I respectfully disagree.

the plasma cannon cannot get a kdr of seven, and if the MD was as busted as it is then obtaining a 7 KDR would be impossible.
the lazer cannot get you a kdr of seven, and if the MD was as busted as it is then obtaining a 7 KDR would be impossible.

Even some of the best pubstomping campers can't get a kdr of 7. Like I said, there are fewer than 50 people on dust that have a kdr of 7 or higher (that have more than 8k kills and actually play) and even fewer if you really consider that many of those people are tankers. It proves a lot...name one bad player that has that 7 or higher KDR and I will rescind.

I said earlier I have no problem with them fixing known problems with the MD, but saying it's broken is incorrect IMO for stated reasons. It does enough damage, it kills just fine, it's a lethal weapon.

It's bugged. CCP is working on it.

Some of us still use it and do well but it's tough. For now, flux nades and damage mods are your best friends.

(also, all the cool MD players hang out in chat channel: Massholes)

I keep forgetting to add that channel when I'm in game

If the enemy is too far for flux to reach, then he's probably too far to even hit you reliably with the current low range. You do maximum damage at maximum range, the tradeoff is that you have to have a lot practice with the MD to know its arc. Lob MDs at him until he tries to close the gap or retreats, in that case you won the battle. Another way to think of this weapon as support is watching your teamates down a guy's shields and lob MDs at him when he takes cover and think he's safe.



Being able to hit multiple players is an advantage in more compact areas like cities but thats only one way of thinking about it. The other way is the fact you dont even need to hit or see your opponent to do damage. If being able to hit people behind cover or missing and still doing damage isnt an advantage then I dont know what is.

The argument I'm trying to make in this thread is that MD isnt suppose to kill like an AR or a semi-auto AR. If that were the case they would have to remove splash damage and grenade arc, and increase projectile speed .
Stop comparing MD to main offensive weapons as they operate very differently in different circumstances.

Oh come on. KDR is such a lame metric in this game. I wont be able to name anyone simply because I dont pay attention to KDR. KDR is something that protostomping corps use when they recruit and compare epeens inside the corp. It has zero relevance to the game play and is a poor correlate to the skill. I can't tell you how many times I ve seen players from negative feedback back out from pub games when they play solo on a losing side (even if their side does not lose but comes close) just to save their KDR status. Yes, it's true that a bad player won't get KDR of 7 no matter what. Beyond that anyone with average skill can get that KDR if they want it. In this game it's too easy to stack up proto equipment in your favor and then just carefully pick your fights. The reason why there are not more ppl with a high KDR is because actually few ppl care that much about it to try to maintain it. I am saying all of that to say that your argument about using one MD user maintaining a high KDR as an example to support you argument that MD is not a weak weapon is weak.

You may hold these assumptions because you cannot accept that a 7 or higher kdr takes an enormous amount of skill, that's fine. You have no proof of your claims. I can name tons of players that have achieved those levels of kdr through skill and talent and I can name players that play PC and have lost those kdrs a bit playing PC matches because they want to play against great competition, they don't care about their kdr. They run into the thick of it to get the most kills just like any of the rest of us, they just are better overall. If you want to exclude the kdr because your own bias then fine, hope it helps ya sleep better. The rest of us who have the humility to see these players for the beasts they are will continue to improve and have the fun playing them.

u dont know what your talking about.

The damage on the flaylock is as follows. 250 dmg for a direct hit and 230 dmg AOE (explosive radius dmg).

Actually yo
In Dust weapons that have direct dmg and splash dmg have both of those dmgs added together for a hit. IE mass driver for a direct hit does MASSIVE dmg because it has the direct dmg plus the AOE dmgs.

So 250 direct dmg and 230 splash ends up with 480 dmg from a direct hit. Now its considered an explosive so it does less dmg to shields. I believe explosive damage only does 80% against shields??? Correct me if I am wrong on that number. So direct hit on shields would be 384 dmg. But it does additional dmg to armor. Explosive dmg to armor is +25% which is 600 dmg for a direct hit. If you dont believe me you can go test it out yourself. Or your can even view the fan fest video showing the flaylock. You will notice on the fanfest video that the flaylock was 1 shotting heavies who had full armor but no shields. A heavy with no armor mods has 405 armor (now remember in fanfest everyone was fully lvled up so the heavy would have had the 25% bonus to armor which actually brings that amount to 506 armor hp). And you can clearly see a direct hit on at least 2 occasions killing the heavy in 1 shot.

Like I said I dont care if you believe me or not. I have the proof right in front of me. And I play regularly with Bonney who uses them and he was skeptical at first but after using it he mentioned that he noticed the same thing the dmg done by a direct hit is MUCH MUCH greater than the dmg done by splash alone. If you look at the numbers noted the difference of 20 damage is pretty small to be able to notice a huge difference between a direct hit and a hit by splash. BTW a direct hit from the flaylock will insta kill 99% of the scouts.

support for what? special explosion effects? If it does not kill what and how does it support? Is it a revival gun? does it should nanohives? How exactly does it support?

Look forward to it. Will be trawling the forums while at the slots tonight, drunk.

Let's evaluate here all of your responses to my posts:

Pardon my cinicism, but seeing how you are in Team Players (cause being in teamplayers means you go protostomp noobs all day when our 2 most visible players, Cubs and our CEO Hightimes run in 32k fits in every pub match they play), I would bet all those 23k adn 7.0 came from proto stomping noobs.

(You were wrong about your assertions here.)

I thought the only reason to protostomp was to have a kdr of of at least 7. (Never verified, a wrong dubious assertion here again) I am not gonna argue against that he is a beast or a god or a stud, I don't know who he is and I don't care. I am saying that kdr of 7 is possible with just about any weapon when proto stumping. (proved you were wrong about this one as well because i have proof from the players who do have that kind of KDR vs you who just dismissed it because that's all you could do.) So, it's a weak argument for why MD is a viable and balanced weapon. (No, if a good player can use it well, then why should I believe you're not just a noob who would be qq'ing over the HMG when it's perfectly fine like people are currently doing? or people qq'ing about nova knives being OP?) -_-

My response:
I respectfully disagree.

the plasma cannon cannot get a kdr of seven, and if the MD was as busted as it is then obtaining a 7 KDR would be impossible.
the lazer cannot get you a kdr of seven, and if the MD was as busted as it is then obtaining a 7 KDR would be impossible.
People can achieve a KDR of 7 with the mass driver and maintain it post uprising, so it seem like that is evidence in favor of my r
Even some of the best pubstomping campers can't get a kdr of 7. Like I said, there are fewer than 50 people on dust that have a kdr of 7 or higher (that have more than 8k kills and actually play) and even fewer if you really consider that many of those people are tankers. It proves a lot...name one bad player that has that 7 or higher KDR and I will rescind. (see this providing leeway for me to change my opinion? notice you never include any such statements in yours? Hmm)

Your response:

Oh come on. KDR is such a lame metric in this game. I wont be able to name anyone simply because I dont pay attention to KDR. (and of course because it's impossible even if you chose to ) KDR is something that protostomping corps use when they recruit and compare epeens inside the corp. (Oh so that's how you assume it goes cause you've been in how many of those corps? the butthurt is strong with this one) It has zero relevance to the game play and is a poor correlate to the skill. (in truth, as aforementioned, a player with that high of a KDR can't be a bad player using proto, they can't even be a good player using proto like Nikia Bethune, or King Kobrah, is has to be someone extremely exceptional, but of course it's easier for you to deny that and proffer weak arguments against it so please feel free) I can't tell you how many times I ve seen players from negative feedback back out from pub games when they play solo on a losing side (even if their side does not lose but comes close) just to save their KDR status (assuming intent ) If it was all about inflating KDR then they wouldn't be the most winningest corp on dust ). Yes, it's true that a bad player won't get KDR of 7 no matter what. (a welcome submission) Beyond that anyone with average skill can get that KDR if they want it. (Proof it's not an assertion? oh wait, you don't want to do that, you just want to throw out assertions without fact behind it cause that's easier than using facts and data and people's experiences sans your own ) In this game it's too easy to stack up proto equipment in your favor and then just carefully pick your fights. (maybe sometimes, but not always...or every decent sniper would have a 100 kdr and all these tryhards would just redline snipe right? ) The reason why there are not more ppl with a high KDR is because actually few ppl care that much about it to try to maintain it. (Exactly, meaning the ones who achieve that are the ones who earned 7 or higher kdr's, another wecome submission ) I am saying all of that to say that your argument about using one MD user maintaining a high KDR as an example to support you argument that MD is not a weak weapon is weak. (I think we're done here )