DUST Search - Mythbusting concerning Tankers

MarasdF Loron wrote:

Disclaimer: The following myths mostly only concern public matches. I do not claim to speak for every tanker out there, and I most certainly do not and will not speak for any MLT "tanker" out there.

The myths

All tankers think that it should require multiple people to take down a tank:

- Busted, some think that but I bet most of us just wants a fair chance to get away from a single AV guy, just like infantry has fair chance of getting away from infantry and Blaster fire (I will return to this later on).

All tankers think tanks are perfectly fine now:

- Busted, hardeners are absolutely not fine right now and the acceleration is arguably too fast.

Tankers love 1.7 tanks (and tank vs AV balance) and would never give them up if possible:

- Busted, many of us wants the days of pre-1.7 back, it was more fun and only required some minor tweaking to make it balanced. Instead both AV and tankers were slapped on the face.

All tankers think that redline Railing in general is acceptable:

- Busted, many of us consider it cowardice and pathetic, also it's a broken mechanic (as I shall point it out later on).

Infantry has no way of taking out tanks:

- Busted, there are ways out there, other than the JLAV, which does work wonders actually, anyway, explore the options.

Blasters will kill anything instantly:

- Busted, only for the anything part tho, but they will only kill stuff instantly when the hit detection works. even then, if you have any sort of tankiness you will survive at least 2-3 seconds unless you just stand there out in the open, and for that you can only blame yourself. Rail Rifles kill any kind of infantry faster, just not at the same extreme ranges that Blasters are capable of if you stand still.

Tanks are godmode now:

- Plausible, stacking hardeneres currently has no downsides, maybe SoonGäó. But even that has limited power, or rather uptime.

Blasters got buffed in 1.7

- Plausible, hit detection got fixed for some, and broken further for some (including myself), rendering was mostly fixed. So why not confirmed? Well, in return skill that increases Large Turret damage got removed, Blaster variants got removed, meaning less damage cause everyone used the Scattered variant which dealt more damage.

MLT tanks are OP for their price:

- Confirmed, they get close to the same amount of firepower and durability (with the right kind of fitting) as maxed out tankers get, for mere 70k ISK.

Railguns are OP now and redline Railing is a broken mechanic:

- Confirmed, Railgun RoF is ridiculous and redline railing makes you fall under the godmode category if you know what you are doing, only gods can kill gods.

Swarms are broken:

- Confirmed, Judge Rhadamanthus did a damn fine job confirming that.

Let me know of any more myths that need busting/confirming cause I am sure I did not cover them all yet.

Leave all negative comments about tanks in the bin marked " TRASH " and we'll get to it as soon as possible . Thank You

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MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 241	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:51:00 - [1] - Quote *Disclaimer: The following myths mostly only concern public matches. I do not claim to speak for every tanker out there, and I most certainly do not and will not speak for any MLT "tanker" out there.* The myths All tankers think that it should require multiple people to take down a tank: - Busted, some think that but I bet most of us just wants a fair chance to get away from a single AV guy, just like infantry has fair chance of getting away from infantry and Blaster fire (I will return to this later on). All tankers think tanks are perfectly fine now: - Busted, hardeners are absolutely not fine right now and the acceleration is arguably too fast. Tankers love 1.7 tanks (and tank vs AV balance) and would never give them up if possible: - Busted, many of us wants the days of pre-1.7 back, it was more fun and only required some minor tweaking to make it balanced. Instead both AV and tankers were slapped on the face. Infantry has no way of taking out tanks: - Busted, there are ways out there, other than the JLAV, which does work wonders actually, anyway, explore the options. Blasters will kill anything instantly: - Busted, only for the anything part tho, but they will only kill stuff instantly when the hit detection works. even then, if you have any sort of tankiness you will survive at least 2-3 seconds unless you just stand there out in the open, and for that you can only blame yourself. Rail Rifles kill any kind of infantry faster, just not at the same extreme ranges that Blasters are capable of if you stand still. Tanks are godmode now: - Plausible, stacking hardeneres currently has no downsides, maybe SoonGäó. But even that has limited power, or rather uptime. Blasters got buffed in 1.7 - Plausible, hit detection got fixed for some, and broken further for some (including myself), rendering was mostly fixed. So why not confirmed? Well, in return skill that increases Large Turret damage got removed, Blaster variants got removed, meaning less damage cause everyone used the Scattered variant which dealt more damage. MLT tanks are OP for their price: - Confirmed, they get close to the same amount of firepower and durability (with the right kind of fitting) as maxed out tankers get, for mere 70k ISK. Railguns are OP now and redline railing is a broken mechanic: - Confirmed, Railgun RoF is ridiculous and redline railing makes you fall under the godmode category if you know what you are doing, only gods can kill gods. Swarms are broken: - Confirmed, Judge Rhadamanthus did a damn fine job confirming that. Let me know of any more myths that need busting/confirming cause I am sure I did not cover them all yet. R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2791	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:56:00 - [2] - Quote I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Takron Nistrom Tinfoil Hatz 273	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:56:00 - [3] - Quote No sources? Seems like another opinion thread. Nothing busted here folks. Keep moving. GÇ£Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)GÇ¥ GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 241	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:58:00 - [4] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
Ander Thedas Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 350	Posted - 2014.03.21 19:59:00 - [5] - Quote Wow, the agenda is very prominent in this post. FW lvl10 reward Mobile Redlines Default FWRace
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2791	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:00:00 - [6] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O I can, simply because it happens. Your telling me MLT blaster had that kind of range in 1.6? "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 241	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:02:00 - [7] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O I can, simply because it happens. Your telling me MLT blaster had that kind of range in 1.6? Every normal Blaster variant had this kind of range in 1.6, we just couldn't see past 50m at the best of times, at the worst we couldn't see what was direclty in front of us cause of rendering. R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 241	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:05:00 - [8] - Quote Ander Thedas wrote: Wow, the agenda is very prominent in this post. Yeah, I want to stop the pointless accusations here on the forums, from both sides. R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle United Brotherhood Alliance 346	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:11:00 - [9] - Quote I have 10m sp in vehicles and I agree with everything the op has said. In some ways things are better, in most ways things are much much worse.
Crimson ShieId Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 242	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:13:00 - [10] - Quote Blasters did get a pretty decent buff in 1.7, both in range and damage. Militia blasters only used to do about 88 damage I believe (Without modules of course) though for the most part, the damage stayed pretty close to what it is now. Range was definitely increased though, or damage dropoff, take your pick, unless the scattered ion cannon was just that bad when it came to range before (I never used anything else, so I'm not 100% on this one) Nova Knives are OP! Nerf em before you lose all your proto suits!

MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 242	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:16:00 - [11] - Quote Crimson ShieId wrote: Blasters did get a pretty decent buff in 1.7, both in range and damage. Militia blasters only used to do about 88 damage I believe (Without modules of course) though for the most part, the damage stayed pretty close to what it is now. Range was definitely increased though, or damage dropoff, take your pick, unless the scattered ion cannon was just that bad when it came to range before (I never used anything else, so I'm not 100% on this one) Well, I have to say that I don't really remember the exact damage value of MLT Blaster but that doesn't account for anything. And yes, the Scattered variant did have a poor performance at range because at and near it's max range many of your "bullets" missed as well. Not to mention the horrible rendering without someone scanning. R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
Godin Thekiller OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1912	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:17:00 - [12] - Quote Blasters got nerfed actually. If you don't believe me, look up the old stats for it. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 406	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:28:00 - [13] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: *Disclaimer: The following myths mostly only concern public matches. I do not claim to speak for every tanker out there, and I most certainly do not and will not speak for any MLT "tanker" out there.* The myths All tankers think that it should require multiple people to take down a tank: - Busted, some think that but I bet most of us just wants a fair chance to get away from a single AV guy, just like infantry has fair chance of getting away from infantry and Blaster fire (I will return to this later on). All tankers think tanks are perfectly fine now: - Busted, hardeners are absolutely not fine right now and the acceleration is arguably too fast. Tankers love 1.7 tanks (and tank vs AV balance) and would never give them up if possible: - Busted, many of us wants the days of pre-1.7 back, it was more fun and only required some minor tweaking to make it balanced. Instead both AV and tankers were slapped on the face. All tankers think that redline Railing in general is acceptable: - Busted, many of us consider it cowardice and pathetic, also it's a broken mechanic (as I shall point it out later on). Infantry has no way of taking out tanks: - Busted, there are ways out there, other than the JLAV, which does work wonders actually, anyway, explore the options. Blasters will kill anything instantly: - Busted, only for the anything part tho, but they will only kill stuff instantly when the hit detection works. even then, if you have any sort of tankiness you will survive at least 2-3 seconds unless you just stand there out in the open, and for that you can only blame yourself. Rail Rifles kill any kind of infantry faster, just not at the same extreme ranges that Blasters are capable of if you stand still. Tanks are godmode now: - Plausible, stacking hardeneres currently has no downsides, maybe SoonGäó. But even that has limited power, or rather uptime. Blasters got buffed in 1.7 - Plausible, hit detection got fixed for some, and broken further for some (including myself), rendering was mostly fixed. So why not confirmed? Well, in return skill that increases Large Turret damage got removed, Blaster variants got removed, meaning less damage cause everyone used the Scattered variant which dealt more damage. MLT tanks are OP for their price: - Confirmed, they get close to the same amount of firepower and durability (with the right kind of fitting) as maxed out tankers get, for mere 70k ISK. Railguns are OP now and redline Railing is a broken mechanic: - Confirmed, Railgun RoF is ridiculous and redline railing makes you fall under the godmode category if you know what you are doing, only gods can kill gods. Swarms are broken: - Confirmed, Judge Rhadamanthus did a damn fine job confirming that. Let me know of any more myths that need busting/confirming cause I am sure I did not cover them all yet. Can I agree with you ..??.. Confirmed . Leave all negative comments about tanks in the bin marked " TRASH " and we'll get to it as soon as possible . Thank You
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 406	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:29:00 - [14] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Blasters got nerfed actually. If you don't believe me, look up the old stats for it. I noticed that too . Leave all negative comments about tanks in the bin marked " TRASH " and we'll get to it as soon as possible . Thank You
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 406	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:30:00 - [15] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: Ander Thedas wrote: Wow, the agenda is very prominent in this post. Yeah, I want to stop the pointless accusations here on the forums, from both sides. Agreed . Maybe I should have just left that up to you . Good Job indeed . Leave all negative comments about tanks in the bin marked " TRASH " and we'll get to it as soon as possible . Thank You
Godin Thekiller OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1914	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:33:00 - [16] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Blasters got nerfed actually. If you don't believe me, look up the old stats for it. I noticed that too . It wasn't that they got buffed, it was that their accuracy got buffed. What I mean is that since you can move slower (because you're not being hurt as bad due to broken hardeners), you're pretty much good to go to just sit and aim well. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 408	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:47:00 - [17] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: Crimson ShieId wrote: Blasters did get a pretty decent buff in 1.7, both in range and damage. Militia blasters only used to do about 88 damage I believe (Without modules of course) though for the most part, the damage stayed pretty close to what it is now. Range was definitely increased though, or damage dropoff, take your pick, unless the scattered ion cannon was just that bad when it came to range before (I never used anything else, so I'm not 100% on this one) Well, I have to say that I don't really remember the exact damage value of MLT Blaster but that doesn't account for anything. And yes, the Scattered variant did have a poor performance at range because at and near it's max range many of your "bullets" missed as well. Not to mention the horrible rendering without someone scanning. True so true . I use to love the scattered blaster though but you are right . Leave all negative comments about tanks in the bin marked " TRASH " and we'll get to it as soon as possible . Thank You
Bruttuss Brutor the stealth ninjas clan 2	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:49:00 - [18] - Quote This is a simple solution, but the guys how ride around killing infantry in a tank will not like this. Get rid of the blaster on tanks completely. In the end that's really all its used for. And whoever says that a blaster on a tank is not overpowered is two things, a dumb ass or, as I just said, someone that uses it to ride around and kill infantry. Ive done it my self, and nothing can touch you but a higher level blaster or a rail tank. sometimes an assault dropship, but it needs to have a proto weapon. And not only that but a lot of times teams are very unevenly matched, so you gotta think, sometimes newer guys don't always have access to call in a rail tank or even know how to build a good tank nor have the bank (isk) to build them. Then you have guys that say you just don't know how to tank. Thats BS, any body can ride around in god mode, in there blaster tank killing infantry. Like i said I have done it before to but I don't do it anymore because if you really think about it your just abusing the mistakes ccp have made. I know for a fact, the people that say this isn't a problem, are the people that do it. I use my tank to take out other tanks and installations, not killing infantry. Anybody that rides around killing infantry in a tank is a coward. Yea I said it.
XxWarlordxX97 4215	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:49:00 - [19] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: *Disclaimer: The following myths mostly only concern public matches. I do not claim to speak for every tanker out there, and I most certainly do not and will not speak for any MLT "tanker" out there.* The myths All tankers think that it should require multiple people to take down a tank: - Busted, some think that but I bet most of us just wants a fair chance to get away from a single AV guy, just like infantry has fair chance of getting away from infantry and Blaster fire (I will return to this later on). All tankers think tanks are perfectly fine now: - Busted, hardeners are absolutely not fine right now and the acceleration is arguably too fast. Tankers love 1.7 tanks (and tank vs AV balance) and would never give them up if possible: - Busted, many of us wants the days of pre-1.7 back, it was more fun and only required some minor tweaking to make it balanced. Instead both AV and tankers were slapped on the face. All tankers think that redline Railing in general is acceptable: - Busted, many of us consider it cowardice and pathetic, also it's a broken mechanic (as I shall point it out later on). Infantry has no way of taking out tanks: - Busted, there are ways out there, other than the JLAV, which does work wonders actually, anyway, explore the options. Blasters will kill anything instantly: - Busted, only for the anything part tho, but they will only kill stuff instantly when the hit detection works. even then, if you have any sort of tankiness you will survive at least 2-3 seconds unless you just stand there out in the open, and for that you can only blame yourself. Rail Rifles kill any kind of infantry faster, just not at the same extreme ranges that Blasters are capable of if you stand still. Tanks are godmode now: - Plausible, stacking hardeneres currently has no downsides, maybe SoonGäó. But even that has limited power, or rather uptime. Blasters got buffed in 1.7 - Plausible, hit detection got fixed for some, and broken further for some (including myself), rendering was mostly fixed. So why not confirmed? Well, in return skill that increases Large Turret damage got removed, Blaster variants got removed, meaning less damage cause everyone used the Scattered variant which dealt more damage. MLT tanks are OP for their price: - Confirmed, they get close to the same amount of firepower and durability (with the right kind of fitting) as maxed out tankers get, for mere 70k ISK. Railguns are OP now and redline Railing is a broken mechanic: - Confirmed, Railgun RoF is ridiculous and redline railing makes you fall under the godmode category if you know what you are doing, only gods can kill gods. Swarms are broken: - Confirmed, Judge Rhadamanthus did a damn fine job confirming that. Let me know of any more myths that need busting/confirming cause I am sure I did not cover them all yet. My Sica is to much isk Elite heavy "I don't rage.I get even" I will ring for A.E. for 1 to 2 million I love the Caldari Sentinel
Godin Thekiller OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1915	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:51:00 - [20] - Quote Bruttuss Brutor wrote: This is a simple solution, but the guys how ride around killing infantry in a tank will not like this. Get rid of the blaster on tanks completely. In the end that's really all its used for. And whoever says that a blaster on a tank is not overpowered is two things, a dumb ass or, as I just said, someone that uses it to ride around and kill infantry. Ive done it my self, and nothing can touch you but a higher level blaster or a rail tank. sometimes an assault dropship, but it needs to have a proto weapon. And not only that but a lot of times teams are very unevenly matched, so you gotta think, sometimes newer guys don't always have access to call in a rail tank or even know how to build a good tank nor have the bank (isk) to build them. Then you have guys that say you just don't know how to tank. Thats BS, any body can ride around in god mode, in there blaster tank killing infantry. Like i said I have done it before to but I don't do it anymore because if you really think about it your just abusing the mistakes ccp have made. I know for a fact, the people that say this isn't a problem, are the people that do it. I use my tank to take out other tanks and installations, not killing infantry. Anybody that rides around killing infantry in a tank is a coward. Yea I said it. lolno click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-

Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2793	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:52:00 - [21] - Quote MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O I can, simply because it happens. Your telling me MLT blaster had that kind of range in 1.6? Every normal Blaster variant had this kind of range in 1.6, we just couldn't see past 50m at the best of times, at the worst we couldn't see what was direclty in front of us cause of rendering. Maybe a stable blaster could maintain the same dmg from that range, but a normal one could not. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 1056	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:53:00 - [22] - Quote Agreed on everything I know enough about to agree on. Biggest problem is broken/nerfed AV and "windows of opportunity that are an epoch We definitely need more discussions like this one that leave hard feelings behind and try to work on common solutions for the benefit of all players. Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Black SlaverX Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 80	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:54:00 - [23] - Quote If CCP nerfed large blaster turrets, all infantry QQ about tanks would stop instantly. Yep. Yes it would. Look I guarantee you it would. Watch your back because I might be there.
Benjamin Ciscko Fatal Absolution 1902	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:54:00 - [24] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O I can, simply because it happens. Your telling me MLT blaster had that kind of range in 1.6? They were too busy getting r@ped from 300m away by Proto Swarms that could 6-7 shot the best most expensive fits. Team carry Prof. IV I am a carried scrub!
Scout Registry Nos Nothi 1738	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:56:00 - [25] - Quote Myth: Tankers prefer books with pictures.
Nothing Certain Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 331	Posted - 2014.03.21 20:57:00 - [26] - Quote The first 4 go from busted to confined by merely replacing "all" with "many. ' ll answer the rest later. Because, that's why.
MarasdF Loron Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 253	Posted - 2014.03.21 21:02:00 - [27] - Quote Nothing Certain wrote: The first 4 go from busted to confined by merely replacing "all" with "many. ' ll answer the rest later. Many =/= most. Hence I decided to use all, I could replace it with most tho. Would that make you feel better? R.I.P. Pre-1.7 tanks, you will be missed.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 716	Posted - 2014.03.21 21:05:00 - [28] - Quote Kudos on being a tanker with common sense, and someone that seems to merely want balance for the game. Looking for the scout hangout?
Glitch116 On The Brink CRONOS. 103	Posted - 2014.03.21 21:05:00 - [29] - Quote Black SlaverX wrote: If CCP nerfed large blaster turrets(like 20% efficiency versus infantry), all infantry QQ about tanks would stop instantly. Yep. Yes it would. Look I guarantee you it would. that would not solve anything if a blaster does 100 damge shot and is reduce by 20% that is still 80 damage going on to a target that infantry cant fight normal so the same problem is still there lower blaster DPS does NOTHING to solve the problem the problem with blaster is not their DPS but how they apply it I AM THE KING OF THE BLASTER!!! deal with it
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8612	Posted - 2014.03.21 21:12:00 - [30] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: MarasdF Loron wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: I'm not going to comment, except on blasters. They got a buff and can now deal full dmg from 150m+ You can't honestly be telling yourself that? o.O I can, simply because it happens. Your telling me MLT blaster had that kind of range in 1.6? We could barely see past 50m pre 1.7 "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two



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