DUST Search - Role of an HMG Heavy?

Kitten Empress wrote:

ChromeBreaker wrote:

Kitten Empress wrote:

ChromeBreaker wrote:

Kitten Empress wrote:

Ehhm, CCP said it themselves.
HMG's are for point defense.

CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way...

HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing...

How are CCP wrong if this is their game and they decide what role to give to something?
Even if it isn't balanced right, CCP wants this weapon to work for point defense, whether you like it or not .

Because they are trying to restrict an entire class? I dont use my heavy as a defensive unit. If i want to charge an objective (albeit slowly) and i do it smart then i should be able to.
Just because CCP says thats what they want it to be doesnt make it right, by god im going to do the complete opposite.

I Advance on an objective lol. Im going to defend the enemies objective against them.

If CCP then completely crunch down on something so it can ONLY be used one way... well then thats detrimental against the entire game

Go assault then.
You can't have the best of both worlds, your suit is a specialized suit meaning its supposed to do one thing best but the rest it wouldn't be as effective.
Its like expecting a scout to be able to go head on against enemies and expect to survive.

Now, for my second point, who the **** are you to dictate to CCP what the heavy suit is?
They can tomorrow give it scout HP and give the HMG over 9000 damage per bullet.
Its their choice, not yours.

Now, about the rest of your post, your balance idea makes heavies the best defense/offense/everything.
You have no idea on how to balance.

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 388	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:37:00 - [31] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Ill be in game in about 15 minutes though if you want to squad up and run a skirmish match or two actually sounds cool. i'm on the east coast, i was checking the forums and was about to sleep, but i'd be more than happy to squad up with you tommorrow. whats a good time for you? im on the east coast so its 3.34 aM here, but at 1:00pm i can be on and squad up. how's that sound? MST here and 1 pm EST is too early in the day for me How is between 8 and 9 pm MST for you?
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 189	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:37:00 - [32] - Quote SoTa PoP wrote: Legend - I still don't get why you think HMG is low DPS. L1 is your friend - learn to use it. And even then don't just stand still accepting every bullet fired at you. HMG in good hands with smart movement choices and is still dangerous - we just can't be agressive because of lack of range. And our PC presence had diminished greatly since all our roles functions can be handled better by a scout shotgun with remote explosives. We're only good for hiding behind terrain and calling for back up or holding chokes. for the first 100 bullets ADS doesnt change accuracy, its better to fire and then at full spin up ADS to to keep the initial mobility, before completely becoming a turret.
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 189	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:41:00 - [33] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Ill be in game in about 15 minutes though if you want to squad up and run a skirmish match or two actually sounds cool. i'm on the east coast, i was checking the forums and was about to sleep, but i'd be more than happy to squad up with you tommorrow. whats a good time for you? im on the east coast so its 3.34 aM here, but at 1:00pm i can be on and squad up. how's that sound? MST here and 1 pm EST is too early in the day for me How is between 8 and 9 pm MST for you? wait is MST = EST + 2hours? if so, then 8 - 9 pm MST is 10 - 11pm EST. yeah, i can do that. do you want to join my squad or i join your squad a combination, etc...? imma add you as a contact, and add me so we can squad up, and settle this matter like gentlemen.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 388	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:45:00 - [34] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Ill be in game in about 15 minutes though if you want to squad up and run a skirmish match or two actually sounds cool. i'm on the east coast, i was checking the forums and was about to sleep, but i'd be more than happy to squad up with you tommorrow. whats a good time for you? im on the east coast so its 3.34 aM here, but at 1:00pm i can be on and squad up. how's that sound? MST here and 1 pm EST is too early in the day for me How is between 8 and 9 pm MST for you? wait is MST = EST + 2hours? if so, then 8 - 9 pm MST is 10 - 11pm EST. yeah, i can do that. do you want to join my squad or i join your squad a combination, etc...? imma add you as a contact, and add me so we can squad up, and settle this matter like gentlemen. Yeah its a two hour difference, and either squad formation is fine, if you are running with other people at the time though Ill join your squad since I usually run solo
Benari Kalidima Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 23	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:46:00 - [35] - Quote Okay people, some cold hard math facts I've done; Heavy Machine Gun DPS:600 Accuracy Rating 61.5 Clip Size: 425 Damage on Clip:7650 Damage Before Overheat: 4200 Assault Rifle DPS:425 Accuracy Rating: 55.5 Clip size:60 Damage on Clip:2040 Damage before overheat is calculated by assuming overheat is at 100 (overheat per second is 14). That makes 7 seconds of fire, which at 600 dps is 4200 damage. I'll be willing to include reload times in the calculations if you want.
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 189	Posted - 2013.06.17 07:53:00 - [36] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Ill be in game in about 15 minutes though if you want to squad up and run a skirmish match or two actually sounds cool. i'm on the east coast, i was checking the forums and was about to sleep, but i'd be more than happy to squad up with you tommorrow. whats a good time for you? im on the east coast so its 3.34 aM here, but at 1:00pm i can be on and squad up. how's that sound? MST here and 1 pm EST is too early in the day for me How is between 8 and 9 pm MST for you? wait is MST = EST + 2hours? if so, then 8 - 9 pm MST is 10 - 11pm EST. yeah, i can do that. do you want to join my squad or i join your squad a combination, etc...? imma add you as a contact, and add me so we can squad up, and settle this matter like gentlemen. Yeah its a two hour difference, and either squad formation is fine, if you are running with other people at the time though Ill join your squad since I usually run solo its a deal epic sceneneending hand shake
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 190	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:02:00 - [37] - Quote [quote=Benari Kalidima]Okay people, some cold hard math facts I've done; Heavy Machine Gun DPS:600 Accuracy Rating 61.5 Clip Size: 425 Damage on Clip:7650 Damage Before Overheat: 4200 Assault Rifle DPS:425 Accuracy Rating: 55.5 Clip size:60 Damage on Clip:2040 Damage before overheat is calculated by assuming overheat is at 100 (overheat per second is 14). That makes 7 seconds of fire, which at 600 dps is 4200 damage. I'll be willing to include reload times in the calculations if you want. dnt forget the dispersion calculation. heavies have approximately 35% dispersion. so a target standing completely still at your optimal range only 65% of your rounds will hit, therefore, 600 - (600 35%) =600 - 210 = 390dps the AR has about a 5-% dispersion 425 - (4255%) = 425 - 21.25 = 403.75 when you factor in the high mobility, and longer range with limited damage fall off, compared to the HMG having hard fall off the dps is better on the AR. ultimately, the AR can put more rounds on target and therefore most enemies can see the 425dps. where as an HMG has 35% dispersion on a stationary target, when strafing is factored inaddition to the low turn speed, dps becomes much less. inaddition, although this is not related to dps but mobility, any suit using an AR other than heavy, can choose to disengage at anytime, where as a heavy commited to battle must win or will die.
hooc order Deep Space Republic 376	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:08:00 - [38] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Alright Im calling it now, you are just a bad player blaming your tools Sadly i think you are right.
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 190	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:12:00 - [39] - Quote hooc order wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Alright Im calling it now, you are just a bad player blaming your tools Sadly i think you are right. i'd like to see you put down your duvole assault rifle and try using a shotgun, a mass drive an HMG... lets see how good you'd do. you have a baseless argument so now your engaging in baseless attacks on my person. you have never played me in this game, at least none that you can recall. therefore, this statement hooc order wrote: Sadly i think you are right. is just as baseless as your argument. case closed.
hooc order Deep Space Republic 376	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:16:00 - [40] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: [quote=Benari Kalidima] inaddition, although this is not related to dps but mobility, any suit using an AR other than heavy, can choose to disengage at anytime, where as a heavy commited to battle must win or will die. If you are a heavy and do not have an exit strategy (cover) then you are playing it wrong. Yes sometimes a heavy just needs to stand there and dish it out and take it....the noble sacrifice...but that is by no means what you should be doing in every gun fight. To be honest at least 50% of my kills are of either people running across my view or i am shooting them in the back. You are fat and slow.....you have plenty of time to think what the hell you are going to do before you fire one bullet. If you think you will figure it out and just go with it hoping your twitch skills will save you then you must know you are playing the wrong class.

D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 190	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:23:00 - [41] - Quote cover? lol, you obviously have never played heavy, or never played good plays, any good player will use your cover against you by vaulting it and taking shots at you until your to weak to defend your self, the low turn speed makes it impossible to hit your moving target that close, from behind cover, (if you have n=done this try it ive done it, and seen other do it to me in the heavy suit.) at range well they dnt even need cover as you cant hit them. cover of course increase longevity, but needless to say its difficult to effectvely use over as a heavy.
Chibi Andy Forsaken Immortals 231	Posted - 2013.06.17 08:34:00 - [42] - Quote though i do agree that the heavy can't really do its job properly but i can still kill good as a heavy, highest KD is 39K 6D in one match. (was playing skirmish) reason for such high kills is that i don't try to beat the AR's at their range, i leave that to other AR users, i get into my covers and such, cramped spaces etc etc thats where i get my kills from, so i tend to stay away from those open areas with S-H-I-T for cover lying around. then again i have good team mates that also helps rep me when i need it to stay in the fight longer. playing as a heavy actually requires some sort of skill, because we have crappy range (if using HMG), slow as fuq and have a huge ass hit box. heck we can't even jump over a step if its higher than your ankle >__> but if you're just trying to run and gun as a heavy then you will most definitely be killed. i hardly play as a defensive heavy because one heavy can't take on 4 guys trying to hack the objective you're defending, you'll just die while trying to take out one of the four guys. so i just mostly play as a offensive heavy, running with the squad and taking down the enemy. then again im using complex dmg mods and complex armor rep mods, to stay in the fight longer .
ChromeBreaker SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 568	Posted - 2013.06.17 09:49:00 - [43] - Quote I dont run and gun... i Advance lol D think we'll have to squad up a on a weekend or somethin (UK) cos i disagree with you too lol. HMG seem in an ok place to me (still needs a little more range). Even if half the stuff your asking for comes in... well im going to start feeling bad for the red dots
Kitten Empress Ametat Security Amarr Empire 634	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:02:00 - [44] - Quote Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense.
ChromeBreaker SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 568	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:07:00 - [45] - Quote Kitten Empress wrote: Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way... HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing...
DeadlyAztec11 Strong-Arm 499	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:18:00 - [46] - Quote The HMG was never meant to be used as an offensive weapon, at least not for quick assaults, it is meant for long sieges when employed in an offensive roll. It was designed to be used as a defensive weapon though. Used to repel enemies trying to capture objectives and keep key map positions under your teams control. I will agree that it needs a buff, though, it should be in the above stated manners, not a run n' gun class.
Chibi Andy Forsaken Immortals 232	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:21:00 - [47] - Quote i wish they'd buff the heavy and then give us some new heavy suits. im sick and tired of playing the amarr heavy suit >__>
Kitten Empress Ametat Security Amarr Empire 634	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:22:00 - [48] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way... HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing... How are CCP wrong if this is their game and they decide what role to give to something? Even if it isn't balanced right, CCP wants this weapon to work for point defense, whether you like it or not .
Zyrus Amalomyn Militaires-Sans-Frontieres 199	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:31:00 - [49] - Quote Heavies are a specialized role that requires support from their team in anything other than CQC. If you think otherwise, you're running on COD syndrome. Stop doing this and think of the suits in squad tactics. This is not a ramboing game. Stop acting like it is.
Orion Vahid DUST University Ivy League 15	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:46:00 - [50] - Quote I used to think HMG Heavy sucked. Then I started joining squads :P Heavy is very strong in CQC. Yes, you can beat scouts if you try to track them rather than going "AHHH ****" and spraying everywhere. Let me tell you this, NEVER EVER try to cross a street. ALWAYS get an LAV when trying to travel somewhere far away. Fighting outsides is usually not the best idea. Always try to get close before engaging. For example I charge with a LAV at a CRU, run one guy over, bail out, mow two others down and I stay there and mow anyone who spawns down and wait for my squad to arrive and hack the damned thing. If you aren't playing in squads, you are doing it wrong. To my experience HMG is best used for corridors and hallways and near objectives. Since your scanners aren't great, make sure you patrol any areas that enemies can sneak up from but never get too far from your team.

ChromeBreaker SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 568	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:55:00 - [51] - Quote Kitten Empress wrote: ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way... HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing... How are CCP wrong if this is their game and they decide what role to give to something? Even if it isn't balanced right, CCP wants this weapon to work for point defense, whether you like it or not . Because they are trying to restrict an entire class? I dont use my heavy as a defensive unit. If i want to charge an objective (albeit slowly) and i do it smart then i should be able to. Just because CCP says thats what they want it to be doesnt make it right, by god im going to do the complete opposite
Another Heavy SOB TRUE TEA BAGGERS EoN. 143	Posted - 2013.06.17 10:56:00 - [52] - Quote I still do very well in close quarters with my Heavy, it's just the getting in to close quarters part. Which is why we Fat boy's have LAVs and Kinetic catalyzers. Yes, the Heavy HMG is best at point defense but I believe with the right fit and tactics you can still play a significant role in attacking and taking an objective. Reds will quickly learn to run from a well fit and powerful Heavy, but you're still not a one man wrecking ball and have to push with you're team not alone. Not bragging but I very rarely, like once in 15 games rare lose a 1vs1 Scenario in my effective range, Since uprising my K/D started to drop until the HMG damage nerf was reversed and I learned how to play/fit my fatty with the changes. Don't get me wrong the range is horrible! I'm not sure who said it first but the best way to sum it up is the fact that I can throw a grenade farther than my HMG's optimal... The longest kill I've gotten without an assault variant was 44M with a Boundless, and then it was a lucky kill steal, 57M with the Freedom assault and also a lucky steal. It is literally astonishing how quickly the damage drops off outside of optimal. At just 5-8M outside optimal its damage resembles a mid range 200lb French Tickler. Stop firing run forward 8M and they drop like a rock. With proficiency V and two complex damage mods my Boundless does 25 to shields and 29 to armor within optimal. One would think the drop off would be less noticeable but it seems to be more apparent.
Kitten Empress Ametat Security Amarr Empire 634	Posted - 2013.06.17 11:28:00 - [53] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way... HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing... How are CCP wrong if this is their game and they decide what role to give to something? Even if it isn't balanced right, CCP wants this weapon to work for point defense, whether you like it or not . Because they are trying to restrict an entire class? I dont use my heavy as a defensive unit. If i want to charge an objective (albeit slowly) and i do it smart then i should be able to. Just because CCP says thats what they want it to be doesnt make it right, by god im going to do the complete opposite. I Advance on an objective lol. Im going to defend the enemies objective against them. If CCP then completely crunch down on something so it can ONLY be used one way... well then thats detrimental against the entire game Go assault then. You can't have the best of both worlds, your suit is a specialized suit meaning its supposed to do one thing best but the rest it wouldn't be as effective. Its like expecting a scout to be able to go head on against enemies and expect to survive. Now, for my second point, who the **** are you to dictate to CCP what the heavy suit is? They can tomorrow give it scout HP and give the HMG over 9000 damage per bullet. Its their choice, not yours. Now, about the rest of your post, your balance idea makes heavies the best defense/offense/everything. You have no idea on how to balance.
ChromeBreaker SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 568	Posted - 2013.06.17 11:47:00 - [54] - Quote Kitten Empress wrote: ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: ChromeBreaker wrote: Kitten Empress wrote: Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. CCP is wrong. OR let me put it this way... HMG's are for point defence... it just might be that the point im defending is over there... where the red dots are standing... How are CCP wrong if this is their game and they decide what role to give to something? Even if it isn't balanced right, CCP wants this weapon to work for point defense, whether you like it or not . Because they are trying to restrict an entire class? I dont use my heavy as a defensive unit. If i want to charge an objective (albeit slowly) and i do it smart then i should be able to. Just because CCP says thats what they want it to be doesnt make it right, by god im going to do the complete opposite. I Advance on an objective lol. Im going to defend the enemies objective against them. If CCP then completely crunch down on something so it can ONLY be used one way... well then thats detrimental against the entire game Go assault then. You can't have the best of both worlds, your suit is a specialized suit meaning its supposed to do one thing best but the rest it wouldn't be as effective. Its like expecting a scout to be able to go head on against enemies and expect to survive. Now, for my second point, who the **** are you to dictate to CCP what the heavy suit is? They can tomorrow give it scout HP and give the HMG over 9000 damage per bullet. Its their choice, not yours. Now, about the rest of your post, your balance idea makes heavies the best defense/offense/everything. You have no idea on how to balance. Wow wow differant people lol i think the heavies good where it is im against all the 10000 dps 2000hp crazyness What im saying is that a heavy shouldnt be made to sit at an objective and wait. Ive been playing since begining of beta and if i wanted to get my fat ass moving and wade into an enemy position then i should be able to. If an Assault wants to be all dmg he can, or all tank, or speedy gonzales or whatever. Why should heavies be dictated to sit at one point and wait? Sure at a fundemental level heavies are slow heavy suits and that define some base characteristics... but that doesnt mean i cant be a suicidal sky diver
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 197	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:55:00 - [55] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: I dont run and gun... i Advance lol D think we'll have to squad up a on a weekend or somethin (UK) cos i disagree with you too lol. HMG seem in an ok place to me (still needs a little more range). Even if half the stuff your asking for comes in... well im going to start feeling bad for the red dots that can be arranged. im going to add you as contact too
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. CRONOS. 1974	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:56:00 - [56] - Quote **** ALL the faces.
D legendary hero One-Armed Bandits 197	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:56:00 - [57] - Quote Kitten Empress wrote: Void Echo wrote: i laugh a little every time I see ASSAULTERS say what OTHER CLASSES are for. Ehhm, CCP said it themselves. HMG's are for point defense. ^^blaster installations are for point defense
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 372	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:57:00 - [58] - Quote Point. Defense. /thread
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. CRONOS. 1975	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:58:00 - [59] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Point. Defense. /thread That's what Sentinels are for, hence the name. Heavies will have many specializations, such as the Commando which is basically a Heavy version of the Assault suit.
Void Echo Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 194	Posted - 2013.06.17 21:59:00 - [60] - Quote every assaulters description of what they think heavies are for is the description of instillations



Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page