DUST Search - The so called aimbot-vid inside

Monkey MAC wrote:

DootDoot wrote:

Monkey MAC wrote:

Parson Atreides wrote:

Wouldn't mind seeing CCP's response to this.

I honestly don't think the AA is that bad (I say this as someone who uses a weapon that doesn't benefit from any type of Aim Assist), but the video definitely shows the reticle following the red player once AA is on. The motion is too fluid and precise for it to be the guy trying to trick us by using the stick.

Nerf it or keep it, I don't mind either way.

We should keep it, its not as bad as people have been claiming and it doesnt, stray for headshots, however you cant deny its is actively helping aiming.

At the same time unless your already aiming yourself, it will only eliminate the texan 2 stepping of previous builds!! Its not aimbot!!

If a computer moves your aim for you ever.... its not an aim assist... if you can't figure out a computer moving your gun at all ever is has nothing to do with you aiming then... why play FPS?

Im not saying its perfect and definitely requires tweaking, I wholey agree it shouldn't move your reticule, not really, but you also cant deny some people have blown it out of proportion!!

I also dont think its the MAIN problem, the hit boxes are wrong, somehow the hit detection/lag compensation is over the top, and even dropping aim assist wont solve that!!

We can all discuss the aim assist later once hit detection/lag compensation is sorted until then "fixing" anything else is pointless!!

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Spec Ops Cipher Seraphim Initiative.. 530	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:51:00 - [31] - Quote Will have another video testing by this time tomorrow.
Abby Invo DUST University Ivy League 58	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:52:00 - [32] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: lots of lag... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyv2bodB2hk Lag is delay in a network. OP's video depicts stutter, which is when the framerate drops. The capture kit is simply not recording at a high framerate or the person who uploaded the video reduced the framerate so as to save on memory. Don't try to use this as a cop-out because you don't agree with the results. The results are still valid, we're merely seeing them at a lower framerate.
Parson Atreides Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 646	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:55:00 - [33] - Quote Spec Ops Cipher wrote: Will have another video testing by this time tomorrow. Please test bunny hoping and both players strafing at once. Also test long strafes vs short strafes, circle strafes and figure eights please. I know you run shotgun so if you can test that too, it would be nice. If it doesn't really track when both players are moving then this is all sort of a moot point.
Nekrokult Cariocecus Consilium 15	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:55:00 - [34] - Quote Assist in maintaining a target on sight (by accelerating or decelerating the reticule as you manually try to follow the target) is ok (you can still loose the target if you move the stick too slow or too fast). Auto-targeting or auto-locking without any input from the player is definitely not ok. Helping you Gëá doing it for you.
Beren Hurin The Vanguardians 1444	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:55:00 - [35] - Quote Also it seems to only track if you are in the red zone. It doesn't pull you too the target, but favors aim at moving targets. I wonder what would happen and how it would track against a target moving in and out of cover.
Spec Ops Cipher Seraphim Initiative.. 530	Posted - 2013.09.06 22:57:00 - [36] - Quote Parson Atreides wrote: Spec Ops Cipher wrote: Will have another video testing by this time tomorrow. Please test bunny hoping and both players strafing at once. Also test long strafes vs short strafes, circle strafes and figure eights please. I know you run shotgun so if you can test that too, it would be nice. If it doesn't really track when both players are moving then this is all sort of a moot point. Will do, I'm not recording though, i'll be the dummy XD
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core Gallente Federation 262	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:04:00 - [37] - Quote Nemo Bluntz wrote: Johnny Guilt wrote: Nemo Bluntz wrote: Johnny Guilt wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMqe6MhXY6Y One of the only vids iv found actually testing the aim assist. i hope you guys take something from this vid and not exaggerate things of the forums before getting evidence. Did you watch past the first minute and half where he actually turns it on? Or did you watch the first 30 seconds, say to your self ah ha! then rush to the forums to post about how stupid we all are for thinking there's a significant amount of aim assist. i watch it 3 times already, how many times have you've watch it Its playing now. Just rewound... 2:00-2:09 is a perfect example of the game tracking for him. Or did you just stop watching as soon as you started to witness something you disagreed with? i saw it but i figured it wasnt a big deal compared to the aim assit in other console shooters with it .link
crazy space 1 Unkn0wn Killers 1714	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:07:00 - [38] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. Your choice guys vote for him, or vote for me
Vrain Matari ZionTCD 835	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:07:00 - [39] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. This is what we need. Solid video evidence to prove the case to CCP. Get the videos, preferably showing your DS3 together with your screen. Once posted, we players and CCP can see the player reaction to irrefutable evidence.
DootDoot Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 8	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:26:00 - [40] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Parson Atreides wrote: Wouldn't mind seeing CCP's response to this. I honestly don't think the AA is that bad (I say this as someone who uses a weapon that doesn't benefit from any type of Aim Assist), but the video definitely shows the reticle following the red player once AA is on. The motion is too fluid and precise for it to be the guy trying to trick us by using the stick. Nerf it or keep it, I don't mind either way. We should keep it, its not as bad as people have been claiming and it doesnt, stray for headshots, however you cant deny its is actively helping aiming. At the same time unless your already aiming yourself, it will only eliminate the texan 2 stepping of previous builds!! Its not aimbot!! If a computer moves your aim for you ever.... its not an aim assist... if you can't figure out a computer moving your gun at all ever is has nothing to do with you aiming then... why play FPS?

J Lav OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 200	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:32:00 - [41] - Quote A. You don't know when the player is turning, and when he's not. B. The only time the Aim Assist tracks the target, is when the player is stationary. Note that the target could still break from the aim assist. C. When he moves, the aim assist does not track the target, but adds friction when he gets on target. Interesting, seems the aim assist benefits players who stop and aim, more than players who run wildly in every direction holding strafe. Makes sense to me. There's a benefit and drawback to stopping.
Monkey MAC killer taxi company General Tso's Alliance 268	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:34:00 - [42] - Quote DootDoot wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Parson Atreides wrote: Wouldn't mind seeing CCP's response to this. I honestly don't think the AA is that bad (I say this as someone who uses a weapon that doesn't benefit from any type of Aim Assist), but the video definitely shows the reticle following the red player once AA is on. The motion is too fluid and precise for it to be the guy trying to trick us by using the stick. Nerf it or keep it, I don't mind either way. We should keep it, its not as bad as people have been claiming and it doesnt, stray for headshots, however you cant deny its is actively helping aiming. At the same time unless your already aiming yourself, it will only eliminate the texan 2 stepping of previous builds!! Its not aimbot!! If a computer moves your aim for you ever.... its not an aim assist... if you can't figure out a computer moving your gun at all ever is has nothing to do with you aiming then... why play FPS? Im not saying its perfect and definitely requires tweaking, I wholey agree it shouldn't move your reticule, not really, but you also cant deny some people have blown it out of proportion!! I also dont think its the MAIN problem, the hit boxes are wrong, somehow the hit detection/lag compensation is over the top, and even dropping aim assist wont solve that!! We can all discuss the aim assist later once hit detection/lag compensation is sorted until then "fixing" anything else is pointless!!
Cosgar ParagonX 4896	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:35:00 - [43] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. Wait, now CCP wants us to do their job for them? They have access to Tranquility just like the rest of us right?
Knight Soiaire Better Hide R Die 2284	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:42:00 - [44] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. Can CCP not test these things? Oh, wait, I forgot, we're still in Beta.
Ninjanomyx TeamPlayers EoN. 315	Posted - 2013.09.06 23:52:00 - [45] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. Why are you even here??? What purpose do you serve??? Seriously.....& you wonder why I see you as a Joke. Not even a "Quality" Joke.....more like a "Knock-Knock" Joke told incredibly wrong.......
Vin Mora Sanguis Defense Syndicate 128	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:09:00 - [46] - Quote Ninjanomyx wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. Why are you even here??? What purpose do you serve??? Seriously.....& you wonder why I see you as a Joke. Not even a "Quality" Joke.....more like a "Knock-Knock" Joke told incredibly wrong....... I doubt that he wonders anything about you feel about him.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 8107	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:26:00 - [47] - Quote Why are you arguing that you don't need a video of how hard these pull?
Monkey MAC killer taxi company General Tso's Alliance 268	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:27:00 - [48] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Why are you arguing that you don't need a video of how hard these pull? Waat?
Bojo The Mighty Zanzibar Concept 1712	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:32:00 - [49] - Quote FUN FACT! He was not actually aiming. He was making little attempt. If you actually use it, like I mean try using it to kill people, it really stands out! It let me track people's movement with such accuracy and ease it's disgusting. I think there should be aim assist but I mean when you are already OK, it makes you much better. I get that non-FPS need a crutch, as they should receive, but I mean when it allows OK people to just beat out skill, c'mon. Since you will point out some obvious, I will add some edit to refute. The ending gun scene was too frantic for even much skill to come into play. More of strategy to get the chaos in your favor. Rarely do I get that frantically close and disoriented (or anyone, unless you play point-blank-cqc-AR514 like that).
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 1432	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:41:00 - [50] - Quote Shadow Of-Chaos wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Still we need a video purely focusing on the conditioning of tracking what ranges, and things that cannot be attested to lag or desyncing issues as well. For example at the 2 minute mark the guy never fired so we don't know if the guy strafing off to the left or right would have been hit as the tracking was not perfect. The target also never strafed that long to see how far it sticks or if there is a threshold of unsticks to see if its angle based or speed based. If you guys really want to change things you need to start breaking things down to a science. I'm serious because all of these "I thinks' is not getting anywhere fast. the video seemed fairly thorough. before you get into strafing, bullet impact while tracking, all that crap, you have to answer one question. are you're ok with a computer literally aiming for you? In EVE, yes. In Dust, no.

Master Jaraiya Ultramarine Corp 703	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:48:00 - [51] - Quote Let me ask you this. What do you really think a video of someone's screen can prove? Do you know what kind of control input device he is using? No! Can you see it? No! Can you simultaneously watch his thumbs (or hands if he is using a Mouse) and the screen to judge if his movements correspond to the reticule moving on the screen or if the reticule is moving of it's own volition? No! Can you confirm that he has no framerate lag? No! All of his movements look twitchy, honestly. I can 100% with out a doubt tell you that there is no "lock on" feature with the current aim assist. As a matter of fact, I would venture to say that because all of his movements look twitchy, he is probably using a Kb/M. Notice when he is aiming from hip and strafing, there is no visible tell that there is any aim assist whatsoever. There is no "magnetism" there is not "target lock" When his buddy strafes in front of his reticule, the reticule does not "auto track" him. When he is ADS, he is simply strafing a tiny bit and stopping when he is actually aming at his buddy. His movements look fast and jerky because of the way you move with a Kb/M set up. Analog stick left to right movement works like this: You start at center, speed up to move right, slow down to center, speed up to left. When you change directions with an analog stick, you must always first pass through center. This cause you to slow down, then speed back up when you begin to move in the other direction. This makes your movements more fluid and more predictable. Kb/M movement works like this: You mash a button to move left, you mash a different button and you are immediately moving the other direction. So you can go from full speed right strafe to full speed left strafe without having to slow down, then speed up. This makes your movements look more twitchy, and less predictable. Are you people really this gullible? Seriously?
DootDoot Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 11	Posted - 2013.09.07 00:51:00 - [52] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: DootDoot wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Parson Atreides wrote: Wouldn't mind seeing CCP's response to this. I honestly don't think the AA is that bad (I say this as someone who uses a weapon that doesn't benefit from any type of Aim Assist), but the video definitely shows the reticle following the red player once AA is on. The motion is too fluid and precise for it to be the guy trying to trick us by using the stick. Nerf it or keep it, I don't mind either way. We should keep it, its not as bad as people have been claiming and it doesnt, stray for headshots, however you cant deny its is actively helping aiming. At the same time unless your already aiming yourself, it will only eliminate the texan 2 stepping of previous builds!! Its not aimbot!! If a computer moves your aim for you ever.... its not an aim assist... if you can't figure out a computer moving your gun at all ever is has nothing to do with you aiming then... why play FPS? Im not saying its perfect and definitely requires tweaking, I wholey agree it shouldn't move your reticule, not really, but you also cant deny some people have blown it out of proportion!! I also dont think its the MAIN problem, the hit boxes are wrong, somehow the hit detection/lag compensation is over the top, and even dropping aim assist wont solve that!! We can all discuss the aim assist later once hit detection/lag compensation is sorted until then "fixing" anything else is pointless!! you can't even prove hit detection with this system activated.. is it bigger hit boxes or is it aim assist blowing them up? you can't tone down a system that is fundamentally broken in the way it works... this is a FPS not WoW where we assume the computer will keep us locked on and all we got to do is make sure we are facing in the right direction for the attacks to be valid. Thats throwing out the entire concept of fine point aimingt for what... Slowing down the sensitivity input when on target for ds3 and allowing LDS snaps more to be more centered is one thing... Having the computer track you jumping... and side stepping... and running behind edges of buildings is a system built fundamentally wrong. Does it suck that they wasted these man hours? .... Its easy to say the hit detection is perfectly fine if no one has a computer tracking system enhancing their aim.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2291	Posted - 2013.09.07 01:05:00 - [53] - Quote Master Jaraiya wrote: Let me ask you this. What do you really think a video of someone's screen can prove? Do you know what kind of control input device he is using? No! Can you see it? No! Can you simultaneously watch his thumbs (or hands if he is using a Mouse) and the screen to judge if his movements correspond to the reticule moving on the screen or if the reticule is moving of it's own volition? No! Seriously? Hmm, well, you could setup a webcam to record your hands during a match, and overlay it. Streamers do that sometimes. With decent capture and cam it's very doable.
Lightning Bolt2 Binary Mercs Abandon PlayGrounds 166	Posted - 2013.09.07 01:40:00 - [54] - Quote that video looks fishy because of the twitchy movements, but the aim assist IS too much, we need a YouTuber with a controller to test this.
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2491	Posted - 2013.09.07 02:26:00 - [55] - Quote bolsh lee wrote: I hate to call it an Aimbot and being I don't speak Russian Im not sure if hes moving it himself but it looks damn close to an Aimbot at 2:00 in and 3:30.... Had to watch this without sound, but it seems he figured it out at around 2:00. It's hip-fire at medium-long range that is the problem.
DootDoot Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 12	Posted - 2013.09.07 04:10:00 - [56] - Quote Zeylon Rho wrote: Master Jaraiya wrote: Let me ask you this. What do you really think a video of someone's screen can prove? Do you know what kind of control input device he is using? No! Can you see it? No! Can you simultaneously watch his thumbs (or hands if he is using a Mouse) and the screen to judge if his movements correspond to the reticule moving on the screen or if the reticule is moving of it's own volition? No! Seriously? Hmm, well, you could setup a webcam to record your hands during a match, and overlay it. Streamers do that sometimes. With decent capture and cam it's very doable. Everything can be edited and refuted... people are learning to go on what they see not what they are told... specially these days.. and this doesn't bode well for public opinion that already was under general consensus of what this video shows... DS3 user and kb/M user alike. it isn't a peripheral debate its a this is wack debate.
Beren Hurin The Vanguardians 1450	Posted - 2013.09.07 04:17:00 - [57] - Quote J Lav wrote: A. You don't know when the player is turning, and when he's not. B. The only time the Aim Assist tracks the target, is when the player is stationary. Note that the target could still break from the aim assist. C. When he moves, the aim assist does not track the target, but adds friction when he gets on target. Interesting, seems the aim assist benefits players who stop and aim, more than players who run wildly in every direction holding strafe. Makes sense to me. There's a benefit and drawback to stopping. I think he's on to something here too. And the aim assist looks like it doesn't kick in until the target is in his 'red-zone' which makes me wonder how it tracks if you dodge in and out of cover breaking the redzone often?
2-Ton Twenty-One Ancient Exiles 905	Posted - 2013.09.07 04:19:00 - [58] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMqe6MhXY6Y One of the only vids iv found actually testing the aim assist. i hope you guys take something from this vid and not exaggerate things of the forums before getting evidence. Is it just me or does the game sound cooler in Russian?
KGB Sleep Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 178	Posted - 2013.09.07 05:07:00 - [59] - Quote i watched the video and all i have to say is.... Never trust a Russian in a pink FBI hat.
Nemo Bluntz TeamPlayers EoN. 541	Posted - 2013.09.07 05:23:00 - [60] - Quote Oh God. Anyone saying that this "could easily be kb/m" or him tracking (perfectly) with a DS3.... I can't even begin to respond to such nonsense claims. The kb/m controls are so floaty that I can only wish they could track that precise, and good luck ever tracking that accurately with a pad. If he can, that guy is some Russia savant who should be getting paid millions to play console FPS. This is classic "I'm seeing this information... but I don't want to believe it, so I'll make up a conspiracy/total bullshit claim to refute it." Come the **** on, already.



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