Maybe that is the problem Jathneil, MY definition of long range is about 90m or so, I have always considered tac rifles to be sniper assault rifle hybrids, like a sniper just without the real long zoom!!

But prehaps be near the objective and cover it from there? If your a scout chances if you miss you can stab him in the back while hacks!

90 meter is definately NOT TAC AR spot. TAC AR can deal a bit of damage at such ranges but killing someone is a different story. tac deals around 45% of its damage at 90 meters.

Well 90m is plenty fine for an Imperial Scrambler Rifle. o7


Look. I give up alright?
I can't win this.
No one likes Devil's Advocate, and an enemy of the majority is doomed to lose no matter his reasoning.

My indicator said that CCP Logibro made a post on this thread, but now I can't find it.

I'm guessing he changed his mind about saying anything (It probably wasn't a good thing).

I give up. It is what it is alright. So whatever.

Ready to lock this thread.

Well 90m is plenty fine for an Imperial Scrambler Rifle. o7


Look. I give up alright?
I can't win this.
No one likes Devil's Advocate, and an enemy of the majority is doomed to lose no matter his reasoning.

My indicator said that CCP Logibro made a post on this thread, but now I can't find it.

I'm guessing he changed his mind about saying anything (It probably wasn't a good thing).

I give up. It is what it is alright. So whatever.

Ready to lock this thread.

I am not normally a sniper but feel that it is in need of some sort of a buff terrain wise. Some thing to hide in or behind like that cloak CCP Wolfman promised or the suggested equipment "Dragon's Teeth" would be useful for snipers and provide some cover while they are picking where they are shooting. The whole idea that snipers need pads that CCP seems to have is ludicrous and to be perfectly clear it is completely ridiculous if they are going to protect everyone at the objective from snipers and not going to put a pad that is above the objective with good overwatch ability (like the top of the rings on the city map).

A sniper, by CCP design, has limited visibility close range with his rifle, scope sway at lower levels making moving to a new spot tedious and time consuming, and defenseless against anyone not in their scope's viewfinder. How does CCP want them to function? As a rag doll flopping on the ground waiting for an assault medic to come pick them up for wp? The "Designated Sniper Pads" are just as deadly perches for someone using an AR/MD/Forge/SMG/Knives when going to pick up the dead team mate too and for the one, possibly 2 bullets a sniper can put out from the locations that he needs to use a DS to get to (to subsequently get the thing shot down) are not worth firing for a death and the chance at no kills.

Sniping is a role that thrives on cover and is really designed with finding that perfect sniping cover in mind where you don't have to move for hours on end because movement makes you a target and easier to see in which case you are less effective. Considering we cannot go prone limiting sniper cover is a mistake, a very very bad mistake. In fact cover for all classes of player should be available on every map not just wide open buildings. IRL factories have machines to hide behind, gravel pits and forests have hills to hide behind and possibly some trees around the outside (tree trunks can block a 30/30 round easily enough) and the military in any country on any continent would likely not tell their sniper to "go down on one knee so you can't run and position yourself in the middle of a group of enemies forget about cover son your job is to snipe them before they get close enough to shoot".

The changes to shared squad vision are a big issue, in my mind, as well due to the benefit previously gained by having "eyes up high" to see troop movements. They were an at range spotter that could direct the squad to the enemy groups from anywhere on the map. Now, with the active scan sniper unbuff, we have people running in, scanning running scanning scanning scanning and asking where are the enemies right up until they get within range of the scanner. I find this annoying and would like at least to benefit from shared squad vision. I pay enough for my suits that I should at least have some benefit of intel about enemy positions without having to be within rifle range to find them.

Imperial Scrambler rilfe deals around 30% of its damage at that range

Oh right, silly me.

I failed to realized that you were implying it's inefficient to use a scrambler at 90m.

http://tinypic.com/r/2q1z41c/5

http://tinypic.com/r/9zu78x/5

I did these just for you so you can feel special. Okay darling?

You're not as accurate as me. I forgot that I was talking to an inferior breed of player. Please pardon me.

I may have over did it. Or do you need me to just do ONE KILL for you, just so you can be absolutely sure that it's plenty lethal in the hands of an accurate sniper?

Any weapon can be used beyond its optimal and still achieve results I kill guys at 50m with a scrambler pistol!
But the point he is trying to make is a sniper at those kind of ranges can match it, which also stems my belief of where long range starts.

By the way did you see the video or would like me to link it?

I am not normally a sniper but feel that it is in need of some sort of a buff terrain wise. Some thing to hide in or behind like that cloak CCP Wolfman promised or the suggested equipment "Dragon's Teeth" would be useful for snipers and provide some cover while they are picking where they are shooting. The whole idea that snipers need pads that CCP seems to have is ludicrous and to be perfectly clear it is completely ridiculous if they are going to protect everyone at the objective from snipers and not going to put a pad that is above the objective with good overwatch ability (like the top of the rings on the city map).

A sniper, by CCP design, has limited visibility close range with his rifle, scope sway at lower levels making moving to a new spot tedious and time consuming, and defenseless against anyone not in their scope's viewfinder. How does CCP want them to function? As a rag doll flopping on the ground waiting for an assault medic to come pick them up for wp? The "Designated Sniper Pads" are just as deadly perches for someone using an AR/MD/Forge/SMG/Knives when going to pick up the dead team mate too and for the one, possibly 2 bullets a sniper can put out from the locations that he needs to use a DS to get to (to subsequently get the thing shot down) are not worth firing for a death and the chance at no kills.

Sniping is a role that thrives on cover and is really designed with finding that perfect sniping cover in mind where you don't have to move for hours on end because movement makes you a target and easier to see in which case you are less effective. Considering we cannot go prone limiting sniper cover is a mistake, a very very bad mistake. In fact cover for all classes of player should be available on every map not just wide open buildings. IRL factories have machines to hide behind, gravel pits and forests have hills to hide behind and possibly some trees around the outside (tree trunks can block a 30/30 round easily enough) and the military in any country on any continent would likely not tell their sniper to "go down on one knee so you can't run and position yourself in the middle of a group of enemies forget about cover son your job is to snipe them before they get close enough to shoot".

The changes to shared squad vision are a big issue, in my mind, as well due to the benefit previously gained by having "eyes up high" to see troop movements. They were an at range spotter that could direct the squad to the enemy groups from anywhere on the map. Now, with the active scan sniper unbuff, we have people running in, scanning running scanning scanning scanning and asking where are the enemies right up until they get within range of the scanner. I find this annoying and would like at least to benefit from shared squad vision. I pay enough for my suits that I should at least have some benefit of intel about enemy positions without having to be within rifle range to find them.

Yes its not the best example, and clearly rigged. But your right my point is indeed that snipers can work at ~100m effectively, while you may have taken a guy down at 96mI doubt it would have been as fast as a sniper, and other drawbacks from said rifle will put you at disadvantage!!

Now I cannot deny you have theory of sniping down, nor would I, but also consider that in a game full of immortal mercenaries the traditional tactics don't always work.

For example, that spot inside the research facility also allows you to see out onto barren land, and if sit near the reactor column in the middle you can see another swathe of open terrain to snipe across again!

The best spots are the ones anyone can get to, but it also allows you to reposition faster as well, swings amd roundabouts you know?

Yes its not the best example, and clearly rigged. But your right my point is indeed that snipers can work at ~100m effectively, while you may have taken a guy down at 96mI doubt it would have been as fast as a sniper, and other drawbacks from said rifle will put you at disadvantage!!

Now I cannot deny you have theory of sniping down, nor would I, but also consider that in a game full of immortal mercenaries the traditional tactics don't always work.

For example, that spot inside the research facility also allows you to see out onto barren land, and if sit near the reactor column in the middle you can see another swathe of open terrain to snipe across again!

The best spots are the ones anyone can get to, but it also allows you to reposition faster as well, swings amd roundabouts you know?

but are they good for snipers to be? or tac AR? because of the direction this game is taking, it's like it's forcing me to use the AR of any variant for all of my needs. if CCP is gonna go that direction, tweak the snipers a bit to help them get along the new terrain so they can do part of their job well. i don't mind if my sniper can't operate well between 1-90 meters, but if we have to be that close now, make it fair for snipers to be able to handle it.

What like an assault varient, we could ask for that I guess?

That sniping theory is literally how every good sniper I have EVER observed, has ever done. From Sleepy Zan, to Immuto, to Heavenly Daughter, to trollsroyce... I can list a few more names.

Trying to find a sniper is supposed to be like playing "Where is Waldo?" not "Whack-a-Mole!".
Sleepy Zan took it an extra step and told me a few more things, and it's common sense, and it's sad that we don't have a few more snipers that do this, but he said,
"Pretty much, if you see your guys somewhere else, but you can capture something real quick, like the CRU, just go for it, then you can go back. You can pull off using your sniper rifle up close in emergencies if you hold a strafe and try to line it up. It takes practice, and you can't rely on it, but it's rewarding if you get it down."

Good snipers always know when to switch things up. These sweeping map changes were not the way to go about things.

What like an assault varient, we could ask for that I guess?

or a toned down sway while moving and ADS, something that helps that sniper a bit. the assault variant of the sniper is the tac AR though, since it's suppose to act like one

Oh right, silly me.

I failed to realized that you were implying it's inefficient to use a scrambler at 90m.

http://tinypic.com/r/1zc1n53/5

http://tinypic.com/r/9zu78x/5

I did these just for you so you can feel special. Okay darling?

You're not as accurate as me, I'm a sniper remember? I forgot that I was talking to an inferior breed of player. Please pardon me.

I may have overdid it just a little. Or do you need me to just do ONE KILL for you, just so you can be absolutely sure that it's plenty lethal in the hands of an accurate sniper?

*sarcasm aside*
As I was saying, 90m is TAC AR and Scrambler Range (for snipers). Period, and since we are generally crouched when shooting, that means that all the DPS, whether it's at 30% or not, is going RIGHT into us, and right into you if we're shooting at you.
That is NO place for a sniper rifle.

As a rule of thumb, if you can kill it with a regular rifle (AR, SCR) at a given range, you don't use a sniper rifle. Period.

EDIT: It's 35% btw

I can agree to that!!

congratulations on finishing someone with low hp at long range, this does not make the AScr effective at that range though. it takes like 9 seconds to kill a brick tanked proto suit at that range and that is assuming every shot hits which is just no going to happen. I got a kill with plasma cannon across the whole map last weekend, applying your ret/\rded monkey logic means all snipers are doomed as soon as they spawn when a PLC is on the field.

you just insulted your own intelligence with that post.

No, you just insulted YOUR own intelligence. I used an Imperial Scrambler Rifle, and downed a proto caldari with 7-8 rounds at 90+m.
I provided evidence.

Nowhere was a AScr "(assault scrambler rifle) used.

Get lost. Dumb fvck.

Just in case you DON'T understand.... the damage reduction apparently takes place across the top of your damage profile. Which is the LAST thing calculated. It does NOT reduce your BASE damage. Therefore bonus %ages are added BEFORE the reduction of damage profile at range occurs. That's why it's still so potent at range.

Here's the low down. With my proficiencies and damage mods i'm doing over 100 damage per shot vs. neutral target (neither armor nor shield). vs. shields. Now VS. SHIELDS. the +20% vs shields is calculated AFTER my proficiencies and damage mods. So lets put me about 100 damage. + 20%. 120 damage. 35% of 120? 42. Calculate headshot bonus, 7, 8, or 9 rounds.

Tell me again, that I need 9 seconds to kill someone at 90m... and make yourself look stupid... one more time. Straight
I dare you.
I double dare.
Tell me that 9 seconds is necessary, one more god-damned time.

all your provided is that you got the last hit and that you are just bad at sniping, nothing else

you dont even get the basics of math
prot tip:
value x * bonus * penalty = value x * penalty * bonus
here is a nice article explaining to you that order in multiplications does not matter http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiplication

headshot bonus is 50% btw and suits have armor too. my proto suit brick tanked has slightly over 1k ehp. assuming non charged shots, everything hits in the head and all my hp are shields, well sorry to bust your bubbles but your weapon would overheat before you could my brick tank.

but ok, you are the pro, everyone else is wrong, your are right. I guess there is no cure for your tunnelvision.

dude that's exactly how i described it. i just did it in literary terms. whatever.
hey you tell me what it is, i tell you what happened. if you can't take my word or screenshot for it, then fine. gtfo.

regards..

what is this? ignorance mode instead of tunnelvision now?

PS: some math lessons would not hurt in your case too.

You can still do that, I have found .4 much more tactical, I have met many snipers who run a different style, they run as squad support, I can imagine overwatch is a bit harder!

However that is prehaps something more attributed to a guy in a dropship!!