Swarm Launchers Cost the same as small turrets of their tier
AV Grenades Cost the same as small turrets of their tier
Forge Guns cost the same as large turrets of their tier.

The other benefits of the tank or suit are paid for by buying the tank or suit.

Yeah... small problem with you logic ... AV weapons only kills Vehicles .. turrets kills EVERYTHING.

Forge Guns?

Yeah... small problem with you logic ... AV weapons only kills Vehicles .. turrets kills EVERYTHING.

Yea cause a hand grenade costs the same as a vehicle mounted weapon.

Yeah, that one is the problem... i agree it should cost allot more ISK, since they seem to be good at EVERYTHING too. But all the other AV weapons are very restrictive.

Cant wait for the medium and heavy aerial vehicles to come into the game, thats REALLY gonna **** HAV jockeys off

I look forward to the "Wahhhhhh they should cost 10M because they are good at their intended role and drop bombs and stuff waaaahhh "

you call homing swarms and av nades restrictive?

you call homing swarms and av nades restrictive?

very very fair

especially considering i hear infantry moaning about how isk is useless and they never worry about going full proto all the time

Yea cause a hand grenade costs the same as a vehicle mounted weapon.

The ones moaning are the ones who don't run full proto all the time and instead use BPO fittings

Hell by your logic why dose a hand grenade do more dammage than a small missile turret???

Very limited range, very limited ammunition and easy to avoid unless you spend 2 seconds cooking it first. And all infantry have access to the grenades making them equal.

Very limited range, very limited ammunition and easy to avoid unless you spend 2 seconds cooking it first. And all infantry have access to the grenades making them equal.

Very limited range, very limited ammunition and easy to avoid unless you spend 2 seconds cooking it first. And all infantry have access to the grenades making them equal.

This

Tanks need infantry homing grenades.

The proto blaster already kills my 700eHP clone in less than a second, no need for homing grenades as everything you point at is dead.

we are talking about av nades dude.

lol you dont even need to point. your swarms and av nades do all the work for you

Then I agree somewhat with the lai dai grenades. Remember the squishy clone has to get up close to hit with the AV grenade. You have three turrets on the tank and active scanners, should be easy to avoid unless you go solo in your tank and drive around in the red blob thinking you should be invincible in the metal fortress.

Yea dont need to aim SL or nades, one of these days am gonna read one of your posts that make sense and my head will explode.

lol you dont even need to point. your swarms and av nades do all the work for you

dont just assume that every tank has a scanner and use it as part of your argument here man. If you are putting yourself in harms way to get those lai dais off you are doing it wrong. hiding behind a short wall is perfect tactics and railings somehow stop tank fire unless you take the time to aim through the bars.

You are aware how useless swarm launcher clones are against other infantry? If one tanker provokes the opposite team to spawn with 4 swarmers, that makes it 15 clones vs 12 clones. And your tank is still lethal to everything red on the field, where the swarm launchers can do little but try and target the tank. Maybe the tanker ends up hiding most of the game, but you have accomplished a big advantage for your team.

No, he have a point, most tanks i shoot at they don't move when they see me shooting at them.. is a bit like... " Ha,ha ! look another AV loser " ... To they realize that i packing ADV Swarm Launcher with Complex light damage modules, and a ADV Plasma Cannon to break through their shields... then they run as hell when they see their shields dropping almost instantly.

Cant wait for the medium and heavy aerial vehicles to come into the game, thats REALLY gonna **** HAV jockeys off

I look forward to the "Wahhhhhh they should cost 10M because they are good at their intended role and drop bombs and stuff waaaahhh "

+1

Wait for the rage of a 500k FG and a 360k swarm launcher/av nades

while i can see you probably do have a problem with this, i will never accept it as a valid argument as a whole. I have an entire alt character built upon using SMGs and knives and i promise you, they are anything but useless

whats the point of having a lethal tank if everything that tries to kill us is invisible?

+1

Wait for the rage of a 500k FG and a 360k swarm launcher/av nades

360k for a Swarm Launcher ? just to be kill by a red-line sniper in a couple of shoots ? or a scout with a Militia Shotgun .. or a MD with a couple of nades ? yeah... i can see how that will work perfectly ... nearly a 450k Dropsuit wasted "TRYING" to kill a tank.

The difference is the price of the suit. You would need to go full proto if you have to add both advanced AV and an advanced sidearm making your fit very expensive. The AV'er normally adds damage mods making him very vulnerable to close quarter combat which all sidearms are aimed at. Being in a 200k isk suit with only a SMG as main weapon, and it is not even proto or have any damage mods. Yes, you could balance it with a better sidearm and less damage on the AV, but then you would not be able to archive much against anything but milita and standard stuff.
The consensus on this forum sounds like it is proto AV with damage modules that are needed against LLAV vehicles and skilled tankers unless you can get up close with nano hives and lai dai grenades. The AV grenade clone should be avoidable, there is a huge risc on the clone trying to get up close.

Commando?

Also, side arm.

360k for a Swarm Launcher ? just to be kill by a red-line sniper in a couple of shoots ? or a scout with a Militia Shotgun .. or a MD with a couple of nades ? yeah... i can see how that will work perfectly ... nearly a 450k Dropsuit wasted "TRYING" to kill a tank.

I doesn't matter how you try to look at it .... tanks don't get kill by a sneaky scout with a Shotgun, or an annoying red-line sniper packing light damage modules ... suggesting that a hand-held weapon should cost nearly as much as a tank, is the most ridiculous thing i hear in this forums.

I doesn't matter how you try to look at it .... tanks don't get kill by a sneaky scout with a Shotgun, or an annoying red-line sniper packing light damage modules ... suggesting that a hand-held weapon should cost nearly as much as a tank, is the most ridiculous thing i hear in this forums.

it doesn't matter how you try to look at it....tanks get killed by a sneaky scout with lai dais, or an annoying invisible tower sniper forge packing heavy damage modules........suggesting that a hand-held weapon should do nearly as much damage as a tank, is the most ridiculous thing i have heard in these forums.



See? I can do it too.

Cant wait for the medium and heavy aerial vehicles to come into the game, thats REALLY gonna **** HAV jockeys off

I look forward to the "Wahhhhhh they should cost 10M because they are good at their intended role and drop bombs and stuff waaaahhh "

You know how easily Scouts die ?... you just have to look at them with evil eyes and they die. For every time a Scout kills a tank it dies about 4 or 5 times in the process... 400k x 4 = 1,600,000 isk ... that is allot of ISK for 1 tank kill.

You know how easily Scouts die ?... you just have to look at them with evil eyes and they die. For every time a Scout kills a tank it dies about 4 or 5 times in the process... 400k x 4 = 1,600,000 isk ... that is allot of ISK for 1 tank kill.

About the price of the tank you killed. If you are bad at it.

And how many KILLS that tank gets ? 30-40 kills ? How much ISK it gets at the end of the battle ? You suggesting that spending 1,600,000 isk for ONE kill is acceptable ?

30-40? in this build? i dont think your opinions matter here anymore.

I see infantry going over 35 kills a match. You are telling me that tanks are doing worse than infantry.

And how many times infantry dies ? .. some times i get 30 kills.. "sometimes", but i die a minimum of 8 times in the process. Tanks can potentially get 30 kills without dying ones... is a very big difference ...Imagine if AV nades cost 300k ..

8 X 350k = 2,800,000 isk.

Yeah... small problem with you logic ... AV weapons only kills Vehicles .. turrets kills EVERYTHING.

Yeah but you can run an ISK profit every game with infantry unless you are stupid and run proto. My 2.2m SP alt runs ADV and makes a profit every game.

If AV grenades cost 300k, people would think before slapping them onto an assault suit not meant for AV. I'm not saying that they should cost that much, but a price increase in AV will make people think twice before slapping on AV. And proto forges need to cost at least half of a proto large turret. The amount of proto forges that are being run is astonishing, as the risk v reward is extremely low for them on top of towers. If they cost more, people would think twice before starting a match with an IAFG before any vehicles have been called in.

btw swarms have only one real valid target: armor tanks
-shield tanks are too resistant due to explo resistance
-llav are invincible
-dropships outrun swarms with AB, once they are at 1/3 health they just fly away and come back later with full health
-untanked vehicles can be also taken out by militia swarms, not an argument

the price for swarms is fine.

Why does everyone say LLAVs are invincible? They are no where near invincible. It just takes some tactics to kill them, but they burn quite nice. Sorry, not the point of the thread, I just get really annoyed when I see people say this.

When you hit a LLAV with an AVD Plasma Cannon with Damage modules.. and the shield "doesn't" goes down.. i'll say that makes them invincible... remember that the Plasma Cannon is supposed to be designed to break through Vehicles Shields.

They are not invincible. I've lost my Charybdis plenty of times because I had three proto swarms unleashed upon me at once. It's called coordination. Sadly, this kind of coordination needs to be used for taking out HAVs, not LLAVs.

When you hit a LLAV with an AVD Plasma Cannon with Damage modules.. and the shield "doesn't" goes down.. i'll say that makes them invincible... remember that the Plasma Cannon is supposed to be designed to break through Vehicles Shields.

Cant wait for the medium and heavy aerial vehicles to come into the game, thats REALLY gonna **** HAV jockeys off

I look forward to the "Wahhhhhh they should cost 10M because they are good at their intended role and drop bombs and stuff waaaahhh "

Three Proto Swarms Coordination is a PUB match ?.. yeah.. like that happens often ..First you need THREE Proto Swarm Launchers in the same team... Then some type of communication.. like.. 3,2,1 SHOOT...

Even Corps will find that hard in a PC battle.. to many variables... So is pretty much IMPOSSIBLE in a PUB match.

Implying tankers are supposed to be solo-viable and profitable.

actually not. it's a CQC weapon. read the description in-game. but that's beside the point lol.

swarms are getting nerfed in 1.4 (clip size)

LLAVs are getting nerfed in 1.4

... big things are apparently coming in 1.5

We shall see.

Three Proto Swarms Coordination is a PUB match ?.. yeah.. like that happens often ..First you need THREE Proto Swarm Launchers in the same team... Then some type of communication.. like.. 3,2,1 SHOOT...

Even Corps will find that hard in a PC battle.. to many variables... So is pretty much IMPOSSIBLE in a PUB match.

-_-
I'll just add the one nerf and not add the other multiple buffs...

Yea cause a hand grenade costs the same as a vehicle mounted weapon.

yeah cuz a hand gernade does more damage than a vehicle mounted weapon...