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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Sponglyboy Squaredoo
Not Guilty EoN.
103
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Posted - 2013.06.06 14:02:00 -
[31] - Quote
Atikali Havendoorr wrote:So most of you agree that PC should be entitled to the top tier players only? And for the vast majority, there is instant battle... lame. The number of districts is laughably small.
Shush kid |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors Reverberation Project
509
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:03:00 -
[32] - Quote
From my understanding there are a few things CCP is looking at with respect to planetary conquest. Participation rates are a small part of it, but the bigger part is more about economic behavior.
They want to know, when they add a new commodity or territory, what is the price that different people will pay for it.
They added territory and clones with planetary conquest. Whenever a new market gets created, in Eve or IRL, there is bound to be drastic fluctuations in the value of that service or good (think dotcom bubbles). The initial value players players placed on territory and clone production was extremely high, probably much higher than their ROI from it.
In other words, Eve/Dust economics team will be able to sort through the data we are generating for PC and say...
"Between clone and equipment cost, It looks as if at least 50% of the players in PC are willing to spend around 210k isk on each clone they use in battle. The top 10% of corps spend about 10% more in costs and get 50% more in returns, and the bottom 25% of players spend about the same as everyone, but get lose 90% of their investment over time."
CCP slowly create 'zones' of economic activity and monitor where isk, services, and goods move in and out of those zones. We have the instant battle zones (highsec), faction warfare zone, and PC zone.
To CCP, they are probably very distinct in economic behavior, as the choices of how much will be spent in each match vary from one squad to the next in each 'zone'. However isk made in highsec, is generally being 'dumped' into lowsec currently. Additionally, many players still have a surplus of currency that was given to them from salvage rebates that also impacts their risk/reward behavior.
Basically, CCP is looking at player behavior and trying to figure out things like, "what is a KDR of 1.0 vs. a 4.0 worth in faction warfare, and what are they worth in planetary conquest?" They cannot very easily determine this, if they are changing the supply of goods and services by huge amounts every month.
You may ask, "Why should I give a kitten about economics, I want to fight!" Well, I feel you, but in the end, we are mercenaries, and for the game to make sense, different levels of performance SHOULD correspond to real change in reward values. To make this possible the economics of player behavior needs to be delicately analyzed and monitored. You are a part of an experiment. |
Heathen Bastard
Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation
316
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Posted - 2013.06.06 14:04:00 -
[33] - Quote
Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Heathen Bastard wrote:Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Districts are still getting flipped constantly.
What it looks to me what CCP is doing (which is a good idea to me) is they're waiting for when districts stop the constant flipping or Wars ending. Something like a peace era. Than they will open up more space to cause more conflict between Corps/Alliances and break bonds. so they're going to wait until all the good people quit the game because no one can/wants to fight them anymore. that's basically the only way there will be peace in dust. it's also the condition dust dies in. We're mercenaries, peace is terrible for business. Maybe you didn't understand what I said. Read it over. Basically, when people(Corps/Alliances) are comfortable about where they stand, that should be the time for more space to open. If that's not what's going to happen, than what we'll have is just land grabbing and ISK farming.
so it will be peace. which is our antithesis as mercenaries, we thrive on conflict. without conflict we die. you want peace before the districts are opend, therefore you want the game dead before any kind of improvement happens to it.
and "when the corps are comfortable about where they stand" is just giving the big corps more cash with which to nab every single new district that opens up. so by waiting longer, you exacerbate the problem. |
LongLostLust
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
26
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Posted - 2013.06.06 14:04:00 -
[34] - Quote
Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Atikali Havendoorr wrote:So most of you agree that PC should be entitled to the top tier players only? And for the vast majority, there is instant battle... lame. The number of districts is laughably small. Shush kid Lookout Internet tough guy |
Deluxe Edition
TeamPlayers EoN.
360
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:08:00 -
[35] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:EnglishSnake wrote:How about you fight for a district instead of asking CCP to give you one? They can fight to keep it...how do you propose a level C corp to take a district if only higher tiered corps owns all of the districts? Inve been watching a corp named Zero Atmosphere, trying relentlessly to get into PC but they just havent beaten anyone yet. We can say that only the strong survive but if players can't play due to a limited amount of districts then, they won't play dust. And well, there goes our playerbase.
They can hire Team Players to take a district for them. |
Sponglyboy Squaredoo
Not Guilty EoN.
103
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:12:00 -
[36] - Quote
Heathen Bastard wrote:Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Heathen Bastard wrote:Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Districts are still getting flipped constantly.
What it looks to me what CCP is doing (which is a good idea to me) is they're waiting for when districts stop the constant flipping or Wars ending. Something like a peace era. Than they will open up more space to cause more conflict between Corps/Alliances and break bonds. so they're going to wait until all the good people quit the game because no one can/wants to fight them anymore. that's basically the only way there will be peace in dust. it's also the condition dust dies in. We're mercenaries, peace is terrible for business. Maybe you didn't understand what I said. Read it over. Basically, when people(Corps/Alliances) are comfortable about where they stand, that should be the time for more space to open. If that's not what's going to happen, than what we'll have is just land grabbing and ISK farming. so it will be peace. which is our antithesis as mercenaries, we thrive on conflict. without conflict we die. you want peace before the districts are opend, therefore you want the game dead before any kind of improvement happens to it. and "when the corps are comfortable about where they stand" is just giving the big corps more cash with which to nab every single new district that opens up. so by waiting longer, you exacerbate the problem.
Think about it. There will always be attacks flying left and right. There will always be a place Mercenaries.
IF there was a pause in your business, how much of a impact on you guys would there really be? Not so big. |
Sponglyboy Squaredoo
Not Guilty EoN.
103
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:12:00 -
[37] - Quote
LongLostLust wrote:Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:Atikali Havendoorr wrote:So most of you agree that PC should be entitled to the top tier players only? And for the vast majority, there is instant battle... lame. The number of districts is laughably small. Shush kid Lookout Internet tough guy
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Knightshade Belladonna
WH0 G1VSA FL0CK GLOCKS
305
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:14:00 -
[38] - Quote
Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:The fact that the Corp Member Size Cap is so high should shout in all of the people's ears who are complaining about smaller corps not have a place in PC that NEW EDEN ISN'T A PLACE FOR SMALL CORPS
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA , this is funny.. New Eden isn't a place for small corps.. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P C C P Alliance
22822
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:20:00 -
[39] - Quote
LongLostLust wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:I'd like CCP to give some intel on it. I just a read an article on Eve's forums where CCP posted about introducing satellites. One poster asked them to sticky it and Foxfour did it immediately. I am beginning to get a little jealous lol More intel on what? Info on a date more regions will be released. Also allowing corps to buy multiple clone packs was a big mistake. There are like 20 corps with districts. There would be a lot more PC action if owned by 250 different corps. Smaller corps have little chance and segregating your only actual unique feature from 80% of your already small playerbase isn't helping matters.
We have not decided on that yet. We monitor the level of activity in planetary conquest and will add more districts/regions when we feel the time is right.
If we didn't allow corps to buy multiple clone packages they would have just used alt corporations. It was going to do the same thing just be a pain in the ass. That is not good game design.
Yes there would be more activity in planetary conquest if all the districts were owned by different... lets say organizations as corps can be in alliances. We are aware of that and will work towards getting more people into planetary conquest. Possibly things like making some districts easier to hold but less valuable. Or something... not really sure yet. Lots of ideas floating around, so much to do, oh god head exploding. |
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Knightshade Belladonna
WH0 G1VSA FL0CK GLOCKS
305
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:27:00 -
[40] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:LongLostLust wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:I'd like CCP to give some intel on it. I just a read an article on Eve's forums where CCP posted about introducing satellites. One poster asked them to sticky it and Foxfour did it immediately. I am beginning to get a little jealous lol More intel on what? Info on a date more regions will be released. Also allowing corps to buy multiple clone packs was a big mistake. There are like 20 corps with districts. There would be a lot more PC action if owned by 250 different corps. Smaller corps have little chance and segregating your only actual unique feature from 80% of your already small playerbase isn't helping matters. We have not decided on that yet. We monitor the level of activity in planetary conquest and will add more districts/regions when we feel the time is right. If we didn't allow corps to buy multiple clone packages they would have just used alt corporations. It was going to do the same thing just be a pain in the ass. That is not good game design. Yes there would be more activity in planetary conquest if all the districts were owned by different... lets say organizations as corps can be in alliances. We are aware of that and will work towards getting more people into planetary conquest. Possibly things like making some districts easier to hold but less valuable. Or something... not really sure yet. Lots of ideas floating around, so much to do, oh god head exploding.
Cheaper easier to gain districts with less value sounds like an idea.. similar to harvesting from a hi sec planet vs harvesting from a good wormhole vs null sec. You don't get the same return off them in different regions, so maybe something similar to tie in with the PC. ( of course I do realize the base cost is pretty much similar no matter which planet you chose to harvest in eve , but the rewards differ greatly) |
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Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors Reverberation Project
511
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:31:00 -
[41] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:We have not decided on that yet. We monitor the level of activity in planetary conquest and will add more districts/regions when we feel the time is right.
If we didn't allow corps to buy multiple clone packages they would have just used alt corporations. It was going to do the same thing just be a pain in the ass. That is not good game design.
Yes there would be more activity in planetary conquest if all the districts were owned by different... lets say organizations as corps can be in alliances. We are aware of that and will work towards getting more people into planetary conquest. Possibly things like making some districts easier to hold but less valuable. Or something... not really sure yet. Lots of ideas floating around, so much to do, oh god head exploding.
What isn't clear to the rewards on the DUST side of things is that some planets/districts are already more valuable than others, not only tactically, but also economically, but this relative value is mostly on the Eve side. A district with a single technetium moon, is much more valuable than a district with a couple cobalt, or silicates moons for example. Right now, moon amount or quality is the biggest determiner of district quality.
If we could have something like a POS module that was necessary to get SI bonuses from your DUST side districts to your POSes then it could be used kind of like a POCO, but in reverse. Perhaps it could be loaded with a commodity, kind of like fuel (biomass?), that then is slowly converted into isk that is transferred to the local district owners (via payment transfers to/from an NPC corp or something)... If it were to run out, then the POS bonuses stop, and Eve corps don't get isk. You could even make it able to be loaded with a variety of things, each possibly modifying SI rewards, or payments to districts...I'll think about this more and find a more appropriate thread for it... |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1359
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:55:00 -
[42] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:Carebear Thread Alert
PC is not Farmville nor to print ISK for helpless scrubs. You want a district in PC then going to have to fight for it .
Seriously though? So, you're ok with only a few corps in PC? Because if youre not one of the Big 3 or a corp with nothing but allstar players then you wont get it whether you fight for it or not.
I'm not asking for CCP to give districts away just open more districts to allow for more corps and variety of fights |
mrunknown2u2
Ill Omens EoN.
49
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:55:00 -
[43] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:We have not decided on that yet. We monitor the level of activity in planetary conquest and will add more districts/regions when we feel the time is right.
If we didn't allow corps to buy multiple clone packages they would have just used alt corporations. It was going to do the same thing just be a pain in the ass. That is not good game design.
Yes there would be more activity in planetary conquest if all the districts were owned by different... lets say organizations as corps can be in alliances. We are aware of that and will work towards getting more people into planetary conquest. Possibly things like making some districts easier to hold but less valuable. Or something... not really sure yet. Lots of ideas floating around, so much to do, oh god head exploding. What isn't clear to the rewards on the DUST side of things is that some planets/districts are already more valuable than others, not only tactically, but also economically, but this relative value is mostly on the Eve side. A district with a single technetium moon, is much more valuable than a district with a couple cobalt, or silicates moons for example. Right now, moon amount or quality is the biggest determiner of district quality. If we could have something like a POS module that was necessary to get SI bonuses from your DUST side districts to your POSes then it could be used kind of like a POCO, but in reverse. Perhaps it could be loaded with a commodity, kind of like fuel (biomass?), that then is slowly converted into isk that is transferred to the local district owners (via payment transfers to/from an NPC corp or something)... If it were to run out, then the POS bonuses stop, and Eve corps don't get isk. You could even make it able to be loaded with a variety of things, each possibly modifying SI rewards, or payments to districts...I'll think about this more and find a more appropriate thread for it... this issue right now is the districts are not that valuable. I think the Isk output should be doubled. That would promote more fights for land and also make it worth spending 160-240mil to buy into PC. Hell it's even hard to sell a district because to get the money back u have to hold the district for a month... Ccp really need to think about this doubling the Isk would be the perfect payout not too much not too little. 16-20mil. Just right.
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1359
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:57:00 -
[44] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:I'd like CCP to give some intel on it. I just a read an article on Eve's forums where CCP posted about introducing satellites. One poster asked them to sticky it and Foxfour did it immediately. I am beginning to get a little jealous lol More intel on what?
I was referring to a time frame of when we will see more districts available to dust corps. |
xjumpman23
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
262
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:03:00 -
[45] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Carebear Thread Alert
PC is not Farmville nor to print ISK for helpless scrubs. You want a district in PC then going to have to fight for it . Seriously though? So, you're ok with only a few corps in PC? Because if youre not one of the Big 3 or a corp with nothing but allstar players then you wont get it whether you fight for it or not. I'm not asking for CCP to give districts away just open more districts to allow for more corps and variety of fights
What happens when those corps are turned into the next DF or STB. NF sells districts all the time. If terrible players want to own stuff simply buy a district from NF via Kanes escrow service. It's not like it's impossible for people to own land. However being good enough to defend that land is another story. |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1359
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:11:00 -
[46] - Quote
xjumpman23 wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Carebear Thread Alert
PC is not Farmville nor to print ISK for helpless scrubs. You want a district in PC then going to have to fight for it . Seriously though? So, you're ok with only a few corps in PC? Because if youre not one of the Big 3 or a corp with nothing but allstar players then you wont get it whether you fight for it or not. I'm not asking for CCP to give districts away just open more districts to allow for more corps and variety of fights What happens when those corps are turned into the next DF or STB. NF sells districts all the time. If terrible players want to own stuff simply buy a district from NF via Kanes escrow service. It's not like it's impossible for people to own land. However being good enough to defend that land is another story.
The idea is this:
If there are more districts, then corps/alliances may be spread to thin to expand....thus allowing new corps/alliances to capture and defend those districts against other corps/alliances. And these new corps won't have to be elite either. They can be B or C level as far as talent is concerned.
Think about it like this...Cronos and EoN is in an ongoing war right now, right? Would they have the manpower to conquer another entire region? Maybe but most likely not...now, a corp like Zero Atmosphere and an alliance like General Tso's can creep in participate in PC.
Imagine if eve had about the same amount of districts.....how dull would it be if Goons or PL owned all. And they would be able to because they wouldnt be spread so far. |
xjumpman23
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
262
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:18:00 -
[47] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:xjumpman23 wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Carebear Thread Alert
PC is not Farmville nor to print ISK for helpless scrubs. You want a district in PC then going to have to fight for it . Seriously though? So, you're ok with only a few corps in PC? Because if youre not one of the Big 3 or a corp with nothing but allstar players then you wont get it whether you fight for it or not. I'm not asking for CCP to give districts away just open more districts to allow for more corps and variety of fights What happens when those corps are turned into the next DF or STB. NF sells districts all the time. If terrible players want to own stuff simply buy a district from NF via Kanes escrow service. It's not like it's impossible for people to own land. However being good enough to defend that land is another story. The idea is this: If there are more districts, then corps/alliances may be spread to thin to expand....thus allowing new corps/alliances to capture and defend those districts against other corps/alliances. And these new corps won't have to be elite either. They can be B or C level as far as talent is concerned. Think about it like this...Cronos and EoN is in an ongoing war right now, right? Would they have the manpower to conquer another entire region? Maybe but most likely not...now, a corp like Zero Atmosphere and an alliance like General Tso's can creep in participate in PC. Imagine if eve had about the same amount of districts.....how dull would it be if Goons or PL owned all. And they would be able to because they wouldnt be spread so far.
Corps and Alliances that effectively manage their timers will never have to worry about spreading themselves too thin. Newer corps or alliances won't have much of a chance to be a factor in PC, because there are those that only look to grief and ruin the PC experience for the fun of it. DUST is cutthroat in terms of PVP. If you are a mediocre player you don't deserve to own land. It doesn't mean you can't attack or work with other organizations in order to ensure you get a piece of the pie.
The weakest organization in terms of player ability currently are part of the ROFL alliance and next would be unclaimed. If you want to own land simply attack them. |
Deluxe Edition
TeamPlayers EoN.
360
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:26:00 -
[48] - Quote
mrunknown2u2 wrote: this issue right now is the districts are not that valuable. I think the Isk output should be doubled. That would promote more fights for land and also make it worth spending 160-240mil to buy into PC. Hell it's even hard to sell a district because to get the money back u have to hold the district for a month... Ccp really need to think about this doubling the Isk would be the perfect payout not too much not too little. 16-20mil. Just right.
^ this is probably the biggest issue. I don't think any alliance has made a profit from PC yet. |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1359
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:35:00 -
[49] - Quote
@ jumpman
But the idea is for them to spread themselves thin and not conquer the entire region. Not until there are many more regions to hold.
If there were new corps/alliances then there will be more activity. New corps can attack and have wars with other new corps. That may increase the playerbase as more players can participate in PC. PC is the allure of dust...if players cant play it, then why play dust. The gameplay isnt there yet to enjoy pubs all day |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors Reverberation Project
512
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 15:37:00 -
[50] - Quote
mrunknown2u2 wrote: This issue right now is the districts are not that valuable. I think the Isk output should be doubled. That would promote more fights for land and also make it worth spending 160-240mil to buy into PC. Hell it's even hard to sell a district because to get the money back u have to hold the district for a month... Ccp really need to think about this doubling the Isk would be the perfect payout not too much not too little. 16-20mil. Just right.
What determines the 'payout' of land isn't only what you get from the Genolution clone buyback, but also how efficient you are at defending it. If your districts' CDR (clone death rate- amt produced vs lost) is 1 it will not even make isk from clone sales regardless of the clone buyback price. You need to have a district CDR of >1 if you want to even start to think about making isk at any level of clone rebate amount.
"The issue right now" as you put it is that, as a whole, KDR and CDR performance can ONLY BE a zero sum game. In planetary conquest, with even just a moderate level of churn/conflict only the top tier teams with a CDR >2 will be netting isk from PC. My guess is that this is 10% or so of the teams in PC. The middile 50% will be around 1 CDR, and lowest 10% around .5. The middle 50% will be bleeding isk, and the bottom 10% will be hemorrhaging it.
If you think about the math, each district can only create at max 100 clones per day (production facility). However, each day it can lose as many as 450 clones (cargo hub). So considering, that in PC you only get paid for what you destroy, the net payout will only be positive in the instances where corps can CREATE more assets than what you lose from battles plus what you destroy. The more you bring into battles and lose, the more you have to create to compensate.
In FW and instant battles this isn't the case, you are paid mostly as a function of your time and performance in battles, and profit when you lose less than this performance based pay. Also, you aren't penalized nearly as much for losing a clone in FW/highsec battles because they are 'subsidized' by your contractors. |
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Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors Reverberation Project
512
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 16:00:00 -
[51] - Quote
Another way of putting my point...
A death in PC is at least 2x as costly as a death in FW/highsec. This is because YOU don't pay the cost of your clone.
In FW/Highsec you only start to see income rates of 3+ million isk/hr at a KDR above 3 or 4 (or if you are a really good logi or farm something else). You need to have the double same success rate within PC on average to see the same returns...
Bad news though: It is a mathmatecal impossibility for more than a very small portion of the PC community to have that kind of performance level.
However the kind of player that could pull off a 4.0 KDR in PC could probably sustain a 6+ KDR in highsec/FW so the question needs to be, why would they want to spend so much time/effort in PC? |
Marston VC
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
286
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 16:16:00 -
[52] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:LongLostLust wrote:CCP FoxFour wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:I'd like CCP to give some intel on it. I just a read an article on Eve's forums where CCP posted about introducing satellites. One poster asked them to sticky it and Foxfour did it immediately. I am beginning to get a little jealous lol More intel on what? Info on a date more regions will be released. Also allowing corps to buy multiple clone packs was a big mistake. There are like 20 corps with districts. There would be a lot more PC action if owned by 250 different corps. Smaller corps have little chance and segregating your only actual unique feature from 80% of your already small playerbase isn't helping matters. We have not decided on that yet. We monitor the level of activity in planetary conquest and will add more districts/regions when we feel the time is right. If we didn't allow corps to buy multiple clone packages they would have just used alt corporations. It was going to do the same thing just be a pain in the ass. That is not good game design. Yes there would be more activity in planetary conquest if all the districts were owned by different... lets say organizations as corps can be in alliances. We are aware of that and will work towards getting more people into planetary conquest. Possibly things like making some districts easier to hold but less valuable. Or something... not really sure yet. Lots of ideas floating around, so much to do, oh god head exploding.
Well heres the big problem I personally have with clone packs...... it ignores the degradation rate for attacking rule. It doesn't matter how far someone is from a system they can send 150 clones to there for a price. 80 million isn't "that" much for a big corp, and so its easy to ignore the whole "% lost over distance" rule that's been established. It totally devalues the research facilities, and if you own a whole planet a corp can make 80 million in literally one 24 hour period off of clone sales alone. I honestly don't believe the alt corp thing would have been as over used as you guys might think and let me explain why.....
If each corp is limited to ONE starter pack at a time, that is 150 clones on day 1. Currently the rules state that you MUST send 150 clones to attack with (which is a poor rule by the way). So even if an alt corp buys a district what are they going to do then? sell all but one clone so they can "give" it to the main corp?? ok.... well if the main corp takes that district they would have to send all 150 over to the next district and lose the one they had. OK, so that means they just have to wait 1 day to get the reinforcements...... well now they have two districts. One with 80 clones and the other with 150. Do you see where im going? The one clone pack per corp rule would have still worked as intended! Alt corps would have just been a means of "reserving" a spot for the main corp, and even then its not really that efficient because anyone could attack the alt corp at any time, OR attack the original plot the main corp left. So in short........ The clone pack is a problem because it provides a limitless amount of clones at any time. 150 is MORE then enough to launch an attack with, and because we were allowed to buy as many packs as we wanted, you guys have seen big corps/ alliances take over whole planets in less then 1 weak. Examples of this would be.... well the obvious STB one, or Imps, or Zion, or Southern legion. SI even..... theres hardly any small corps for a reason.... and that reason is because they cant afford to spam clone packs like the big groups do. Simple as that. |
Luke Vetri
D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION
90
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 16:21:00 -
[53] - Quote
This is great and all, but whats the point of opining more PC when the tiny amount we have now is so broken...
Ridiculous amount of disconnects getting people into the war barge
Extreme lag for some
Memory leak in Merc quarters (OK not limited to PC)
Infinite loading issue (OK not limited to PC)
Yes I know there are multiple teams working on all this, just saying that opening up PC right now is going to cause more problems than its going to solve. |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1359
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 16:34:00 -
[54] - Quote
@ Marston.....I agree with you. Gen packs really are not expensive to some corps and they can spam them without the loss of transfer notion. |
Beren Hurin
OMNI Endeavors Reverberation Project
515
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 16:50:00 -
[55] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:@ Marston.....I agree with you. Gen packs really are not expensive to some corps and they can spam them without the loss of transfer notion.
If you make them cheaper...they will still be EVEN CHEAPER for these 'super corps'.
Go away trooper...Gen Pack cost is not the fix you are looking for...
**EDIT** unless I misread...You might be suggesting that they need to have some sort of distance factor. Which, I'm not sure how that would work? Suggestions? Maybe if we paid rent for an established office somewhere, and that became the location from which you deployed clones?
Rental offices are already a thing in Eve, and I wonder how hard it would be to make them such in Dust. The thing is that there are limited office slots, and the fewer available the more expensive they are.
It would be kind of cool if offices could act like its own mini-district, storing, but not creating clones. They couldn't be attacked either. Perhaps they could be the basis for starting to trade clones within Dust...They could behave like districts with lock times and those related rules. They'd have more strict movement penalties for attacking compared to districts though.
Directors/CEOs would manage them, and they would have the additional option of accessing the local clone market from the office. Districts would have the option of moving/selling clones to open buy orders from the various offices in the system. And the offices could transfer clones from one system to the next either to other systems' office buy orders (with a strict movement cost penalty) or their own districts in another system.
You create a couple of new skills:
Corporation Facilities Management x8 (Corporation can run 1 office at each level- up to 5 offices) Corporate Trade Relations x4 (can have +1 clone buy/sell order at each level)
Offices would create a secondary clone market, which could raise the amount that players could earn from clones captured/created. Prices would obviously be between the genolution biomass-sell cost and the deployment pack cost.
What could be even more interesting is, if clones could be awarded as loot/salvage to individual players in FW. Then local offices throughout FW systems could buy groups of clones, which it could then use to start a FW battle of its own choosing. |
Phantomnom
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
629
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 17:27:00 -
[56] - Quote
By distance he means there is no real current representation of attrition vs logistics, and how corps only have to throw money to instigate a war. Wars need to be literal theatres that take pre-planning and logistics to keep operating, otherwise it degrades in efficiency and you have a harder time of it. Right now it is just a case of "send money + A Team = Win".
Winning a gunfight works well, but the setting up of one is basic. |
VEXation Gunn
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
43
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 18:40:00 -
[57] - Quote
Jeez I can't believe I actually read this thread.
-conflict good. farming bad
-more districts anytime soon would just give the big blue donut 2 cronos/rofl more districts/isk
-Imps have lots of EU members/Nyain San so we planned a head of time to fight on all region timers (Don't QQ if you didn't)
-CCP needs to be able to expand the ability to beachhead with gen packs not remove them. All that would do is benefit the blue donut to force trench warfare on the front lines so they can farm isk behind it.
I'm am really starting to think most of you don't want to actually fight you just want to earn isk. PC is a failure in design because it rewards farming over fighting.
smh @ girls who just want to play Farmville on ps3 |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1368
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 19:28:00 -
[58] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:@ Marston.....I agree with you. Gen packs really are not expensive to some corps and they can spam them without the loss of transfer notion. If you make them cheaper...they will still be EVEN CHEAPER for these 'super corps'. Go away trooper...Gen Pack cost is not the fix you are looking for... **EDIT** unless I misread...You might be suggesting that they need to have some sort of distance factor. Which, I'm not sure how that would work? Suggestions? Maybe if we paid rent for an established office somewhere, and that became the location from which you deployed clones? Rental offices are already a thing in Eve, and I wonder how hard it would be to make them such in Dust. The thing is that there are limited office slots, and the fewer available the more expensive they are. It would be kind of cool if offices could act like its own mini-district, storing, but not creating clones. They couldn't be attacked either. Perhaps they could be the basis for starting to trade clones within Dust...They could behave like districts with lock times and those related rules. They'd have more strict movement penalties for attacking compared to districts though. Directors/CEOs would manage them, and they would have the additional option of accessing the local clone market from the office. Districts would have the option of moving/selling clones to open buy orders from the various offices in the system. And the offices could transfer clones from one system to the next either to other systems' office buy orders (with a strict movement cost penalty) or their own districts in another system. You create a couple of new skills: Corporation Facilities Management x8 (Corporation can run 1 office at each level- up to 5 offices) Corporate Trade Relations x4 (can have +1 clone buy/sell order at each level) Offices would create a secondary clone market, which could raise the amount that players could earn from clones captured/created. Prices would obviously be between the genolution biomass-sell cost and the deployment pack cost. What could be even more interesting is, if clones could be awarded as loot/salvage to individual players in FW. Then local offices throughout FW systems could buy groups of clones, which it could then use to start a FW battle of its own choosing. Created a feedback thread for this idea
No...dont make them cheaper. They should be more expensive if anything. But if there was a way for a distance penalty. So, I guess maybe if they made you choose a home region than there would be penalties for jumps to attack other regions.
Idk, just brainstorming |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Omega Commission
1368
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 19:49:00 -
[59] - Quote
VEXation Gunn wrote:Jeez I can't believe I actually read this thread.
-conflict good. farming bad
-more districts anytime soon would just give the big blue donut 2 cronos/rofl more districts/isk
-Imps have lots of EU members/Nyain San so we planned a head of time to fight on all region timers (Don't QQ if you didn't)
-CCP needs to be able to expand the ability to beachhead with gen packs not remove them. All that would do is benefit the blue donut to force trench warfare on the front lines so they can farm isk behind it.
I'm am really starting to think most of you don't want to actually fight you just want to earn isk. PC is a failure in design because it rewards farming over fighting.
smh @ girls who just want to play Farmville on ps3
Well, noone is asking to farm ISK. I'm asking to promote more fights with more corps involved. Smaller and/or less skilled corps are trying to fight and get into PC but they cant because all that are left are bigger corps/organizations and better talented corps.
It's easy to ask for fights and call other corps cowards when you're the top corp in the game with allstar shooters. A corp with an average of 0.89KDR knows that they cant compete with a corp that has a 5KDR. They would rather fight a battle where they feel they have a chance of winning. But the way things are now with limited districts, that won't happen. |
Rhorian Darkstar
Dark Force Katana General Tso's Alliance
47
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 20:01:00 -
[60] - Quote
Sponglyboy Squaredoo wrote:The fact that the Corp Member Size Cap is so high should shout in all of the people's ears who are complaining about smaller corps not have a place in PC that NEW EDEN ISN'T A PLACE FOR SMALL CORPS BY THEMSELVES Correction, a small corp by itself isn't as dangerous as a single super corp. But a whole shitload of small corps working together towards a common is even more dangerous than a super corp. Quality over quantity |
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