DUST Search - In regards to Minnmandos and Swarms

Kaeru Nayiri wrote:

SponkSponkSponk wrote:

Why not just remove swarms from the things that Minnie suits get +2% damage per level for?

They can still get the reload bonus because all commando suits get that for all light weapons.

Job done, let's have a beer.

As Pokey said, the minmatar commando, with the AV boosts completely set aside, are actually underwhelming. It's not that the minmatar commando gets a bonus to AV, it's how the particular form of AV works.

He's comparing it to the plasma cannon. People don't care about the Gallente Commando wiedling a plasma cannon. The reason you can come to is probably because using the plasma cannon is difficult and limited in range.

I will, however, point out that comparing the caldari commando to the gallente commando for using the plasma cannon is silly. The gallente commando tanks with its low slots while the caldari tanks with its high slots. The caldari Commando does NOT want to be in the thick of the fight with a plasma cannon and no shield modules. (please correct me if I'm wrong)

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 9644	Posted - 2015.02.20 23:22:00 - [61] - Quote shoots plasma cannon in thread threw is locked before I can land a second shot Damn, they always go away after the first shot. *As long as 4/5 (80%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2978	Posted - 2015.02.21 18:48:00 - [62] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: third grade reading level. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2978	Posted - 2015.02.21 18:49:00 - [63] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: shoots plasma cannon in thread threw is locked before I can land a second shot Damn, they always go away after the first shot. Only with help. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 1553	Posted - 2015.02.21 19:09:00 - [64] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Soldner VonKuechle wrote: third grade reading level. Aww how'ed did yew noes? In favor of removing vehicles only so Spkr quits everything.
Sequal's Back Dead Man's Game RUST415 294	Posted - 2015.02.22 00:22:00 - [65] - Quote Minmando is made to use use swarm, such as amarr are maint to use laser weapons and caldari to use rail weapons. Stop debating about the obvious efficiency of a suit using its weapon, it's absolutely normal if does better than all others do with the same weapon. It's meant for it. Btw, minmando has good swarms yeah, but they dont have AV nade. Now add to the dps of a swarm the damage of a lai dai nade, and HO! EVERY OTHER SUITS ARE OP! Buff Minmando! Seriously. Rise? That's what they used to call me. Sequal Rise. That was my name. Now I come Back to you, at the turn of the tide.
Thaddeus Reynolds Facepunch Security 209	Posted - 2015.02.27 16:53:00 - [66] - Quote Sequal's Back wrote: Minmando is made to use use swarm, such as amarr are maint to use laser weapons and caldari to use rail weapons. Stop debating about the obvious efficiency of a suit using its weapon, it's absolutely normal if does better than all others do with the same weapon. It's meant for it. Btw, minmando has good swarms yeah, but they dont have AV nade. Now add to the dps of a swarm the damage of a lai dai nade, and HO! EVERY OTHER SUITS ARE OP! Buff Minmando! Seriously. I'd disagree that the Minmando is made to use swarms, so much as it's made to use the Combat Rifle and Mass Driver, it only got the use of swarms (a Caldari Weapon) by way of the Swarm Launcher's Damage typing. But that is neither here nor there now...this thread is more about looking into exactly how much utility the Minmando gets to swarm launchers specifically relative to other potential platforms, and to what degree Commando Suits in general should be getting AV utility. Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper. Vehicle Re-vamp Proposal
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 512	Posted - 2015.02.27 19:04:00 - [67] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Why not just remove swarms from the things that Minnie suits get +2% damage per level for? They can still get the reload bonus because all commando suits get that for all light weapons. Job done, let's have a beer. As Pokey said, the minmatar commando, with the AV boosts completely set aside, are actually underwhelming. It's not that the minmatar commando gets a bonus to AV, it's how the particular form of AV works. He's comparing it to the plasma cannon. People don't care about the Gallente Commando wiedling a plasma cannon. The reason you can come to is probably because using the plasma cannon is difficult and limited in range. I will, however, point out that comparing the caldari commando to the gallente commando for using the plasma cannon is silly. The gallente commando tanks with its low slots while the caldari tanks with its high slots. The caldari Commando does NOT want to be in the thick of the fight with a plasma cannon and no shield modules. (please correct me if I'm wrong)
LudiKure ninda Dead Man's Game RUST415 202	Posted - 2015.02.27 19:13:00 - [68] - Quote even more op then old Duvolle/Cal.Logi ( -í° -£-û -í°) `SCAN ATTEMPT PREVENTED`
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5068	Posted - 2015.02.27 21:38:00 - [69] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: Why not just remove swarms from the things that Minnie suits get +2% damage per level for? They can still get the reload bonus because all commando suits get that for all light weapons. Job done, let's have a beer. As Pokey said, the minmatar commando, with the AV boosts completely set aside, are actually underwhelming. It's not that the minmatar commando gets a bonus to AV, it's how the particular form of AV works. He's comparing it to the plasma cannon. People don't care about the Gallente Commando wiedling a plasma cannon. The reason you can come to is probably because using the plasma cannon is difficult and limited in range. I will, however, point out that comparing the caldari commando to the gallente commando for using the plasma cannon is silly. The gallente commando tanks with its low slots while the caldari tanks with its high slots. The caldari Commando does NOT want to be in the thick of the fight with a plasma cannon and no shield modules. (please correct me if I'm wrong) Well the point I was making is that if you use damage mods on a Calmmando you can actually do more damage with a PLC...even if it is a very small difference. I wouldn't suggest using a Calmmando that way though, the PLC works far better on a Gallente Commando, as it should, namely because its playstyle suits the Gallmando's tanking style quite well. I mean I kinda see it this way. Commando and Asssault fill very similar roles. The Assault's bonuses work well with many anti-infantry weapons within that race, but don't affect the AV weapons much (Fitting bonus being the only real benefit). The Commando's bonus work very well with AV weapons because it pushes their sustained DPS way up, but the reload bonus doesnt really affect anti-infantry weapons all that well, (though the damage bonus obviously does). In general people feel the Assaults are in a decent place, and in general the Commandos are in a decent place (though I would argue they might need some slight tweaks in a couple areas to make them slightly better, but regardless). Both roles are effectively designed as "Attacker" roles, so why not just move under the assumption that Assault is primary Anti-Infantry with a secondary role as Anti-Vehicle, and the Commando is primary Anti-vehicle with a secondary role as Anti-Infantry. Assault's bonuses lend itself to more Anti-Infantry weapons, but it can use AV with reduced fitting cost as well as AV/Flux grenades for Anti-vehicles. Commando's bonuses lends itself more to Anti-Vehicle weapons, but can use anti-infantry weapons with increased damage (but lacks any grenades). I personally feel that in general, this fragmentation of the "Attacker" role actually feels about right. So Assaults, Commandos, and the roles they both fill feel about right....it's just the damn swarms that are problematic, and I think THAT'S what really needs to be addressed. Oh and give us Light Laser and Rail AV weapons so the Caldari and Amarr Commandos don't get boned on the whole "Primary Anti-vehicle" role. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net


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