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Proof the RR is OP - Proto Breach AR vs. standard RR

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DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4142	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:21:00 - [1] - Quote CreoDron Breach Assault Rifle Damage - 56.1 HP Fire rate -400 RPM Accuracy - 58.0 Mag size - 36 Max Ammo - 300 Reload time - 3.0 s CPU - 90 gF PG - 13 kW Price - 77,280! ISK Standard Rail Rifle Damage - 55.00 HP Charge up - 0.25s Fire rate - 461.54 RPM Accuracy rating - 58.28 Mag size - 42 Max Ammo - 252 Reload time - 3.2 s CPU - 26 gF PG - 6 kW Price - 1,500 ISK The Stadard Rail Rifle has a higher fire rate, better accuracy costs a ton less, less requirements, better hipfire, bigger mag and loses to the CreoDron by only 1.1 damage... How did CCP expect the Rail Rifle to be balanced? Seriously the standard Rail Rifle is everything the PROTO Breach AR is and more. CCP, fix this, My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
IRON PATRIOT 1 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 97	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:25:00 - [2] - Quote They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining
Godin Thekiller OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1684	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:26:00 - [3] - Quote LOL 'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever! Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 425	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:27:00 - [4] - Quote Interesting balance question you ask, but why compare the base RR to the breach variant? A better comparison might be between base models, IMO, rather than a rarely-used variant. IMO, of course....Lead
LUGMOS YELLOW JESUS EXP FORCE 307	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:28:00 - [5] - Quote My boy, it is very simple. The RR was specialized as a breach weapon, while the assault rifle was not. It is merely a variant. The biggest threat to my scout is everything. [Q] <-- Drink Moar Quafe
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 1238	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:28:00 - [6] - Quote Yah but, the BAR has alwayse been a piece of junk, even at proto. {:)}{3GÇó>
Godin Thekiller OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 1686	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:29:00 - [7] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Interesting balance question you ask, but why compare the base RR to the breach variant? A better comparison might be between base models, IMO, rather than a rarely-used variant. IMO, of course....Lead Because the breach Plasma Rifle is the answer to the Caldari Rail Rifle, and th assault Rail Rifle is the answer to the Gallente Plasma Rifle. 'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever! Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4614	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:29:00 - [8] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4142	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:29:00 - [9] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining Because it's one of those herp derp moments that just.really needed to be thrown into light. I mean the proof that it was going to be OP was EXTREMELY obvious and glaring. Honestly... I was so distraught I had to share it with the wider community. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4142	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:32:00 - [10] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... What you all fail to realize is that the Assault variants of the AR are as good if not better than the AR itself. So why is the Breach AR not comparable to the RR? My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior

Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 425	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:34:00 - [11] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: Interesting balance question you ask, but why compare the base RR to the breach variant? A better comparison might be between base models, IMO, rather than a rarely-used variant. IMO, of course....Lead Because the breach Plasma Rifle is the answer to the Caldari Rail Rifle, and th assault Rail Rifle is the answer to the Gallente Plasma Rifle. Opinion, meta, blah. How many breach ARs do you see? The base AR (and GEK and Duo) are the most used variants, and as full auto weapons, compare much more directly to the RR both in terms of dynamics and frequency. Just seems much more logical to use a weapon you see on the battlefield and one that handles similarly.
Nosid Katona HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 78	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:38:00 - [12] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... Alright then why don't we compare the assault variants of the other rifles to the PR, cause the TAC, Burst, and Breach are all cheap knockoffs right? Would only stand to reason that the other races knockoffs are just as "cheap" as ours are of their rifles right? -_- Vae Victis Valor Vet, R.I.P MAG
Delanus Turgias Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 234	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:42:00 - [13] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Yah but, the BAR has alwayse been a piece of junk, even at proto. No. Once there was a time where the bluedots feared to tread, for the deadly creo breach AR could slay them at any time, at any distance. But seriously, breach ARs used to be OP, for all the same reasons the RR is OP. Closed Beta Vet since May, 2012 TEST Alliance Best Alliance Proud owner of essentially every BPO in Dust
Garth Mandra The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 328	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:47:00 - [14] - Quote Don't forget ranges. Standard RR has 62m optimal and 85m effective. Proto Breach AR has 48m optimal and 78m effective range.
Debacle Nano BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 673	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:47:00 - [15] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Yah but, the BAR has alwayse been a piece of junk, even at proto. Used to be the bomb in beta. Closed beta anyone?
The Eristic Sad Panda Solutions 184	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:55:00 - [16] - Quote Delanus Turgias wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Yah but, the BAR has alwayse been a piece of junk, even at proto. No. Once there was a time where the bluedots feared to tread, for the deadly creo breach AR could slay them at any time, at any distance. But seriously, breach ARs used to be OP, for all the same reasons the RR is OP. QFT. (Still, the Breach could use a reasonable ROF buff, imo, unless everything else will be getting ROF nerfs next patch. It is bloody Blaster tech, after all.)
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 1020	Posted - 2014.02.14 03:58:00 - [17] - Quote I would hold off from posting more RR threads until their nerf arrives. Focus on the CR instead.
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4620	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:06:00 - [18] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... What you all fail to realize is that the Assault variants of the AR are as good if not better than the AR itself. So why is the Breach AR not comparable to the RR? LOL not really . If i can go 35-5 with a Toxin AR with prof 3 and nothing else so can everybody. But people like running in the middle of open areas and start gun fights with RR users that are 70mts away... XD AR is the best of the Plasma rifles. Keep the fight inside the 30-40mts , hipfire and lulz .... Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4144	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:12:00 - [19] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... What you all fail to realize is that the Assault variants of the AR are as good if not better than the AR itself. So why is the Breach AR not comparable to the RR? AR is the best of the Plasma rifles. Well nobody told me... Yo, I meant that why are the Assault variants of the other rifles (ASCR, ACR, ARR) just as good if not better than the AR? Shouldn't they be worse? My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
Auris Lionesse Capital Acquisitions LLC Renegade Alliance 202	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:21:00 - [20] - Quote shame the rail is getting nerfed. It's the combat rifle that's op.

Debacle Nano BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 680	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:23:00 - [21] - Quote Wait.. isn't the only plasma rifle the AR? Or am I missing something? Closed beta anyone?
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4621	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:24:00 - [22] - Quote Nosid Katona wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: They said they were gonna nerf it why are you still complaining NOT ONLY THIS. But you are comparing a Gallente Cheap knockoff of a Caldari Main Riffle,with the actual REAL DEAL. Doesnt seem very fair. Compare it to other main rifles,like the SCR or CR..... Alright then why don't we compare the assault variants of the other rifles to the PR, cause the TAC, Burst, and Breach are all cheap knockoffs right? Would only stand to reason that the other races knockoffs are just as "cheap" as ours are of their rifles right? -_- True, the ASCR is a piece of crap compared to the Duvolle. Quote: ''Yo, I meant that why are the Assault variants of the other rifles (ASCR, ACR, ARR) just as good if not better than the AR? Shouldn't they be worse?'' -AZTEC Well, THe Asault RR is pretty beasty,probably SAME as an AR. But the Assault CR , even the six kin is not as effective as the duvolle. and Needs reload/eats ammo way to frequently/fast. As i stated before, the ASCR is a joke compared to the DVLLE.If you consider you will never apply full DPS since the rifle jumps more than my bed on a Saturday night (if you know what i mean) and after the shields are gone you will be applying a meres 80% , 95% with Prof 5 (but after 1.8 it will stay at 80%). Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
Texs Red DUST University Ivy League 200	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:35:00 - [23] - Quote Lets water this down to DPS at proto: RR: 465.38 (2,541 damage per clip) Assault RR: 471.9 (1,981.98 damage per clip) CR: 704 (1,900.8 damage per clip) Assault CR: 464 (1,577.6 damage per clip) SCR: 931.76 (3,564 damage per clip) Assault SCR: 465.88 (2,851.2) AR: 467.5 (2,244 damage per clip) Tac AR: 523.6 (1,413.72 damage per clip) Breach AR: 374 (2,019.6 damage per clip) The breach AR has the worst DPS of any rifle weapon and the Tac AR is useless due to unreasonable kick and hipfire spread. The regular AR has only slightly better DPS than the Assault SCR and CR but is worse than the Assault RR while having inferior range to all 3. The scrambler rifle has the best possible DPS but is limited by overheat, the CR is the next best and is abused by people with modded controllers. The rail rifle has 2 less DPS than the AR but has a superior ability to apply DPS from hip fire, therefore making it the best CQC weapon and the longest range weapon as well. The Assault scrambler rifle also has 2 less DPS but has 600 more damage per clip, making it better due to longer range and able to put out damage longer while the AR has to reload. The Assault CR has 3 less DPS but has superior range, the AR has a greater damage per clip and a clear disadvantage at range. Result: The only real weapon the AR has the advantage over in CQC is the assault combat rifle and only by merit of having more damage per clip, it is inferior to every other weapon in every possible aspect.
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1129	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:37:00 - [24] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Yah but, the BAR has alwayse been a piece of junk, even at proto. I guess you never played during closed beta when the Credron was king. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado, Cannabis Sativa Connoisseur
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4622	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:39:00 - [25] - Quote People using DPS math to decide if a weapon is good or not are insane. IT IS A FACTOR BUT (the BREACH AR sucks,there is no denying it): There is a difference between Optimal DPS and conistency to apply it. Great example is the ASCR that misses lost of shots due to unreasonable kick and flash. and The SCR RIFLE that if it misses the first charged shot ends up having less DPS than every sidearm bar the FP. I prefer consistency of DPS than Max POSSIBLE DPS. There is where the AR comes in, the AR is by far the best weapon because you can ACTUALLY HIT ALL 60 BULLETS IN A ROW, with consistency, sometimes only by Hipfiring... Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
Texs Red DUST University Ivy League 202	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:44:00 - [26] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: People using DPS math to decide if a weapon is good or not are insane. IT IS A FACTOR BUT (the BREACH AR sucks,there is no denying it): There is a difference between Optimal DPS and conistency to apply it. Great example is the ASCR that misses lost of shots due to unreasonable kick and flash. and The SCR RIFLE that if it misses the first charged shot ends up having less DPS than every sidearm bar the FP. I prefer consistency of DPS than Max POSSIBLE DPS. There is where the AR comes in, the AR is by far the best weapon because you can ACTUALLY HIT ALL 60 BULLETS IN A ROW, with consistency, sometimes only by Hipfiring... I can apply better hipfire DPS with my RR than my AR, it has a hipfire cone that is just tight enough that even at 15-20 meter I still get great damage application. At those ranges I would have to aim down sights with my AR which would make me even more vulnerable to the RR due to slower movement and his greater mobility.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4144	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:45:00 - [27] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Great example is the ASCR that misses lost of shots due to unreasonable kick and flash. and The SCR RIFLE that if it misses the first charged shot ends up having less DPS than every sidearm bar the FP. [b] You do realize the kick is all visual, right? They do the same thing in COD, they make it appear that the kick of the weapon makes it inaccurate but the kick reset is so fast that as long as you do not try to compensate, then the shots will land close together. It's just a mind trick, like when they make running with nova knives look faster than ruining with the Swarm Launcher. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4622	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:49:00 - [28] - Quote Texs Red wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: People using DPS math to decide if a weapon is good or not are insane. IT IS A FACTOR BUT (the BREACH AR sucks,there is no denying it): There is a difference between Optimal DPS and conistency to apply it. Great example is the ASCR that misses lost of shots due to unreasonable kick and flash. and The SCR RIFLE that if it misses the first charged shot ends up having less DPS than every sidearm bar the FP. I prefer consistency of DPS than Max POSSIBLE DPS. There is where the AR comes in, the AR is by far the best weapon because you can ACTUALLY HIT ALL 60 BULLETS IN A ROW, with consistency, sometimes only by Hipfiring... I can apply better hipfire DPS with my RR than my AR, it has a hipfire cone that is just tight enough that even at 15-20 meter I still get great damage application. At those ranges I would have to aim down sights with my AR which would make me even more vulnerable to the RR due to slower movement and his greater mobility. True true. But still the Ar is a lot better at CQ. Im NOT TALKING the = ''oh i find an enemy and stand there receiving RR shots to the face while i hipfire my AR at the roof and then come to the Forums to QQ on how the RR is the best weapon at CQ,'' kind of CQ of course.... I am willing to prove how a profile dampened assault with an AR can pretty much wreck anything... Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4622	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:51:00 - [29] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: You do realize the kick is all visual, right? They do the same thing in COD, they make it appear that the kick of the weapon makes it inaccurate but the kick reset is so fast that as long as you do not try to compensate, then the shots will land close together. It's just a mind trick, like when they make running with nova knives look faster than ruining with the Swarm Launcher. Well if its Visual it still makes me miss like 30% of my shots .... XD (BTW no i didnt know that) Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4622	Posted - 2014.02.14 04:54:00 - [30] - Quote Anyhow , comparing the Breach AR that is one of the most UP weapons in the game vs the RR,one of the most powerful and solid weapons is just....not the way to go. It makes people miss the point. Next thing you know i'll make a post that says: ''Breach AR is OP. Compared to the FP.'' LOL And the fact they are both , slow automatic weapons is no base to compare them. PLUS> CCP announced a BRCH buff and a RR nerf so there.... stop it XD Support Amarr scout bonus change! : https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813029#post1813029



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