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WyrmHero1945
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
195
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 07:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
They're now what they're meant to be, moving damage sponges. Don't expect to be killing everyone at CQC now. Your role is to survive and take hits while the assaults do the killing. When the assaults die you stand there and don't let them take the objective/position.
A class that has the highest HP cannot have the highest DPS. People learned to counter you and they still have this in mind, you're a primary target. Make them do so and don't expose yourself. Your teammates do the flanking job. Always run with a squad, remember people will target you first so take cover. If the squad dies you're the only hope. Let them get very close to you and either kill them all or scare them away. But always hold the position.
The HMG nerf will force people towards this role. It's interesting how CCP is developing the meta game. I like the direction of balance they're aiming. Proto suits have to get close now and run towards cover in fear, no longer in their safe zone provided by sharpshooter. |
Coleman Gray
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
239
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Posted - 2013.05.07 07:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
But why would you aim for the sponge doing no damage? |
Jotun Hiem
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
594
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Posted - 2013.05.07 07:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
How does taking three and a half seconds to kill qualify the Heavy for a role as 'damage sponge'?
Especially when they aren't that threatening in the first place. |
Boomer Dues Mortis
D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION
84
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 07:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
You know what be nice to help us fill our "niche" would be a suppression bonus since that is what everyone thinks heavies are meant for. We have to kill or we get no SP/ISK, also to be able to suppress the enemy we have to be able to shoot farther than 15m. |
Chris F2112
187. Unclaimed.
144
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 07:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
A heavy rounding a corner is still a great threat, much more so than an assault. My take on it is that heavies are supposed to be the front line players that charge through positions. The assaults will be the killers on any squad. |
Master Jaraiya
Ultramarine Corp Orion Empire
11
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 07:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Coleman Gray wrote:But why would you aim for the sponge doing no damage?
because I am the biggest slowest target.
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Matakage
WildCard Ninja Clan
44
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Posted - 2013.05.07 07:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
Boomer Dues Mortis wrote:You know what be nice to help us fill our "niche" would be a suppression bonus since that is what everyone thinks heavies are meant for. We have to kill or we get no SP/ISK, also to be able to suppress the enemy we have to be able to shoot farther than 15m. I've personally never prioritized heavies when shooting at a group of enemies. Why would I shoot the guy who takes the longest to kill? I want to drop crowds as quickly as I can so there are less people shooting at me. |
Master Jaraiya
Ultramarine Corp Orion Empire
11
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 07:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
Boomer Dues Mortis wrote:You know what be nice to help us fill our "niche" would be a suppression bonus since that is what everyone thinks heavies are meant for. We have to kill or we get no SP/ISK, also to be able to suppress the enemy we have to be able to shoot farther than 15m.
I have been saying this. Also a suppression effect to our gunfire. IMO you should be very quickly disoriented as you get sprayed by 2000 rpm gunfire, however mercs just aim right through the hailstorm and take us down,
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bill the noon
PSU GHOST SYNDICATE
3
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Posted - 2013.05.07 07:56:00 -
[9] - Quote
WyrmHero1945 wrote:They're now what they're meant to be, moving damage sponges. Don't expect to be killing everyone at CQC now. Your role is to survive and take hits while the assaults do the killing. When the assaults die you stand there and don't let them take the objective/position.
A class that has the highest HP cannot have the highest DPS. People learned to counter you and they still have this in mind, you're a primary target. Make them do so and don't expose yourself. Your teammates do the flanking job. Always run with a squad, remember people will target you first so take cover. If the squad dies you're the only hope. Let them get very close to you and either kill them all or scare them away. But always hold the position.
The HMG nerf will force people towards this role. It's interesting how CCP is developing the meta game. I like the direction of balance they're aiming. Proto suits have to get close now and run towards cover in fear, no longer in their safe zone provided by sharpshooter.
ya, they gonna start giving out wp for being a bullet sponge. and remember they only do the most damage at certain ranges. i dont see why the answer to noobs getting killed by heavies is to make the hmg unusable and not to teach noobs how range works in this game. the assault rifles have always been competitive against the hmg . as long as the Ar wielder remembers to control the distance and not stand still aiming down the barrel. the hmg being nerfed also wont bring about your desired heavy role because they will just move on to the next weapon and have all that health and the new highest dps weapon. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3724
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:02:00 -
[10] - Quote
If they're going to have the HMG be so crappy then its pointless to have it available exclusively for one suit. Exclusivity was a balancing solution, basically countering the high DPS by forcing the user to use slow easily hit overpriced suir. Since the HMG is crap now then it doesn't make sense to make it exclusive to only one suit anymore. Without the HMG's high DPS, having it as a heavy only weapon is essentially pointless.
A heavy can just equip a duvolle assault rifle and crap on your "can't have highest health and DPS" logic. I don't see a problem with them having both the highest DPS and the highest health as long as they are balanced by other factors like cost, profile signature, speed, hit box, etc. |
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Balzich Rotaine
Rotaine Shipping Inc
45
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Posted - 2013.05.07 08:02:00 -
[11] - Quote
Boomer Dues Mortis wrote:You know what be nice to help us fill our "niche" would be a suppression bonus since that is what everyone thinks heavies are meant for. We have to kill or we get no SP/ISK, also to be able to suppress the enemy we have to be able to shoot farther than 15m. You wish you could shoot 15 meters. I was pimp slappin proto heavies all day in a light militia dropsuit |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
775
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
WyrmHero1945 wrote:They're now what they're meant to be, moving damage sponges. Don't expect to be killing everyone at CQC now. Your role is to survive and take hits while the assaults do the killing. When the assaults die you stand there and don't let them take the objective/position.
A class that has the highest HP cannot have the highest DPS. People learned to counter you and they still have this in mind, you're a primary target. Make them do so and don't expose yourself. Your teammates do the flanking job. Always run with a squad, remember people will target you first so take cover. If the squad dies you're the only hope. Let them get very close to you and either kill them all or scare them away. But always hold the position.
The HMG nerf will force people towards this role. It's interesting how CCP is developing the meta game. I like the direction of balance they're aiming. Proto suits have to get close now and run towards cover in fear, no longer in their safe zone provided by sharpshooter.
yes, unfortunately this wonderful thing you're propping up is about as fun as wiping my butt with wads of razor wire, so I'll say the intended change is a spectacular failure. |
Balzich Rotaine
Rotaine Shipping Inc
45
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
My new method for taking out heavies is bunny hop bunny hop slap. Don't want to waste the ammo on crying babies |
fred orpaul
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
257
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
Any one with half a brain is not going to shoot a heavy first ever now. But then the reason heavies got nerfed was because people thought they should be able to walk up to a heavy and shot him in the face and win, the same guys that thought that MD were an instant win button, the same guys that thought LR were OP. so I guess even half of a brain is too much to expect from 90% of dust players.
You may be right this could be an interesting meta, act like a ****** in pub matches with my favorite weapon so that every other weapon looks OP and gets nerfed.
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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
141
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:06:00 -
[15] - Quote
tried HMG militia and it is fine imho. I can still mow down anything up close in under a second. all others are doing less damage too which means I survive longer. they all have less range which means that I can cross the street without getting shot down in 1s by some AR dude with 3 damage mods on the other side of the map.
overall it is a buff imho. |
Talos Alomar
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
709
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
I didn't want to always be a "niche" player.
Heavies need a new weapon. Badly. I don't know what CCP was thinking bringing out two new light weapons and a sidearm while one entire class just gets one anti infantry gun and one av gun.
That's pretty much why I'm not running a heavy anymore. I'd like to get back into a heavy suit someday, but there is just no reason to keep banging my head against the wall waiting for something besides a short range gun that just keeps getting nerfed.
Of course this also means that once we have a new heavy weapon that's better at range we'll have to re-balance the heavy. You're just making more and more work for yourself, ccp. |
bcs1a
ROYAL SQUAD Shadow of the Apocalypse
16
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Posted - 2013.05.07 08:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
Balzich Rotaine wrote:Boomer Dues Mortis wrote:You know what be nice to help us fill our "niche" would be a suppression bonus since that is what everyone thinks heavies are meant for. We have to kill or we get no SP/ISK, also to be able to suppress the enemy we have to be able to shoot farther than 15m. You wish you could shoot 15 meters. I was pimp slappin proto heavies all day in a light militia dropsuit
Hell, if i could actually shoot 15 meters, I might have a chance at killing the guy across the street from me before he kills me with his militia AR...
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
775
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 08:17:00 -
[18] - Quote
The heavy always had a niche. heavies were literally an exemplar of the phrase "who dares, wins"
The only people who were successful and brutally efficient were the ones who realized that heavy suits were a great way to get killed. a lot. then they applied a "Don't care about KDR and ISK efficiency" mindset, gloriously and spectacularly maimed the crap out of people because they weren't afraid to lose an expensive fit.
You killed the protofit fatty AV? If he's one of the good ones you will be bombarded again in fifteen seconds, and he will keep coming from every angle until he KILLS YOU and your stupid marauder.
HMG heavies were door-kicking shock troops who would charge madly into a crowd and kill their first two men and die gloriously while their assault buddies ran in behind to clean up the bad guys now in disarray because they were all focusing fire on the big, metal, walking distraction.
Now I see an HMG heavy? I just leave him alone. he can't threaten me, can't keep up with me, and he certainly ain't gonna kill me. I'm here to kill enemies, not pick on Lenny from Of Mice and Men.
You can kite heavies now! |
Snagman 313
Carbon 7
63
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 09:41:00 -
[19] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:The heavy always had a niche. heavies were literally an exemplar of the phrase "who dares, wins"
The only people who were successful and brutally efficient were the ones who realized that heavy suits were a great way to get killed. a lot. then they applied a "Don't care about KDR and ISK efficiency" mindset, gloriously and spectacularly maimed the crap out of people because they weren't afraid to lose an expensive fit.
You killed the protofit fatty AV? If he's one of the good ones you will be bombarded again in fifteen seconds, and he will keep coming from every angle until he KILLS YOU and your stupid marauder.
HMG heavies were door-kicking shock troops who would charge madly into a crowd and kill their first two men and die gloriously while their assault buddies ran in behind to clean up the bad guys now in disarray because they were all focusing fire on the big, metal, walking distraction.
Now I see an HMG heavy? I just leave him alone. he can't threaten me, can't keep up with me, and he certainly ain't gonna kill me. I'm here to kill enemies, not pick on Lenny from Of Mice and Men.
You can kite heavies now!
Pretty much spot on mate. That's how I still go tank hunting to this day.
I suppose I'll figure out something with this new build for my heavy but it'll take a while..
regards
Snag |
Harkon Vysarii
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
220
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 09:43:00 -
[20] - Quote
Coleman Gray wrote:But why would you aim for the sponge doing no damage?
I keep telling you nay sayers that Heavies arent that badly nerfed. The Heavies in my corp have noticed only that they need to change how they approach situations. The still kill people likeit aint nobodies buisness. |
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RazielJones
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
24
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Posted - 2013.05.07 09:59:00 -
[21] - Quote
The only thing heavys need is a slight buff to range, or to tighten up bullet spread at range. as it is right now anyone can stand still out side the 15 meter max range and just take their time taking down a heavy.
I don't need to be a God on the battlefield as a heavy no fun there either but as it is now HMG users will have to try and sneak up a reds to try and get in range. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
787
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:27:00 -
[22] - Quote
RazielJones wrote:The only thing heavys need is a slight buff to range, or to tighten up bullet spread at range. as it is right now anyone can stand still out side the 15 meter max range and just take their time taking down a heavy.
I don't need to be a God on the battlefield as a heavy no fun there either but as it is now HMG users will have to try and sneak up a reds to try and get in range.
slight my ass. The HMG is pointless if it cannot hit something across a street effectively.
rule of thumb: if the weapon's optimal is shorter than an HAV then odds are it's broken or it's a shotgun. |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
427
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:36:00 -
[23] - Quote
Played as my adv heavy.
Solo attack on enemey CRU.
Spam flux grenades
Start firing before i turn the corner
6 dead
just lost shields
continued to camp for 4 more kills before blueberry hacked it -_- |
Tech Ohm Eaven
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
482
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:45:00 -
[24] - Quote
ChromeBreaker wrote:Played as my adv heavy. Solo attack on enemey CRU. Spam flux grenades Start firing before i turn the corner 6 dead just lost shields continued to camp for 4 more kills before blueberry hacked it Heavies are big slow and put a lot of bullets down range. They come into thier own with all the armour tanking (much more noticable dmg against armour) tracking and range are thier achillies. Just with adv mods you have a LOT of hp and very respectable dmg in your killing area. They are still to be feared in urban areas
Oh you CAMPED......lol!!
HMG is garbage. |
Harkon Vysarii
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
221
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:47:00 -
[25] - Quote
Tech Ohm Eaven wrote:ChromeBreaker wrote:Played as my adv heavy. Solo attack on enemey CRU. Spam flux grenades Start firing before i turn the corner 6 dead just lost shields continued to camp for 4 more kills before blueberry hacked it Heavies are big slow and put a lot of bullets down range. They come into thier own with all the armour tanking (much more noticable dmg against armour) tracking and range are thier achillies. Just with adv mods you have a LOT of hp and very respectable dmg in your killing area. They are still to be feared in urban areas Oh you CAMPED......lol!! HMG is garbage.
Ha not even close mate you obvious arent using yours right then. |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
428
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:50:00 -
[26] - Quote
Harkon Vysarii wrote:Tech Ohm Eaven wrote:ChromeBreaker wrote:Played as my adv heavy. Solo attack on enemey CRU. Spam flux grenades Start firing before i turn the corner 6 dead just lost shields continued to camp for 4 more kills before blueberry hacked it Heavies are big slow and put a lot of bullets down range. They come into thier own with all the armour tanking (much more noticable dmg against armour) tracking and range are thier achillies. Just with adv mods you have a LOT of hp and very respectable dmg in your killing area. They are still to be feared in urban areas Oh you CAMPED......lol!! HMG is garbage. Ha not even close mate you obvious arent using yours right then.
Charging 6 guys solo is camping? |
steadyhand amarr
The Red Apple
472
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:51:00 -
[27] - Quote
All the heavys I know changed their playstyle got used to new rules and are right back to kicking ass I still fear hmgs more so now because it takes me longer to drop a heavy |
Harkon Vysarii
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
222
|
Posted - 2013.05.07 10:53:00 -
[28] - Quote
steadyhand amarr wrote:All the heavys I know changed their playstyle got used to new rules and are right back to kicking ass I still fear hmgs more so now because it takes me longer to drop a heavy
This. First game I played in squad with the Dead Sixers our Heavies went 17/4 and 30/6. Now how can you tell me that the Heavy is underpowered after that. |
Pvt Numnutz
On The Brink CRONOS.
41
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Posted - 2013.05.07 11:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
I agree with OP. Heavies arent juggernauts now, they too must work in a team of logis assaults and scouts to thrive. I played with a heavy in this one game, enemies had a strong position on this building. So me another assault and this heavy went around the flank. That heavy and i managed to hit them hard in the flank together, helping each other get kills and assists and driving them from the position. They arent useless, they have just changed. The thing people need to understand is we all have a little more learning to do now. I fly, and i have to relearn how to fly. deal with it. |
Sylwester Dziewiecki
BetaMax. CRONOS.
54
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Posted - 2013.05.07 11:11:00 -
[30] - Quote
WyrmHero1945 wrote:They're now what they're meant to be, moving damage sponges. Don't expect to be killing everyone at CQC now. Your role is to survive and take hits while the assaults do the killing. When the assaults die you stand there and don't let them take the objective/position.
A class that has the highest HP cannot have the highest DPS. People learned to counter you and they still have this in mind, you're a primary target. Make them do so and don't expose yourself. Your teammates do the flanking job. Always run with a squad, remember people will target you first so take cover. If the squad dies you're the only hope. Let them get very close to you and either kill them all or scare them away. But always hold the position.
The HMG nerf will force people towards this role. It's interesting how CCP is developing the meta game. I like the direction of balance they're aiming. Proto suits have to get close now and run towards cover in fear, no longer in their safe zone provided by sharpshooter. HMG never had highest dps in previous build, and nerfing them will only force people to use Light weapons on them. |
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