DUST Search - Petition to STOP AMARR SENTINEL NERF from changing HMG profile

bamboo x wrote:

Monkey MAC wrote:

TTK
Cal Sent (-15% Shields +15% Armour) - 1.8 Seconds
Min Sent (-15% Shields +15% Armour) -1.7 Seconds
Gal Sent (-15% Shields + 5% Armour) - 2.0 Seconds
Amr Sent (-15% Shields + 0% Armour) - 2.2 Seconds
Still seems pretty balanced to me.

Now let's put what an Amarr and Caldari are SUPPOSED to run.

http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/337/7304

652 shields 487 armor. Those 652 shields will soak up the majority of a Six Kin Burst leaving plenty of room for it to stay alive. What if he has a logi on him and is behind cover? He will be back up to full health from zero shields in 8 seconds and will start repairing at 86 shields per second. If he chooses to run a shield energizer he can start repairing when his shields aren't fully gone in 2.4 seconds. If he chooses to run an armor rep he doesn't even need the Logi on him.

652 Shields lasts 0.9 Seconds, if you are assuming the caldari has a logi with a triage repair tool, you must also assume that the Amarr does as well, in which case the amarr wins out due to his armour resistance.

http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/337/6443

450 shields 1344 armor. His shields take FOREVER to recharge. He can't afford to run reps in a serious fight so he literally has ZERO armor reps. Even with a Core Focused rep tool on him it will take 10 seconds to fully heal. Combine this with the nerf against HMG damage and it's easy to see the problem. Six kin will kill him even faster than Caldari because Amarr has to charge into the fight, and Caldari can easily hang back behind cover.

If you aren't running reps, you are an idiot. You also have the opportunity to hang back wait for a flank or whatever you want to do.

What if there are two Caldari sentinels instead of a Caldari and his logi? Normally an Amarr can take out two other Amarr heavies if he has a Logi and they don't. In this case he and his Logi will be slaughtered.

Focused fire from to HMG's SHOULD KILL EVERYTHING

What if his Logi dies first?
You didn't protect him well enough, teaches you not to stack pure armour plates.

What if Minmatar and Gallente decide to start running shield extenders to compensate for the OP caldari? Amarr Sentinel is screwed.

You mean a dual tanker, dual tanks and armour sentinel adds 70 extra shields, god forbid.

Not only has the Sentinel Fitting Nerf made Amarr the WORST FORGE GUNNER but now he will be the WORST HMG USER.

They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank!

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Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 269	Posted - 2014.09.01 21:52:00 - [61] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Jack 3enimble wrote: So you want your armor suit to rep shields aswell? My cal sent still needs a armor repair mod to rep armor (the ONLY low slot)What does your sentinel need to rep shields? Go back and read my post. The only thing you actually lose from replacing a shield reg with an armor rep is the regular shield recharge delay. It's still about the same once your shields are depleted. So literally when you are in a real fight against other heavies the shield reg isn't as good as an armor rep because you need that extra buffer against Six Kin Burst. Keep in mind the Burst is getting nerfed again so you will definitely have more survivability against it than Amarr. LOOK... Why don't we do -10/+10 for projectiles, that way Caldari are buffed against shields and the damage against armor stays the same. I am mostly just against the +15 against armor. That is what scares me the most. Seems fair enough, this is a valid argument. Just stop drawing the OP card. Makes you look like the Al Sharpton of Dust
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3403	Posted - 2014.09.01 21:57:00 - [62] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: TTK Cal Sent (-15% Shields +15% Armour) - 1.8 Seconds Min Sent (-15% Shields +15% Armour) -1.7 Seconds Gal Sent (-15% Shields + 5% Armour) - 2.0 Seconds Amr Sent (-15% Shields + 0% Armour) - 2.2 Seconds Still seems pretty balanced to me. Now let's put what an Amarr and Caldari are SUPPOSED to run. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/337/7304 652 shields 487 armor. Those 652 shields will soak up the majority of a Six Kin Burst leaving plenty of room for it to stay alive. What if he has a logi on him and is behind cover? He will be back up to full health from zero shields in 8 seconds and will start repairing at 86 shields per second. If he chooses to run a shield energizer he can start repairing when his shields aren't fully gone in 2.4 seconds. If he chooses to run an armor rep he doesn't even need the Logi on him. 652 Shields lasts 0.9 Seconds, if you are assuming the caldari has a logi with a triage repair tool, you must also assume that the Amarr does as well, in which case the amarr wins out due to his armour resistance. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/337/6443 450 shields 1344 armor. His shields take FOREVER to recharge. He can't afford to run reps in a serious fight so he literally has ZERO armor reps. Even with a Core Focused rep tool on him it will take 10 seconds to fully heal. Combine this with the nerf against HMG damage and it's easy to see the problem. Six kin will kill him even faster than Caldari because Amarr has to charge into the fight, and Caldari can easily hang back behind cover. If you aren't running reps, you are an idiot. You also have the opportunity to hang back wait for a flank or whatever you want to do. What if there are two Caldari sentinels instead of a Caldari and his logi? Normally an Amarr can take out two other Amarr heavies if he has a Logi and they don't. In this case he and his Logi will be slaughtered. Focused fire from to HMG's SHOULD KILL EVERYTHING What if his Logi dies first? You didn't protect him well enough, teaches you not to stack pure armour plates. What if Minmatar and Gallente decide to start running shield extenders to compensate for the OP caldari? Amarr Sentinel is screwed. You mean a dual tanker, dual tanks and armour sentinel adds 70 extra shields, god forbid. Not only has the Sentinel Fitting Nerf made Amarr the WORST FORGE GUNNER but now he will be the WORST HMG USER. My god, you have no idea do you, Amarr is designed to be the high eHP suit, you outlast in 1v1 but suffer against hit and run tactics. Your entire rebuttal is based upon biased scenarios, where you would expect to loose. You give a caldari a repper but not the Amarr, you pit 2v1. It's poorly disguised QQ nothing more. They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 21:57:00 - [63] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Seems fair enough, this is a valid argument. Just stop drawing the OP card. Makes you look like the Al Sharpton of Dust It's just I was considering doing Cal Sentinel for a while because they are just so much better than Amarr because of their independence and regen ability. But I thought about it and it kind of seems like the 2.5 mil I spent on Amarr would be wasted if I'm using Caldari more of the time. I was kind of enjoying the fact that I have the freedom now to skill into Assault or Scout because I have all my heavy weapon skills up to either 4 or 5 and I already had to drop 1.3 mil into fitting my HMG heavy better. But then I noticed that I'm the worst Forge Gunner now... I just can't stack that extra HP like I used to and snipers have a field day with me. Today I even got one-shot by an advanced FG... Now if they make my HMG Amarr inferior I will have no choice but to skill into Caldari like it's FOTM. All the SP I spent on heavy weapons and running heavies the best way possible will be wasted. Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:07:00 - [64] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: It's poorly disguised QQ nothing more. You know what? I'm done trying to disguise it. People are leaving this game in droves because of CCP nerfing everyone. Most of the best people in my corp have left already. One of our dropship pilots who was ******* LEGENDARY quit because of the installation buff. I'm tired of getting short strawed just like everyone else who lost faith in CCP. I was in a match against Shayz before I made this thread. He was in his proto Caldari assault and I was having a difficult time killing him with my basic Amarr sentinel, but I managed to do it a couple times and even got him once with my Militia Scrambler Pistol. I thought to myself "imagine when shields get buffed against projectiles, I won't even be able to use my HMG against Caldari." Then I messaged him after I played another match against some Caldari heavies because it had finally hit me. What good is a heavy weapon when you can't even use it? Should sentinels start running around with dual pistols? Why should shields be OP against the only heavy weapon there is, when CCP hasn't even given us Gallente or Amarr ones yet? Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf
Maiden selena MORTIMOR Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 127	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:09:00 - [65] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: It's poorly disguised QQ nothing more. You know what? I'm done trying to disguise it. People are leaving this game in droves because of CCP nerfing everyone. Most of the best people in my corp have left already. One of our dropship pilots who was ******* LEGENDARY quit because of the installation buff. I'm tired of getting short strawed just like everyone else who lost faith in CCP. I was in a match against Shayz before I made this thread. He was in his proto Caldari assault and I was having a difficult time killing him with my basic Amarr sentinel, but I managed to do it a couple times and even got him once with my Militia Scrambler Pistol. I thought to myself "imagine when shields get buffed against projectiles, I won't even be able to use my HMG against Caldari." Then I messaged him after I played another match against some Caldari heavies because it had finally hit me. What good is a heavy weapon when you can't even use it? Should sentinels start running around with dual pistols? Why should shields be OP against the only heavy weapon there is, when CCP hasn't even given us Gallente or Amarr ones yet? 2 words SCRAMBLER LANCE no im not a mortedeamor alt..im her slave When my master is banned I represent her wishes and that of the Mortimor famil
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:13:00 - [66] - Quote OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! Let's give needles the ability to heal shields right at the same time as we nerf armor heavies to a pulp! Herp derp, we need to make changes SLOW and CAREFULLY and OBSERVE what happens before we change everything at once! All this right after we make OBs cost 5000 WP! Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:16:00 - [67] - Quote bamboo x wrote: who is actually signing this again? drunk guy? Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf
Greasepalms Ahrendee Mercenaries 628	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:17:00 - [68] - Quote grr how do I downvote
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 276	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:19:00 - [69] - Quote OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! DERP LOUDER! Take what i say with a bag of salt Who needs a gun when you can run people over FW saboteur
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:23:00 - [70] - Quote RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! DERP LOUDER! Why don't you ** on heavies a little more before you ** on their graves? You watch. We'll be leaving in drones if projectiles do 15/15. Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf

RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 276	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:25:00 - [71] - Quote bamboo x wrote: RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! DERP LOUDER! Why don't you ** on heavies a little more before you ** on their graves? You watch. We'll be leaving in drones if projectiles do 15/15. OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! I AM A HEAVY, GET GOOD DERP! Take what i say with a bag of salt Who needs a gun when you can run people over FW saboteur
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3405	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:25:00 - [72] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: It's poorly disguised QQ nothing more. You know what? I'm done trying to disguise it. Took your time. People are leaving this game in droves because of CCP nerfing everyone. Most of the best people in my corp have left already. One of our dropship pilots who was ***** LEGENDARY quit because of the installation buff. http://eve-offline.net/?server=dust As a matter of fact our numbers have been pretty unmoved for the last year. Secondly who? Judge is a CPM I don't think he's quit has he? I'm tired of getting short strawed just like everyone else who lost faith in CCP. Short strawed about what? You've lost faith in CCP allowing you stomp around in your favourite FOTM OP suit? Any other loss in faith has nothing to do with rattati. I was in a match against Shayz before I made this thread. He was in his proto Caldari assault and I was having a difficult time killing him with my basic Amarr sentinel, but I managed to do it a couple times and even got him once with my Militia Scrambler Pistol. I thought to myself "imagine when shields get buffed against projectiles, I won't even be able to use my HMG against Caldari." Then I messaged him after I played another match against some Caldari heavies because it had finally hit me. You 'struggled' with a STD sent vs a PRO I should blommkn well hope so. You mean instead of thinking** Wow, he just lost a full PRO fit, to my STD fit, that stuff must UP You starting thinking that a PRO Cal sent actually holding his own would be OP? Are you missing a few brain cells? What good is a heavy weapon when you can't even use it? Should sentinels start running around with dual pistols? Why should shields be OP against the only heavy weapon there is, when CCP hasn't even given us Gallente or Amarr ones yet? Shields won't be OP, they will be about as resistant to the damage as you are, insteading crying like a little girl because projectiles are finally getting balanced, you should ask rattati for a shield variant like he has offered to give to swarm launchers. I rarely decide to say this and as such take great pleasure in doing so. *HARDEN THE FCK UP They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1113	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:28:00 - [73] - Quote That's all you people can do. Resort to insults. Why harden up when you can grow up and stop caring about a dead game. Peace, I'm out. Click here to prevent Amarr Sentinel unfair nerf
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1372	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:30:00 - [74] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Zindorak wrote: Put me on the list i want OP Am sentinel it's not OP. it's very weak without a logi repairing it. armor based sentinels are not as powerful as you think when they are alone without support from their entire squad. caldari and minmatar are different. they are quite literally more independent and don't need a logi. they are faster and can benefit greater from shared tacnet scans this will make the shield tanking heavies FOTM and extremely OP. not only will they resist HMGs and projectiles but also lasers, hybrid blasters, hybrid rails, pretty much EVERYTHING IN THE GAME. I do quite well with my usually non-logi assisted Amarr Sentinel and quite frequently take out other sentinels that are being repped by a logi. Honestly as it stands now Cal and Min Sentinels are a joke when it comes to heavy vs heavy. I'd happily take on 2 of either well before I took on two Amarr or Gal Sentinels. Maybe Cal and Min Sentinels will actually stand a chance against Amarr or Gal Sentinels after this change. At the RJC we don't kick ass, we kick dick and we kick it hard. Fix supply depots
Zindorak 1.U.P 775	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:30:00 - [75] - Quote What only 3 people signed? Pokemon master! CCP undo ScP nerf. It hurt my feering very bad
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3405	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:31:00 - [76] - Quote bamboo x wrote: That's all you people can do. Resort to insults. Why harden up when you can grow up and stop caring about a dead game. Peace, I'm out. Bye Bye Etches another gouge out of Dropsuit They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh* and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 277	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:31:00 - [77] - Quote bamboo x wrote: That's all you people can do. Resort to insults. Why harden up when you can grow up and stop caring about a dead game. Peace, I'm out. OH AND I'VE GOT AN IDEA!!! WHY WOULD ANY SANE HUMAN WASTE TIME TRYING TO PROVE THAT SOMEONES BIASED SHT ISN'T FACT. INSERT MORE BIAS CRAP HERE. CHEW YOUR OWN WORDS AND BE GONE FOOL! Take what i say with a bag of salt Who needs a gun when you can run people over FW saboteur
Bri Bub Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 30	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:37:00 - [78] - Quote bamboo x wrote: LOOK... Why don't we do -10/+10 for projectiles, that way Caldari are buffed against shields and the damage against armor stays the same. I am mostly just against the +15 against armor. That is what scares me the most. I support this... More delicate changes instead of the same old heavy-handed approach to re-balancing... Signed! Be just and if you can't be just be arbitrary.
Cody Sietz Evzones Public.Disorder. 3951	Posted - 2014.09.01 22:54:00 - [79] - Quote It's only a nerf to quad plates Amarr sentinels and triple plates Gallente and I hate both those guys. Though I'm honestly not a fan of the 15/15 profile. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 881	Posted - 2014.09.01 23:13:00 - [80] - Quote LOL All this over the HMG change when the real issue for armor heavies is going to be the combat rifle. The thing already kills an armor tanked sentinel just as fast as a shot gun but can do it from almost 50 meters and now it is going to be getting armor damage buffed even more. Scout 514 carries on.........

JARREL THOMAS Dead Man's Game 351	Posted - 2014.09.01 23:31:00 - [81] - Quote Not exact numbers but lets look at a cr to shields shields crumble to peices compaired to most weapons shields crumble and the cal heavy would crumble to not having to much armor it should get killed faster than you If your hmgs at full ammo. Caldari Loyalist I speak for the rabbits
Benjamin Ciscko Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 3068	Posted - 2014.09.01 23:44:00 - [82] - Quote deezy dabest wrote: LOL All this over the HMG change when the real issue for armor heavies is going to be the combat rifle. The thing already kills an armor tanked sentinel just as fast as a shot gun but can do it from almost 50 meters and now it is going to be getting armor damage buffed even more. Scout 514 carries on......... The Sentinel generally carries a 50m shot gun also referred to as a burst HMG your point is invalid. Tanker/Logi/Assault
Mauren NOON The Exemplars 430	Posted - 2014.09.01 23:54:00 - [83] - Quote Signed Scr and commando enthusiast. A commando is not just a suit, but a way of life... "The only thing to fear is fear itself"
Jace Kaisar 74	Posted - 2014.09.01 23:58:00 - [84] - Quote This thread is hilarious I'm a Spooky Scary Ghost
Zindorak 1.U.P 777	Posted - 2014.09.02 00:02:00 - [85] - Quote Jace Kaisar wrote: This thread is intellligent Fixed Pokemon master! CCP undo ScP nerf. It hurt my feering very bad
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 284	Posted - 2014.09.02 00:24:00 - [86] - Quote Zindorak wrote: Jace Kaisar wrote: EXTREME DERP Fixed Take what i say with a bag of salt Who needs a gun when you can run people over FW saboteur
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 881	Posted - 2014.09.02 00:29:00 - [87] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: deezy dabest wrote: LOL All this over the HMG change when the real issue for armor heavies is going to be the combat rifle. The thing already kills an armor tanked sentinel just as fast as a shot gun but can do it from almost 50 meters and now it is going to be getting armor damage buffed even more. Scout 514 carries on......... The Sentinel generally carries a 50m shot gun also referred to as a burst HMG your point is invalid. He also moves at 3 times your speed and has a hitbox less than half your size. Oh wait thats not true and neither is the fact that the burst HMG instakills at 50m. I really dont care I have every suit proto so I will find something that works. You guys should just go back to spamming respec threads so CCP can point and laugh at you.
castba Merc-0107 592	Posted - 2014.09.02 00:52:00 - [88] - Quote As an AmSent since Feb 2012, I will not sign such a thing for the following reasons: 1. You used the word "unfair". Not only should you feel ashamed, but I strongly suggest you have a think as to why you should feel ashamed. 2. It really won't make that much of a difference. Heavy use will still be ~80% Gal/Am and they will still be extremely effective. 3. Armour plate HP values vs Shield extenders. Not only total HP but effective HP will be greater on Am/Gal sentinels 4. Projectile resistances for both AmSent and GalSent apply to armour which still nullifies projectile bonuses. Lastly, and I can't emphasise this enough, you used the word "unfair". "When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1120	Posted - 2014.09.02 01:08:00 - [89] - Quote I can use some french words if you like. Votre mere shittez en eskimo. Stop armor based heavies from getting nerfed
castba Merc-0107 592	Posted - 2014.09.02 03:11:00 - [90] - Quote I used Google translate on your eskimo line. Dungeddit. Talking down to my "fellow Amarr Sentinels"? You are clearly far too sensitive and irrational to view the projectile change objectively so I won't be taking this, nor any of your other threads on the AmSent "nerf" seriously. bamboo x wrote: I've had a very hard life as a heavy while everyone on the forum likes to shrug us off as a bunch of "fatsuits on easy mode" when that is nowhere near the case. Nothing is really "easy mode" at the moment, but a hard life as a heavy? C'mon man, I know the whole "squeaky wheel gets the grease" process, but really! Do you even use other (non-heavy) dropsuits? Anyway, best of luck in Delta (sincere statement). "When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti



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