I don't want to offend you, but people like you, assuming that the only reason to tank is to boost KDR, are the main reason why the vehicle-infantry relationship in this game sucks that hard.

Anyway, if it were so easy to raise (this horrible thing which is) KDR, anyone in this game would be a tanker. Instead, tankers are maybe the 2% (just guessing) of the playerbase.

And if you wonder why... you can always call a tank and try to harvest kills.

You know that isn't true or I would be doing better in the games I play with you and Strong.

Your assumption is flawed in so many ways ...
- proto assaults can use miltia gear and still greatly benefit from their SP, tankers can't
- one cheap tank costs the ISK of 3 matches (skirmish), one expensive tank around 6 matches (skirmish), don't talk about enforcer where the hull alone is 6 matches ...
- people tend to go berserk against tanks, yesterday EoN scrubs wasted orbitals to kill me and other scrubs suicided into our redline to get me - won't happen vs dropsuits

You know that isn't true or I would be doing better in the games I play with you and Strong.

Fair enough, but 5 proto assault deaths is equivalent to 1 decent tank death, in terms of isk, but tankers such as yourself surely do not lose much per match for your 30-40 kills.

And i hope you read the whole thread in regards to my train of thought...

the whole ISK=kills thing really doesnt work, i can get as many, usually more kills in a match running my standard suit as i can in my 1.4mil isk 8mil sp tank

Admittedly didn't.

As to your point to Void I can loosehalf a dozen tanks a match if I keep bringing them in.... they are Soma though....

I have hylighted your problem right there. Yes I know and understand why you havent specked into the fotm maddys . Yes I agree with why you havent . But you will looses allot of tanks if you run malitia tanks.

Pretty sure True implied how bad they were with the whole " they are Soma's though... " thing.

That is the whole point of this thread Shaman, tankers pay ISK for KDR.

Just saying mabe u guys are just paying for your KDR..

I don't pay Isk for KDR (i'm shaman), i pay isk because i like to play with a vehicle (this alt, has sp invested only in vehicles, so i have no choice), KDR is a consequence of a tanker who tries to not go passive with ISK.
I would really like to play as logi vehicle (i'm a logi with my infantry main), the problem is that i'm not rewarded if i do that.
Another problem is that i don't have sp invested in dropsuit or weapons, not playing with a vehicle means a massacre for me, New players have better infantry equipment/dropsuits/weapons than me.

If at beginning of the game, someone on enemy team decide to start with proto-SL, we do not have positive KDR. Good driver doesn't have skill points in dropsuits or infantry weapons.

I'm curious what you describe as good KDR - me sniper have 9.+ with 3k kills, and HAV driver just 4.22 with 10k kills. It's not easy to kill someone with tank - when he know where you are, and what weapon you have. People with close range blasters need to risc a lot to get kill, those with mid range blasters doesn't have tank properly build. Railgun splash need 2-4 shots to kill someone, especially when he is in tanked proto Assault/Logistic suit. Missiles on HAV is totally joke against infantry.

Driving HAV's require actual skill to do so, while there is a lot of AV weapons that 'do the job for themself', SL for example are laag friendly(no matter what they always will hit).

You are correct sir most folks view tankd as killing mchiens with no other purpose but we fill a variety of rolles.

If you have a tanker on your squad then you should encourage them to use gadjets like scanners and mobile crus.

We are also exelent point DEFENCE wepons, if you have a blaster tank in a good position coveri g the rear objective then it will take an incredible ammount of coordination to take that objective . Many times when my corp stacked squads into fw I was often orderd to hold down the rear objective this role will not net you many kills if your enimy is smart and dosent run into your missiles or blaster fire like suicidal lemmings. But it will make sure the rear objective is allways a safe spawn location.

Red line rail tanks as much as everyone hates them are the ultimate area denile when enimy tanks are concerned as only a bad pilot will rush the front lines when a red line rail is present.

As I often tell new pilots dont over extend your reach and stick to the 3 ds of tanking Distract Demoralise and Destroy . If you follow these rules you will do well. But if you see the red mist and start chasing kills like a beserker you will die allot and shortly be out of isk.

Starya your many points and arguments are flawed in several aspects.

When you state things like tanks pay for a high kdr and are met with valid counter arguments like if we loose 1 tank every 5 games we are in a net loss. Unless we run 10 or 12 games of ambush in free suits. Do you know how mant times you can die in an ambus with free suits lol that totally negates our good kdr stats from tanking .

Tanks are not worth the current isk cost as it takes 5 games at keast to pay for a tank that can survive more than 4 or 5 vollys of swarms . When they reduced the module cost they doubled the turret price and that ended out with havs being more expensive than they were in chrome whare we acctually did domminate a battlefield.

Honestly most of the vet tankers like myself havs stayed with tanking after several nerfs not because wr want to be team stomping monsters but because we want to have fun in our tanks. Yes it may be hard to believe us tankers just want to have fun but having to grind 5 to 10 games of ambush in free suits to pay for 1 loss is not fun .... we are really the only class (other than comando) that is not viable for pc all tanks are good for in oc is point defense or rail snioing other tanks (if the proto av dosent get them first) we are the only class not to have anything proto . Thats just not fun when you are pitted up against wepons designed to destroy vehicles that are miles ahead of what we have.

If I you ever see me ingame squad up with me and ill drop you a tank of the highest speck (highest meta fit possible) aprox 2.4 mill (youll of couse send me the isk) then you can run it and see how its not worth its isk

I do understand what you are saying, but for arguments sake lets say you could run your tank 100% of the time without having to go assault to pay for it, your KDR would be huge. I know u guys love tanking but without the extreme cost of tanks you would run them 24/7 and the only way out would be for CCP to nerf the sh*t out of them so infantry could compete.

I guess what i'm getting at with this thread is the cost of tanks is balanced with the effectiveness on the battlefield. You might get popped after 15 kills but your assault brothers ( assuming an even match, not protostomp ) will take a lot more deaths, hence "ISKcost =Kdr" . The same goes for assault guys, people will generally get more kills with less deaths when they run their proto suits as compared to their BPO's.

edit- i will take you up on the tank drop, but of course i won't be sending any isk.

Look at the leader boards and its not hav pilots with all the insain kdrs it snipers and proto stomping assaults

yes tankers get lotsof kills when were tanking but to fund our efforts we run free ssuits and die allot thusly decreasing our kdr . Most serious tankers dont care about our kdr record wr acctually just want to have fun .

Forgive me man, i did not mean to imply that tankers are paying large sums of ISK purely for KDR as opposed to paying for a game style that they enjoy. I am just trying to point out that tanks are destructive and dominating on the battlefield and ( in my opinion) are worth the high cost involved in running one. There needs to be some drawback to running these beasts and i think the high ISK cost is doing a pretty good job of it.

Maybe they cost a lot because CCP doesnt want them being spammed in every single match? Its not much different than going from a STD suit to a PROTO dropsuit, price skyrockets so they're less sustainable but gain high efficiency. Going from proto suit to STD tank with proto mods is basically a massive upgrade. I highly doubt CCP intended tankers to literally live out their whole life inside a tank. A properly fit tank in a proper environment is devastating on ground infantry, add in infantry support and that AV guy wont last very long out in the open. Add in a second tank and you can cover each other's weak points/blind spots and trade who takes blows.

If they're gonna decrease the price of tanks, they should lower it's overall effectiveness to match that.
If they increase it's tankability, then they should lower it's overall speed to match that.

Same for tankers man, anyone can run in militia gear, does not tank related SP improve on a militia tank?

Just saying mabe u guys are just paying for your KDR..

This is a valid question from OP.


However, for purposes of balancing the battlefield and in-match gameplay:

KDR is irrelevant.
ISK is irrelevant

I guess what i really mean by KDR is not the numbers on the leader board - But the enjoyment factor.

This is an FPS so the endorphins are released when we kill someone hence we like playing the game- I'm just making a link between ISK spent and endorphin release ( kills ) if you will.