DUST Search - The Incubus is Broken - Here's why (Video inside)

All Channels

General Discussions

The Incubus is Broken - Here's why (Video inside)

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 918	Posted - 2014.10.19 23:55:00 - [1] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: 3) Incubus is less efficient than the Python, in effective kills per spawn, or K/S. (i.e. Shield better than Armor) This is true. The Incubus is an Anti-Vehical vehicle, and therefore does not get as many kills as a Python. Incubus is also armor tanked, meaning it takes more damage from most AV weapons (swarms, forges, rails) These two traits combined put it in a different niche than the Python. It shouldn't be killing infantry! Or at least not to the extent the Python does. In PC, the highest level of competitive play, Incubus' rome the skies dealing with enemy vehicles while Pythons fly low and harass infantry. CCP Rattati wrote: 4) Yet, people complain that the Python is worse than the Incubus, even after the rail ROF nerf. These people are wrong. The Python is absolutely fine. Enough rate of fire to eliminate targets, but not so much that infantry have no chance. Enough tank to survive, but not so much as to make it indestructible. Balance. The problem is with the Incubus. The Incubus takes more damage from AV weapons. This is as it should be. An Incubus fulfilling it's roles is seeking out enemy vehicles, not engaging hostile infantry. The issue comes when the Incubus is doing its job as a vehicle hunter. The ROF nerf on top of the unchanged heat buildup mechanic results in the Incubus not being able to fire enough rounds to do it's job. Video: The Incubus is Broken Not only are Incubus pilots hard pressed to do their job, they are also punished for investing skill points into their chosen playstyle. We hear a lot of talk about how vehicles should be manned by multiple players to be effective. I agree with this, but why then are our gunners punished for investing the millions of skill points required to be good at their job? The solutions are many: Change the ROF, Change the overheat mechanic, Change the skill bonus. Change something! Delta did some great things for vehicle balance, but nothing always turns out perfectly. Before moving on to the next fire, let's fix this one first. Let CCP know what you think directly in the Feedback Thread The Incubus is Broken
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 1272	Posted - 2014.10.19 23:58:00 - [2] - Quote as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps [[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]]
hfderrtgvcd 886	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:01:00 - [3] - Quote inb4 people who didn't watch the video saying the incubus is fine You can't fight in here! This is the war room.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 548	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:08:00 - [4] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: inb4 people who didn't watch the video saying the incubus is fine I don't need to watch a video I fly an Incubus and say it's fine... The only problem is with swarms.
Stupid Blueberry Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 522	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:09:00 - [5] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps They won't render that far away. Chillin, waitin on Legion. Ishukone loyalist, Caldari Scout enthusiast!
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 920	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:12:00 - [6] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps Small blasters are still pretty ineffective against vehicles, despite the buff (which wasn't really a buff considering the ROF got nerved) They can work against Pythons, but require very close range. As for the sniping from 200 meters, I think you'll find it extremely hard to hit infantry from that distance, not to mention the hit detection issues. This plays in to what I was saying about Incubuses being anti vehicle, because a tank IS a target you can hit from 200 meters. The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 920	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:13:00 - [7] - Quote Stupid Blueberry wrote: Apothecary Za'ki wrote: as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps They won't render that far away. Excellent point. The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 920	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:13:00 - [8] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: hfderrtgvcd wrote: inb4 people who didn't watch the video saying the incubus is fine I don't need to watch a video I fly an Incubus and say it's fine... The only problem is with swarms. Care to explain your opinion? The Incubus is Broken
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 550	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:25:00 - [9] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: hfderrtgvcd wrote: inb4 people who didn't watch the video saying the incubus is fine I don't need to watch a video I fly an Incubus and say it's fine... The only problem is with swarms. Care to explain your opinion? facepalms <__< should have probably mentioned the heat buildup on the rails instead of leaving it for the video... I concede there's 2 issues then, lol. I could technically argue that it's a rail issue and not an Incubus issue though... Saving myself a small amount of humiliation. I'm gonna argue some more anyway though, missiles on a Bus do just fine at farming infantry as well as thrashing any ground vehicles and standard dropships... Also bad ads pilots die with ease, but that doesn't count for much. In your video you missed the last shot which would have downed the Python & then you hovered there infront of it to get shot... That was not a good argument for fixing the issue.
Koch Rosenzweig Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 7	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:39:00 - [10] - Quote I know this isnt relationed with ur post but, awesome video "For the love of Dropships" Huh, what a pretty biotic a$$. Slap

Atiim 13085	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:40:00 - [11] - Quote I think the RoF on all turrets need to be increased by 15%, and have a different bonus for the ADS, maybe: +5% Splash Radius per Level (Python) +8% Heat Sink Expansion per Level (Incubus) Not only that, but the Damage on 20GJ Railguns also needs an increase. As it stands now, they have absolutely no chance against a 'Triple Rep' Madrugar. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13671	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:52:00 - [12] - Quote Well posted. They do look really bad right now. It's like Maddies. Useless as HAV, and might as well be removed, as shields do everything better. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 552	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:52:00 - [13] - Quote Atiim wrote: I think the RoF on all turrets need to be increased by 15%, and have a different bonus for the ADS, maybe: +5% Splash Radius per Level (Python) +8% Heat Sink Expansion per Level (Incubus) Not only that, but the Damage on 20GJ Railguns also needs an increase. As it stands now, they have absolutely no chance against a 'Triple Rep' Madrugar. If you give me 15% RoF even the fooked up sentinal swarmers wont last long enough to get a 2nd shot off, lol. Basic small rails do enough damage to trololol infantry meanwhile doing enough to drop all but the dreaded triple rep Madruga, which suggests the issue with with armour rep or even just that people should be allowed to make their tank immune to small rails as they will get dropped by everything else in seconds. The small blaster perhaps could use a slight increase, but only really on an ads that doesn't get to sit still for long, because I'm running small blasters on a cheap LAV and taking out HMG's with ease.
Crimson ShieId Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1089	Posted - 2014.10.20 00:53:00 - [14] - Quote Huh... well, that's kinda BS... I knew the ROF got cut, but I wasn't aware the heat buildup got such an increase... WTF, CCP? And a better question would be, why is the main complaint about these things right now swarms when your AV turret is nearly useless? Nova Knives are best sidearm.
BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 88	Posted - 2014.10.20 01:14:00 - [15] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps The blaster is incapable of dropping ANY vehicle other than a LAV AND it has a hard time of destroying lavs too even if they are just sitting there. If you want to talk about against infantry then it would take a better pilot than me to be able to safely and accurately employ a blaster turret against infantry. You are correct, the rails do have a 200m range, but that is the max. After 200m the shots harmlessly explode in midair and with near zero splash damage worth that means you'll only have about a 25m range of safety. It's rather difficult with communication between turret gunners and pilots to get that just right. AND at that range there is the issue of pop-in structures, disappearing cover and load times for infantry. Overall that is just a bad idea that could be completely fruitless. The MCRU gives the pilot nothing. Unless the pilot travels about 400m (not sure about that) there is 0% chance of getting transport assists (whenever they choose to work). there are no spawn bonuses for MCRU's either. The point? The Incubus is broken. Short and simple. Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 88	Posted - 2014.10.20 01:32:00 - [16] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: hfderrtgvcd wrote: facepalms <__< should have probably mentioned the heat buildup on the rails instead of leaving it for the video... I concede there's 2 issues then, lol. I could technically argue that it's a rail issue and not an Incubus issue though... Saving myself a small amount of humiliation. I'm gonna argue some more anyway though, missiles on a Bus do just fine at farming infantry as well as thrashing any ground vehicles and standard dropships... Also bad ads pilots die with ease, but that doesn't count for much. In your video you missed the last shot which would have downed the Python & then you hovered there infront of it to get shot... That was not a good argument for fixing the issue. Here's my problem with your argument. You have to put a caldari missile launcher on a Gallente Ship that gets no bonuses to that weapon JUST so that you can use the Incubus. This shows that while the entire Gallente ADS is not broken, the natural weapons of the race are so ineffective that you toss them out the window. THIS is why the incubus is called broken. Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
ACT1ON BASTARD Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 233	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:01:00 - [17] - Quote Wait i just noticed something the small rail turret was the last good gallente weapon and now its broken like all the others. I guess the shotguns still good but the officer that just came out sucks horribly.
hfderrtgvcd 891	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:06:00 - [18] - Quote ACT1ON BASTARD wrote: Wait i just noticed something the small rail turret was the last good gallente weapon and now its broken like all the others. I guess the shotguns still good but the officer that just came out sucks horribly. the assault rifle is amazing You can't fight in here! This is the war room.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 924	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:15:00 - [19] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: In your video you missed the last shot which would have downed the Python & then you hovered there infront of it to get shot... That was not a good argument for fixing the issue. I actually didn't miss the shot, and I'm glad somebody noticed that. Watch it again and you'll notice the reticule is firmly on the opposing dropship. That, my friend, is the other issue with small rails: Hideous Hit Detection. The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 924	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:16:00 - [20] - Quote Koch Rosenzweig wrote: I know this isnt relationed with ur post but, awesome video "For the love of Dropships" Thank you very much! The Incubus is Broken

Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:20:00 - [21] - Quote Atiim wrote: I think the RoF on all turrets need to be increased by 15%, and have a different bonus for the ADS, maybe: +5% Splash Radius per Level (Python) +8% Heat Sink Expansion per Level (Incubus) Not only that, but the Damage on 20GJ Railguns also needs an increase. As it stands now, they have absolutely no chance against a 'Triple Rep' Madrugar. As a pilot I like those suggestions a lot, but I can also imagine the storm increasing missile splash damage would cause The heat expansion is an idea I think most everybody could get behind though. And yeah, rails may do more damage to armor now, but good luck finding the DPS to take out those Madrugars The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:22:00 - [22] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Well posted. They do look really bad right now. It's like Maddies. Useless as HAV, and might as well be removed, as shields do everything better. Thanks, True! I know what you mean. I can't seem to do half as good in a Madrugar as I can in a Gunny, but then again, Duna manages it somehow... The Incubus is Broken
jace silencerww Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 61	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:24:00 - [23] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: as i recall dosnt rails have like 200m range ? and swarms are only 175m? that means you could hover.. drop players with an MCRU and have you+2 gunners spraying down on people from like 176m high.. and iirc isnt incubus with blaster a beast vs other ADS/DS and HAV as i recall people saying it had like 3000 dps true but at that range the damage % is at 15-30% with rail against ground troops . blasters lol those are a joke on any ds but missiles are good however you do kill yourself. shooting then the missiles hits the ds and hurts to kills the gunner, you don't always show up until we are about 150 meters away then your swarms are fired at the the ads/ds
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:28:00 - [24] - Quote Crimson ShieId wrote: Huh... well, that's kinda BS... I knew the ROF got cut, but I wasn't aware the heat buildup got such an increase... WTF, CCP? And a better question would be, why is the main complaint about these things right now swarms when your AV turret is nearly useless? ROF is affects heat buildup and vice versa. You can't change one without the other (I think) so they are going to have to dial something back a notch. The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:30:00 - [25] - Quote ACT1ON BASTARD wrote: Wait i just noticed something the small rail turret was the last good gallente weapon and now its broken like all the others. I guess the shotguns still good but the officer that just came out sucks horribly. I saw the video of that shotgun. Yet another thing to add to the fix-list The Incubus is Broken
BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 91	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:33:00 - [26] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Crimson ShieId wrote: Huh... well, that's kinda BS... I knew the ROF got cut, but I wasn't aware the heat buildup got such an increase... WTF, CCP? And a better question would be, why is the main complaint about these things right now swarms when your AV turret is nearly useless? ROF is affects heat buildup and vice versa. You can't change one without the other (I think) so they are going to have to dial something back a notch. If they would push back the ROF to what it was, but add a penalty that actually reduces the damage (or just lower the damage, but this would affect other uses of the small rail turrets) they could get around this problem. Or why don't they just have a hidden penalty attached to the dropship? That way players would have the original rate of fire, so no terrible heat issue/bug, but do less damage so that it would require more shots and provide a more balanced ship. Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 91	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:35:00 - [27] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: ACT1ON BASTARD wrote: Wait i just noticed something the small rail turret was the last good gallente weapon and now its broken like all the others. I guess the shotguns still good but the officer that just came out sucks horribly. I saw the video of that shotgun. Yet another thing to add to the fix-list What video? Can you provide a link? Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:42:00 - [28] - Quote BrotherofHavok wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Crimson ShieId wrote: Huh... well, that's kinda BS... I knew the ROF got cut, but I wasn't aware the heat buildup got such an increase... WTF, CCP? And a better question would be, why is the main complaint about these things right now swarms when your AV turret is nearly useless? ROF is affects heat buildup and vice versa. You can't change one without the other (I think) so they are going to have to dial something back a notch. If they would push back the ROF to what it was, but add a penalty that actually reduces the damage (or just lower the damage, but this would affect other uses of the small rail turrets) they could get around this problem. Or why don't they just have a hidden penalty attached to the dropship? That way players would have the original rate of fire, so no terrible heat issue/bug, but do less damage so that it would require more shots and provide a more balanced ship. I'm fine with the speed, to be honest. Sure faster is better, but I would rather be able to fire more shots than fire 7 shots sort of quickly. As it is, all an Incubus pilot can do is nag a Python, very rarely can he destroy it. Not unlike the problem with most AV weapons before Delta... The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:45:00 - [29] - Quote BrotherofHavok wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: ACT1ON BASTARD wrote: Wait i just noticed something the small rail turret was the last good gallente weapon and now its broken like all the others. I guess the shotguns still good but the officer that just came out sucks horribly. I saw the video of that shotgun. Yet another thing to add to the fix-list What video? Can you provide a link? Prepare to cry Thank god my scrambler came out alright The Incubus is Broken
Cody Sietz Evzones Public.Disorder. 4074	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:46:00 - [30] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: hfderrtgvcd wrote: inb4 people who didn't watch the video saying the incubus is fine I don't need to watch a video I fly an Incubus and say it's fine... The only problem is with swarms. Yeah, why does it only take 6 swarms to kill a incubus! "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire

BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 91	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:47:00 - [31] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: BrotherofHavok wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: [quote=Crimson ShieId][/quote If they would push back the ROF to what it was, but add a penalty that actually reduces the damage (or just lower the damage, but this would affect other uses of the small rail turrets) they could get around this problem. Or why don't they just have a hidden penalty attached to the dropship? That way players would have the original rate of fire, so no terrible heat issue/bug, but do less damage so that it would require more shots and provide a more balanced ship. I'm fine with the speed, to be honest. Sure faster is better, but I would rather be able to fire more shots than fire 7 shots sort of quickly. As it is, all an Incubus pilot can do is nag a Python, very rarely can he destroy it. Not unlike the problem with most AV weapons before Delta... I'm saying that if the rate of fire and overheat are too close together to adjust one without seriously messing with the other than my option looks like a viable choice. I personally am fine with the rate of fire except it drops the DPS and combined with the heat build-up issue makes it unable to seriously take on vehicles/installations. Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
Gabriella Grey THE HANDS OF DEATH RUST415 193	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:47:00 - [32] - Quote I am not really a fan of saying the Incubus is the ONLY ANTI VEHICLE DROPSHIP. It would be much more practical and dynamic for the game that the type of turret equipped on the assault dropship makes it anti vehicle or not. But as it stands the Incubus is in a bad place and the same goes for the python. *Always Grey Skies* Leader of the Alpaca Commandos
BrotherofHavok PIanet Express Top Men. 91	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:56:00 - [33] - Quote Gabriella Grey wrote: I am not really a fan of saying the Incubus is the ONLY ANTI VEHICLE DROPSHIP. It would be much more practical and dynamic for the game that the type of turret equipped on the assault dropship makes it anti vehicle or not. But as it stands the Incubus is in a bad place and the same goes for the python. I could get behind that, except there seems to be an issue that no one brings up. Why is it that the missiles are really good at dealing with infantry and at the same time are also pretty good at dealing with vehicles? If rails are truly meant to be AV and blasters are meant to be anti-infantry than what are the missiles suppose to be good for? The direct damage needs to be reduced so that the dps of missiles is lower than the dps AND overheat of the rails. Maybe the missiles should be for some serious suppression? Decrease the direct damage a lot and decrease the splash damage some, but increase the splash radius to maybe like 8 meters? OR Decrease direct damage of the missile turrets. Leave the splash damage and splash radius alone, but increase the clip of Blasters and/or reduce heat build-up of blasters. Sincerely, Your Multi-purpose Everything User
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 925	Posted - 2014.10.20 02:57:00 - [34] - Quote BrotherofHavok wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: BrotherofHavok wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: [quote=Crimson ShieId][/quote If they would push back the ROF to what it was, but add a penalty that actually reduces the damage (or just lower the damage, but this would affect other uses of the small rail turrets) they could get around this problem. Or why don't they just have a hidden penalty attached to the dropship? That way players would have the original rate of fire, so no terrible heat issue/bug, but do less damage so that it would require more shots and provide a more balanced ship. I'm fine with the speed, to be honest. Sure faster is better, but I would rather be able to fire more shots than fire 7 shots sort of quickly. As it is, all an Incubus pilot can do is nag a Python, very rarely can he destroy it. Not unlike the problem with most AV weapons before Delta... I'm saying that if the rate of fire and overheat are too close together to adjust one without seriously messing with the other than my option looks like a viable choice. I personally am fine with the rate of fire except it drops the DPS and combined with the heat build-up issue makes it unable to seriously take on vehicles/installations. I know what you mean. I'm just not familiar enough with how the mechanics work behind the scenes to know whether a change like that is possible. It should be, but I guess we have to wait until CCP acknowledges the problem to find out. The Incubus is Broken
Gabriella Grey THE HANDS OF DEATH RUST415 193	Posted - 2014.10.20 03:32:00 - [35] - Quote BrotherofHavok wrote: Gabriella Grey wrote: I am not really a fan of saying the Incubus is the ONLY ANTI VEHICLE DROPSHIP. It would be much more practical and dynamic for the game that the type of turret equipped on the assault dropship makes it anti vehicle or not. But as it stands the Incubus is in a bad place and the same goes for the python. I could get behind that, except there seems to be an issue that no one brings up. Why is it that the missiles are really good at dealing with infantry and at the same time are also pretty good at dealing with vehicles? If rails are truly meant to be AV and blasters are meant to be anti-infantry than what are the missiles suppose to be good for? The direct damage needs to be reduced so that the dps of missiles is lower than the dps AND overheat of the rails. Maybe the missiles should be for some serious suppression? Decrease the direct damage a lot and decrease the splash damage some, but increase the splash radius to maybe like 8 meters? OR Decrease direct damage of the missile turrets. Leave the splash damage and splash radius alone, but increase the clip of Blasters and/or reduce heat build-up of blasters. I don't think the missiles need to be reduced, When the rail turret and missile turret were both given better rate of fire, they produced better results, some may say far to well. Missiles are good against infantry and vehicles no different than the forge gun and plasma cannon are against infantry. Missiles need to produce more damage to punch through vehicle armor. For them to achieve this for vehicles they need a high rate of fire. To kill infantry they need a better splash damage, which would bring us to having different types of turrets for all types, specializing in a specific role. During HAV fights I have went through almost all my ammo in many games trying to just kill one single HAV. That number is greatly reduced with the rail if we are talking pre Delta. There is a thread floating around started by Halla on acceptable numbers and also the official dropship post delta feedback to where everyone has been talking about reintroduce turret variants. Making a missile turret that is AV with little to no splash damage, specific in engaging vehicles. A turret designed or infantry, and a turret that is slightly in between. Blasters actually suffer from a similar issue. Currently blasters have the best ROF, but they also need more ammo per box and more max ammo to be affective against infantry. Ratatti has it where the blaster has a small splash damage, and this is actually been a great idea, it now needs more bullets and a decrease in heat build up. After that it will excel in killing infantry over missiles easily. *Always Grey Skies* Leader of the Alpaca Commandos
Lupus Wolf Minmatar Republic 5	Posted - 2014.10.20 03:57:00 - [36] - Quote Gabriella Grey wrote: I am not really a fan of saying the Incubus is the ONLY ANTI VEHICLE DROPSHIP. It would be much more practical and dynamic for the game that the type of turret equipped on the assault dropship makes it anti vehicle or not. But as it stands the Incubus is in a bad place and the same goes for the python. The Incubus isn't the only "Anti-Vehicle" dropship, but the bonus for rail turrets it makes it more effective as that role. Derpty Derp wrote: Atiim wrote: I think the RoF on all turrets need to be increased by 15%, and have a different bonus for the ADS, maybe: +5% Splash Radius per Level (Python) +8% Heat Sink Expansion per Level (Incubus) Not only that, but the Damage on 20GJ Railguns also needs an increase. As it stands now, they have absolutely no chance against a 'Triple Rep' Madrugar. If you give me 15% RoF even the fooked up sentinal swarmers wont last long enough to get a 2nd shot off, lol. Basic small rails do enough damage to trololol infantry meanwhile doing enough to drop all but the dreaded triple rep Madruga, which suggests the issue with with armour rep or even just that people should be allowed to make their tank immune to small rails as they will get dropped by everything else in seconds. The small blaster perhaps could use a slight increase, but only really on an ads that doesn't get to sit still for long, because I'm running small blasters on a cheap LAV and taking out HMG's with ease. Ratati has stated that he hates small rail turrets being able to fire fast. Just adding my useless and slightly unrelated 2 bits here: I only skilled into the ADS a few months ago. I went Incubus because of it's tank and I heard the Python's shields were like paper. Now I know it's not as bad if it's fit right. Personally, I switched from Incubus to Python because of it's natural resistance to AV. Still getting used to the handling though, it seems to always want to move forward. Also, imo, I wouldn't stick turrets on my ADS because it takes away from tank. I'd rather NOT lose 300k than get a few vehicle kill assists. P.S. Back in Bravo, my bro and I (With basic swarms and an advanced Forge) took down an Incubus before he had a chance to get away (it was around 10 seconds). He came back and with another blueberry swarmer, we took him down before he could even hit the afterburner. Yes, he probably had a low tanked fit, but just sayin, AV was fine IF we worked as a team and knew WHEN to engage (Or if the pilot was dumb). Now, mind you, the buff to swarms also encouraged more players to put a few skills in them, resulting in even more AV than before. I can only hang around for a few minutes before there's 3 swarmers on my tail. No, I don't agree that someone with a 2.5 million SP investment should be equal to someone with a 12k SP into swarms, but that's not a problem with dropships, is it? Gunnlogis with BLASTERS!?! BLASPHEMY!!! #MissilesFoLyfe \|: Rail/Missile GL< Blaster GL< B Matty< M Matty< Missile GL :\|
Operative 1125 Lokaas True Companion Planetary Requisitions 508	Posted - 2014.10.20 04:33:00 - [37] - Quote It also sucks to have to be so pinpoint accurate with a rail and yet take damage so easily from swarms. Pythons just run off or hover close down to their lil b*tch swarmer buddy now. Missile turret shouldn't be the better choice for an Incubus. THIS IS THE VOICE OF RÁN
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 238	Posted - 2014.10.20 06:24:00 - [38] - Quote The Incubus it self is not broken. I've been flying it nonstop over the last several days, and i've been brought down by what brought me down pre Delta, 5x Damage modded CK.0 Proto forge guns, railtanks, blueberries and enemies ramming me, getting stuck on building textures, undodgeable swarms etc. I haven't seen a single missile yet that didn't follow me around buildings, pipes, and the like. That being said, it can still be survivable to fly, and I much prefer it over the Python. However, every thing i speced into the incubus for is crap. Raill turret over heats at 7 shots and does't have the DPS to take down other ships before sizeing up. Blasters are a joke versus infantry. ROF is usless. Its not too bad with some missiles on it.. I've gotten 3 or 4 air to air kills with it. You just have to do three things. 1)Engage the enemy early on, dont give them a chance to set up AV nests. They wont render but their Nanohives will, take them out and leave the enemy there. Without resuspply they are useless. 2) Proto fit. Anything less than proto is going to die very quickly, proto swarms are still rare. 3) Enlist the help of a tanker buddy (i got delb0y) to destroy every single CRU and Supply Deot, ASAP. If its red its dead, and not so many players are going to pull out proto gear when there is no hope of switching back. Yes, i'll do what i got to do when i'm running on the ground, but when i'm in the air or in a vehicle, screw the infantry, Blue and Red. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
iKILLu osborne Kirjuun Heiian 430	Posted - 2014.10.20 08:02:00 - [39] - Quote my tank is more afraid of an incubus with a missile than an incubus with a rail, that right there says something is broken lp cal scout i demand it kirjuun heiian now recruiting cal loyalist
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 2035	Posted - 2014.10.20 08:59:00 - [40] - Quote As a Python pilot I can say without doubt the Incubus is in a rough place. Right now its only 'bonus' is being tough enough to ram a python out of the sky. Before, yes the railgun was OP on the incubus. The missiles were a OP vs infantry. Right now the missiles are reasonable vs infantry and lacking a little vs vehicles but they are still in a much better place than rails are against anything. Lets not forget the small blasters though for the incubus, they are actually really good again now for those that forget about that. Overall the rails need fixing. Lets not kid ourselves, the main reason this all got changed so much was because of pilot stacking skills. I would like to see a balance where every dropship is totally viable in its role, a good missile python pilot should beat a bad rail incubus but a good rail incubus should be able to kill a good missile python. Lets not forget the missiles do have the advantage of being versatile against most targets where as an incubus has to pick an anti infantry or an anti vehicle role. (Further, blasters are only good for side gunners. The blaster sucks balls for the ADS main weapon) So yes balance for all please. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!

Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 556	Posted - 2014.10.20 10:39:00 - [41] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: In your video you missed the last shot which would have downed the Python & then you hovered there infront of it to get shot... That was not a good argument for fixing the issue. I actually didn't miss the shot, and I'm glad somebody noticed that. Watch it again and you'll notice the reticule is firmly on the opposing dropship. That, my friend, is the other issue with small rails: Hideous Hit Detection. You were fractionally off the right side in my view... But as for the rails not being balanced if your only issue is the higher level heat buildup issue then I agree with you, however if you're suggesting that it's no good at lvl 0 - 3 then I'd have to disagree as I am quite happy with the lvl 3 rails.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 948	Posted - 2014.10.20 15:46:00 - [42] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: In your video you missed the last shot which would have downed the Python & then you hovered there infront of it to get shot... That was not a good argument for fixing the issue. I actually didn't miss the shot, and I'm glad somebody noticed that. Watch it again and you'll notice the reticule is firmly on the opposing dropship. That, my friend, is the other issue with small rails: Hideous Hit Detection. You were fractionally off the right side in my view... But as for the rails not being balanced if your only issue is the higher level heat buildup issue then I agree with you, however if you're suggesting that it's no good at lvl 0 - 3 then I'd have to disagree as I am quite happy with the lvl 3 rails. I'm saying the opposite. As it is right now, I feel that a level 1 Incubus is actually better at its job than a level 5, due to the fact it can fire more shots. A speedy ROF counts for nothing if you just overheat before dealing with your enemy. The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 948	Posted - 2014.10.20 15:55:00 - [43] - Quote Operative 1125 Lokaas wrote: It also sucks to have to be so pinpoint accurate with a rail and yet take damage so easily from swarms. Pythons just run off or hover close down to their lil btch swarmer buddy now. Missile turret shouldn't be the better choice for an Incubus. An Incubus should not have to run missiles to be effective, just as a swarmer should not have to skill into forges to be a threat to vehicles. (as it was pre buff) Agreed. The Incubus is Broken*
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 948	Posted - 2014.10.20 15:59:00 - [44] - Quote Lupus Wolf wrote: Also, imo, I wouldn't stick turrets on my ADS because it takes away from tank. I'd rather NOT lose 300k than get a few vehicle kill assists. You really should give side guns a chance! The benefit you receive in firepower really is worth the loss of a couple hundred HP. That said, DON'T use an Incubus with a skilled gunner. As you can see in the video, they'd probably die from overheat before killing their target The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 953	Posted - 2014.10.20 16:01:00 - [45] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: The Incubus it self is not broken. Correct. The ship itself is fine. The issue is with the bonuses and heat mechanics behind the scenes. Saying "The Incubus is Broken" was a good way to get people to engage with the topic, and then discover the issue at hand. (the "Here's Why" part) The Incubus is Broken
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 953	Posted - 2014.10.20 16:04:00 - [46] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: As a Python pilot I can say without doubt the Incubus is in a rough place. Right now its only 'bonus' is being tough enough to ram a python out of the sky. Before, yes the railgun was OP on the incubus. The missiles were a OP vs infantry. Right now the missiles are reasonable vs infantry and lacking a little vs vehicles but they are still in a much better place than rails are against anything. Lets not forget the small blasters though for the incubus, they are actually really good again now for those that forget about that. Overall the rails need fixing. Lets not kid ourselves, the main reason this all got changed so much was because of pilot stacking skills. I would like to see a balance where every dropship is totally viable in its role, a good missile python pilot should beat a bad rail incubus but a good rail incubus should be able to kill a good missile python. Lets not forget the missiles do have the advantage of being versatile against most targets where as an incubus has to pick an anti infantry or an anti vehicle role. (Further, blasters are only good for side gunners. The blaster sucks balls for the ADS main weapon) So yes balance for all please. Agreed 100%, on all points. +1 The Incubus is Broken
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 560	Posted - 2014.10.20 18:27:00 - [47] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: I'm saying the opposite. As it is right now, I feel that a level 1 Incubus is actually better at its job than a level 5, due to the fact it can fire more shots. A speedy ROF counts for nothing if you just overheat before dealing with your enemy. I agree that lvl 1 shouldn't be better than lvl 5 (as it is at the moment) but I also disagree that we should be able to destroy a vehicle without having the deal with the heat buildup, having to save a few shots is far more entertaining than the 'pew pew pew dead Python/Gunlogi' of pre-Delta... I've downed a good number of Pythons and tanks (Don't think I've come across any triple reps yet, but a few that will rep back up if you don't land every shot, which I feel fine with.) At best I would suggest first fixing the heat build up issue, before moving on to changing the amount of shots that we can fire before overheat... Anymore than 9 I feel would be far too easy (for my liking.)
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 974	Posted - 2014.10.20 19:01:00 - [48] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I agree that lvl 1 shouldn't be better than lvl 5 (as it is at the moment) but I also disagree that we should be able to destroy a vehicle without having the deal with the heat buildup, having to save a few shots is far more entertaining than the 'pew pew pew dead Python/Gunlogi' of pre-Delta... Of course we should have heat buildup! Without it, as you say, rails would dominate everything. Instead, heat buildup should be toned down to a point between what it was pre delta, and post delta. The skill bonus also should be looked at, as it is quite useless right now. The Incubus is Broken
jace silencerww Second-Nature 64	Posted - 2014.10.27 21:49:00 - [49] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: As a Python pilot I can say without doubt the Incubus is in a rough place. Right now its only 'bonus' is being tough enough to ram a python out of the sky. Before, yes the railgun was OP on the incubus. The missiles were a OP vs infantry. Right now the missiles are reasonable vs infantry and lacking a little vs vehicles but they are still in a much better place than rails are against anything. Lets not forget the small blasters though for the incubus, they are actually really good again now for those that forget about that. Overall the rails need fixing. Lets not kid ourselves, the main reason this all got changed so much was because of pilot stacking skills. I would like to see a balance where every dropship is totally viable in its role, a good missile python pilot should beat a bad rail incubus but a good rail incubus should be able to kill a good missile python. Lets not forget the missiles do have the advantage of being versatile against most targets where as an incubus has to pick an anti infantry or an anti vehicle role. (Further, blasters are only good for side gunners. The blaster sucks balls for the ADS main weapon) So yes balance for all please. LOL ok blasters are good AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT put them on an Incubus be it for the gunner. you shot 48-54 rounds before you over heat. and use them as the pilot you do better crushing reds then shooting them. lol want a good ads then here skill into the assault dropship skill (bonus to damage) but do not skill into the gall ads skill for the rof and ammo. you will do better damage and shoot more with the rails this way. you do not have to have that skill to use the incubus. funny CCP is hurting players that skilled into the gall ads lol.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 1202	Posted - 2014.10.27 22:31:00 - [50] - Quote jace silencerww wrote: LOL ok blasters are good AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT put them on an Incubus be it for the gunner. you shot 48-54 rounds before you over heat. and use them as the pilot you do better crushing reds then shooting them. lol want a good ads then here skill into the assault dropship skill (bonus to damage) but do not skill into the gall ads skill for the rof and ammo. you will do better damage and shoot more with the rails this way. you do not have to have that skill to use the incubus. funny CCP is hurting players that skilled into the gall ads lol. After tomorrow, the problem should be lessoned. I agree with you on blasters though. They are best on ground vehicles, due to the inherently steady platform that LAVs and Tanks provide. Put it on a dropship and you start getting problems. A blaster gunner often finds him or herself in a far to elevated position to deal with infantry, because of the blaster's nature as a close range weapon. And of course putting a blaster as the main gun of an ADS is questionable, given that the spread is so horrendous and the nose of the dropship obscures your target. The Incubus is Broken Judge Rhadamanthus is my Hero

jace silencerww Second-Nature 65	Posted - 2014.10.28 02:23:00 - [51] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: jace silencerww wrote: LOL ok blasters are good AS LONG AS YOU DO NOT put them on an Incubus be it for the gunner. you shot 48-54 rounds before you over heat. and use them as the pilot you do better crushing reds then shooting them. lol want a good ads then here skill into the assault dropship skill (bonus to damage) but do not skill into the gall ads skill for the rof and ammo. you will do better damage and shoot more with the rails this way. you do not have to have that skill to use the incubus. funny CCP is hurting players that skilled into the gall ads lol. After tomorrow, the problem should be lessoned. I agree with you on blasters though. They are best on ground vehicles, due to the inherently steady platform that LAVs and Tanks provide. Put it on a dropship and you start getting problems. A blaster gunner often finds him or herself in a far to elevated position to deal with infantry, because of the blaster's nature as a close range weapon. And of course putting a blaster as the main gun of an ADS is questionable, given that the spread is so horrendous and the nose of the dropship obscures your target. reelly? nope as long as the incubus has the heat build up of 1.02 per level it will not be any good on an incubus. reason being the stack ads skills equal a total heat build up of 1.2 per shot with a 1.3 rof increase. so you get faster stronger shots but only until 48-54 rounds before you over heat and in cool down. even a great gunner will be hard to get a kill within that many shots. to be at 60-70 meters the hit circle is about lav (not zoomed). even with a proto blasters with damage boosted you ae only hitting 1-3 of 7-14 shots.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 1203	Posted - 2014.10.28 05:02:00 - [52] - Quote Tell me how you feel after tomorrow. The heat buildup is being addressed, so I think it's a little unfair to judge at this stage. The Incubus is Broken Judge Rhadamanthus is my Hero


Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.