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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
6988
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 00:44:00 -
[31] - Quote
Increase HP,
Give ADS controls to all Dropships
Add new quality life controls (like auto level off/hover/retros)
Give WP for supporting and transporting the team.
Fix PG skill
Give real roles to all three variants. |
G Groenenstein
The Malevolent Monkey Militia
2
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:48:00 -
[32] - Quote
Nelo Angel0 wrote:xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:Nelo Angel0 wrote:Right now their underpowered. Their supposed to be dropships, get in pick people up get out. But as is they can be raped by swarms and FGs. The AV is fine but the DS needs more health in order to do it's job effectively. Saying that if DS get more HP they should lose their weapons and gain more passenger seats.
In all it'd like look this. +HP +WP bonuses for CRU +PG&CPU +passenger seats
-weapons
That's just the regular dropship. The assault would stay as is and logistics would be a variation on the regular that's faster,has less HP,more PG&CPU,slots,even more seats to carry people.
I'm on the fence about if the logi version should have weapons though. I mean the dropships main role is fast reliable transportation not destruction and mayham (save that for bombers).
What do you guys think? This^ DS should move troops from one spot to another, so they'd have an insane amount of HP (not really that insane) but they should have less weapons. What i'm getting at overall is. Best air to ground: bombers Best Air to Air: fighters Best transport: dropships. For bombers you can carry alot of people and they'll be on weapons but it'll be a slow ride and not one that will drop you where you need to be dropped off. Fighters will be the most useful in air to air combat and will be the most used to destroy HAVs/dropships. However to drop someone off using a fighter would mean to stop. Stopping would mean getting yourself killed by AV.
Bombers will be a totally different type of flying vehicle. Dropships job is extraction and dropoff meaning it should be able to face allot more damage than it does now while providing support. If u just wana get to a location throw out a uplink. Using a dropship with no guns make no sense unless ure dropping tanks and lavs off with it to. Air to air will only work once dropships cant be shot down by any ground based infantry its ridiculous everyone wants a shot at a ADS because they know its expensive. |
Johnny Guilt
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
211
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:50:00 -
[33] - Quote
They're pretty hard to take down if they're fast and they have enough HP to get away and this is coming from a my experience with forge guns. |
G Groenenstein
The Malevolent Monkey Militia
3
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:51:00 -
[34] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:There's no point in flying anything other than an Assault Dropship since CCP thought it would be a good idea to butcher the handling on militia, standard, and logistics dropships in order to give the illusion that Assault Dropships had an upgrade in speed and handling, when in fact (or damn close to it) the other ships simply lost their grace. The handling of the ADS is only just a hair better than the handling of dropships in the before time.
God damn it this game pisses me off sometimes.
Actually i find the Prometheus to be the best dropship it just needs more thrust more pg then it would be pretty much balanced. |
Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
986
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 00:52:00 -
[35] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Increase HP,
Give ADS controls to all Dropships
Add new quality life controls (like auto level off/hover/retros)
Give WP for supporting and transporting the team.
Fix PG skill
Give real roles to all three variants.
You're a CPM quit making sense.
Why should a support vehicle receive war points for contributing to a support role? Nah.
I say make them try to be gunships without giving them the tools to be gunships. Make it super expensive and then laugh at them when an RDV steals 1.5 million by spawning inside them! Is there an application for vehicle balance dev? I feel overly qualified! |
Nelo Angel0
The Nommo Insurance Fraud.
155
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:55:00 -
[36] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Increase HP,
Give ADS controls to all Dropships
Add new quality life controls (like auto level off/hover/retros)
Give WP for supporting and transporting the team.
Fix PG skill
Give real roles to all three variants.
If I had to fix it that's what I do but alas I don't do that thing.
Give WP for people spawning in on you and bonus points for those people leaving your dropships. This way the system desn't get abused (people just entering and leaving the dropship.)
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gbghg
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
2959
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:55:00 -
[37] - Quote
Xender17 wrote:Against AV they're underpowered. But swarms are pretty useless against them tbh. Tanks are only a threat if they are behind the redline. In other cases we have to hide from them now.
FGs are the only problem. They can fire at DS directly above them. Tanks can't/ Swarm will most likely only hit once/ plasma cannon.... lol. DS needs a buff to they're controls, stability and HP. Swarms need to be visible. You can't tell where FGs are coming from to half the time too. Also by saying swarms are useless against them now. You will most likely disagree with me, but if dropships can outrun swarms... whats going to happen to swarms when jets are introduced? Maybe decrease their start up speed. They stay in the air for several seconds then launch faster. I'd split swarms into 2 varieties, a slow (current speed, maybe 10% slower) but high damage version (10% stronger than current damage) and a faster (10-20% faster) but weaker in damage (say 10%) variants. |
G Groenenstein
The Malevolent Monkey Militia
3
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Posted - 2013.08.06 00:57:00 -
[38] - Quote
Nelo Angel0 wrote:G Groenenstein wrote:Nelo Angel0 wrote:Right now their underpowered. Their supposed to be dropships, get in pick people up get out. But as is they can be raped by swarms and FGs. The AV is fine but the DS needs more health in order to do it's job effectively. Saying that if DS get more HP they should lose their weapons and gain more passenger seats.
In all it'd like look this. +HP +WP bonuses for CRU +PG&CPU +passenger seats
-weapons
That's just the regular dropship. The assault would stay as is and logistics would be a variation on the regular that's faster,has less HP,more PG&CPU,slots,even more seats to carry people.
I'm on the fence about if the logi version should have weapons though. I mean the dropships main role is fast reliable transportation not destruction and mayham (save that for bombers).
What do you guys think? I think you dont fly enough to know what youre talking about./ LEt me ask you this have you ever seen a chopper in real life that does less damage while being a troop transport with its turret and a AR does? My proto turrets do less damage than a standard AR. Tell me how this is not ridiculously stupid. Troop transports can carry weapons. Ure idea is ridiculous. Why dont just go throw down uplinks then and remove dropships completely? I agree that dropships need a masssive hp bonus And with everything else you said + weapons. IF a tank hovers around the objective 10 guys storm it and take 10 rounds each to take it out. IT can still run away. give dropships this option. IF i hover and htere is a forge gunner and a swarmer im toast. I cant even run. First and foremost your grammar man it makes my eyes bleed. Of course I should mention I don't ride dropships AT ALL. Try to remember this is just a rough draft of a overall idea. One cannot simply buff dropships with no consideration for them being broken. Why spec into bombers if the previously weak dropships can start tanking shots and destroy infantry? Why spec into fighters when dropships start out lasting them and are even able to kill them? Of course i'm not saying all dropships deserve the same treatment and that they should ALL get the same +/-s. What i'm saying is the intial dropships should be dedicated transport with high HP, how high is debatable. They should be able to move in and out of areas quickly or stay in one area for an extended amount of time if need be. The assault version is the one that'd be used as a infantry harassment and the one people would be spec into for killing and transporting(just not the latter as effectively anymore). As for the turret issue. This is an idea for dropships not their weapons. The weapons are not my problem and i wouldn't know how to handle them to begin with. If you want feel free to toss ideas around other than criticizing mine.
I have given ideas already. You dont need troop transport with uplinks. Remove uplinks completely and ill agree with you . Make dropships glorified transportation. Put guns on logies and and assaults are anti tank and ti dropship vehicles. Logis troop support and mobile cru. Normal dropship just dropship. Jets should be bombers only remove orbitals. Give all air vehicles buffs in each area. HP(largest buff), PG,CPU,Thrusts,Speed and fix collision errors with RDV and MCC. Also im not English get over it. Not everyone is American |
Paladin Sas
Pro Hic Immortalis League of Infamy
185
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Posted - 2013.08.06 01:04:00 -
[39] - Quote
i know im gonna get alot of hate for this, but im not sure dropships are overly terrible. yes they have issues with the controlls and module selection, and as a semi-compitent door gunner myself, the bloody magnet on the front nose of the ship needs to be removed. a slight pg increase would be nice but overall with a decent pilot (points to Nguruthos) and a doorgunner that knows how to kill targets and cordinate with the pilot, they can be super difficult to kill. i personally believe the main issue lies with the unbalance of AV vs. Vehicles. its not the the dropships arent strong enough (we dont want flying bricks) its more that AV (ie forge) is TO strong. the range on forge guns needs to be brought in, and the fire time between rounds increased. now, i know im gonna get flamed because im not actually a pilot, but thist is just what ive witnessed being in dropships alot. yes buff the ship, but not to much, just bring AV in line. and fix the bloody instakill MCC. |
Paladin Sas
Pro Hic Immortalis League of Infamy
185
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Posted - 2013.08.06 01:08:00 -
[40] - Quote
a note on forge guns, Assault - keep a high ROF, but bring the range WAY in... it should be for clost range AV defense, it fires WAY to fast to have the same range as all the others standard - mid range, drop the damage a wee bit and increase the cycle time by about a second breach? (the one where you cant move) - im ok with the range on this beast because it requires some thought to your personal positioning to use properly, and because of the massive charge time on it, im ok with it being the "sniper" forge, it should reward good aim with solid hits. really, i think its ok where its at
again, the idea here isnt to to buff or nerf anything to much or to little, its about finding a balance
EDIT - NERF THE BOLAS |
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Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
986
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 01:26:00 -
[41] - Quote
Paladin Sas wrote:i know im gonna get alot of hate for this, but im not sure dropships are overly terrible. yes they have issues with the controlls and module selection, and as a semi-compitent door gunner myself, the bloody magnet on the front nose of the ship needs to be removed. a slight pg increase would be nice but overall with a decent pilot (points to Nguruthos) and a doorgunner that knows how to kill targets and cordinate with the pilot, they can be super difficult to kill. i personally believe the main issue lies with the unbalance of AV vs. Vehicles. its not the the dropships arent strong enough (we dont want flying bricks) its more that AV (ie forge) is TO strong. the range on forge guns needs to be brought in, and the fire time between rounds increased. now, i know im gonna get flamed because im not actually a pilot, but thist is just what ive witnessed being in dropships alot. yes buff the ship, but not to much, just bring AV in line. and fix the bloody instakill MCC.
I don't want to be god.
Unbalance is not fun in both ways. DS are not overly weak in general but in specifics. Rail tanks, rail turrets, forge guns.
These things set up too many situations where the best pilot in the world with the best ship in the world, best modules and best SP can literally have done nothing to survive against one player with a free redline installation, cheap dmg modded rail tank in the red line, or a forge gun that simple shoots to fast and does too much damage to ever survive once within 100 meters them. And its difficult to tell which dot has a FG since they don't glow anymore, and hide around corners. Theres no telling that one has spawned in, but he knows the moment you activate a ship and this sound alerts the entire game.
He does not render to you beyond a certain point. Damage indicators are inaccurate to the direction hes coming from. There is no cover in the air. 320 meter range with 100% accuracy. All dropship functions require slowing down or hovering at certain points and the charge time on say assault forge gun makes they can easily sink 2/3 of the required forge shots needed to destroy any dropship before the thing has built enough momentum to even move outside his original position completely.
DS does not need a massive buff. And FG may not need a tremendous nerf. But some balancing needs done between the two and I'd say its around the 20-30% area. Somehow
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Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
986
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 01:31:00 -
[42] - Quote
Paladin Sas wrote:a note on forge guns, Assault - keep a high ROF, but bring the range WAY in... it should be for clost range AV defense, it fires WAY to fast to have the same range as all the others standard - mid range, drop the damage a wee bit and increase the cycle time by about a second breach? (the one where you cant move) - im ok with the range on this beast because it requires some thought to your personal positioning to use properly, and because of the massive charge time on it, im ok with it being the "sniper" forge, it should reward good aim with solid hits. really, i think its ok where its at
again, the idea here isnt to to buff or nerf anything to much or to little, its about finding a balance
EDIT - NERF THE BOLAS
I could get on board with all of this. I think a single player should not so effortlessly be able to destroy literally any dropship imaginable in under 3 seconds while exposing themselves to zero risk of going ISK negative for the match. I mean you'd have to kill how many assault forge guns to == one dropship? But the whole time they just keep coming back. There no real victory in killing them. Theres no point its like you're better off avoiding them. Marking and leaving that entire 320 meter radius of the map totally ignored (mostly the whole map) than risking your life to kill it and have it spawn in god knows where to broadside you with 3200 damage every 0.7 seconds or whatever the hell it is.
Maybe I'm only mad that I've lost 700 million ISK to RDV's and forge guns so far and most of it was completely unavoidable. |
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