It's really not. It reduces HAVs to being used only in corp battles, since it would require something like five people to drive. That also means that two extra people are removed from infantry roles where they might be protecting the HAV from AV. So the HAV stays the same strength, or increases very slightly, but he team infantry part of the team is severely weakened.

I can see how it'd be fun if certain specialized vehicles were set up this way, but that doesn't need to be the case for all armor. Certainly not for HAVs as they are now.

Theoretically you can still go solo, but at a cost. Honestly, I like HAVs, but they need to be nerfed, one way or another. I'd rather they require a few more people than make them weaker, because I love them too much to see them devolve into a fragile, slow, petty vehicle.

This will only really be worthwhile once we have larger teams, also the commander position is pretty much redundant considering that the driver would always be able to best gauge when to turn mods on and the same for the equipment slot however the support role is pretty much around now since either gunner can pull a mad up, all the passengers need to be able to do now is add the ability to drop OMS from them. Adding redundant roles only leads to wasteful changes

I think you have not met a dedicated AV guy yet. Take 2 of them and there is not much that can be done to save your tank.
For gunners I want to drive and gun myself and can with no problem. Why did I spend 5 mil SP? To drive blueberry on top and letting him getting all the kills? Nope!

Not really, the added roles would simply be better in the hands of the driver, since they'd undoubtedly have the most intuition of when to use certain mods since they're the ones actually dumping sp into it.

Theoretically you can still go solo, but at a cost. Honestly, I like HAVs, but they need to be nerfed, one way or another. I'd rather they require a few more people than make them weaker, because I love them too much to see them devolve into a fragile, slow, petty vehicle.

HAV's use the same Jove/sleeper tech capsules use allowing 1 man to control the entire vehicle, no separating the driver from the main gun that's just stupid, get some dumb blue dot in here and you have become useless

No your an idiot, HAV's are made of glass as it is if you can't kill them now your doing it wrong >_>
Tanks need amassive PG CPU armor and shield buff to make them into tanks again not wet cardboard boxes

HAV's use the same Jove/sleeper tech capsules use allowing 1 man to control the entire vehicle

Source?

Commons sense, you have a large 10 ton vehicle, it is operated by one man/women.

The only logical explanation is that it uses the same tech as the capsules made by the Jove/sleepers

I already said the owner would have the option to kick people out as well as lock them out.


When did I say that HAVs were unkillable? When? When you can answer that, I'll listen to you.

That makes no damn sense and you know it.

Right in the title "HAV's are Overpowerd" implying that you have trouble killig them.

use common sense, 1 guy controlling an entire tank only way that is possible = sleeper/Jove tech eliminating the need for extra crew keeping more bots on the ground,

Welcome to the future son, no need for a five man crew when everything is automated

Yeah, that's a bit of a stretch.

A big rig can easily weight ten tons. Are modern truckers secretly space mercenaries?

So is a capital ship in eve op because it rolled up on an in-organized group and murders them single handedly is that op? Or is it a faulted on the enemy's side? if I invest 4.6 million sp into an Hav I expect to murder face single handedly

(I'm typing this on my phone that's why the gremmer is utter **** useless iPhone and there rubbish pell check)

Now these are not modern tanks there for amusing they weight upwards of 60 tons like modern tanks is redundant.
They have the option of nano fiber chassis, Do modern tanks like the C2A1 leopard have a nano fiber chassis? NO
Modern tanks are made of iron and steel, What are the tanks in dust made of? In all likelihood they are comprised of composite metals to make them stronger and lighter then conventional materials.
The power plants are in modern tanks and the tanks in dust car very very different in weight, Modern tanks use internal combustion, the tanks in dust MAY OR may not use a turbine engine or a form of cold fusion to generate power

Now onto the way we maneuver said armored Vehicle around the battlefield, In modern tanks they require a full crew for it to operate.

In dust like in eve alot of the work that would be done by a man is replaced by automated systems, I.E. an auto loaded for rail/missile turrets.

I own a World war 2 British centurion ask any of my corp mates (most the log time players in Tritan have seen the pics) The difference between a tank and a Semi are very very different, Tanks have no fixed steering point a semi truck does, A tank can turn on a dime a semi truck can't. you are trying to compare a helicopter to a fighter jet.

To have a 5 man crew in a tank (for arguments sake) would be completely redundant, If you go into a match be in a pub or a corp battle you loose 4 sets of boots that could be doing something important.


If you have the tech to have 1 man control a 30 km long ship why wouldn't you use the same tech to control a 30 ton tank?
If you can have 1 man control a power house why not use it? (<----do you have an answer for this?) You instantly gain 4 soldiers using Jove/sleeper tech to control vehicles.

THIS IS NOT WORLD OF TANKS! YOU DO NOT NEED A CREW TO OPERATE THE TANK.
THIS IS NOT BATTLE FIELD THIS IS DUST

DUST IS APART OF EVE
EVE IS NOT YOUR EVERYDAY MMORPG

I didn't sate an entire capsule...(my god why are you so stupid?) I said "same tech" as in a more compact less refined version of it simple enough to let one person control a land/air vehicle (<--this is not hard to comprehend)

A capsule is capable of space flight, the basic equipment that allows a capsuleer to command a cruiser could easily be striped down to the basic components and jammed into a tank.

(please keep in mine a capsule has to contain fuel, life support, systems for navigation, etc etc)

Anyway, plenty of things can be overpowered yet be easy to kill.

Word of advice - If you want to tell CCP that something is broke, tell them what is broke, and why do you think like that. You are strongly attacking tanks in general it this treat and it is very harmful.

You act like you only read my title. I explained why HAVs were overpowered, and how to fix it without actually making them inferior. I agree, HAVs are not overpowered against AV, but a disorganized foe likely won't have powerful enough of AV. That's why I am suggesting this. Why should HAVs require less cooperation than AV? That's my main point, and I thought I made it quite clear in my wall of text.

Tanks in general are not overpowered, the militia one is okay and has plenty of survivabilty. A fully specced and fully "tanked" tank is ludicrously overpowered. I've had matches where at least five people were shooting at a tank with swarms and I was using a militia forge gun. The tank did not get below half armour.

Tanks should be powerful but when six guys let off AV at a single tank and it shrugs them off like whatever, then something is wrong.

I haven't specced into tanks at all and my experience with them is 99% from being mowed down by them but as my paragraph above explains, six guys should be able to take down a single tank .

I'm a tanker, and I love tanks. Unfortunately, there is a storm brewing regarding the Heavy Assault Vehicle. HAVs are tanks, and therefore should be overpowered if seen as a singular entity. However, all too often I hear complaints about how a single person can run around in a HAV and murder everyone without a care. Unfortunately, this is true. A HAV has multiple objectives: draw enemy fire away from infantry; pin down enemy infantry; take out enemy vehicles. It performs all these tasks admirably in most situations, and I don't think that should change. However, the fact that it can operate with such a small crew is not a good thing, either. It isn't realistic and it isn't balanced.

Militia AV works on Militia tanks - yes, you can try to kill something better with just militia stuff, but don't expect to kill it. Instead you may pin it down, with is good.
If you would skill-up to tanks you will know that they high resistance are not permanent, every active module have cool-down, and sooner or later tank driver have to disengage to hide somewhere for 30 second. In that time he is vulnerable, and you could probably solo him in that time(if he don't know where you are, and you have him on plate).
Beside that, AV grenades are one of most successfully AV that can be easily fited on you dropsuit without heavy drawback. SL takes L slot, Forge Guns take way more then just weapon slot. Thats whey AV granades are perfect, you can easlly protect with them against waves of enemy troops.
SL have one more thing worth to mention, they screw a little bit with tank optics - if swarms are launch directly at tank, they generate smoke that hide shooter, of curse if tank driver is come he gone kill SL in time. Each AV weapon for tank driver is a threat, if he see swarms on air he don't know yet is it militia one or proto so he will try to counter them same each and every time with a high level of caution, with manse that he can turn on all his hardeners on and have problem becaous of it in next 60sec(armor). So it is not like that all AV is a crap. Even if you are using Militia stuff you have impact on high grade tanks.


It's BS or we are not playing in the same game. Yesterday I killed Railgun-Sagraris that engage me, with my Blaster-Madruger, at other match I die to 4guys with AV granades in some militia suit, is it sound's ok for you? None force people to skill-up they characters to use better AV stuff; AV granades and proxy mines are one of those that don't required plenty of skillpoints. If you are in tank, and you see crowd of people, do you engange them at close or not? If not you are good, because you realize that even capital ships in eve means nothing if you don't have fleet to protect them. All tanks need cover form his team-mates infantry, always when you are spawning tank it is not one men show. Yes you may end up with 30 frags on you score, but it's not because you are awesome and tanks are OP. Big part of pie go to people that in first place did a scout-job for you, telling you where are AV guys if they couldent kill them right away, or that did inform you where is enemy tank and where is he heading to..

All people that want HAV nerfed are 1d1ots that do not want to spec Av but want to kill proto tanks by militia swarms.
IF YOU GOING TO NERF THOSE FREAKING TANKS REFUND ALL MY 5M SP THAT I USED TO MAKE MY TANK BETTER.

Tanks should be operated by at least 2 people. Right now they can solo better then any other piece of equipment/dropsuit on the battlefield. They should require logi support to do well or have to resupply their ammo like everyone else. why they get unlimited ammo is beyond me.

This is quite hunestly one of the stupidest topics I have ever seen. HAVs are not OP. They rip balls off of people not equipped to kill tanks. This is as it should be. If you are tooling around with ARs, mass drivers, sniper rifles and HMGs then you are getting rolled for your lunch money.

The last three Sagaris marauders I got into it with I blew the kitten out of them in three shots with my forge gun. One took four because he had a proper tank fit, go figure. Im running full proto AV fits right now, and, militia tanks take one more shot than an LAV for me to execute.

Surya marauders are trickier but I kill more of them than escape because I took the time to learn how to kill them. Tanks are only overpowered if no one on your team is willing to deploy the proper tools to destroy them. The toolkit is there, and if you take the time to use it correctly you can become a holy kittening terror for vehicle drivers.

Further for you dinguses spouting lore, all the tanks need is a cybernetic neural uplink. Hydrostatic capsules were created to sustain capsuleers, but the only reason they exist is the neural burner used to transfer consciousness accurately is rediculously bulky. the capsules were built around it. With the advent of the DUST neural transfer implant, the hydrostatic capsule has been rendered obsolete. It, and the clone mechanics in EVE are due for a redesign.

Finally, 99% of AV in DUST 514 is militia grade. Somewhere, you people were spoon-fed the delusion that militia grade AV was simply good enough. It is if you have five or more militia AV concentrating fire, but if you want an HAV burned use proto AV. They don't shrug those hits off. They run or they die.

So only proto should be able to deal with tanks? What a load of ass cheeks.

If militia AV fits are incapable of dealing with tanks (which they aren't) then they shouldn't exist as an AV fit, they should be called anti LAV and Dropship fits. Either that or tanks are overpowered, you choose.

Tanks should be operated by at least 2 people. Right now they can solo better then any other piece of equipment/dropsuit on the battlefield. They should require logi support to do well or have to resupply their ammo like everyone else. why they get unlimited ammo is beyond me.

So only proto should be able to deal with tanks? What a load of ass cheeks.

If militia AV fits are incapable of dealing with tanks (which they aren't) then they shouldn't exist as an AV fit, they should be called anti LAV and Dropship fits. Either that or tanks are overpowered, you choose.

Every time I see a title that has "HAV" and "Overpowered" in the same sentence I think to myself "the poor tanks have been nerfed enough as it is". Bad enough the missiles got nerfed to oblivion, now people are asking to nerf the blaster/railgun tanks.

My tank costs 1mil and I have 4mil skill points in tanks, my tank is basically maxed out, "meta", whatever you want to call it....

Yes I average 20/0 in a lot of pubs...
So does a triple complex dmg stacked proto using AR assault...

Whats your point?

Someone with 4 mil sp in an AV fit with proto AV nades kicks the crap out of my tank..


Hence why tanks are rare..and no a soma or sica is not a tank, and they die to your newberry free militia AV fit. ;-)

The commitment needed to use an HAV effectively, both in ISK and SP as well as simple player skill, makes HAVs rare, but the ones you see and complain about do it to often enough that we've perfected it just like Imperfects pub stomp with their Proto AR builds...


So seriously, how are we HAVs op?
I need to not blow up for 4-5 games to just break even on it!

Your simply hating the fact that your Scissors doesn't beat Rock...next time roll paper.

Edit: That being said no we are not in pods in HAVS, just like you don't see an egg driving the LAV...PODs are used to drive spaceships in EVE because the normal crew for a Frigate to fly fully functional is in the dozens...

So no we HAVs are not tankers, unfortunately you cant make omelettes out of us after cracking us open with those damn OP AV Nades...sorry.

And a Tank in this day and age drives will 1-3 people, just like HAVs do, and yes gunners are important.

You have convinced me that tanks, as they are right now, do not need a nerf (and believe me that can be a difficult thing to do).

My suggestion to remedy the problem of having brutally powerful tanks is to bring down the costs of them and then nerf them. Like I said before, a tank being hit repeatedly by a forge gunner and 5 militia swarms should die, simple as that.

i think people should just stop being ignorant and train AV

furthermore CCP has better things to do than worry about this, such as new dropsuits, vehicles and maps...as well as fixing those damn dmg mods.