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Feelings on the new and improved RR?

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Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:37:00 - [1] - Quote People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
xavier zor G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 220	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:43:00 - [2] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? so the hipfire is gone, but it takes twice as long to charge? Highest plasma cannon kill: 132 metres
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 382	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:47:00 - [3] - Quote To be honest i mostly run an Assault CR on a minmatar assault, when i'm...uh...assaulting I do use the RR when i need some range. It seems okay to me but that comes with two caveats 1) I don't use hipfire very often, i almoast always aim down sights 2) I use it for long range engagements when i need more punch Specialists will know much better than I. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.

ChribbaX Otherworld Enterprises Dust Control Otherworld Empire Productions 1340	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:48:00 - [4] - Quote The kick is gone? My RR goes all over the place after a few rounds... DUSTSearch DUSTBoard DUST Server Status

Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:48:00 - [5] - Quote xavier zor wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? so the hipfire is gone, but it takes twice as long to charge? yes. thoughts? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
sir RAVEN WING Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 231	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:48:00 - [6] - Quote I'm okay with the kick, but that charge time...No, I'm not okay with it... Also I can still use my Kaal. RR to kill in CQC easily, but it's harder to use in longer ranges... *For The State!*
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:49:00 - [7] - Quote ChribbaX wrote: The kick is gone? My RR goes all over the place after a few rounds... Not gone entirely...just 'toned down' B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:51:00 - [8] - Quote sir RAVEN WING wrote: I'm okay with the kick, but that charge time...No, I'm not okay with it... Also I can still use my Kaal. RR to kill in CQC easily, but it's harder to use in longer ranges... Wooooooow. That's interesting feedback you got there. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1605	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:52:00 - [9] - Quote xavier zor wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? so the hipfire is gone, but it takes twice as long to charge? Not gone, still quite bad in comparison to every other gun. ARR kick feels nasty for the 'close quarter' variant when compared to weapons like the acr, cr, scr and ar which functionally don't kick. Would like to see cal assault get a 5% kick reduction to rail weapons per level, gives the cal an actually distinct racial weapon bonus and should bring things into line. Honestly wish that HMG's had a .6sec spoolup to balance their 700dps cqc bullet hose. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
xavier zor G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 221	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:54:00 - [10] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? so the hipfire is gone, but it takes twice as long to charge? yes. thoughts? It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... Highest plasma cannon kill: 132 metres

Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:54:00 - [11] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: xavier zor wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? so the hipfire is gone, but it takes twice as long to charge? Not gone, still quite bad in comparison to every other gun. ARR kick still feels nasty. Would like to see cal assault get a 5% kick reduction to rail weapons per level, gives the cal an actually distinct racial weapon bonus and should bring things into line. Honestly wish that HMG's had a .6sec spoolup to balance their 700dps cqc bullet hose. Woooooooooow...this is also VERY interesting. THANK YOU! B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 07:55:00 - [12] - Quote xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1605	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:00:00 - [13] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Woooooooooow...this is also VERY interesting. THANK YOU! Made a small edit to original message. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4987	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:01:00 - [14] - Quote Recoil helps in CQ Zatara. I keep saying it and people keep blowing me off. Recoil walks your shots from crotch to eyeball. It's not a disadvantage in CQC. You want less recoil for range weapons an dispersion to balance CQC. Recoil and high damage help in close. Dispersion and rate of fire help at range. We keep trying to shoehorn the damn guns opposite of this simple fact. WHY? HIGH DAMAGE HIGH RANGE SLOW FIRE IS A SHIP/VEHICLE DOCTRINE. It falls apart with infantry. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Hansei Kaizen The Jackson Five 284	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:01:00 - [15] - Quote Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it The answer to your complaint is PvE. Always. NPE status: (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ Casual solo
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 387	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:01:00 - [16] - Quote I don't use RRs myself -- but as someone who gets killed by RR I will say this: In CQC situations if we both see eachother at the same time I definitely get an alpha damage advantage. I have killed RR users before they even fired a shot before. That being said -- if I miss the first few bullets and the RR user starts shooting about the same time I start hitting -- I die slightly more often than I kill due to the dispersion and DPS catching me when I strafe or dodge. Take that for what you will.
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:04:00 - [17] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Woooooooooow...this is also VERY interesting. THANK YOU! Made a small edit to original message. I'm glad you did. The ARR as a cqc weapon kicks a lot harder hipfire wise than the other variants intended for cqc use, I concur. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:05:00 - [18] - Quote Hansei Kaizen wrote: Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it Interesting...well the change actually reduced the hipfire kick...are you saying you would have preferred that to the doubling of the charge time? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:08:00 - [19] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Recoil helps in CQ Zatara. I keep saying it and people keep blowing me off. Recoil walks your shots from crotch to eyeball. It's not a disadvantage in CQC. You want less recoil for range weapons an dispersion to balance CQC. Recoil and high damage help in close. Dispersion and rate of fire help at range. We keep trying to shoehorn the damn guns opposite of this simple fact. WHY? HIGH DAMAGE HIGH RANGE SLOW FIRE IS A SHIP/VEHICLE DOCTRINE. It falls apart with infantry. SO with your principles in mind how does the new changes stack up with where you see it being? Just about the same? If not are you suggesting that it should hipfire like a mule? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4988	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:14:00 - [20] - Quote Im saying revert the changes. Swap the ranges on the RR and ARR. Swap the ranges on the breach AR and the AR. PROBLEM FIXED. Breach weapons are ideal CQC profile and the assault rifles advantages only really BEGIN to show up right at it's 40m optimal. It gets progressively crappier the closer you get to your target. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.

Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4500	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:19:00 - [21] - Quote Anyone else got feedback?! :D B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zaria Min Deir TeamPlayers Negative-Feedback 841	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:33:00 - [22] - Quote Problem: Long range weapon doing too well at cqc? CCP's solution: Make it worse at long range. With my serious face on: Can't comment on the RR kick at cqc, as I noticed no difference, but I never really used it in cqc, and I don't use the ARR anyway. But. Longer spool up time hurts long range combat more than anything else. And regardless of anything else, the RR is supposed to be the best rifle at range. Take that as you will. Have you considered installing the improved keyboard? "Go Go Power Rangers!"
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4988	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:45:00 - [23] - Quote Unfortunately high damage weapons will always perform better in CQC because of better application of damage and stopping power. Anything you do to make them worse in close to force them to perform at range will also gimp them at range. High alpha should be CQC with high rate of fire being longer range. High RoF low kick weapons with decently tight dispersion can become suppression as well as killing tools. Its one of the reasons I think HMGs should be pulled from CQC. The things we have done to make it work in CQC alternately make it overperform or neuter it with zero middle ground. Rattati has come the closest to proving me wrong but that balance is on a razor's edge and any changes to some random thing can throw it out of whack again. But if the AR/ARR perform better at the outer edges of their performance envelope and the RR and BAR work better in closer natively why are we forcing them opposite of that? Lore in New Eden is great. It's focused on ships. You can't balance an infantryman like a ship. It does not work. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 275	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:55:00 - [24] - Quote The change offers the distinct disadvantage the weapon needed the mechanics of the weapon now feel proper the damage may need altered still (nerf), but I really can not tell until I am proto. This is a lil off topic, but many have said they don't like the reload buff as far as I am concerned it is pretty fitting. I mean there is nothing worse than facing someone closing in with a empty clip or course I am using the bolt p so I cant pop over and spray and prey. The Impossible Dream and Wizard Talk
Sequal Rise Les Desanusseurs 266	Posted - 2014.11.14 08:57:00 - [25] - Quote The charge is too long IMO, 0.45s would havd been much better. You must precharge all the time if you want to reach a target at long range cause if you dont, he'll have the time to hide way before you start shooting. I felt the hipfire kick still big which isn't a problem to me as it's not a CQC weapon. Didn't try the ARR yet. Take out all forms of scans and you'll see how great Dust can be. Scrubs will cry, good players will love it.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 2451	Posted - 2014.11.14 09:15:00 - [26] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Unfortunately high damage weapons will always perform better in CQC because of better application of damage and stopping power. Anything you do to make them worse in close to force them to perform at range will also gimp them at range. High alpha should be CQC with high rate of fire being longer range. High RoF low kick weapons with decently tight dispersion can become suppression as well as killing tools. Its one of the reasons I think HMGs should be pulled from CQC. The things we have done to make it work in CQC alternately make it overperform or neuter it with zero middle ground. Rattati has come the closest to proving me wrong but that balance is on a razor's edge and any changes to some random thing can throw it out of whack again. But if the AR/ARR perform better at the outer edges of their performance envelope and the RR and BAR work better in closer natively why are we forcing them opposite of that? Lore in New Eden is great. It's focused on ships. You can't balance an infantryman like a ship. It does not work. It only works in eve because of the systems in place. It works because everything is a number game. Tracking is a set number and a calculation, NOT a person`s ability to track just as one example. I agree, things that work in EVE dont necessarily work in DUST purely because this is an FPS. I've always disliked that the 4 races have to be pigeon holed into certain roles and certain battle tactics. You would have thought that all races would operate and have tactics for ALL ranges of combat. I mean we are slowly getting there I guess but I feel we have always took the arse-end way to balance and make his game fun. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Jathniel G I A N T 1260	Posted - 2014.11.14 09:41:00 - [27] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? lol.... lets experiment with something real extreme... Burst Rail Rifle Quadrupole the charge time... Triple the rate of fire... Cut the magazine size in half. Set your goals high, and shoot for the moon; even if you miss you'll land amongst the stars.
xavier zor G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 223	Posted - 2014.11.14 09:53:00 - [28] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because i precharge, then turn my head around the corner if he is still there hiding around HIS corner-shoot and hit nothing. OR shoot him if he poked his head out to then either of us hides. Several problems here such as wasted bullets, position giveaway and originally the only IDEAL situation for rail rifle long-range is when i KNOW the target is there in the open so i can pre-charge my RR and THEN he does not get the extra half a second to do damage to me. Highest plasma cannon kill: 132 metres
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4988	Posted - 2014.11.14 09:57:00 - [29] - Quote Precharge really only works when an enemy commits. Bluntly why are wtrying to make any weapon ineffective at any range? Less effective ok I can see but an ineffective weapon is a waste of ISK and SP. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2173	Posted - 2014.11.14 10:04:00 - [30] - Quote My jury is still out. Have to play it some more. Not liking either change (spool or kick), and both RR and ARR kick more than they did originally, I believe, even if it was dialed back from the original 4x increase. I will play some more and provide a more detailed and thoughtful response. I appreciate you asking, Z.

Miokai Zahou WarRavens Capital Punishment. 409	Posted - 2014.11.14 10:05:00 - [31] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Anyone else got feedback?! :D As a Cal assault user i think it's a silly change due to the fact that there is no bonus on the suit that reduces hip fir and charge up time. Noob isn't really a status, it's the online equivalent of a 5-year old calling you a poopy fart head.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4988	Posted - 2014.11.14 10:56:00 - [32] - Quote Miokai Zahou wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Anyone else got feedback?! :D As a Cal assault user i think it's a silly change due to the fact that there is no bonus on the suit that reduces hip fir and charge up time. Herein lies one of the reasons why the weapon is oversaturated. Armor is the favored meta. RR is effective vs armor at long range. Therefore an amarr or gallente assault or logi will gain more utility from the rail line. Reload bonus? If it takes less than two seconds reload speed is irrelevant. Really the only three weapons where reload speed is a major concern is the HMG, PLC and MD. PERHAPS... If caldari suits were bonused for charge time and kick we would see more caldari suits rocking rails. This is a major problem with TTK slowly ticking up. With increasing due to HP creep we should very much consider bonusing assaults for making their weapons function better rather than reload speed or whatnot. An assault suit should be optimized for racial light weapons the way sentinels are optimized to carry heavy weapons. Right now the only assault set up to improve weapon performance is the amarr. The gallente bonus doesn't help much and the gallente weapons are eating ass because of range. Minmatar weapons? They get to fire a crapton more between reloads. You don't have to husband your ammo like Ebenezer scrooge pinches pennies. This is a clear advantage like the amarr heat reduction. Each in its own way equals the same bonus. More shots downrange. What if the RR PERFORMED like it did pre-fix but only in the hands of a caldari assault? That just leaves us with the gallente assault rifles. The gallente rifles have more drawbacks than advantages because the anemic range means that the rifles are rarely able to get into optimal. The breach is the only assault rifle variant tgat really shines right now. Some people swear by the burst but by and large they are a rarity. Why are people gravitating to the BAR? because it is the only rifle in the series that WORKS. Because it performs in a way FPS gamers like and are familiar with. But the gallente assault suits get no bonuses tgat allow them to employ the weapon better. Getting in range is iffy and when you're in range it's an HMG sentinel. It's either time to break the gallente meta or give the assaults the means to properly employ their weapons. Rather than a weapon bonus in the traditional sense they either need range or speed because if you can't reach your target what's the point? EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
CUSE TOWN333 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1869	Posted - 2014.11.14 11:56:00 - [33] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. KEQ diplomat/ intel /GC officer
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 276	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:01:00 - [34] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. Lol this I doubt it, but perception is a funny thing. The Impossible Dream and Wizard Talk
IVIaster LUKE 733	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:05:00 - [35] - Quote I got a nice shady spot on this hill. Caldari assault=shit shields/shit weapons. Sipping tea on a hill, eating crumpets.
CUSE TOWN333 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1869	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:06:00 - [36] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. Lol this I doubt it, but perception is a funny thing. do you know what meta is KEQ diplomat/ intel /GC officer
Zindorak Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 1286	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:08:00 - [37] - Quote Yas we now have a balanced Rail Rifle Pokemon master and Tekken Lord Gk0 Scout yay :)
LudiKure ninda Dead Man's Game RUST415 151	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:27:00 - [38] - Quote Zindorak wrote: Yas we now have a balanced Rail Rifle No,now we hawe a dead Rail Rifle,..at least 4 me..it horrible ( -í° -£-û -í°) `SCAN ATTEMPT PREVENTED`
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:37:00 - [39] - Quote I already posted my feedback, Short version.. different charge time depending on ADS or Hipfire. If I'm pointing down ADS I'd like my old charge time back please. With the RR doing better against armor it will always falsely appear to be better at CQC. Oh, I felt that the reload bonus was broke for a bit on the assault suit. I really use the reload bonus in my gameplay to keep constant fire downfield. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Zindorak Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 1286	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:42:00 - [40] - Quote LudiKure ninda wrote: Zindorak wrote: Yas we now have a balanced Rail Rifle No,now we hawe a dead Rail Rifle,..at least 4 me..it horrible Well atleast it isn't the OP RR that we had in Delta. It doesn't instagank me so imo its balanced Pokemon master and Tekken Lord Gk0 Scout yay :)

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4992	Posted - 2014.11.14 12:53:00 - [41] - Quote How the hell can an RR instagank anything? It's pretty much impossible. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game RUST415 1490	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:02:00 - [42] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Hansei Kaizen wrote: Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it Interesting...well the change actually reduced the hipfire kick...are you saying you would have preferred that to the doubling of the charge time? Yes, having to charge while the red dot is beginning to shoot me is a severe disadvantage... It's not like I'm firing a ScR and have a bonus to charging up .. it's a drawback... and worse than the super kick.. Mercs complaining of the kick needed to use the RR in other situations.. if you hipfire = 90% chance you miss The charge time is already leaving mercs to get shot while they ready up the RR.... And when you are running Caldari Assault - in alpha shield dmg 514 you will, die more often And to note on pre-charging it's one of the worst mechanics in game (wallhack + precharge) I would prefer kick rather than the extended charge time
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game RUST415 1490	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:05:00 - [43] - Quote NextDark Knight wrote: I already posted my feedback, Short version.. different charge time depending on ADS or Hipfire. If I'm pointing down ADS I'd like my old charge time back please. With the RR doing better against armor it will always falsely appear to be better at CQC. Oh, I felt that the reload bonus was broke for a bit on the assault suit. I really use the reload bonus in my gameplay to keep constant fire downfield. If anything... hipfire charge should be whats extended..... taking a target on in ads with increased charge time is not good
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:20:00 - [44] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? We don't know when they are going to pop them heads out of cover.. The old kick made it a small challenge to keep damage applied at long range. Again, Can we get comment on if it's possible to have different charge times in ADS then with Hipfire.. Like maybe the gun has a button that is pressed while in ADS to keep the spool going.. don't really matter how you justify it but would it be possible to have different charge times? Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4791	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:30:00 - [45] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? In 5 - 10m engagements I am at a disadvantage, but not completely useless. At longer distances I aim down sights and mutilate folks with perfect Caldari precision. Charge time increase instead of crazy kick was a good choice. I don't use the ARR personally, but I have had a few of them pointed at me. They seem to do just fine in CQC. Now that the RR seems to be in a better place can we please examine the breach AR? My advice to you, playa...
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui VEHICLEBUSTERS Demolitions and Logistics Corp . 1394	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:32:00 - [46] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Honestly wish that HMG's had a .6sec spoolup to balance their 700dps cqc bullet hose. Please lay off the HMG , the thing overheats quickly now when not managed properly . To me ... that's leading it to balance and it's better in that regard then previous . No more HMG tweaks , it would ruin the gun already . Now people can't stand there and give continuous fire , like it's suppose to be . Now you need to manage that gun and use your sidearm more . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 2550	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:34:00 - [47] - Quote The longer charge time hurts a hell of a lot more than than the kick. The kick could be leveled out with "Short, controlled bursts" but it was still far less effective than other weapons because the kick was still pretty intense before 10 shots and .3 second delay every 2 or 3 seconds makes the Rate of Fire low enough to not be a monster in close quarters fighting while not hurting the ranges at which you would ADS, ~20+ meters. You could either get REALLY close so that your shots would all hit before the kick became uncontrollable (like Nova Knife range), you could hope to get lucky at about 5 meters, or you could burst fire. Seemed alright; still weaker than basically any Rifle other than Laser Rifle at that range but you weren't utterly screwed. The kick now is still really intense and the charge time is absolute murder. .6 seconds is actually quite a long time. Basically, if you get the drop on someone to where you start charging right as they see you, even if their reaction time is terrible they will start to fire rounds off on you. Had numerous encounters with that happening. I pull up my RR to charge to take someone out. They immediately start blasting me with the Combat or Scrambler at about 25 meters and end up winning "even though I was doing what I was supposed to do." I even had one where I was standing on a building, aimed at a guy who was not facing me, and before my charge was off he happened to turn, and managed to start firing at about the same time my charge got off. It almost feels like I am using a Charged Sniper Rifle with the delay. I still prefer "crazy kick when ADS" rather than "glacial charge time." "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 658	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:37:00 - [48] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Its easy RR was little op before (overperformed all rifles on long/medium/cqc) after nerf, all RR population went mental becuase their toy was nerfed and start QQ threads. I tried it and long/medium range is completely fine (helvete i basicaly went better then wit fit what i normaly using-without specsing in RR i wen 17/4 like basic matar logi). RR was meant to be used like precision auto rifle and thats it. Most of RR community used it differently and thats issue. Issue is community what dont want balanced weapon. They want weapon OP and i know if you make it that waz there will be again "rule of RR". Basicaly rifles should be this way: RoF - CR (MATARI) Versatility - AR (GALENTE) Accuracy - ScR (AMARR) Power - RR (CALDARI) And now we have it, there is need for few tweaks but that tweaks are not around RR, what is completely fine. If someone have problem with RR on cqc, he should try some sidearm or another rifle. *"Savvy"*
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 276	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:43:00 - [49] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. Lol this I doubt it, but perception is a funny thing. do you know what meta is Bro I spent 8 years ranking top 800k wol, was second in progression the first few months of d3, alpha/beta tested many of the mmo's that came out the last ten years, helped lead blackgate to number one and joined in on many of their pro tourneys,... but I have no idea could you explain it to me :D ? The Impossible Dream and Wizard Talk
The Master Race Immortal Guides 279	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:43:00 - [50] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. Lol this I doubt it, but perception is a funny thing. do you know what meta is Bro I spent 8 years ranking top 800 wol, was second in progression the first few months of d3, alpha/beta tested many of the mmo's that came out the last ten years, helped lead blackgate to number one and joined in on many of their pro tourneys,... but I have no idea could you explain it to me :D...? The Impossible Dream and Wizard Talk

shaman oga The Dunwich Horror 3168	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:51:00 - [51] - Quote I prefer how it was before, more kick, less charge up. Join channel: FW Kickstarter More people in = more FW matches
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui VEHICLEBUSTERS Demolitions and Logistics Corp . 1394	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:54:00 - [52] - Quote All they have to do if they really care about doing anything to make this right is what Breakin and others have suggested and that's retool the Cal assault to give them bonuses that help with that gun , it's their rifle and their not even effective with it because of said changes and that's just not going to work . This would be a way to help Caldari loyalist and those who are faithful to that weapon . It's only right to give the Cal Assault a kick reduction and decreased charge time bonus , you know ... something that would actually help that role out and place them more in line with the bonuses of other Assault roles because the Caldari was and is the only assault that has a worthless bonus ( you could increase reload from the weapons branch of that particular weapon ) and now it's even more useless with the changes made to that gun . It would be nice to have a weapon that actually functions properly when you invest in that particular role . It should behave like the prenerf RR at level 5 Assault . Easy fix and you won't have to do anything to the current setup for the gun and it would give the Cal Assault a useful bonus and help to make them more competitive . You wanna know what to do .?. do this and you will kill all the QQ and kill the uselessness of the Cal assault while using their own racial weapon . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 2550	Posted - 2014.11.14 13:56:00 - [53] - Quote Nerfing the Rail Rifle so the Caldari Assault bonus can be relevant is robbing Peter to pay Paul though. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 471	Posted - 2014.11.14 14:03:00 - [54] - Quote Full time RR user here with all Cal suits proto. My 2 ISK. ARR The ARR is decent at CQC and definitely the better choice over the the RR. Problem is that the ARR still gets outperformed by the ACR in both CQC and at range. This is because of the kick build up of the ARR and the charge time. The kick build up makes you inaccurate at sustained fire and the charge up time means death if a ACR gets the drop on you. Now something I'll get flamed for but will suggest it anyway. What if there was a skill for the RR that reduces charge up time or sharpshooter to make it more viable CQC and compete with the CQC monsters? I mean those have sharpshooter skill too, it seems fair to those users that the RR gets a extra sp sink for better CQC ability. IMHO every faction should have a ranged light weapon and CQC light weapon RR Plain and simple if the enemy doesn't see you the charge up time doesnt matter. Now with the kick it makes you inaccurate in sustained fire. Also with the charge up if someone runs up to you and bursts his shots you're dead because you cannot burst the RR. The charge up time kills you at medium range. it's only viable in certain situations. I will test it out more and give some better feedback
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 658	Posted - 2014.11.14 14:16:00 - [55] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Full time RR user here with all Cal suits proto. My 2 ISK. ARR The ARR is decent at CQC and definitely the better choice over the the RR. Problem is that the ARR still gets outperformed by the ACR in both CQC and at range. This is because of the kick build up of the ARR and the charge time. The kick build up makes you inaccurate at sustained fire and the charge up time means death if a ACR gets the drop on you. Now something I'll get flamed for but will suggest it anyway. What if there was a skill for the RR that reduces charge up time or sharpshooter to make it more viable CQC and compete with the CQC monsters? I mean those have sharpshooter skill too, it seems fair to those users that the RR gets a extra sp sink for better CQC ability. IMHO every faction should have a ranged light weapon and CQC light weapon RR Plain and simple if the enemy doesn't see you the charge up time doesnt matter. Now with the kick it makes you inaccurate in sustained fire. Also with the charge up if someone runs up to you and bursts his shots you're dead because you cannot burst the RR. The charge up time kills you at medium range. it's only viable in certain situations. I will test it out more and give some better feedback Just take a look on the other side ACR matching this because RoF, nothing else. If you put RoF of ARR up, you will have OP beast and if you make it with lower damage you will basicaly have ACR on steroids (BYE BYE RACIAL VERSATILITY AROUND RIFLES). Sharpshooter similar problem, with its damage and implemented sharpshooter again you have OP weapon from ARR again. Because ARR core is meant to be "slower damage powerhouse". Just take a look on damages. How i told upper: RoF - CR (MATARI - Hybrid killer) Versatility - AR (GALENTE - Hybrid killer) Accuracy - ScR (AMARR - Shield killer) Power - RR (CALDARI - Armor killer) And now we have it, there is need for few tweaks but that tweaks are not around RR, what is completely fine. If someone have problem with RR on cqc, he should try some sidearm or another rifle. X x X x X about RR, yup basicaly same story what cpl. Dwayne Hicks told us once. *"Savvy"*
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 659	Posted - 2014.11.14 14:47:00 - [56] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Oki tried it right now and behaviour of that rifle is really bad. What was that before great in long2medium range and bad on cqc was balance. This was thing what (in my eyes broke weapon). Just bring back kick like mule version, this "doubletime charge"its like.. honestly it makes RR crappy *"Savvy"*
Aramis Madrigal Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 312	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:11:00 - [57] - Quote I use the RR a fair amount and I preferred the additional kick to the increased spool time. If I'm using the RR, it's because I want to be able to take out targets as they move from one covered position to the next, at long range. The increased spool time makes this a bit harder and closes the window of opportunity, particularly if your target is fast. I'd rather have to swap out to my SMG for cqc then have the long range effectiveness of the RR diminished. -Aramis
Aramis Madrigal Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 312	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:23:00 - [58] - Quote Also, the "feel" of the spool up time is just wrong. As creatures forced to live (~100ms) in the proximal past with the swiftest reaction to visual stimuli being ~150ms, .3 seconds places us just about at the bound of what appears "immediate". That is to say it feels like pressing the trigger is coupled with the weapon firing with a very slight delay. Increasing the spool up time adds an unsettling moment where you (rightly) feel as though you could be doing something else. -Aramis P.S. can you tell I just attended a colloquium on the neural correlates of interval timing?
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 660	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:23:00 - [59] - Quote Aramis Madrigal wrote: I use the RR a fair amount and I preferred the additional kick to the increased spool time. If I'm using the RR, it's because I want to be able to take out targets as they move from one covered position to the next, at long range. The increased spool time makes this a bit harder and closes the window of opportunity, particularly if your target is fast. I'd rather have to swap out to my SMG for cqc then have the long range effectiveness of the RR diminished. -Aramis Defo agree here, "kick-like-mule" balance was actually good one. RR stayed in place where it outshines other rifles (like long2medium range precision autorifle) and was balanced by mediocre cqc. But now, after that "doubletime fix" it seems like really broken rifle, behavior is wierd and whole that thingie basicaly dont have that sturdy feel anymore. I tried RR every time when it was augmented or tinked and this fix, oh boyo additional kick was real balance, but this is just broken mechanism. But helvete all that just because RR community what wanted to have RR OP again, good job boyos you broke your own weapon. Its just, hell additional kick on hopfiring should be that last touch, this is just funny like hell. From final balance again to state of broken. Honestly, RR should be good long2medium range rifle and that was with that "hipfire kick" fix. What was implemented now just make RR wierd nothing else, if someone fromm CCP listening just redo it back to "kick like mule" state and everythignie will be fine. *"Savvy"*
Jacques Cayton II Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1068	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:25:00 - [60] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It scks. Try the Militia rr and then see the thing for it really is. A pile of poop We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals

Jacques Cayton II Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1069	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:38:00 - [61] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because when is he going to pop out you cant precharge forever like a forge gun. You can't fire burst with a .6 charge. Zatara i thought better of u now I'm beginning to doubt you. Btw instead of kick or charge why not bad dispersion in hip fire but laser accuracy in ads who'd a thubk that We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4505	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:48:00 - [62] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. the way to balance long range rifles is not charge time but just makeing hipfire accuracy very bad. no need for crazy kick just make it accurate in ADS and wide dispersion in hipfire take that kick out and put the charge time back to what it was. Woooooooow! Thank you for the feedback! B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4505	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:54:00 - [63] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because when is he going to pop out you cant precharge forever like a forge gun. You can't fire burst with a .6 charge. Zatara i thought better of u now I'm beginning to doubt you. Btw instead of kick or charge why not bad dispersion in hip fire but laser accuracy in ads who'd a thubk that Don't mistake me asking for you to explain it as me not understanding it. There's a lot of power in a lot of minds feeling the same feedback I have. It's only been 8 hours or so but we seem to overwhelmingly agree the RR hipfire kick was a much better solution than the charge up time increase. I shared these exact same feelings, and came to the exact same conclusions, but how am I ever to represent you if I do not "show my work" I hope that because of this thread we can have the RR changes reversed and the hipfire kick reintroduced. Nerfing the RR into oblivion by crippling it at it's intended long range job through the increased charge time is IMO a mistake. Those of you that complained about the increased charge up time need to suck it up. If the majority of the community disagrees please make me look quite the fool by responding here. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 660	Posted - 2014.11.14 15:54:00 - [64] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because when is he going to pop out you cant precharge forever like a forge gun. You can't fire burst with a .6 charge. Zatara i thought better of u now I'm beginning to doubt you. Btw instead of kick or charge why not bad dispersion in hip fire but laser accuracy in ads who'd a thubk that Laser accu with its damage - instat kill Kick in cqc is only way. RR was ment like percision autorifle, basicaly its similar story like trying cqc with sniper rifle. BTW i tried RR it with hipfire change aswell and it was great weapon, most of contenders dont have any chance to ambush me (RR took them down on long2medium range), they dont have a chance to fight me in cqc. If you are assault, you still can have smg like sidearm (or magsec like purist). If you loggiin' you can use RR still well or swap for other weapon, if you are like me a prefere something for medium2short range (and like purist there is ARR for you aswell). Like really the kick in cqc is only way how you can balance RR, any other can make weapon boken (like you have it now) or OP (like it was before). *"Savvy"*
Devilish Killzone Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 2	Posted - 2014.11.14 16:06:00 - [65] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? I guess i'll settle for dual bolt pistols on my Cal Assault... *"Jumping feet first into hell is not my job. Making sure it's full when I get there is."*
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 16:48:00 - [66] - Quote Kincaid and green bottles? Hmmmm.... Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Shley Ashes Commando Perkone Caldari State 187	Posted - 2014.11.14 16:52:00 - [67] - Quote Here is as I see it the issue with the "New Rail rifle" The increase into charge time means that you need to maintain fire in some cases when you either miss or there are multiple targets to engage, this here is the issue, the rail rifle hip fire spread is fine, it's been nerfed to hell, it deserved it really, however the Aim down sights spread that starts going mental at about the 25th ish round is where the only issue I feel lies, tone that down and you've got the rail rifle in a good place I feel. TL:DR ADS stronger, keep hipfire as is The assault rail rifle is just over nerfed to hell that weapon with only iron sights is meant to be hip fired the 18th ish hip fire round and again the reticule is all over the place, that is to much of a nerf, and ADS is around the 34ish shot, tone down the hip fire spread ADS is ok but could maybe use a very very very minor tone down. TL:DR Over nerfed hipfire, ADS could use a tiny buff I personally never remember seeing QQ about the assault rail rifle so I am slightly puzzled as to why the nerf bat hit it so hard, I can ever remember yesterday someone in squad said "wow that guys using an assault rail rifle, gotta give him props its useless now" so if that's the general perception of the players ( I don't know that it is that's just one example ) then the ARR is not in a good place. apart from that, the balance is good if those dispersion numbers were reworked I think the Rail Rifles would be in a place where people might choose them over the Breach Assault Rifle hope that's helpful For 21 day EveOnline trial https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=0f1324bf-679c-420a-b7ed-c181423c1369&action=buddy
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 16:56:00 - [68] - Quote ZataraRought can I get some constructive comments on the suggestion about ads and hipfire having different charge times so I can quit posting about it. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4508	Posted - 2014.11.14 17:03:00 - [69] - Quote NextDark Knight wrote: ZataraRought can I get some constructive comments on the suggestion about ads and hipfire having different charge times so I can quit posting about it. I'll ask, but that's very...counterintuitive. Think about it why would they have different charge up times? Just nerf the damn hipfire so it's bad in CQC (or requires a great deal of skill or perhaps a bonus being given to the cal assault) and call it good. But for ***** and giggles, i'll ask. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
John ShepardIII Capital Acquisitions LLC 1055	Posted - 2014.11.14 17:44:00 - [70] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though The True Shepard Lvl 1 Forum Warrior

jace silencerww Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 87	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:05:00 - [71] - Quote WELL THIS STINKS. lol time to suck it up and buy a respec as much as I hate to respec. now my caldari commando is useless. sniper riles got buffed so the cald commando lost some of it use now my rail rifle takes 0.6 seconds to charge up and hipfire after 10 shots is a joke. so BYE BYE my poor caldari commando. You did me proud.
137H4RGIC Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 332	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:06:00 - [72] - Quote How do you make a long range weapon suck at close quarters? Decrease its hoodie accuracy substantially so that if one wishes to consistently hit their targets, one must aim down sights. I want to help DUST become a better experience for everyone. Let's work together! 137H4RGIC - Running for CPM2 (SOONGäó)
John ShepardIII Capital Acquisitions LLC 1055	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:15:00 - [73] - Quote 137H4RGIC wrote: How do you make a long range weapon suck at close quarters? Decrease its hoodie accuracy substantially so that if one wishes to consistently hit their targets, one must aim down sights. Yeah that'll work too The True Shepard Lvl 1 Forum Warrior
137H4RGIC Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 333	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:17:00 - [74] - Quote Oops auto correct typo, fixing I want to help DUST become a better experience for everyone. Let's work together! 137H4RGIC - Running for CPM2 (SOONGäó)
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4511	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:24:00 - [75] - Quote John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though Wait what...you think in addition to the charge time we need to add MORE hipfire kick in? Afaik it's a troll right? Someone tell me it's a troll!? B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
John ShepardIII Capital Acquisitions LLC 1060	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:38:00 - [76] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though Wait what...you think in addition to the charge time we need to add MORE hipfire kick in? Afaik it's a troll right? Someone tell me it's a troll!? I used it the other day easiest 30 something kills I got in a while. The no kick is ridiculous it should have a little bit, and actually the charge up time isn't too bad I think the charge time is good where it's at. Not trolling btw The True Shepard Lvl 1 Forum Warrior
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 18:40:00 - [77] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: I'll ask, but that's very...counterintuitive. How?? The high kick breaks the fun of the weapon. It's Jaring to the user especially on Front line suits. Zatara Rought wrote: Think about it why would they have different charge up times? You could say the gun goes into a standby mode when not looking down the sight. Save energy.. I don't know anything is better then that crazy kick. Zatara Rought wrote: Just nerf the damn hipfire so it's bad in CQC (or requires a great deal of skill or perhaps a bonus being given to the cal assault) and call it good. >> as some one that has used it and maxed it out early as my main. When fighting of equal skill I find the RR to loss out. Zatara Rought wrote: But for ***** and giggles, i'll ask. I don't really mind it being nerfed so bad as I just stopped using it until all the balance fixes get worked out. I rather everyone just stop using it then I go back to using later. With such a armor heavy meta and the nice sight on the gun it's easy to gravitate to the RR until we start seeing more shield users. Yet thank you for asking. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4517	Posted - 2014.11.14 19:12:00 - [78] - Quote John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though Wait what...you think in addition to the charge time we need to add MORE hipfire kick in? Afaik it's a troll right? Someone tell me it's a troll!? I used it the other day easiest 30 something kills I got in a while. The no kick is ridiculous it should have a little bit, and actually the charge up time isn't too bad I think the charge time is good where it's at. Not trolling btw Lol, it just got changed Yesterday. The charge was changed from .3 to .6 seconds before you can fire a shot. Perhaps you should retry and tell me the results. And if you thought the kick the other day (hipfire) was just fine...I think you were stoned or something. The hipfire kick after about 15-20 shots sent you twitching horribly towards the sky. Lmao. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
GLOBAL fils'de RAGE Consolidated Dust 42	Posted - 2014.11.14 20:09:00 - [79] - Quote I went all in with the RR when it was introduced. I ran it with my CAL assaults and logis. I pulled the plug and now run the CR in my CALDARI assault.
Jakkal Shoobah Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 9	Posted - 2014.11.14 20:29:00 - [80] - Quote Jakkal here. Uh I used to run the rail rifle on my galmando way before the nerf because id always get rail rifled by EVERY POSSIBLE SUIT. I tried using the rail rifle now. Its left me with a bitter taste. Just gonna try and say my experience with the RR. When rail rifles had unreasonably tiny hipfire kick and the best range they were OP in my opinion because they were king at range and cqc. I resorted to using them because id get bested at cqc with my ar by rail rifles. They were too good at everything, but I think CCP nerfed it a little too far. Recently, before the extra charge, the RR was more acceptable in cqc. No longer was i mowed down with unreasonable accuracy and kick at 6 mtrs. i would have preferred an increase to hipfire dispersion per shot and not hipfire kick per shot. Because logic you know? Long range gun with dispersion being controlled by ads instead of long range gun with tons of kick being controlled by ads. Now though, I feel sorry for RR. Although RR still maintain potency at long range they have lost some touches that were unique and minor disadvantages. The doubled charge time is not ok with me.Yes i can now effectively run from cover to cover without fear of being instaganked by rail rifles, but its not balanced. Every gun in this game has a certain ergonomic sense to it that is kept in check by a minor disadvantage. ScR is heat. CR is clip. AR is range. RR is charge up time. The RR's disadvantage is no longer minor. I feel the RR's charge up time could effectively be set back to .3 seconds and the hipfire kick could be set back as well as long as the hipfire dispersion is increased. The RR has lost its ability to quickly put rounds down range in the general vicinity of anyone who dare peeks out in 70 mtrs. It has lost its ability to be extremely effective long range combat. I have decided to put the RR down until it is in line with its description of being "designed for field operations where penetrative power and precision are paramount." Pre-nerf it was able to perform way too good in cr and ar range, but now it has trouble operating in its own range. Only exception to this being rooftop campers who have all the time in the world to line up a shot. Yeah kacique77 you know what i'm talking about. Damn campers with the broken links that cant be punched nor shot. Rant aside. Please fix the RR so Mr. Reacher can stop complaining about it. Jakkal "Jammal" Shoobah, The friendly/pissy Gallente Commando/Assault Assault Rifles til I get stomped to the ground

kayn TARON Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 63	Posted - 2014.11.14 20:37:00 - [81] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Logged in just for you :0 As one of the rare few to bare the good and bad of the RR since it came out including the ARR, and as a Caldari Commando figured I should put my 2 cents in. I think we can all agree prior to it being changed it was overly OP in all situations. Ambush had become, and to an extent still is nothing but Rail Rifles. That being said the kick change was horrid even at ranged, although the spool up being .6 is nothing more than an annoyance than anything all you have to do is pre charge it. The issue there is though those that don't are automatically put at a disadvantage (yet more gap between new and vet players). It has so little kick it's hardly noticeable. I actually hooked my wireless mouse up as I can keep it straight much easier than with DS3 controller. After unloading at ranged 4 clips into someone As a test there was virtually ZERO kick. A gun with this much range needs more kick. That being said the best solution in the end is to take a bit from both changes, change spool to .45 (in between .3 and .6) and also have the kick it had before but toned down (only a hair otherwise it will dominate CQC again). This will allow the kick at long range to exist but not be useless, as after 3 or 4 shots at ranged you're stopping to reapply to control kick and again waiting on spool up. So yeah in the end I would suggest a combination of both increased spool up and kick to hender it at CQC but not make it useless. Hope this helps Princess :) On that note give us a better sight for the ARR and reduce the kick dispersion a hair please... :) Dust is marketed as an FPS/MMO. Can you name me one MMO that does not have a functional online friends list or PVE? lol
John ShepardIII Capital Acquisitions LLC 1060	Posted - 2014.11.14 20:41:00 - [82] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though Wait what...you think in addition to the charge time we need to add MORE hipfire kick in? Afaik it's a troll right? Someone tell me it's a troll!? I used it the other day easiest 30 something kills I got in a while. The no kick is ridiculous it should have a little bit, and actually the charge up time isn't too bad I think the charge time is good where it's at. Not trolling btw Lol, it just got changed Yesterday. The charge was changed from .3 to .6 seconds before you can fire a shot. Perhaps you should retry and tell me the results. And if you thought the kick the other day (hipfire) was just fine...I think you were stoned or something. The hipfire kick after about 15-20 shots sent you twitching horribly towards the sky. Lmao. I might have been a little stoned :) damn now I have to log on to dust again because I need to see the changes that were "yesterday" The True Shepard Lvl 1 Forum Warrior
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 606	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:03:00 - [83] - Quote after further testing with the longer time I just rather not use the gun at all Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 3142	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:13:00 - [84] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. the way to balance long range rifles is not charge time but just makeing hipfire accuracy very bad. no need for crazy kick just make it accurate in ADS and wide dispersion in hipfire take that kick out and put the charge time back to what it was. Gee guys, its almost like this simple solution makes perfect sense instead of tweaking this that and the other thing
CUSE TOWN333 KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1875	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:14:00 - [85] - Quote NextDark Knight wrote: after further testing with the longer time I just rather not use the gun at all yeah most these people are on drugs and have no clue what dafuq they are talking about. there is just much better options to put on my caldari assault like the combat rifle or BAR its just sad. KEQ diplomat/ intel /GC officer
Benjamin Ciscko Fatal Absolution 3473	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:19:00 - [86] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Recoil helps in CQ Zatara. I keep saying it and people keep blowing me off. Recoil walks your shots from crotch to eyeball. It's not a disadvantage in CQC. You want less recoil for range weapons an dispersion to balance CQC. Recoil and high damage help in close. Dispersion and rate of fire help at range. We keep trying to shoehorn the damn guns opposite of this simple fact. WHY? HIGH DAMAGE HIGH RANGE SLOW FIRE IS A SHIP/VEHICLE DOCTRINE. It falls apart with infantry. So does gun game and disperse weapons are far harder to control hurting players who choose skill. Fatal Absolution Director
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1612	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:31:00 - [87] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because when is he going to pop out you cant precharge forever like a forge gun. You can't fire burst with a .6 charge. Zatara i thought better of u now I'm beginning to doubt you. Btw instead of kick or charge why not bad dispersion in hip fire but laser accuracy in ads who'd a thubk that Don't mistake me asking for you to explain it as me not understanding it. There's a lot of power in a lot of minds feeling the same feedback I have. It's only been 8 hours or so but we seem to overwhelmingly agree the RR hipfire kick was a much better solution than the charge up time increase. I shared these exact same feelings, and came to the exact same conclusions, but how am I ever to represent you if I do not "show my work" I hope that because of this thread we can have the RR changes reversed and the hipfire kick reintroduced. Nerfing the RR into oblivion by crippling it at it's intended long range job through the increased charge time is IMO a mistake. Those of you that complained about the increased charge up time need to suck it up. If the majority of the community disagrees please make me look quite the fool by responding here. A large part of the problem is that opinions are being gathered from people who honestly want to see the weapon ruined and or useless, rather than from people actually use the weapon on a consistant basis. Due to the range of the RR in any map or game mode where you can get up high and not be surprised with a short range fight (where it was already at a 100+ dps disadvantage) or where you can safely stand back and just plink at each other because there's no objective beyond 'kill people' the rail rifle will ALWAYS be an incredibly popular choice due to its range. Being too good at range was a problem unique to the rail rifle, its cqc ability wasn't a 'problem' so breaking the fact that it could be used in cqc, simply to slap the hands of people who stood really far back with it didn't actually change much. It simply made the RR an incredibly frustrating and practically non-viable weapon. I would have been one of the first people who supported nerfing the RR's range, but CCP seemingly doesn't want to go the obvious route of tweaking the range of a weapon that's overperforming at range due to a combination of factors (largely map design). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
jace silencerww Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 87	Posted - 2014.11.14 21:32:00 - [88] - Quote the assault rail rifle is fine but the other is freaking stupid. I see a scout running at 50-60 meters who is going across the street and by the time the RR ready to fire (charged up) the scout is across the street and gone. I can not even defend myself with it under 20 meters while defending a point. so yup as I said earlier BYE BYE to my caldari commando now I say BYE BYE RR you were a great long range weapon and you serviced proudly.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2177	Posted - 2014.11.14 22:00:00 - [89] - Quote GLOBAL fils'de RAGE wrote: I went all in with the RR when it was introduced. I ran it with my CAL assaults and logis. I pulled the plug and now run the CR in my CALDARI assault. Which do you find better and why?
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 390	Posted - 2014.11.15 00:37:00 - [90] - Quote I ran a few doms last night and I got put up against the same guy who was using ARR several times in a row. We ended up dueling about a dozen times. So I'd like to edit my last bit of feedback. He was in a Minmatar assault and I was in my Caldari Heavy so please take the EHP/HMG factor in consideration. The charge time definitely gave me a huge advantage at first. Several times he would rush the letter and I'd be waiting, and for the first few lives he died without getting off a shot. After that he switched up and started precharging when assaulting. Keeping his gun at half or so charge when turning corners. In those instances I won about 70% of the time. After that (when we were on a map with open area) his team had the point and I was pushing it. He was using the RR at this point and killed me every time he caught me at a distance (as expected) except once when I got 3 lucky bolt pistol headshots off. When I got close (he started precharging when he saw me get close enough) I no longer killed him before he got a shot off. But in those cases with the standard RR I won 100% of the time. So while the charge time appears to be a problem for opponents who are caught with their gun completely uncharged -- it seems work-aroundable with precharging when turning corners or popping out of cover. Don't know if that is fair or not skill ceiling wise though. /shrug

John ShepardIII Capital Acquisitions LLC 1070	Posted - 2014.11.15 01:35:00 - [91] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: John ShepardIII wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It's nice right now definitely the easiest rifle to use. It should probably get a little more kick though Wait what...you think in addition to the charge time we need to add MORE hipfire kick in? Afaik it's a troll right? Someone tell me it's a troll!? I used it the other day easiest 30 something kills I got in a while. The no kick is ridiculous it should have a little bit, and actually the charge up time isn't too bad I think the charge time is good where it's at. Not trolling btw Lol, it just got changed Yesterday. The charge was changed from .3 to .6 seconds before you can fire a shot. Perhaps you should retry and tell me the results. And if you thought the kick the other day (hipfire) was just fine...I think you were stoned or something. The hipfire kick after about 15-20 shots sent you twitching horribly towards the sky. Lmao. ok I tried it again and I think it could use a lil kick still just so it'll take a lil more skill to use. I don't know why I thought it was different when i used it before The True Shepard Lvl 1 Forum Warrior
Midas Fool Prophets of the Velocirapture 526	Posted - 2014.11.15 01:55:00 - [92] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Hansei Kaizen wrote: Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it Interesting...well the change actually reduced the hipfire kick...are you saying you would have preferred that to the doubling of the charge time? I like this. I like the RR right now. CQC is more challenging, but that is supposed to be the balancing factor anyway. Before this patch the RR had no problems competing at point blank, just on sheer damage. Increasing the charge up time would hurt it at range because it shortens the damage-dealing window. IMO, that would hurt the rifle in an area where it should excel. Call me crazy but this wasn't really a nerf, the RR feels actually balanced now. Almost everything feels actually balanced now. [Ironically generic forum signature here]
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2250	Posted - 2014.11.15 01:57:00 - [93] - Quote The kick is horrible. I hope they tone it down. Second you cant have two terrible ways of fire. I can take bad hip fire but not jerky, hard to stay on target, missing target shots. IMO the best way to fix it is the longer you shoot it the better it performs and reduce charge by a second. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4527	Posted - 2014.11.15 02:16:00 - [94] - Quote Midas Fool wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Hansei Kaizen wrote: Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it Interesting...well the change actually reduced the hipfire kick...are you saying you would have preferred that to the doubling of the charge time? I like this. I like the RR right now. CQC is more challenging, but that is supposed to be the balancing factor anyway. Before this patch the RR had no problems competing at point blank, just on sheer damage. Increasing the charge up time would hurt it at range because it shortens the damage-dealing window. IMO, that would hurt the rifle in an area where it should excel. Call me crazy but this wasn't really a nerf, the RR feels actually balanced now. Almost everything feels actually balanced now. My thoughts EXACTLY. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Ryme Intrinseca Dead Man's Game RUST415 1993	Posted - 2014.11.15 02:19:00 - [95] - Quote From a quick play it seemed maybe too good at range since there is now very low kick, and too weak in cqc due to high kick and delay (which is less of a factor at range).
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2741	Posted - 2014.11.15 02:52:00 - [96] - Quote edit never mind... "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1190	Posted - 2014.11.15 03:38:00 - [97] - Quote how about just leave it alone because it was fine months ago? unfortunately i cant try it out now and see how bad its been messed up. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Lloyd Orfay SHAKING BABIES FACTION WARFARE ALLIANCE 207	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:26:00 - [98] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Their complaints were for naught. Though, a lot of the rifles need to be unuseable in CQC. Shorter ranged guns having the least amount of inefficiency in shorter ranges, and longer ranged ones having the most inefficiency in shorter ranges(by doing so I suggest major recoil and dispersion, or simply hardcoding them to do less damage at certain ranges) Reason for this is because rifles are not CQC class weaponry(yet players are not predisposed to easily kill other players with higher damage weaponry of their liking), and the guns need handicaps to keep them from this abuse. Also since some guns have high alpha damage(Does it seem fair for your face to be blasted off with a whopping 69 points of damage that, where that 69 points of damage had no disadvantage from being used to easily defeat you?) There is literally no sense for team killing to be possible in any gamemode.
GLOBAL fils'de RAGE Consolidated Dust 43	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:27:00 - [99] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: GLOBAL fils'de RAGE wrote: I went all in with the RR when it was introduced. I ran it with my CAL assaults and logis. I pulled the plug and now run the CR in my CALDARI assault. Which do you find better and why? The burst from the CR from hip is tight and very quick to place on target. The scope is much quicker and lighter than the RR. The CR on a botttled dragonfly scout is so much fun I bought the militia CR BPO.
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:29:00 - [100] - Quote Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there

VikingKong iBUN T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 198	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:29:00 - [101] - Quote I had a go on my friend's fully proto'd cal assault and was like "wtf this sucks".
Xatha De'Agelle Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 22	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:44:00 - [102] - Quote xavier zor wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: xavier zor wrote: It is a worse solution I always switch to my SMG in close quarters when using the rail rifle, but when i see somebody and they see me within a decent range (outside SMG range) he gets 6 extra bullets (around 200hp) off me before i can shoot him? When i stop to recover, i pop my head around the crate to see him, he gets another 200hp off me before i start doing damage... I hate to say this again but...Woooooooww!!! Now let me ask a follow up...why not just precharge at those long ranges the same way it feels intuitive to do so for cqc? Because i precharge, then turn my head around the corner if he is still there hiding around HIS corner-shoot and hit nothing. OR shoot him if he poked his head out to then either of us hides. Several problems here such as wasted bullets, position giveaway and originally the only IDEAL situation for rail rifle long-range is when i KNOW the target is there in the open so i can pre-charge my RR and THEN he does not get the extra half a second to do damage to me. Your argument would be sound if Laser Rifles didn't basically operate under similar mechanics. Ensure you have the drop on the target by taking advantage of range to have moved in under cover. Pre-charge, rip them for immediate damage. Laser rifle is the same, but starts without ripping them for damage. Both now are modifications on an identical premise. Slow start, strong finish.
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:51:00 - [103] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Midas Fool wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Hansei Kaizen wrote: Using the RR from the hip is like grabbing a donkey by its legs and then setting its tail on fire. I love it Interesting...well the change actually reduced the hipfire kick...are you saying you would have preferred that to the doubling of the charge time? I like this. I like the RR right now. CQC is more challenging, but that is supposed to be the balancing factor anyway. Before this patch the RR had no problems competing at point blank, just on sheer damage. Increasing the charge up time would hurt it at range because it shortens the damage-dealing window. IMO, that would hurt the rifle in an area where it should excel. Call me crazy but this wasn't really a nerf, the RR feels actually balanced now. Almost everything feels actually balanced now. My thoughts EXACTLY. Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.15 04:54:00 - [104] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 4577	Posted - 2014.11.15 05:28:00 - [105] - Quote Kick feels the same, the weapon only got even worse thanks to the longer spool.
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 608	Posted - 2014.11.15 15:27:00 - [106] - Quote Clone the RR, put the damage profile to Blaster, Set the range to the TAR and remove the spool. Then name is Assault Repeater. See what happens.. BTW, don't use the AR scope use the RR scope but on a AR frame. The RR is popular not cause it's bad or good in CQC.. it's good because it has a nice scope and is fun to use. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 464	Posted - 2014.11.15 15:32:00 - [107] - Quote I can not agree. The rail kills where it's suppose to now. At range! Situational awareness is key now! Fotm kills your abilities. You actually have to work with the rail now. It's still great weapon, but it isn't good up close. "Anybody order chaos?"
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7847	Posted - 2014.11.15 15:35:00 - [108] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: CUSE TOWN333 wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? Rail rifle has been useless since 4 nerfs ago. all other rifles out do it putting the RR at the bottom of the meta. the way to balance long range rifles is not charge time but just makeing hipfire accuracy very bad. no need for crazy kick just make it accurate in ADS and wide dispersion in hipfire take that kick out and put the charge time back to what it was. Gee guys, its almost like this simple solution makes perfect sense instead of tweaking this that and the other thing Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we HAVE this solution earlier? And then everyone whined about the hipfire, said it was trash, and then CCP changed it to this? AND NOW everyone is saying "That's not what we wanted?" I'm really confused after reading all of this. It seems like you guys are running in circles in hopes that they just change it back to what it used to be out of frustration. Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 5928	Posted - 2014.11.15 15:57:00 - [109] - Quote This is the equivalent of running on your hands because your feet get tired. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 2458	Posted - 2014.11.15 16:53:00 - [110] - Quote I'm not a fan of the RR and never really have been but that being said the recent nerfs are very heavy handed. The charge time is too much and the hipfire kick is also too much. I don't have to like a weapon to see when it is out of balance. The scrambler.... I see that weapon is back to its old powerful ways.... "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!

DDx77 The Exemplars Top Men. 24	Posted - 2014.11.15 17:04:00 - [111] - Quote I think the rr is heading in the right direction but I still think the kick and spool up time is a bit too much. Either increase spool or kick, not both. (I personally favor increased spool time, the kick drives me crazy) And as others have suggested, what about keeping the rifle as it stands but add a bonus to Cal Assault? Something like 5% reduction of rail/hybrid weapon kick and charge time per level? I hate running a CR on my Cal. Maybe I should use a scrambler instead? - But then I should use Amar because that suit benefits that weapon.
2Berries Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 401	Posted - 2014.11.15 21:08:00 - [112] - Quote I'm fine with the spool times & hip fire. The issue i see is the kick while ads being too high. Dps with dispersion taken into account equates to a waste of the range bonus the RR has over the AR or CR. Once your target is aware of the direction you are firing from and has general knowledge that you cannot maintain accuracy & sustained fire, closing the distance and forcing you into hipfire is no issue. Bring back some accuracy at distance by reducing the the kick while ads, either through general buff or sharpshooter skillbook. I used the RR almost exclusively through 1.7 & 1.8 & i have been going back to SCR on my C-1. Accuracy, range & still useful in cqc. Have you considered a career in costumed aggression?
Maitue Mae Involuntary Manslaughter 108	Posted - 2014.11.15 22:26:00 - [113] - Quote It would be nice to have a Lower spool and kick bonus for the CalAs. Also, a Sharpshooter book for the RR would be nice. Ishukone gave me my papers to transfer into the State Hail To The Caldari State
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4534	Posted - 2014.11.16 00:03:00 - [114] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: I can not agree. The rail kills where it's suppose to now. At range! Situational awareness is key now! Fotm kills your abilities. You actually have to work with the rail now. It's still great weapon, but it isn't good up close. I think you're missing the point...they actually undid the CQC nerf to hipfire and instead made hipfire kick easier but doubled the charge time...which hurts long range effectiveness due to the nature of needing to realign targets at range...especially with the kick you still have to deal with ADS. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Seigfried Warheit Caught Me With My Pants Down 379	Posted - 2014.11.16 02:01:00 - [115] - Quote What irks me with the current normal RR variant is the charge up is a tad too long and it hindering its long range efficiency , reduce it a smudge and see how that plays out. Also the kick ADS is problematic..but I think that is more cause of the long charge up time that is making it a glaring issue.... stopping when the kick gets bad to "restart" the assault gives them more than enough time to just run into cover. You basically already knew my issues with it Zatara The ARR..I am not even sure what it needs anymore.....Ill leave that to other people til I can express in words instead of grunts and sighs to express how to make it better. I am a prof. V scrub. I have no honor The best strategy is not to wear pants My Skills = a fresh blueberry
LOADED'HORN KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 122	Posted - 2014.11.16 02:19:00 - [116] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: People complained about the hipfire kick so the charge time was doubled Feedback? It is broke. The spool time is horrible, I just let the breach AR guys kill me so I can use anything else. Only still have the ARR on a Cal commando. Otherwise I don't use the RR anymore. Proficiency 4 wasted. Thanks Ccp, please break the game the other direction, again. Open beta vet. (@L@) I see all you cloak scrubs. Game breaking B!T(#E$
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.16 02:54:00 - [117] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I can not agree. The rail kills where it's suppose to now. At range! Situational awareness is key now! Fotm kills your abilities. You actually have to work with the rail now. It's still great weapon, but it isn't good up close. I think you're missing the point...they actually undid the CQC nerf to hipfire and instead made hipfire kick easier but doubled the charge time...which hurts long range effectiveness due to the nature of needing to realign targets at range...especially with the kick you still have to deal with ADS. no the kick was never removed its still there and the charge is kinda fing it up to but like my forum post says and my teroy above make it normal .3 charge no kik like it was before and shorten the clip size or give it a sharpness skill book or do both i think people would love that
Crop420 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 0	Posted - 2014.11.16 13:36:00 - [118] - Quote R.I.P RR lets nerf shotgun,hmg,breach ar next week
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4537	Posted - 2014.11.16 21:49:00 - [119] - Quote Jack the Rlpper wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I can not agree. The rail kills where it's suppose to now. At range! Situational awareness is key now! Fotm kills your abilities. You actually have to work with the rail now. It's still great weapon, but it isn't good up close. I think you're missing the point...they actually undid the CQC nerf to hipfire and instead made hipfire kick easier but doubled the charge time...which hurts long range effectiveness due to the nature of needing to realign targets at range...especially with the kick you still have to deal with ADS. no the kick was never removed its still there and the charge is kinda fing it up to but like my forum post says and my teroy above make it normal .3 charge no kik like it was before and shorten the clip size or give it a sharpness skill book or do both i think people would love that You misinterpreted "undid the CQC hipfire kick" for "removed all kick" But yeah...the whole point is asking feedback over the new changes (Which Rattati detailed were reducing the kick he previously implemented and instead gave it 2x the charge up time) B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:02:00 - [120] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jack the Rlpper wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: I can not agree. The rail kills where it's suppose to now. At range! Situational awareness is key now! Fotm kills your abilities. You actually have to work with the rail now. It's still great weapon, but it isn't good up close. I think you're missing the point...they actually undid the CQC nerf to hipfire and instead made hipfire kick easier but doubled the charge time...which hurts long range effectiveness due to the nature of needing to realign targets at range...especially with the kick you still have to deal with ADS. no the kick was never removed its still there and the charge is kinda fing it up to but like my forum post says and my teroy above make it normal .3 charge no kik like it was before and shorten the clip size or give it a sharpness skill book or do both i think people would love that You misinterpreted "undid the CQC hipfire kick" for "removed all kick" But yeah...the whole point is asking feedback over the new changes (Which Rattati detailed were reducing the kick he previously implemented and instead gave it 2x the charge up time) Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there

Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4537	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:04:00 - [121] - Quote Jack the Rlpper wrote: Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there Here's my theory. If you break that up so my eyes don't start bleeding when I see the Wall of Text you got there...I might just be able to read, interpret, and respond to that there post. BRB that damn thing is gonna require some eye bleach. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:11:00 - [122] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jack the Rlpper wrote: Ok heres my theroy and the theroy alot of friends have agreed with ive always loved cal and rr but never choose to spec it why i dont know i myself have already payed 100 american dollars just in respecs this last week trying new things out and i think i still love cal and rr the most so my proposal to all whom it concerns(if any) take the kick away and the charge up time like it was before ok make the clip size smaller and maybe add a sharpshooter skill for the hell of it my theroy the cal assault bonus is relod why not make a smaller clip so that the reload speed bonus is more relevant and means something you know like 36 round clips instead this way if people wanna use it they will go to the cal assault and use it like that instead of what they used to do people will actually need the cal suit for the rr to be decent but dont go make it kick like a mule and charge like a snail thats just to much over nerf there Here's my theory. If you break that up so my eyes don't start bleeding when I see the Wall of Text you got there...I might just be able to read, interpret, and respond to that there post. BRB that damn thing is gonna require some eye bleach. Sorry Basically put it back to normal charge and normal kick but add a sharpshooter skill book or reduce the clip size so the cal assault bonus will be more needed and it will require more sp like ar and cr
Michael Arck 6045	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:34:00 - [123] - Quote The RR is ****. Spool time is life threatening in critical situations. It fires all over the damn place... The weapon is now useless. Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah** *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4538	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:37:00 - [124] - Quote Jack the Rlpper wrote: Sorry Basically put it back to normal charge and normal kick but add a sharpshooter skill book or reduce the clip size so the cal assault bonus will be more needed and it will require more sp like ar and cr I like the idea of sharpshooter. I don't even mind the clip size being reduced...wow this actually might be a viable alternative. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 479	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:40:00 - [125] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jack the Rlpper wrote: Sorry Basically put it back to normal charge and normal kick but add a sharpshooter skill book or reduce the clip size so the cal assault bonus will be more needed and it will require more sp like ar and cr I like the idea of sharpshooter. I don't even mind the clip size being reduced...wow this actually might be a viable alternative. This is exactly what I posted too. It's only fair to the combat and assault rifle in regards to eficiency vs sp sink. EDIT This was my previous post: Now something I'll get flamed for but will suggest it anyway. What if there was a skill for the RR that reduces charge up time or sharpshooter to make it more viable CQC and compete with the CQC monsters? I mean those have sharpshooter skill too, it seems fair to those users that the RR gets a extra sp sink for better CQC ability. IMHO every faction should have a ranged light weapon and CQC light weapon
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 14	Posted - 2014.11.16 22:42:00 - [126] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jack the Rlpper wrote: Sorry Basically put it back to normal charge and normal kick but add a sharpshooter skill book or reduce the clip size so the cal assault bonus will be more needed and it will require more sp like ar and cr I like the idea of sharpshooter. I don't even mind the clip size being reduced...wow this actually might be a viable alternative. see i knew you would it wont kick like a mule charge like a snail and requires more sp like ar and cr with less clip to make bonus more useful and everyone walks away happy and if im able to get my 6th repec or ccp is able to refund my aur for the last cause i made a mistake ill be able to go full cal assault and rr finally


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