No.
Just no.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

Hmmmm...you must be that guy who dies a lot to get his kills. Thanks for sucking up the clone bank.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

I don't want to lose X War Points just because I'm actually willing to risk any ISK I have invested in my suit and am playing the map as it should be (ie going for objectives). To make this sort of suggestion have any relevancy, you'd need the penalty to be notable, which means even more people would fall into the habit of removing themselves from danger altogether--something that makes the game less fun overall.

Plus it would would make Ambush even less popular than it already is.

"If this has been said a 1000 times.."???? Lmao who would suggest such a horrible idea?

A + 50 points for a kill and - 5 or -10 points for a death does not seem overly dramatic to me. It also keeps the people who have gobs of ISK in line to a degree for just the reason you've stated. Many people in this game are both fearless AND foolish when it comes to "storming the lines" or "playing bait"; what's another dropsuit to them when they have 500 million ISK in the bank? Snipers are easily handled or avoided in my opinion, and I prefer Ambush to Skirmish. In fact, I haven't played a Skirmish game since the second week I was in the Demo back in November.

Having absolutely no penalty for death when it comes to WP is extremely small minded in my viewpoint.

Having absolutely no penalty for death when it comes to WP is extremely small minded in my viewpoint.

I am definitely getting a feel now on these forums for who some of these fools are I've been running into in the game.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

Many people load up on Militia gear and just run around, blasting everything in sight, with no mind to their team nor any real strategy or self preservation plan in general.

Those are the players who bust the seams of their pants when someone suggests a WP penalty for deaths. Those are also the players who drain the clone bank dry and cause defeats in Ambush mode.

I hate them. And a WP penalty may just help to keep them the tiniest bit more in check with a little more self control.

Maybe.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

Why would death matter to us?

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

One of the major problems I always have with this idea is that it further rewards the already-cozy red-line warriors and snipers in general.

I play plenty of matches where I die 5+ times because I'm always on the front line with my AR. I don't want to lose X War Points just because I'm actually willing to risk any ISK I have invested in my suit and am playing the map as it should be (ie going for objectives). To make this sort of suggestion have any relevancy, you'd need the penalty to be notable, which means even more people would fall into the habit of removing themselves from danger altogether--something that makes the game less fun overall.

Plus it would would make Ambush even less popular than it already is.

Worse idea ever. BigggusssDikuuuussss, smallest brain.

lol, you just described my game play down to a T.

If people think that taking away WP's will do any good, it won't. Less WP means less ISK and less SP. Which means I'll be running in militia/skinweave gear longer and continue to run around the map with my "Devil may care attitude."

Yeah, this is exatly the kind of Nincompoop playstyle that obviously 90% of the players in Dust adhere too as evidenced by the "No! Don't take away my WP because I can't stay alive for five seconds and don't have the sense to avoid bullets!" respones in this thread.

Sad.

Yeah, this is exatly the kind of Nincompoop playstyle that obviously 90% of the players in Dust adhere too as evidenced by the "No! Don't take away my WP because I can't stay alive for five seconds and don't have the sense to avoid bullets!" respones in this thread.

Sad.

The problem is that you haven't made a compelling argument to convince anyone that the current system is flawed,other than if you have more kills that the other guy,you should be higher on the scoreboard,which isn't a good argument to begin with.

While that was a part of my point, the main gist of what I was trying to convey was that some (well, many according to the responses in this thread) players just jump willy-nilly into battle without a thought in the world in order to get a kill, so their WP goes up, so their SP/ISK rewards go up at the end of the match. They could care less about whether their team wins or loses, because such playstyles drain the clone bank at an alarming speed.

If this is the future of Dust 514, populated by a punch of Yahoos who only care about match rewards to level and gear up their own characters, then what is the point in the end? I'm already not exactly sold on the "MMO" nature of this game, and this is yet another flaw in the design to me.

If this is the future of Dust 514, populated by a punch of Yahoos who only care about match rewards to level and gear up their own characters, then what is the point in the end? I'm already not exactly sold on the "MMO" nature of this game, and this is yet another flaw in the design to me.

Kinda makes me go "Oh. What is that OTHER free-to-play game marketed by Sony which seems more like a true MMO? Planetside 2? And it's SO pretty too..."

Actually, I think it should be negative points for friendly kills once friendly fire is on. I don't see a need to subtract WP because you died.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

Curious, your avatar implies that you run logistics, but your post implies quite the opposite.

Just because you ended up with a higher KDR does not mean you contributed to the battle more than the other guy. I've had Logi's in my corp go 0/5 and be top score, and they deserved every last point of it because they allowed the top killers to keep killing.

Not all about kills my friend

Oh another solution would be to raise to clone count from 150-200 and in the tutorial section of the game and/or create a introductory battle session similar to Assassin's Creed MP that walk players through the finer points of things in battle, right now it only tells us how to navigate the neocom, marketplace and dropsuit stuff but nothing about in game mechanics.

A key mechanic newbies need to know is that dying though adding to your personal stat does not drop the clone count until you bleed out/opt to respawn or if you suit is otherwise unrevivable. If however you are revivable dont simply push square, wait sometimes triage is on the way but not nearby enough to prompt the message that triage is nearby. Something they need to fix, also it seems the help requested does little more than tell me that im requesting help i have not noticed in any way that a person requesting help is asking me for help, the triage symbols appear regardless it seems. It might help us logi's if we know if someone is actively asking for help by changing the color of the triage symbol since flashing just tells us they are close to bleeding out. If they change flashing to indicate help requested they could just make players close to death turn red.

I must mention the tactical use of nanite injectors. My friends and I always use nanite injectors - if any one of us are alive at the end of an encounter, we're all revived and back to full health in no time. Everybody dies.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

You've nailed a problem,while totally missing the solution. As stated, negative WP actually encourages more militia running. the problem isn't penalty... have that. the problem is there is zero incentive to win. When that changes, so will the number of militia zombies.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

First of all, this belongs in Feedback/Requests.
Second, this is a horrible idea, so horrible in fact, that I am angry I can't find the -1 button.

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

this encourages silly camping, get out of here noob L2go30-0

add a bonus payout of 100 ISK per warpoint.

You get more WP achieving than killfarming if you think strategically. I do the logi thing, usually get a 2/7 KD and wind up in the top three 90% of the time.

reward value to the team. Killfarmers will get cookies but I can get more WP faster with reps, hacks, assists and revives than you can just rocking out random murders.

Oh, and I forgot to mention, if you actually did something OTHER than shooting people, like hacking an objective, supporting your team-mates, etc. then you would still be higher than that 11/11 guy on the WP leaderboards.

You made a bad suggestion that you failed to justify in any real way, nobody liked it, so now you're going to take your ball and go home?

Ok this thread reminded me of what was implemented in another game (one of the all time best!) Metal Gear Online.

Now the way the penalty system worked was a three fold approach: 1. Emblems 2. a number ranking 3. a letter rating.

The emblems were probably the coolest of the penalty and award system. Say if you had a lot of head shot kills, your emblem would be a Eagle. Conversely if you died by a lot of head shots you would earn a Sloth emblem. There were many emblems in the game, and I suggest that people go look them up and come up with some of our own.

The numbers I think help see where you are to the next Letter level. But you just don't keep increasing, there are penalties for doing bad and advantages of doing good. Say if you die by a player that isnt as good as you, you lose prestige. If you kill someone better than you, you gain prestige.

There are many ways to find out the good players and the bad through stats, but to make it publicly known is either an incentive for people to do better (for those that care) or a badge of honor and also a good recruiting tool.

This way you wont really be punished but there is a social aspect that shows what type of player you are.

First of all, this belongs in Feedback/Requests.
Second, this is a horrible idea, so horrible in fact, that I am angry I can't find the -1 button.

A + 50 points for a kill and - 5 or -10 points for a death does not seem overly dramatic to me. It also keeps the people who have gobs of ISK in line to a degree for just the reason you've stated. Many people in this game are both fearless AND foolish when it comes to "storming the lines" or "playing bait"; what's another dropsuit to them when they have 500 million ISK in the bank? Snipers are easily handled or avoided in my opinion, and I prefer Ambush to Skirmish. In fact, I haven't played a Skirmish game since the second week I was in the Demo back in November.

Having absolutely no penalty for death when it comes to WP is extremely small minded in my viewpoint.

The real money and the real challenge will come in Low Sec, and .later Null Sec with battles like Faction Warfare and Sovereignty. Those are objectives battles and the "ambush only" KDR fixated mentality will cost anyone who has it (and by extension their team and corp mates) dearly.

0.02 ISK
Cross

If this has been said a 1000 times already, my appologies. But here is time number 1001.

If I have 10 kills and 1 death and another player has 11 kills and 11 deaths, no way they should be atop me at the end of the match on the WP "leaderboard". Not that those "leaderboards" mean a darn thing, but still,,,,

First of all, this belongs in Feedback/Requests.
Second, this is a horrible idea, so horrible in fact, that I am angry I can't find the -1 button.

This is the best response I have read in this thread.

I quite enjoyed the "Medal Reward" system in BLUR too. Would be nice if something like this were implemented in Dust since the negative WP prospect would apparently be soooo detrimental to the play styles of so many (bad, lazy, inept) players who have voiced their concerns here.

Let me clean up and correct that post of yours cause I'm nice like that.

What you meant to say was:

"You made a suggestion that I personally do not agree with, and my likewise braindead compatriots also find unpalatable to our SP-ISK grinding suicide runs. I see that you have both explained and justified your opinion on several occasions, but I'm chosing to ignore those points because it would invalidate my argument and make me look like a whiner. The fact that you could possibly enjoy a game that CCP does not have anything to do with and dare to voice such a conceit is unforgivable on this forum."

There. Translation complete.

Some problems that spring to mind;

Which death would you count as losing yourself WP, when you hit the deck, or when you bleed out?
What happens if you're revived? Do you get the WP back? Shouldn't the person who revived you get more WP for it too?
What happens if you're playing Ambush and are unlucky with your spawns, why should you lose WP for bad luck? What happens if you end up with negative WP? Do you owe SP/ISK to the rest of your team?

Ok this thread reminded me of what was implemented in another game (one of the all time best!) Metal Gear Online.

Now the way the penalty system worked was a three fold approach: 1. Emblems 2. a number ranking 3. a letter rating.

The emblems were probably the coolest of the penalty and award system. Say if you had a lot of head shot kills, your emblem would be a Eagle. Conversely if you died by a lot of head shots you would earn a Sloth emblem. There were many emblems in the game, and I suggest that people go look them up and come up with some of our own.

The numbers I think help see where you are to the next Letter level. But you just don't keep increasing, there are penalties for doing bad and advantages of doing good. Say if you die by a player that isnt as good as you, you lose prestige. If you kill someone better than you, you gain prestige.

There are many ways to find out the good players and the bad through stats, but to make it publicly known is either an incentive for people to do better (for those that care) or a badge of honor and also a good recruiting tool.

This way you wont really be punished but there is a social aspect that shows what type of player you are.

you get negative points for killing teammates.

Trust me I know

The other player is actually much more aggressive and possibly better at the game.

He fought in 22 engagements during the match and you fought in 11.

Your fix isn't useful or good as it would discourage aggression and fight seeking.

The risk tuning should be done elsewhere.