[FEEDBACK] Re-adjusting heavy dropsuits
Update: Balancing work on dropsuits are ongoing, and we will keep you posted with future updates on the results.

Its just the Zitro effect. you nerf my stuff yours is next :)

Its just the Zitro effect. you nerf my stuff yours is next :)

Its just the Zitro effect. you nerf my stuff yours is next :)

Sucks to be heavies but i smell a nerf so everyone get on the ban wagon and enjoy the ride.

it may be the maps but other things got nerf from other factors.

Dropships got nerfed cause swarms couldnt hit
TARs damage mods are broken
and the list goes on, now you just add heavies again :)

They are getting buffed soon.... like next build, what are you talking about.

I admit that HMGs are way too easy to use, makes me take great joy in mowing down garbage heavies just piggybacking on the HMG.

Nerf the suit any more though, and there really won't be much point in playing a heavy. They're already very easy to kill if you don't get caught with your pants down, and engage at a proper range, especially if you use a laser. Never mind the very underwhelming progression of heavy suits as time goes on.

It just amuses me, that as good as you are, you have trouble with these HMG spamming noobs. Rather, I smell a hidden agenda, considering you understand how powerful tank play is and is going to be, and you'd like to see heavies (the primary infantry answer to tanks) brought down as much as possible. This is why you focus your posts lately at "heavies" and not "heavy machine guns"

Just sayin.

What got nerfed clown you butt hurt because a heavy is on the top of the leader boards?
i think so

Are you talking about this?
I doubt they would bend heavies over any more than they have already, a nerf is the last thing the heavy dropsuit needs and I hope CCP sees that.

Its just the Zitro effect. you nerf my stuff yours is next :)

Im sick of all the scrubs out scoring me with a assault load out, so instead of griping make a heavy alt and see how you great killers do bet you aint that good.
zitro hasn't used a heavy once like i never used a assault but i think the assault is over powered, in my opinion.

Please nerf all 3 foot fences. They're too tall. btw zitro your discussion of balance always effects the gear you never use. Hmm.

i have alts just like everyone else, heavies are too easy. Where am i wrong?

Against infantry I will not argue with you. What is going to happen when people spec into tanks? Heavies should be able to help defend their squad against vehicles. If you nerf the heavies and remove their ability to counter the tanks then this game will turn into WoT.

I disagree with you there tbh. No ads, poor range, slow turning, 4.8 minute reload and to tip it all of they do less dps than a AR (if its not less its similar, at work so can't check the maths right now, feel free to put the math in for me anyone )

The thing the heavy has going for it IMO is the scare factor. So many times someone takes a shot at me wipes out my sheild, (type 2) then runs away, and normally gets a back full of metal. If they'd keep that ar on me for an extra second I'd probably be toast.
Lasers, now they need a nerf, they take down anything you point them at, and don't say oh but you have to keep them on target, cos surprisingly the rest of the guns don't fire tracking bullets either.

I am spec into tanks, and what counters a tank is swarms and av nades not heavies and forges. if you have no knowlage of vehicle and av combat dont talk please

I am spec into tanks, and what counters a tank is swarms and av nades not heavies and forges. if you have no knowlage of vehicle and av combat dont talk please

My aren't you a real sweetie. Okay Mr. know-it-all please enlighten me what the Forge gun is used for then?

My aren't you a real sweetie. Okay Mr. know-it-all please enlighten me what the Forge gun is used for then?

The forge gun primarily used to kill shield tanks, or any vehicle that favors shields over armor for that matter.

I agree - all I see is Gek Gek Gek - soon it will be Douvolle blah blah. Assult guns are way way over powered in this game - seem to have sniper range too !

The only solution to avoid a heavy nerf is for everyone to switch to heavy then we can point fingers at shotguns.

All these supposed "great players" QQ'ing about heavies...smh.

If you only played as one you'll realize it's not all that. The sh!t's weak tbh, unless you know how to play...like EVERY other class.

If it gets nerfed again then there won't be a point playing as a heavy...which I'm sure is what most of these Assault / tankers want.

Mavado dont tell you accepted this kids app -.- he is Zion quality not SyN

Mavado dont tell you accepted this kids app -.- he is Zion quality not SyN

When I can run around with an HMG on my assault suit then the heavy's will be balanced.

Lance kd speaks for itself considering he runs both assault and heavy
and Lance is very much SyN quality and an officer in SyN hes been with us since BF3 and is a very good player.

I see no problems with heavies tbqh Zitro
i drop them easy, they get the drop on me i go down

there is almost no point to using a prototype heavy since heavies are actually gimped slot wise.
one of ur own guys laid it out best Zitro.......a low lvl heavy > low lvl assault but high lvl assault >> high lvl heavy

right now everyone is low still rockin standard suits.
A heavy should be tough to take out within his element solo or they'd be no point in using the dropsuit at all

Assault suit is actually the easiest role to play since its so versatile. Other suits u have to play a certain way in order to do well with the suit.

i wasnt talking about stats i dont care really, im talking about how he thinks. its on par with a random zion kid

When I can run around with an HMG on my assault suit then the heavy's will be balanced.

Your way off. They do 20 dmg per hit if I remember correctly but have a ROF of 2000 which is essentially like the AR doing 50 dmg per shot.

I hope they don't nerf them for a while yet, Im going to train them up myself and start playing the game on easy mode too.

Sorry, they already fixed your breach rifle.

no

Sucks to be heavies but i smell a nerf so the 8 or 9 of you that are left get on the ban wagon and enjoy the ride.

viable

i wasnt talking about stats i dont care really, im talking about how he thinks. its on par with a random zion kid

nothing wrong with the way he thinks
ur own heavies have said heavy suits are meh ppl who specialize in these roles see the flaws better than most especially someone who plays both assault and heavy

heavies really arent all that tbqh

Actually, the base HMG deals 16 damage per shot, with the Proto HMG bumbing that up to 17.6.

Spot on about the RoF though.

The big problem is that HMGs have terrible deviation and damage drop off at range. They basically turn into shotguns unless you're able to keep it trained long enough for the anti-recoil to kick in, but even then you can't normally engage at proper efficiency.

i never said heavies are good, they are EASY. TOO EASY in fact and if you think otherwise you suck at fps. they mostlikely will get nefed cause of that

What got nerfed clown you butt hurt because a heavy is on the top of the leader boards?
i think so

A little like tanks if you've got some ISK?

The movement of an armor tank can be compared to a crippled turtle.

bad tank=**** while bad heavy=meat shield that hits back. if you think tanks are easy try using armor tanks, they are harder than shield tanks IMO

Clearly you haven't watched Zitro's armor tank....



I hate tank play, I've tried to enjoy it but I just don't. I prefer flying dropships over everything, but they suck face, and you STILL don't get any SP for flying them. So, I went heavy, in anticipation of players like you focusing on things like tanks.

Good call

What is that? A scout buff in the distance?

When I can run around with an HMG on my assault suit then the heavy's will be balanced.

Actually, the base HMG deals 16 damage per shot, with the Proto HMG bumbing that up to 17.6.

Spot on about the RoF though.

The big problem is that HMGs have terrible deviation and damage drop off at range. They basically turn into shotguns unless you're able to keep it trained long enough for the anti-recoil to kick in, but even then you can't normally engage at proper efficiency.

Not quite sure I believe you here because heavies are always attacking me back with the hog when I am a range with an at and hey do more DMV faster than I can with my supposed better range. In fact I they sometimes engage me when it's out of my ads effective range.

Did a test today with some corp mates in the back of the base just to see how HMG's vary from AR's. The results are both surprising and somewhat disturbing.

A basic HMG has a max range of 63 meters with level 1 heavy sharpshooter
An assaul HMG has a max range of 85 meters with level 1 heavy sharpshooter
A basic AR has a max range of 88 meters with level 1 light sharpshooter

In case you are wondering how I got the range I was shooting at, you can get these stats by checking the information that pops up at the center bottom of your screen when you aim your crosshair at people (including teammates.)

So, basically, a assault HMG has the same range as an AR. 3 meters difference. This is insanely imbalanced. An HMG is supposed to be great at close range, fair at mid range, useless at long range. But with this kind of range, it's just as deadly at mid range as it is at close range, and more deadly than an AR at any range that both weapons can reach due to the 2000 RPM that the HMG puts out. Anyone within 50 meters of an HMG , or 75 meters of an assault HMG can get mowed down by it just as easily as if they were point blank.

But you may say "but the HMG is far less accurate than the AR! It's bullet spread more than makes up for this!" Not true. The most accurate AR in the marketplace, the Allotek Burst AR, has an accuracy rating of 59.0. All HMG's except for the burst variants have an accuracy rating of 61.5, which makes them MORE ACCURATE THAN AN ASSAULT RIFLE. Yes, for about a quarter of a second, while the HMG is spinning up, the HMG spreads quite wildly. But after about a second of constant firing it has become more accurate than any assault rifle you can buy. And if you are using the assault variant, you can virtually reach just as far as any AR with the same skill level in sharpshooter (as I said, the AR is 3 meters further).

So, in summary, the HMG has virtually the same range as the AR, fires off 1250 more RPM, and has a greater accuracy rating than the top AR's on the market. This is too much for a weapon with such high damage output.

So now, let's hear the heavies start trying to convince me that the HMG isn't imbalanced. I welcome any legitimate responses.

What's the rof and damage of the standard AR?

*facepalm*

No no no...

What is with all this Heavies are OP talk? They are big targets and not impossible to take down. Yes they can win in a 1 vs 1 fight more often than not, but that is your fault then for being alone.

Sure it is intimidating to hear that HMG spin up near you, but it should be. It is a large guy in a Heavy Drop suit for crying out loud. His suit costs more than yours and should do more damage and soak up more damage. There is nothing wrong with this.

They move slowly and this itself is a good balance point. Heaves are an easy target when they try to run around too much. They pretty much have to stay in one location to stay alive.

Everyone just needs to quit whining and learn that each suit has its own strengths and weaknesses. Even Heavies have weaknesses, and they alone can not win a match.

There is always something in DUST that will be more powerful than any one suit type, and that is a group of players each using their particular suits advantages to their best.

I initially doubted this post but perhaps based on player accounts im starting to think it has merit

Are you talking about this?
I doubt they would bend heavies over any more than they have already, a nerf is the last thing the heavy dropsuit needs and I hope CCP sees that.

AR ROF 768 DMG 31

HMG ROF 2000 DMG 16

HMG firs 2.5 rounds for every ar round.......or approx 40 DMG in the same timeframe of a single ar shot.

I've been playing this game longer than most people, and probably have more knowledge when it comes to combat in this game than most people. The fact that the heavy suit can basically use every weapon in the game is a bit ridiculous. The fact that the HMG has the same effective range as an AR is ridiculous. The fact that a kid can head glitch in a heavy suit and a laser rifle is a bit ridiculous.

Heavy suits can easily turn the tide of any match especially with the Domination/Conquest (skirmish) all you have to do is camp on 2 points with heavy suits. Good luck trying to beat a group of heavy's camped on the OBJ's, or at your Clone reserve.

the counter are grenades against heavys on objectives. Cause they are too slow to evade them. Theres a reason why we have 2 sec fuse timers on grenades and damn slow heavys. Its the #1 thing that heavys are getting killed by and they hate them with a passion.

I've been playing this game longer than most people, and probably have more knowledge when it comes to combat in this game than most people. The fact that the heavy suit can basically use every weapon in the game is a bit ridiculous. The fact that the HMG has the same effective range as an AR is ridiculous. The fact that a kid can head glitch in a heavy suit and a laser rifle is a bit ridiculous.

Heavy suits can easily turn the tide of any match especially with the Domination/Conquest (skirmish) all you have to do is camp on 2 points with heavy suits. Good luck trying to beat a group of heavy's camped on the OBJ's, or at your Clone reserve.

*facepalm*

a loathing passion.

Go f*ck yourself in a piranha tank with a porkchop thong

There's so much stupid in this thread it's insane. We're barely even in to this build and we have a stupid low sp cap now, roughly 1/5 to 1/4 the SP per week we were getting before. Nobody has skills yet, nobody is running great gear. Nothing can be OP yet. We're only a couple days away from open BETA with fresh players and new tactics on the horizon. Am I the only one that sees this?

If you think the heavy suit w/ HMG is OP or it's super-easy kill mode then you know what? F*ck you. Just go f*ck yourself right in the face. Go f*ck yourself in a piranha tank with a porkchop thong. Just like last build give two weeks and you won't see hardly any heavies anymore. Just like after the last reset.

Heavy suits could probably use a buff, but the HMG needs a massive nerf. Which would hopefully make heavies more useful for what they are supposed to be, AV.

A heavies place in an infantry fight needs to be purely support based, and their role as AV should be a main focus. As it stands now, a heavy is the most effective and devastating run-n-gun platform in the game (granted they do a little skill upgrading). That's almost as awkward as saying that a scout with a sniper rifle can run-n-gun in the frontlines better than any other class.

run n gun?

HAHAHAHAHA

Please... just quit... I'll bust a rib laughing at this sh!t

Heavy suits could probably use a buff, but the HMG needs a massive nerf. Which would hopefully make heavies more useful for what they are supposed to be, AV.

A heavies place in an infantry fight needs to be purely support based, and their role as AV should be a main focus. As it stands now, a heavy is the most effective and devastating run-n-gun platform in the game (granted they do a little skill upgrading).

That's almost as awkward as saying that a scout with a sniper rifle can run-n-gun in the frontlines better than any other class.

I can only hope others did not take the word "run" literally as you have.

So what you're telling me, is that a heavy machine gun fires quicker than an assault rifle?

HOLY CRAP!!! STOP THE PRESSES!!! That makes absolutely ZERO sense!!!!

So next time why dont you check and read the posts before you go spouting off on something that you obviously did not check.

I don mind dps being higher for the hmg...........the issue i think is more the accracy and range. If heavies want the same accuracy then they should get a range decrease.

the counter are grenades against heavys on objectives. Cause they are too slow to evade them. Theres a reason why we have 2 sec fuse timers on grenades and damn slow heavys. Its the #1 thing that heavys are getting killed by and they hate them with a passion.

Oh I agree, the range is definitely a bit too high. Also, the standard HMG needs to overheat just a tad faster. I wouldn't be opposed to a slight spool up before you start shooting, then I could walk around reving my HMG like I do with my assault forge

we should just give it a week and then the scouts will be op then the melee attack will be op, then this then that.

If everything is overpowered nothing is.

I still disagree with you about the range.

Currently the standard HMG overheats at 173 shots left with HMG Operation 1 and 159 shots left with HMG Operation 2. What's your take on this? Personally I wouldn't mind a very slight nerf to this, so that it overheats at around 220 shots left instead. You could also change the skill to 2% less heat build up per level instead of 3%.

I agree heavys are just everywhere now its getting annoying. Its just cause to many scrubs are scared of getting killed so they run to the dropsuit with the most hp its just sad

I admit that HMGs are way too easy to use, makes me take great joy in mowing down garbage heavies just piggybacking on the HMG.

Nerf the suit any more though, and there really won't be much point in playing a heavy. They're already very easy to kill if you don't get caught with your pants down, and engage at a proper range, especially if you use a laser. Never mind the very underwhelming progression of heavy suits as time goes on.

It just amuses me, that as good as you are, you have trouble with these HMG spamming noobs. Rather, I smell a hidden agenda, considering you understand how powerful tank play is and is going to be, and you'd like to see heavies (the primary infantry answer to tanks) brought down as much as possible. This is why you focus your posts lately at "heavies" and not "heavy machine guns"

Just sayin.

Its just the Zitro effect. you nerf my stuff yours is next :)

Are you talking about this?
I doubt they would bend heavies over any more than they have already, a nerf is the last thing the heavy dropsuit needs and I hope CCP sees that.

I now have a Heavy suit and HMG, after using this suit to rack up 39 kills in a single game where my team lost, I now totally agree that heavy suits are not OP and shouldn't be nerfed in anyway, it makes perfect sense that a type I heavy with level 1 HMG can pwn that much face, despite not having a single SP in any of the support skills.

Are you talking about this?
I doubt they would bend heavies over any more than they have already, a nerf is the last thing the heavy dropsuit needs and I hope CCP sees that.

*facepalm*

No no no...

What is with all this Heavies are OP talk? They are big targets and not impossible to take down. Yes they can win in a 1 vs 1 fight more often than not, but that is your fault then for being alone.

Sure it is intimidating to hear that HMG spin up near you, but it should be. It is a large guy in a Heavy Drop suit for crying out loud. His suit costs more than yours and should do more damage and soak up more damage. There is nothing wrong with this.

They move slowly and this itself is a good balance point. Heaves are an easy target when they try to run around too much. They pretty much have to stay in one location to stay alive.

Everyone just needs to quit whining and learn that each suit has its own strengths and weaknesses. Even Heavies have weaknesses, and they alone can not win a match.

There is always something in DUST that will be more powerful than any one suit type, and that is a group of players each using their particular suits advantages to their best.