DUST Search - Skill into AV if you're tired of getting destroyed by tanks?

Speedddogg wrote:

So I sometimes complain about tanks after dying to them immediately as I spawn. (On the eleventh time, I managed to cloak just before they killed me, and started messing with them. Of course I only have so much stamina, and I eventually got a missile to the face.) Well here's a few reasons why skilling into AV doesn't really fix that.

1. Most of the time, they'll shoot you upon spawn. Even if you spawn at the MCC. I got blasted once mid-fall.
2. You're implying that I have spare SP. No... I don't. And if I did, it wouldn't be put into a class that I only use when I need to take out an annoying tank.
3. AVV (Anti-vehicle Vehicle) doesn't work if there's more then one tank. They just gang up on you.
4. You can't do it alone. I have a heavy suit with a forge just for tanks (and the occasional forge sniping. Hey, if you're just sitting there, you deserve to die. Especially if you've sniped me five times), but it takes five shots from my militia forge (Like I said, I don't have the SP to get to weapon level five and get the Heavy Weapons skill. I'm busy trying to get to Scout level 3 so I have more then just a railgun and advanced nova knives on my suit with the cloak), to destroy a militia tank. And believe it or not, some tankers have actually gone beyond that point! GASP! Shocking I know. The problem is, there needs to be more then one person shooting. And for some reason, my teammates don't think to get something out to wreck the tank.
5. If you try to destroy a tank, the infantry will destroy you. The best weapon I can get on my heavy besides the forge is a Advanced Magsec SMG.

Now I know tanks are supposed to be a terrifying force that can turn the tides of battle. Its just that when there are four tanks roaming the map, and every member of my team is in hiding, hoping the tanks don't notice them, its a problem. And I, and most others, can't really do anything about it. So the next time somebody says "SKILL INTO AV TO FIGHT TANKS", well.... I'll probably hunt them down and stab them in the back, because I am so tired of hearing that. The only real downside for tanks is... dear god they're harder to control then a LAV with a fuel injector (Although that is amazingly fun. I bounced myself onto a building once by getting out of my LAV after it started rolling). After fitting a Rail Sica, I've found out why tankers get so annoyed when I jump onto their turrets.

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True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9401	Posted - 2014.04.10 04:20:00 - [31] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: 1) Tanks can be seen from the orbital map thing. You can even see infantry now and then. Seriously, why are you wasting 10 lives before learning to spawn somewhere else? 2) No one has spare SP. It take >250m SP to max out everything (iirc). Make choices. 3-5) Teamwork > All. I have 5 million spare SP........ "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Zaaeed Massani RisingSuns Dark Taboo 130	Posted - 2014.04.10 09:11:00 - [32] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: 1) Tanks can be seen from the orbital map thing. You can even see infantry now and then. Seriously, why are you wasting 10 lives before learning to spawn somewhere else? 2) No one has spare SP. It take >250m SP to max out everything (iirc). Make choices. 3-5) Teamwork > All. Doesn't mean anyone is going to CHOOSE to max out everything... Proud Federal Marine & Republic Commando / Do you even lift?
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2694	Posted - 2014.04.10 09:50:00 - [33] - Quote Zaaeed Massani wrote: Vulpes Dolosus wrote: 1) Tanks can be seen from the orbital map thing. You can even see infantry now and then. Seriously, why are you wasting 10 lives before learning to spawn somewhere else? 2) No one has spare SP. It take >250m SP to max out everything (iirc). Make choices. 3-5) Teamwork > All. Doesn't mean anyone is going to CHOOSE to max out everything... In 1.5 I chose to start investing in FG. Spent my next 2M on proto forges and an ADV basic heavy frame, when I would much have preferred to max out my tank fittings instead. I can still solo a tank without issues. Some tanks I have a problem with. Some tanks I have an issue killing now in my rail tank - sometimes you find rail tanks entrenched in the redline in some headglitch-y position and it takes a friend to shift them, either by outflanking or sheer DPS. And for those saying 'how any people does it take to operate a tank' what do you say when you 2v1 other tanks and win? Does that mean my tank is OP but theirs are gimped? ak.0 4 LYFE RARITY IS BEST PONE
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 793	Posted - 2014.04.10 10:36:00 - [34] - Quote I'd say the point is moot until they actually fix forge guns (current skill bug makes them unusable) After 1.7 if you had proficiency in them (I had 5) and were running advanced or proto forges you could most of the time kill bad tankers. Some tankers were still unkillable since all the other elements of HAV's - formidable speed, 5 second recall (even while under fire!) and hardener cycling meant you could just duck out of line of sight for a few seconds to recharge (or just recall your vehicle). Add to this the low ammo counts of the AV weapon and you're not going to be killing many tanks at all. If you're serious about killing tanks just get another tank - as of this moment it's cheaper and more efficient - it can also kill infantry... oh and once you're done killing tanks, just spend 5 seconds recalling it - you can't do that with your AV suit without a supply depot!
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 904	Posted - 2014.04.10 11:09:00 - [35] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Skilling into AV is necessary for killing tanks. You complain because you wish not to skill into AV, and would rather AV be buffed to 1.6 levels when a Militia Forge could drop a 900k ISK tabk/ads. No thanks? Edit: it's much like the scout hunter's dilemma. You wish for scouts to have a counter, you don't wish to skill into said counter, you die to thing you wish to not exist. Either Skill AV or stop complaining that you're dying to tanks. I have skilled into AV but since 1.7 RE's works better AND its more fun. I really like the cat and mouse game with tanks.
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1827	Posted - 2014.04.10 11:21:00 - [36] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Skilling into AV is necessary for killing tanks. You complain because you wish not to skill into AV, and would rather AV be buffed to 1.6 levels when a Militia Forge could drop a 900k ISK tabk/ads. No thanks? Edit: it's much like the scout hunter's dilemma. You wish for scouts to have a counter, you don't wish to skill into said counter, you die to thing you wish to not exist. Either Skill AV or stop complaining that you're dying to tanks. Point is people shouldn't have to skill into dealing with something when the problem is the prevalence of something in the first place. Something is causing the problem in the game. You don't fix it in the game with ther make-believe stuff. You fix the damn product. Brick tanking a scout suit since April 2013!
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 365	Posted - 2014.04.10 11:39:00 - [37] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: "would require me to invest in something other than assault rifles and I'd have to actually make an effort to cooperate with others" Err, Just pointing out the obvious here, but this is an MMO, you're supposed to co-operate with other, and secondly, No one is an island, you cannot win a battle on your own, Thirdly, you will eventually spec into AV. You may only have Assault rifles now, but in time if you keep playing, that will not be so. Of the main light weapons, only 2 am i NOT proto in. Tanks are not so tough, you learn to take measure that work well, 1 suit is capable of laying 15 proxy mines , bye bye tank, and when you have 2 or 3 people laying mines, well...... I've lost count how many times I've done this, then theres the swarms and forgers lying in wait as we know they're about. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 2333	Posted - 2014.04.10 11:59:00 - [38] - Quote you don 't skill into av to kill tanks you spec into tanks to kill tanks.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Dirt Nap Squad. 785	Posted - 2014.04.10 12:35:00 - [39] - Quote Speedddogg wrote: So I sometimes complain about tanks after dying to them immediately as I spawn. (On the eleventh time, I managed to cloak just before they killed me, and started messing with them. Of course I only have so much stamina, and I eventually got a missile to the face.) Well here's a few reasons why skilling into AV doesn't really fix that. 1. Most of the time, they'll shoot you upon spawn. Even if you spawn at the MCC. I got blasted once mid-fall. 2. You're implying that I have spare SP. No... I don't. And if I did, it wouldn't be put into a class that I only use when I need to take out an annoying tank. 3. AVV (Anti-vehicle Vehicle) doesn't work if there's more then one tank. They just gang up on you. 4. You can't do it alone. I have a heavy suit with a forge just for tanks (and the occasional forge sniping. Hey, if you're just sitting there, you deserve to die. Especially if you've sniped me five times), but it takes five shots from my militia forge (Like I said, I don't have the SP to get to weapon level five and get the Heavy Weapons skill. I'm busy trying to get to Scout level 3 so I have more then just a railgun and advanced nova knives on my suit with the cloak), to destroy a militia tank. And believe it or not, some tankers have actually gone beyond that point! GASP! Shocking I know. The problem is, there needs to be more then one person shooting. And for some reason, my teammates don't think to get something out to wreck the tank. 5. If you try to destroy a tank, the infantry will destroy you. The best weapon I can get on my heavy besides the forge is a Advanced Magsec SMG. Now I know tanks are supposed to be a terrifying force that can turn the tides of battle. Its just that when there are four tanks roaming the map, and every member of my team is in hiding, hoping the tanks don't notice them, its a problem. And I, and most others, can't really do anything about it. So the next time somebody says "SKILL INTO AV TO FIGHT TANKS", well.... I'll probably hunt them down and stab them in the back, because I am so tired of hearing that. The only real downside for tanks is... dear god they're harder to control then a LAV with a fuel injector (Although that is amazingly fun. I bounced myself onto a building once by getting out of my LAV after it started rolling). After fitting a Rail Sica, I've found out why tankers get so annoyed when I jump onto their turrets. AV is still in a bad place regardless of the nerfs to hardeners and rail range. Can't imagine anything less than proto actually killing a skilled tanker, or even a well fit sica or soma. Hopefully a few more months and they will finally have a real working solution to the imbalance. But don't forget proximity mines. They can be a powerful asset against even the best of tankers that feel there is no threat about. Good placements, IE entrances to cities, or other structures that funnel a tank into a tight area. Or bait them into prox mines with the thought of an easy kill. Although not all tankers will fall for it, it does give them pause and force them to either go around, shoot them, or try to tank the damage. Just have your AV nades and swarms handy. Another tip, use STD prox mines and ADV prox mines. You can lay like 9 down at a time or something like that. Plenty to blow up a tank, or send it back limpin. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 1402	Posted - 2014.04.10 12:52:00 - [40] - Quote Speedddogg wrote: So I sometimes complain about tanks after dying to them immediately as I spawn. (On the eleventh time, I managed to cloak just before they killed me, and started messing with them. Of course I only have so much stamina, and I eventually got a missile to the face.) Well here's a few reasons why skilling into AV doesn't really fix that. 1. Most of the time, they'll shoot you upon spawn. Even if you spawn at the MCC. I got blasted once mid-fall. 2. You're implying that I have spare SP. No... I don't. And if I did, it wouldn't be put into a class that I only use when I need to take out an annoying tank. 3. AVV (Anti-vehicle Vehicle) doesn't work if there's more then one tank. They just gang up on you. 4. You can't do it alone. I have a heavy suit with a forge just for tanks (and the occasional forge sniping. Hey, if you're just sitting there, you deserve to die. Especially if you've sniped me five times), but it takes five shots from my militia forge (Like I said, I don't have the SP to get to weapon level five and get the Heavy Weapons skill. I'm busy trying to get to Scout level 3 so I have more then just a railgun and advanced nova knives on my suit with the cloak), to destroy a militia tank. And believe it or not, some tankers have actually gone beyond that point! GASP! Shocking I know. The problem is, there needs to be more then one person shooting. And for some reason, my teammates don't think to get something out to wreck the tank. 5. If you try to destroy a tank, the infantry will destroy you. The best weapon I can get on my heavy besides the forge is a Advanced Magsec SMG. Now I know tanks are supposed to be a terrifying force that can turn the tides of battle. Its just that when there are four tanks roaming the map, and every member of my team is in hiding, hoping the tanks don't notice them, its a problem. And I, and most others, can't really do anything about it. So the next time somebody says "SKILL INTO AV TO FIGHT TANKS", well.... I'll probably hunt them down and stab them in the back, because I am so tired of hearing that. The only real downside for tanks is... dear god they're harder to control then a LAV with a fuel injector (Although that is amazingly fun. I bounced myself onto a building once by getting out of my LAV after it started rolling). After fitting a Rail Sica, I've found out why tankers get so annoyed when I jump onto their turrets. By AV you mean a Free LAV and Remotes ?! It's a lot cheaper than speccing into Swarms and Forges

Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 457	Posted - 2014.04.10 13:30:00 - [41] - Quote Zaaeed Massani wrote: True Adamance wrote: Zaaeed Massani wrote: Good players can make anything feel OP. Always has been that way in PvP games, and it always will. Yeah most people cannot believe that my best games came out of 1.4-1.6 against that really powerful long range AV....and where or not they want to admit it HAV have always been the best counter of enemy tanks...... Best counter for a scout? Another scout. Best counter for a sniper? Another sniper. Best counter for a vehicle? Another vehicle. There's no trend here. None at all. Move along. Because, that's why.
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 457	Posted - 2014.04.10 15:03:00 - [42] - Quote negative49er wrote: I'm having difficulty with my proto swarms or is i just me Help No, it is not just you and there is no help. Swarms by themselves are not viable, they can work in conjunction with some other measure. Because, that's why.
Rifter7 Ancient Exiles. Dirt Nap Squad. 377	Posted - 2014.04.10 15:16:00 - [43] - Quote you can't balance a game on pubs.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 6532	Posted - 2014.04.10 15:18:00 - [44] - Quote Rifter7 wrote: you can't balance a game on pubs. It shouldn't revolve on a gamemode that a small subset of the community participates in either. #LivingLikeLarry [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 152	Posted - 2014.04.10 16:44:00 - [45] - Quote Zaaeed Massani wrote: True Adamance wrote: Zaaeed Massani wrote: Good players can make anything feel OP. Always has been that way in PvP games, and it always will. Yeah most people cannot believe that my best games came out of 1.4-1.6 against that really powerful long range AV....and where or not they want to admit it HAV have always been the best counter of enemy tanks...... Best counter for a scout? Another scout. Best counter for a sniper? Another sniper. Best counter for a vehicle? Another vehicle. There's no trend here. None at all. Move along. Sure I'll bite: Best Counter For a scout? Anything other then a swarm launcher AV grenade or proxy mine. The notion that the best counter for a scout is a scout is completely made up, plenty of different suit and weapon styles can wreck a scout. Best Counter For a Sniper? This depends, is it a douchebag redline sniper far in the back? Well you need a weapon that can reach them since they nerfed Forge Range so a sniper makes sense. If the redline douchebag is hiding behind the crest of the highest hill and exploiting the FOV to make counter sniping impossible, well you can always try suiciding a dropship into them. For any sniper not being a douchebag newberry sniper, (IE actually moving around the map to assist the front line) like the scout anything other then a swarm launcher av grenade or proxy mine will destroy them. Best Counter for a Vehicle? Another Vehicle really?! Is that the best way to counter LAVs? Or Dropships even? Only Derpships think crashing into other Derpships is productive. And LAVs are not broken so AV is actually good against them since they got rid of the passive resist bumble bee monster from pre 1.7. Now it is true that the best counter, especially against a triple repped maddy is a rail/missle tank but here's the thing about your fail analogy. Only tanks are the best at killing other tanks, everything else has many options so pick your poison. As the saying goes, "One of these things isn't like the others, one of these things just doesn't belong." Is it coughtankscough? Surely they are a necessary edition to an fps with a player cap of 16v16.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Dirt Nap Squad. 786	Posted - 2014.04.10 17:20:00 - [46] - Quote Atiim wrote: Rifter7 wrote: you can't balance a game on pubs. It shouldn't revolve on a gamemode that a small subset of the community participates in either. You also fail to realize the imbalances gear makes. I know people hate PC, namely because they can't break into it, but it is a good basis for balance. Why? Because the only differences between teams are the skill and tactics they use. Everyone WILL be running the best of the best, much unlike the typical pub match. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 152	Posted - 2014.04.10 17:33:00 - [47] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Atiim wrote: Rifter7 wrote: you can't balance a game on pubs. It shouldn't revolve on a gamemode that a small subset of the community participates in either. You also fail to realize the imbalances gear makes. I know people hate PC, namely because they can't break into it, but it is a good basis for balance. Why? Because the only differences between teams are the skill and tactics they use. Everyone WILL be running the best of the best, much unlike the typical pub match. Oh so flaylocks and potato cannons are balanced in PC? Get out of here with that ****, the imbalances in gear exist because CCP doesn't into balance. Like I said tanks are force multipliers, if you have two equally skilled teams the one with the most tanks will win, period. That's how force multipliers work. In MAG and Planetside 2 a force multiplier is fine because your average human no matter how hardcore into this game they are is going to have trouble mass coordinating. This game is far too small in level design and player caps to balance the power that tanks have as force multipliers. This game has a lot of good concepts, but it's pretty much the facebook Zynga of console shooters. A game for try hards wouldn't penalize players for playing a lot and it wouldn't reward players for not playing the game.
IR Scifi Knights of Eternal Darkness League of Infamy 139	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:24:00 - [48] - Quote Can I at least complain about useless my plasma cannon feels against armor tanks?
Rusty Shallows 1478	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:35:00 - [49] - Quote Contaminator Aquarius wrote: snip 2) If you are getting spawn killed on Domination or Skirmish matches because they are being camped, that is SOMETHING TO TAKE UP WITH MAP DEVELOPMENT, not AV/Tank balancing. We had map discussions last year, so many of them. Based on CCPs nerfing pattern that is not a valid counter-point. Regardless what we think about it. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
Rusty Shallows 1478	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:38:00 - [50] - Quote IR Scifi wrote: Can I at least complain about useless my plasma cannon feels against armor tanks? No. PLC & Flaylock users do not get to vote or express their emotions. Return to the subterranean getto cities we keep your kind in. If only CCP had listened to me those Commandos wouldn't have pulled off that exodus. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>

Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 6557	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:45:00 - [51] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: You also fail to realize the imbalances gear makes. I know people hate PC, namely because they can't break into it, but it is a good basis for balance. Why? Because the only differences between teams are the skill and tactics they use. Everyone WILL be running the best of the best, much unlike the typical pub match. Who says I hate PC? if it weren't for the fact that most of the good players in my corp quit, we'd probably be fighting the Doughnut right now as we speak. That still doesn't change the fact that if you balance around Planetary Conquest, it would force nearly the entire playerbase to play an imbalanced game for the sake of about 3-500 people. Although, balancing on a 1v1 scale wouldn't really break things for either PC, FW, or PUBs. #LivingLikeLarry [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Marc Rime 372	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:46:00 - [52] - Quote IR Scifi wrote: Can I at least complain about useless my plasma cannon feels against armor tanks? Do you mean how even the most sluggish target in the game has enough acceleration to dodge your shots? Or how, when they can't be bothered to do that, the damage is barely noticeable and pretty much instantly repaired? ;)
Assault Swarm Launcher 29	Posted - 2014.04.10 19:46:00 - [53] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: IR Scifi wrote: Can I at least complain about useless my plasma cannon feels against armor tanks? No. PLC & Flaylock users do not get to vote or express their emotions. Return to the subterranean getto cities we keep your kind in. If only CCP had listened to me those Commandos wouldn't have pulled off that exodus. It's not that bad. Despite the horrible living conditions, we're pretty friendly people. [...]
Pocket Rocket Girl Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 76	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:11:00 - [54] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: negative49er wrote: I'm having difficulty with my proto swarms or is i just me Help Minmatar commando. Reload bonus + damage buff. Reload bonus allows youto reload before shields start regenning, and Dmg bonus makes individual missiles stop shield regen. Best part is even with std swarms you can stop shields thx to only thing changing being missile count. Also, swarm Op decreasing lock times is almost necessary. That is what i use, a proto dual swarm minn commando, it does wonders against tanks
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core 642	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:11:00 - [55] - Quote CCP make A heavy forgegun starterfit please A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. GalHeav E-vo
Pocket Rocket Girl Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 76	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:15:00 - [56] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: Dont bother skilling into AV. It will not help. My AV suits consits of proto swarm with 2 complex dmg mods and it still sucks learn how to use it. i have been AV since i started this game and with all the changes i still find a way to take tanks down
Jenza's Pants The Hetairoi 152	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:17:00 - [57] - Quote What does the triple rep maddy say to proto swarms? TROLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO
Martin0 Brancaleone Maphia Clan Corporation 522	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:23:00 - [58] - Quote How to kill tanks with the minimal skill and Skill Points. 1- Skill into advanced Remote explosives 2- buy militia lav 3- call militia lav 4- strap REs to lav 5- drive lav into tank 6- tank is no more. I do that when i'm really pissed and/or the enemy team is spamming tanks. Oh and i killed a maddy with a militia swarm launcher yesterday, its not that hard if you actually COOPERATE with your TEAM.
IR Scifi Knights of Eternal Darkness League of Infamy 140	Posted - 2014.04.10 20:48:00 - [59] - Quote Marc Rime wrote: IR Scifi wrote: Can I at least complain about useless my plasma cannon feels against armor tanks? Do you mean how even the most sluggish target in the game has enough acceleration to dodge your shots? Or how, when they can't be bothered to do that, the damage is barely noticeable and pretty much instantly repaired? ;) Or my personal favorite, "No damage for you!" Guess I'll go shuffle off to my hole then, I hear the c.h.u.d's aren't so bad once you get to know them.
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 160	Posted - 2014.04.10 21:32:00 - [60] - Quote Martin0 Brancaleone wrote: How to kill tanks with the minimal skill and Skill Points. 1- Skill into advanced Remote explosives 2- buy militia lav 3- call militia lav 4- strap REs to lav 5- drive lav into tank 6- tank is no more. I do that when i'm really pissed and/or the enemy team is spamming tanks. Oh and i killed a maddy with a militia swarm launcher yesterday, its not that hard if you actually COOPERATE with your TEAM. Jihad Jeeps only work when the tanker has poor situational awareness aka a bad tanker. You can set up a perfect ambush, but this relies on the enemy team to be too derpy to shoot your REs, either way it's about as useful as cooking grenades and throwing them at the last second, true its likely to kill most suits, but they can easily kill you in the time it takes for you to suicide bomb them. As to the second one, I've killed a tank with a Mass driver using "teamwork," just because you got the last hit with a swarm while the tank was getting pounded by a rail gun doesn't mean swarm launchers are balanced.



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