANNOT fight multiple opponents with it. You can with the AR. I don't know how this keeps slipping by you.
If two people come at me from around the corner one at a time and i charge in anticipation, I will probably drop the first guy if i don't miss the charged shot. If I do miss the charged shot, I will die. If I succeed, the second guy will kill me, guaranteed, because my weapon will overheat if i continue firing.
If they both come at me at the same time, I will die. If I am flanked, I will die.
If I have an AR instead and scenario one plays out, I can potentially beat out the first guy, not have to worry about overheat, and then beat out the next guy.
If scenario two plays out, well, its a much more uphill battle but again I don't have to worry about overheat. A slim chance is better than no chance. |
Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
1016
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:25:00 -
[32] - Quote
- I actually looked at the stats of the enemies being killed. Most of the enemies were wearing militia and standard suits, with militia and standard guns.
- Arkena was using a Gallente Logistics with 900 HP. 900 HP > 400 HP.
- Arkena had a scanner. Knowing where everyone is > not knowing anything.
- Arkena got several kills in a row with cooked Core Locus Grenades while camping a hive. I'd say that infinite OHKO grenades with a 15m diameter blast is more OP than Scrambler Rifles.
- Arkena has Wiyrkomi Nanohives that heal 70 HP/S, plus 5 HP/S innate armor repair.
Arkena would've died multiple times without such a pronounced gear advantage. A couple of times the militia opponents dropped 500+ HP. To add further insult to injury, here come the Wiyrkomi Triage Nanohives. Let's say we swapped the Imperial for a Duvolle. What would happen? Maybe they'd get a few less kills against enemies out of range. Would going 40/0 against militia noobs really be any better? If you have scan intel, twice as much health, 75 HP/S regen, infinite ammo and damage mods with a proto weapon and Gallente suit, it's pretty hard to die.
Even with a standard Heavy suit with 2 Armor Repair modules and a GLU Tac AR, which is essentially a poor man's version with slightly longer range and no hives, I can post up 30+ kills and <3 deaths against a team of mostly standard and militia. During Black Eagle week, I went something like 40 to 2 strafing back and forth on a mushroom roof in Domination mowing down enemies going to capture a terminal because I had 1200 HP with 7 HP/S repair. I died twice, but only to damage mod snipers. It took 0 effort and had I used a proto sentinel with complex repairers, plates, mods, I probably could've went 49/0, too.
Now, the Scrambler Rifle is more OP than the AR in the right hands. I'd suggest a RoF nerf down to 500 to bring the DPS down to a little over 900 when the Duvolle hits 640. There's still an advantage in damage and range plus charge shots, but it makes it a little harder to just run at people and spasm the trigger.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Greasepalms
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
270
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:35:00 -
[33] - Quote
I've been using the ScR since it was released back in January, mostly the semi-auto, and honestly I think it's fine. However, sometimes I do feel it's hipfire can be a bit OP. That's all. |
Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service
RISE of LEGION
260
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 15:58:00 -
[34] - Quote
Greasepalms wrote:I've been using the ScR since it was released back in January, mostly the semi-auto, and honestly I think it's fine. However, sometimes I do feel it's hipfire can be a bit OP. That's all.
I guess a nerf to hipfire accuracy makes sense similar to the Tac AR hipfire nerf. Beeing that precise makes not so much sense for semi automedium to long range weapon. |
Kira Lannister
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
1997
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:00:00 -
[35] - Quote
Marvel at our Holy Tech Infidels!
"The Ancient Templars will guard fearlessly the people, the land and the heavens of the empire."
Book of Exiles 1:3
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Sylwester Dziewiecki
206
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:02:00 -
[36] - Quote
WoW,
- 910 of total HP(pretty much like heavy, but without immobility),
- 4 different equipment items:
a) that heal you,
b) resupply you,
c) give you advantage over enemy by knowing where he is hiding(pretty much like scout, but without just 200HP and 1e-slot),
d) to all of this Nanite Injector so you can pick up friendly, and you know where heat of battle is.
- Like to all this you would still need some grenades.
Proto weapon is not primary problem here, logistic suit is, it's covers way too many roles.
I'm here since may 2012, my EVE alter ego is Nosum Hseebnrido.
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LittleCuteBunny
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
138
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:03:00 -
[37] - Quote
CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass |
Duran Lex
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
390
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:10:00 -
[38] - Quote
Far too much emphasis on "DPS".
It's a generalized statistic that has no bearing on outside influences.
example :
I'm using a gun that has 5000 damage per shot. The gun overheats after firing a single shot, and becomes unusable for 10 minutes while it cools down. This gun has 5000 DPS. Can't really put that high DPS to use if it can't continuously fire every second. |
Slag Emberforge
Immortal Retribution
140
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:33:00 -
[39] - Quote
I hear people in here complaining about the meaning if DPS on a weapon with cylic, dynamic damage output due to mechanics. I have three things to note.
1. Burst DPS is superior - in any PVP based game burst is better than static DPS, it allows you to put down your opponent quickly, take less damage, and allow you to prevent opponents from having the ability to escape.
2. Burst allows better tactics - you can dodge in and out of complete cover and not lose potential dps from not constantly firing
3. Accuracy at all ranges especially hipfire shots are almost unerringly accurate. This is the PRIMARY weapon I die from, not ARs, SRs, LRs, MDs, SMGs, HMGs. |
Zaria Min Deir
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
322
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:48:00 -
[40] - Quote
LittleCuteBunny wrote:CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass
This. The point that the ScR has it's drawback of (supposedly) not being able to kill multiple enemies because of the overheat is lovely in theory, but when the overheat is so easy to ignore...
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
146
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Posted - 2013.11.24 16:58:00 -
[41] - Quote
Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:WoW, - 910 of total HP(pretty much like heavy, but without immobility), - 4 different equipment items: a) that heal you, b) resupply you, c) give you advantage over enemy by knowing where he is hiding(pretty much like scout, but without just 200HP and 1e-slot), d) to all of this Nanite Injector so you can pick up friendly, and you know where heat of battle is. - Like to all this you would still need some grenades. Proto weapon is not primary problem here, logistic suit is, it's covers way too many roles.
STOP SAYIN SHHHHIIIT...... 
FIRST : Heavies with same level than an Logi with 910ehp have 1500-2000 hp if he want.
Secondly : He have Imperial SCR and lot of life because he have ****** equipements.
Seriously i'm tired of people like you "Logistics is bad blah blah blah" Real Logi using it as intended are balanced it's not our fault if YOU noob assaults has come in logistics suits to not use it as intended.
When fitting good equipements we can't make a good combat suits.
So we are not overpowered.
Exemple : My Amarr Logi suit. (The suit intended as a Combat Logi he's supposed to be the most powerful logi in combat)
89 PG.
Fit equipement :
Nanohive (Don't remember the name but takes 11/12PG.)
Drop uplinks : 11PG
Triage BDR-8 : 8 PG
30PG used for equipement. (And i didn't unlock my Proto repair tools)
59 PG left and i'm supposed to be the most powerful Logi suit ? HA!
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
146
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 16:59:00 -
[42] - Quote
Zaria Min Deir wrote:LittleCuteBunny wrote:CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass This. The point that the ScR has it's drawback of (supposedly) not being able to kill multiple enemies because of the overheat is lovely in theory, but when the overheat is so easy to ignore...
Are you kidding me ? Without Amarr assault suits it overheat in less than 8-9 shots......
Making you cannot run or do anything during 3sec (makes you die...) |
RKKR
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
472
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:03:00 -
[43] - Quote
Only a logi is OP claim on the second page? You guys are slacking... |
xSir Campsalotx
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
78
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:04:00 -
[44] - Quote
exactly why i was pointing to how long the weapon could be fired if you read the above, the scrambler rifle in my eyes truly became OP after the auto aim after which missing shots is a lot less often. Yes a gun with 5000 damage gun that takes 10 min to recharge has a dps of 5000 but really how is this example anywhere near any of the guns in this game. Honestly c"mon keep your examples relevant. yes the emphasis is on dps but only in its positively correlation with time to kill.
This game is not truly about skill its optimizing HP to damage output.
Citing your own incompetence in support of a claim is not a valid defense and does nothing to detract from my point, but i digress it can be done i have done it and i will continue to do it. Regardless, if i can do it on an alt character of whom i play with occasionally im quite certain someone who fields the weapon to any degree of frequency can make a mastery out of it and bring about its full potential. I hate to be like this but your arguments are becoming lax without any sense of clear logic flow, citing outlandish and frivolous examples that have no bearing or base to them. Alas the wall is up and i am out. |
Flix Keptick
Red Star.
EoN.
1316
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:05:00 -
[45] - Quote
Following op's logic I should clearly be seeing more scrambler rifles than oh say, assault rifles
"Please don't"
GÿåForum warrior lvl.1Gÿå
I Support SP Rollover, MAKE IT HAPPEN CCP !!!
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
445
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:13:00 -
[46] - Quote
Borne Velvalor wrote:
- I actually looked at the stats of the enemies being killed. Most of the enemies were wearing militia and standard suits, with militia and standard guns.
- Arkena was using a Gallente Logistics with 900 HP. 900 HP > 400 HP.
- Arkena had a scanner. Knowing where everyone is > not knowing anything.
- Arkena got several kills in a row with cooked Core Locus Grenades while camping a hive. I'd say that infinite OHKO grenades with a 15m diameter blast is more OP than Scrambler Rifles.
- Arkena has Wiyrkomi Nanohives that heal 70 HP/S, plus 5 HP/S innate armor repair.
Arkena would've died multiple times without such a pronounced gear advantage. A couple of times the militia opponents dropped 500+ HP. To add further insult to injury, here come the Wiyrkomi Triage Nanohives. Let's say we swapped the Imperial for a Duvolle. What would happen? Maybe they'd get a few less kills against enemies out of range. Would going 40/0 against militia noobs really be any better? If you have scan intel, twice as much health, 75 HP/S regen, infinite ammo and damage mods with a proto weapon and Gallente suit, it's pretty hard to die. Even with a standard Heavy suit with 2 Armor Repair modules and a GLU Tac AR, which is essentially a poor man's version with slightly longer range and no hives, I can post up 30+ kills and <3 deaths against a team of mostly standard and militia. During Black Eagle week, I went something like 40 to 2 strafing back and forth on a mushroom roof in Domination mowing down enemies going to capture a terminal because I had 1200 HP with 7 HP/S repair. I died twice, but only to damage mod snipers. It took 0 effort and had I used a proto sentinel with complex repairers, plates, mods, I probably could've went 49/0, too. Now, the Scrambler Rifle is more OP than the AR in the right hands. I'd suggest a RoF nerf down to 500 to bring the DPS down to a little over 900 when the Duvolle hits 640. There's still an advantage in damage and range plus charge shots, but it makes it a little harder to just run at people and spasm the trigger. EDIT: Also, most players cannot hit the RoF cap. I've seen a few that break the 400-500 range, and obviously turbo controllers can hit the cap, so a nerf would bring down the raw potential. Maybe a small hipfire spread increase would help, too.
Yup, it's always "this person went 40/0, it must be the weapon." As a non-murder logi, I have a crap KDR and usually get less than 10 kills a game (avg game maybe 7/5 nowadays?). My best game ever in terms of kills was 25/3, a few weeks ago on Ashland domination. I got killed 3 times pretty quick trying to take the objective while the blueberries ran around in circles, hacked turrets far away from the battle, tried to shoot up at the protobears raining down nades and MD rounds, etc. So, I switched to a super-profile-damped A/1 suit, camped on a hill, and with a charge sniper prof 3 and 3 complex dmg mods proceeded to go 25/0 in the 5 minutes or so left in the battle and somehow we won on clones, I'm not sure how that happened but whatever.
Was I suddenly OP? No, trust me, if I always went 26/0 and got 400k ISK sniping I would surely do it more often. There were just some stupid people who thought their proto suits made them invincible standing still on the pipes begging me to headshot them, and then inexplicably continued to spawn up there. (to be sure, they were mercilessly slaughtering blueberries that way so maybe it made sense to them, who knows). Regardless, I'm sure some aurum proto wearing tryhard who also couldn't believe they lost probably saw me on top of the board at 26/3 with 2500 WP or whatever and made one of those stupid rage threads about damage mods being OP some some crap.
Experiences like this cloud peoples judgement and make what sounds like a compelling argument that really isn't based in fact. It's like a recall bias (or maybe availability bias is a better term) - you don't know much about the 5 guys you just killed, It's anyone's guess whether your victims had a imperial or std scrambler, or even an AR if you didn't get a good look. But you sure as hell get a big "you lose" screen every time you die telling you all about the person who got you. It's made worse by what it doesn't tell you, like if that person had prof 5, or about the other 2 guys who got some shots on you, or those triage hives, or that pesky logi with a rep tool around the corner you couldn't see.
TL; DR. This QQ is all subjective and has little basis in fact. All rifles are currently OP, it's not the ScR.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
445
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:15:00 -
[47] - Quote
Oh, almost forgot. I'd support a reduction in RoF for the regular ScR, modded controllers or KBM macros are annoying.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
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Syeven Reed
RETR0 PR0 GAMERS
174
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Posted - 2013.11.24 17:21:00 -
[48] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:because bpo whining is more important.
Whaaaaay more important....
Gÿé Syeven 514
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Rynoceros
Rise Of Old Dudes
1358
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
The gun itself it OP.
The users are such ******* scrubs that nobody cares.
Cheeseburgers.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
3962
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:31:00 -
[50] - Quote
Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Gota disagree here.
The scrambler is meant to do exactly this. It is a 1v1 superiority weapon with checks and balances that keep it from killing everybody at once like the TAC did. All fights in that video were picked intelligently, and it is the enemy teams fault for coming at him one at a time like an old kung fu movie.
The TAC had no business doing that nonsense however. The AR is a medium to close range kill-everyone device. The TAC was meant to give some versatility to a weapon skill that was never intended as an broad-range dueling superiority weapon. It was abused to an extreme extent and had no checks or balances, thanks to the lack of overheat, it could solo the universe quite easily at any range it pleased.
If a semi-auto weapon is incapable of 1v1 or range superiority, it has no real value.
Actually, the SCR is capable of pulling off 18 shots before overheating, considering most of the people he killed there died in 3 shots...
You get the idea :P
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
3962
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:33:00 -
[51] - Quote
Your Absolut End wrote:yeah Scr must be soooo uber-op thats the reason why you see it as only used weapon in pc....... oh wait.... you dont see ot used in pc, its the ar you see all the time.... the scr has been like it is since it is released, I always could go 30+ in pubmatches with it. So is it now cool to #scramblerrage or what? goddamned hipsters..... Everytime an Ar user dies to another weapon its terrible Op and whatsoever.
Because SCR requires good frame rate to nail shots.
Something PC can't provide
I myself would use it if it wasn't for that.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Mortedeamor
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
839
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:33:00 -
[52] - Quote
Scheherazade VII wrote:the scrambler rifle is an absolute joke
im going to use it so im not at a disadvantage to those that do.
It destroys starter fits in 3 rounds which is half a second.
it makes the AR TTK look like before they changed the TTK.
Just stack damage mods and armour and anybody running less won't be able to mathematically take you down
before you take them down.
it really is the FOTM and needs more threads to be made about it. I won't stop QQ'ing until CCP realises
it's destroying the game.
it's the new invincibility mode crutch for scrubs who have no gun-game
and need to compensate by making their SCR do 100 damage per shot just to **** on everybody else.
really this game is just about damage output and HP, it's mathematical, not tactical.
I wish it revolved around skill but it doesn't/
well clearly the qqing is working didnt you hear they are giving it a range buff |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
3962
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:36:00 -
[53] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:LittleCuteBunny wrote:CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass This. The point that the ScR has it's drawback of (supposedly) not being able to kill multiple enemies because of the overheat is lovely in theory, but when the overheat is so easy to ignore... Are you kidding me ? Without Amarr assault suits it overheat in less than 8-9 shots...... Making you cannot run or do anything during 3sec (makes you die...)
8-9 shots?
Without Amarr Assault - 18
With Amarr Assault - 24
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
3962
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 17:37:00 -
[54] - Quote
Flix Keptick wrote:Following op's logic I should clearly be seeing more scrambler rifles than oh say, assault rifles
The numbers are actually increasing daily.
I see more and more people use the SCR and ASCR over the AR.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Johnny Guilt
362
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 18:07:00 -
[55] - Quote
make the crosshairs spread as big(or bigger) as current Tar and youll get a balanced weapon,so simple CCP would screw it up like they did the tar as they lowered the Rof with it as well.... |
Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
1326
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 19:29:00 -
[56] - Quote
Until they get run over by a Limbus going 120mph 
Check out my corp's new website here :D
-HAND
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
5352
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 19:58:00 -
[57] - Quote
Borne Velvalor wrote: I actually looked at the stats of the enemies being killed. Most of the enemies were wearing militia and standard suits, with militia and standard guns.
This.
Quote:
Arkena was using a Gallente Logistics with 900 HP. 900 HP > 400 HP.
This.
Quote: Arkena had a scanner. Knowing where everyone is > not knowing anything.
This.
Quote: Arkena got several kills in a row with cooked Core Locus Grenades while camping a hive. I'd say that infinite OHKO grenades with a 15m diameter blast is more OP than Scrambler Rifles.
This.
Level 5 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Supporter of CCP raRaRa.
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Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
669
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 20:28:00 -
[58] - Quote
Because the war against AR has not yet been won.
Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
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Doc Noah
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
884
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 20:47:00 -
[59] - Quote
I believe SCR is getting a range buff in 1.7 and TAR is getting a range nerf. TAR will be worse in every aspect. |
deepfried salad gilliam
Sanguine Knights
153
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 20:47:00 -
[60] - Quote
The scr has 15 shots to kill how many does the duvolle have?
And yes I know it has a mag thsts more than 15 but overheat kills it at 15
if hot those 10/15 shots we win,if not we lose
If we lead with a charged we have 3 remaining shots
Christ is lord
Sanguine knights , open recruitment, join now.
Free tacos
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
147
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 20:54:00 -
[61] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:LittleCuteBunny wrote:CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass This. The point that the ScR has it's drawback of (supposedly) not being able to kill multiple enemies because of the overheat is lovely in theory, but when the overheat is so easy to ignore... Are you kidding me ? Without Amarr assault suits it overheat in less than 8-9 shots...... Making you cannot run or do anything during 3sec (makes you die...) 8-9 shots? Without Amarr Assault - 18 With Amarr Assault - 24
I'm using it and if you spam the trigger it overheats before 18 shots.
If you shoot normally it cooldown a little between 2 shots.
So in fact the theorical DPS is no sense.
Anyway YES ScR must be nerfed.
But AR too.
AR must be nerf on range (and/Or accuracy) because it's supposed to be the lowest range Rifle in the game in fact because of his high RoF and Accuracy he can still be the best weapon far beyond his range.
ScR should lose some RoF and not be a "Shoot as fast as i use the trigger" ScR range and Damage is fine it's supposed to be the DMR of Dust. |
Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
147
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 21:04:00 -
[62] - Quote
Doc Noah wrote:I believe SCR is getting a range buff in 1.7 and TAR is getting a range nerf. TAR will be worse in every aspect.
You need to understand than ScR is the Racial specialist of TAR.
So YES it's NORMAL than he's way more powerful than TAR with better range.
And TAR is using plasma which is a Low range ammo. (But don't overheat)
While Laser is a long range ammo with same damage. (But Overheat)
But i'll also agree than AscR should be less effective than Duvolle.
In reality ScR is way less powerful than Assualt rifles.
Since armor values everybody got a huge amount of armor.
And Laser receive a 20% drawback on armor while Assault rifles drawback is only 10%.
So in fact Most of the time ScR is 20% less effective and Assault rifles Only 10%.
Assault rifles are more versatile.
While ScR is really good gainst Shield (But shield actually is low) but sucks against Armor (Which is 80% of eHP)
What the point about being great on something that sucks ?
That is the bigger advantages of AR against ScR.
I'm a ScR user.
Have you already tried to kill an heavy with 1000Hp ONLY on Armor ????
Impossible without overheat like 3/4 time......
With assault rifle (Militia) i melted this heavy with no problem in less than a MAG without stop firing. (Yes sometime i'm using the basic suit who cost nothing.) |
Your Absolut End
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
226
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 21:09:00 -
[63] - Quote
Korvin Lomont wrote:Greasepalms wrote:I've been using the ScR since it was released back in January, mostly the semi-auto, and honestly I think it's fine. However, sometimes I do feel it's hipfire can be a bit OP. That's all. I guess a nerf to hipfire accuracy makes sense similar to the Tac AR hipfire nerf. Beeing that precise makes not so much sense for semi automedium to long range weapon.
Indeed.
I thinkthe semi auto scr should get the biggest nerf in hipfire accuracy, Ascr should still somehow stay in the area of the Ar.
I used the scr alsways as mid to lange ragne weapon, never really tried the hipfire. I tried it in the last few days and this really moves the weapon from its supposed role away to a cqc styled singleshot ar.
another one bites the Dust...
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Zaria Min Deir
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
322
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 23:10:00 -
[64] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Zaria Min Deir wrote:LittleCuteBunny wrote:CCP just needs to fix the overheat bypass This. The point that the ScR has it's drawback of (supposedly) not being able to kill multiple enemies because of the overheat is lovely in theory, but when the overheat is so easy to ignore... Are you kidding me ? Without Amarr assault suits it overheat in less than 8-9 shots...... Making you cannot run or do anything during 3sec (makes you die...) Not kidding, just referring to the overheat bybass/glitch that Bunny mentioned... So yes, the overheat is decent balance to the high damage output of the ScR, unfortunately, it is not exactly difficult to bybass it, and I know a lot of people are doing just that... Not all Scrambler users, by any means, but many.
Have you considered installing the improved keyboard?
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
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Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
1331
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 23:14:00 -
[65] - Quote
How long do you think it will take CCP to patch the overheat exploit?
Now before you answer, remember how long it took to patch the Melee glitch.
Check out my corp's new website here :D
-HAND
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CharCharOdell
1672
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 04:50:00 -
[66] - Quote
RevoL Frog wrote:Zatara Rought wrote:SMH, one thread uses this to argue the logi and specifically the gallente logi are OP, this one uses it to argue the Scr is OP. Just a funny observation. Good player in the video. He's using everything possible to his advantage, and I salute his abilities. I see the problem as not the suit, but as the weapon. Had he been using a DuVolle it would have been much different story on several occasions. The only thing that even remotely comes close to the performance of the Imperial Scrambler Rifle is the pre-nerf TAC AR, and we know how that turned out.
but with one HUGE difference:
the scrambler is only able to engage a couple targets at once before overheating. 1 v 1, it is the best weapon in the game, but 3 v 1, you would be better of with an assault rifle, 6 v 1, mass driver is king ;)
Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ
Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó
Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
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Himiko Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution
2366
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 05:42:00 -
[67] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Gota disagree here.
The scrambler is meant to do exactly this. It is a 1v1 superiority weapon with checks and balances that keep it from killing everybody at once like the TAC did. All fights in that video were picked intelligently, and it is the enemy teams fault for coming at him one at a time like an old kung fu movie.
The TAC had no business doing that nonsense however. The AR is a medium to close range kill-everyone device. The TAC was meant to give some versatility to a weapon skill that was never intended as an broad-range dueling superiority weapon. It was abused to an extreme extent and had no checks or balances, thanks to the lack of overheat, it could solo the universe quite easily at any range it pleased.
If a semi-auto weapon is incapable of 1v1 or range superiority, it has no real value. Actually, the SCR is capable of pulling off 18 shots before overheating, considering most of the people he killed there died in 3 shots... You get the idea :P
A 3 shot kill will only happen with a charged shot as part of the equation, unless it is against a completely untanked scout suit.
And I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not, but a charged shot deals more heat to the gun than its regular fire equivalent, even from multiple shots trying to get the same amount of damage. A charged shot is a superiority mechanism for 1v1, but it seals your fate in 1v2. |
AfroSunshineY Consequence
R 0 N 1 N
188
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Posted - 2013.11.25 05:46:00 -
[68] - Quote
Scheherazade VII wrote:the scrambler rifle is an absolute joke
im going to use it so im not at a disadvantage to those that do.
It destroys starter fits in 3 rounds which is half a second.
it makes the AR TTK look like before they changed the TTK.
Just stack damage mods and armour and anybody running less won't be able to mathematically take you down
before you take them down.
it really is the FOTM and needs more threads to be made about it. I won't stop QQ'ing until CCP realises
it's destroying the game.
it's the new invincibility mode crutch for scrubs who have no gun-game
and need to compensate by making their SCR do 100 damage per shot just to **** on everybody else.
really this game is just about damage output and HP, it's mathematical, not tactical.
I wish it revolved around skill but it doesn't/
^^^^^^^ Uses an AR. |
AfroSunshineY Consequence
R 0 N 1 N
188
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 05:51:00 -
[69] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:its not that hard any decent gamer can fire quite rapidly especially with a mouse and modded controllers are common i have one on an alt with prof 4 and it is clearly OP fun to use and awesome but OP the same. I would be ok with allowing this op weapon to go unchecked but in pc i see full squads running it and theyre even more deadly than duvolles. I dont like the power of duvolles but this thing is insane. Again i really dont mind all that much its the core grenades that holds my upmost hate. I highly doubt you can fire 12.25 rounds per second consistently. For most people, 9-10 is the average. so then you do around 900 to 1000 dps im sry but thank you, compared to a duvolles 600 thats a solid 50% advantage
I can't believe AR scrubs are trying to claim any other class of player has an advantage over them XD Hilarious. ScR is OP, but it is hardly FoTM - more people still run around with ARs first of all and at lower levels, the heat buildup of the ScR helps it be relatively balanced (Imperial is a nightmare).
Try being a scout with 240 eHP using exclusively sidearms. Get Good Scrubs. |
Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
2340
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 05:57:00 -
[70] - Quote
I've resisted making a serious one simply because I'm a Minmatar scout and it's kinda made to take me out.
Not that there's not a weapon in the game that can't easily take me out.......
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja.
Forum Warrior level 2
A grunt of STB
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
149
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Posted - 2013.11.25 07:43:00 -
[71] - Quote
Atiim wrote:How long do you think it will take CCP to patch the overheat exploit?
Now before you answer, remember how long it took to patch the Melee glitch.
I didn't know thereas a glitch.
So that's ******* weird !!!!
The weapon is Op because of a glitch so you ask a general Nerf ? what the hell ?
Why i should be nerf if that's because of a glitch i don't use huh ??
Fix the nerf reduce the RoF and it will be balanced i'm sure. |
Seigfried Warheit
The Neutral Zone
50
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Posted - 2013.11.25 08:47:00 -
[72] - Quote
The Scram Rifle takes no skill to use? I bet everyone that says that haven't actually used it and "heard " from a friend it is easy to use. Ill admit I might make it look easy to use cause Im beast with it  but its takes some skill to use and some are just horrible with it that they use the Ass variant instead. (If your gonna use a AScram just go AR not sure why there is a assault variant..I wouldnt mind it being removed no need for it)
Its not OP cause you actually have to think have some skill cause you have to aim and make those shots count or your dead...what you actually have to aim at things and not just spray in that general direction and they are dead?!?! Spray and pray with this baby and your good as dead. You cant just charge in doing your war cries and spray in the room. Gotta actually think of tactics! The gun overheats fast and quick and tends to blow up in your face constantly. I have seen people try to use it as a AR against me or any smart player and they end up overheating and bleeding out on the floor .
Ill admit I have ran into some idiot that sucks at shooters and think there is some importance in them that they have to use a modded controller that makes it more usable in cqc than it really should be but the controller works for all guns and Im sure there will be threads saying nerf the rail and combat cause modded controllers make it op when they come out. Modded Controllers users just wreck the game and should stop playing if they suck so bad they have to spend money on a modded controler that makes them look good.
If you want to kill a scram rifle user there is a easy solution..instead of thinking you can kill everything with your godly AR...opps I mean with any weapon really .....not just because the biggest cry for nerf the Scr is coming from "adept" Ar users..anywho just charge the sucker with a group of 3 guys and he is toast...well if he is stupid and doesn't realize his gun will overheat before he can kill you and attempts to anyways (happens all the time)or is a logi (besides amarr). If he is in a squad atk from the back cause most likely he is in the back of the squad. If you couldn't think of doing this yourself........then maybe this game isn't for you..or go easy mode and throw a couple nades and make everyone hop like bunnies cause that requires less brain power.
 Tl;dr version : Its balanced except when modded controller user uses them and shouldnt be dragged down cause of those no skill players. If want to kill a Scram Rifle user just bum rush them with some teamates or do a heavy style drive by .
Edit: added those explanation mark emotes |
Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service
RISE of LEGION
262
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 09:13:00 -
[73] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane This is stupid. Your duvolle is fully automatic wity no recoil. SCR is semi auto and has a huge Heat factor you can't fire as you wish.
You are right the comparision with a fully automatic weapon is stupid so lets make some more reasonable comaprisons.
IMHO the only comparable weaponis the Tac AR,
So lets have a look at those weapons:
D Tac:
Damage: 78.5
RPM: 400
Clip size: 18
Burst(shots before overheat): N/A
Range(opt/Eff): 65/ ~100 (1.7: 60/84)
DPS: ~ 523
Damage per Clip: 1413
Imp SR:
Damage: 79,2
RPM: 705
Clip Size: 45
Burst(shots before overheat): ~ 18
Range(Opt/Eff): 50/~85 (1.7: 78/96)
DPS: ~ 930
Damage per Clip: 3564
Damage per Burst: 1425,6
So right now the Tac AR has a slight Range advantage whereas the SCR has nearly twice the DPS. Overheating is not much of an issue as you still can fire roughly 18 rounds before overheating thats a whole Tac AR clip.
In 1.7 the Tac AR will also loose the Range advantage. What will be left in 1.7? Two weapons with similar roles where one of them deals nearly twice as much DPS with more Range. Seems totally balanced....
Shouldn't have the weapon with less range more DPS? So there is clearly an imbalance between the two. This comparision did not even regard the hipfire advantage of the SCR.
Regarding the Overheat there is only one weapon where the overheat is used to balance good damage output and thats the LR and here CCP felt that the overheat is not enough to balance the weapon so they added a damage built up, a quite narrow optimal Range and a harsh damage fall off to balance the weapon further,even though the DPS on overheat is lower than the DPS of the SCR...
So regarding the higher Damage potential of the SCR shouldn't there be the same drawbacks that CCP felt necessary for the Laser? |
Jenova Rhapsodos
Fatal Absolution
4
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 16:03:00 -
[74] - Quote
Scheherazade VII wrote:the scrambler rifle is an absolute joke
im going to use it so im not at a disadvantage to those that do.
It destroys starter fits in 3 rounds which is half a second.
it makes the AR TTK look like before they changed the TTK.
Just stack damage mods and armour and anybody running less won't be able to mathematically take you down
before you take them down.
it really is the FOTM and needs more threads to be made about it. I won't stop QQ'ing until CCP realises
it's destroying the game.
it's the new invincibility mode crutch for scrubs who have no gun-game
and need to compensate by making their SCR do 100 damage per shot just to **** on everybody else.
really this game is just about damage output and HP, it's mathematical, not tactical.
I wish it revolved around skill but it doesn't/
Dying laughing here.
So the 2 page hate mail you sent me about my CRW wasn't enough... |
Jak'Saan
3dge of D4rkness
SoulWing Alliance
135
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 16:37:00 -
[75] - Quote
RevoL Frog wrote:I am ashamed at your slackery!
You all know that charged shot is simply ridiculous. It's TAC AR 2.0 out there.
To be honest It is OP. But so is AR, SG, SP, SMG, etc... with the exception of flaylock. lol. Truth is all weapons are OP since 1.6.
That is when they fixed HD and forgot to remove all the "fixes" they added to pretend like HD wasn't an issue. The real issue is TTK. remember the 10% damage buff all weapons received prior to 1.6? That was to hide HD fails. Remember stamina and speed nerf? HP nerfs in general? Hitbox enlargement on running/jumping? And many more? these are all "fixes" that were supposed to hide how crappy HD was.
Now that they fixed HD, they broke gameplay. CCP == fail. |
Mortedeamor
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
850
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 16:49:00 -
[76] - Quote
Doc Noah wrote:I believe SCR is getting a range buff in 1.7 and TAR is getting a range nerf. TAR will be worse in every aspect.
your belief is 100% correct |
Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe.
RISE of LEGION
2001
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:08:00 -
[77] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:xSir Campsalotx wrote:Agreed but your scrabler rifle can have upwards of 1200dps and duvolle barely breaks 600 i think it should have a advantage but does it really have to be twice as deadly. I run HMG so they beat me either way.
37.5 duvolle x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 12.5 rof =636 dps a common setup i see run
78.5 imperial x 1.15 (15%) prof times the 2 damage mods at 1.18 for both (18%) x 11.7 rof= 1246 dps a common setup i see run (the dps on this weapon is similar to that of the prenerfed duvolle tac)
as you can see your 1 vs 1 advantage is insane Its 1200 DPS on paper, but in practice it is much lower, unless modded controllers are involved.
But they are involved.
Every time a weapon appears that would benefit from them we have this issue.
Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
|
Vinsarrow
New Eden Blades Of The Azure
Zero-Day
110
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:18:00 -
[78] - Quote
Because people want to extend how long they can take advantage of it before it gets nerfed & actually theirs a certain.... secret "technique" with the Scrambler Rifle making it even more OP but I'm not telling..... Well maybe if i'm paid a little  |
C-C-P SCOTTY-THE-AI
C C P.
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:24:00 -
[79] - Quote
RevoL Frog wrote:I am ashamed at your slackery!
You all know that charged shot is simply ridiculous. It's TAC AR 2.0 out there.
EXACTLY!! but all the people here use either an AR, or a scrambler, so no one is complaining that its OP, insted of saying that 'its OP' they blame TTK so their OP to **** weapon isnt nerfed. |
Jak'Saan
3dge of D4rkness
SoulWing Alliance
139
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:36:00 -
[80] - Quote
Vinsarrow wrote:Because people want to extend how long they can take advantage of it before it gets nerfed & actually theirs a certain.... secret "technique" with the Scrambler Rifle making it even more OP but I'm not telling..... Well maybe if i'm paid a little
Secret: overheat, crouth, run, continue shooting... congrats on exploiting the already dying game... you lose. |
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Tebu Gan
Dem Durrty Boyz
231
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:39:00 -
[81] - Quote
Looks like I have a weapon to try out!
Nuff Said
|
Jak'Saan
3dge of D4rkness
SoulWing Alliance
139
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 17:40:00 -
[82] - Quote
C-C-P SCOTTY-THE-AI wrote:RevoL Frog wrote:I am ashamed at your slackery!
You all know that charged shot is simply ridiculous. It's TAC AR 2.0 out there. EXACTLY!! but all the people here use either an AR, or a scrambler, so no one is complaining that its OP, insted of saying that 'its OP' they blame TTK so their OP to **** weapon isnt nerfed.
I use all CQC weapons exclusively and have no skills into AR and one level into SR because I made a mistake instead of Scrambler Pistol. The only time I ever used AR was for the Black Eagle event and when I saw how easy it was to use, it litterally made me quit the game. The reason AR seems so OP is because as soon as it sees you, you have no time to get behind cover. TTK fail. |
Jenova Rhapsodos
Fatal Absolution
5
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 19:10:00 -
[83] - Quote
The Imperial Scrambler will destroy in pub matches for sure, MLT frames will dissolve in front of it.
In PC against other Proto suits it is much more balanced and definitely separates those who can actually use it from FOTM chasers.
Also I'm fairly sure modded controllers would just make the weapon overheat very quickly? Yes there is an exploit/glitch to get around that but it is not perfect and renders you unable to change weapon/equipment or ADS.
I personally can't wait for the overheat bypass to be removed from the game as it is a crappy way out for people without the skill to use the weapon. |
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