DUST Search - So CCP, You know there is a problem with tanks. What are you doing ...

Aeon Amadi wrote:

CommanderBolt wrote:

Guys the simple and by far best solution is to improve the performance of AV. Tanks are balanced in a lot of respects TOWARDS OTHER TANKS. Don't screw them up as tank game play is fun and interesting.

AV needs to be buffed. That way tanks can still be fun. I dont know exact figures but I do know PROTO forges and swarms need less of a buff than standard and advanced gear - they need much more of a buff.

I dont want tanks to be useless again, but I do think an increase of price is certainly something that needs to happen. As well as buffing AV, especially swarms and also forges.

I dunno about Tank vs Tank being fun and interesting. There are a lot of bugs with it. You've never been frustrated with the game until you've tried to turn on an armor hardener and realize it jams your blaster turret. Or if the enemy rolls ontop of your tank, that jams your turret.

And while it's not a "bug" it's certainly not a good design in my book but a shield tanker throwing on a hardener shouldn't recharge through a Large Blaster damage, regardless of it's tier. It's sort of an 'I win' button when any damage applied is not only negated but completely regenerated.

But... Yes. AV needs a boost. I remember running the numbers in a skype channel about vehicle rebalance and we discussed the 1.7 changes to tanks under the stipulation that AV wasn't being nerfed and it looked well balanced. Then they announced the AV nerf and there was a mutual feeling of "oh ****".

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abarkrishna WarRavens 294	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:34:00 - [1] - Quote It is getting pretty effing ridiculous. 1.7 has been out for 2 months and not a word has been uttered about what your doing to fix tanks. How about some input. P.s A great start would be getting rid of large blasters. No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 1632	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:42:00 - [2] - Quote That would not be a great start. Nerfing them, for sure. But "Hey guys I have a great idea lets remove some of the already limited content in the game because I can't think of a better way of working it!" is stupid. Nerf them so they're either capable only of AI, and change them to AV when we get a medium vehicle class (so HAVs are heavy breaching and AV weapons) or just make them CQC AV par excellence. Happily printing ISK with permahardeners and MLT blasters. Just let me get a couple mil more before nerf, CCP!
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 1948	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:49:00 - [3] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: That would not be a great start. Nerfing them, for sure. But "Hey guys I have a great idea lets remove some of the already limited content in the game because I can't think of a better way of working it!" is stupid. Nerf them so they're either capable only of AI, and change them to AV when we get a medium vehicle class (so HAVs are heavy breaching and AV weapons) or just make them CQC AV par excellence. This is the way to do it. Im not a tank advocate, that much is probably well know. But even I disagree with removing blaster turrets, we want a full battlfiled, not 2 seperate ones. Nerf the Blaster by giving it dispersion, REAL dispersion. Then reduce tne DPS to approx 400 DPS and reduce optimal ramge to 80m and effective to 200m. It is now a CLOSE RANGE anti infantry turret. By reducing the DPS sentinels can now go toe to toe as expected. Buff Swarms, FG, Plc by 25% direct damage. Then increase charge time on hardners by 50% Sorted. Spkr4thedead: Me > AV This is why tanks are unbalanced Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.
abarkrishna WarRavens 294	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:50:00 - [4] - Quote There is no way to balance large blasters. If you nerf them they will be useless against tanks. If you do not nerf it they will be way to OP against infantry like we have currently. There is no middle ground. I am open to the idea but I have yet to hear an intelligent idea regarding a good way to nerf them. To be clear I am only speaking about large blasters. Small blasters can stay the way they are. No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
straya fox Sad Panda Solutions 209	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:55:00 - [5] - Quote I think stacking hardeners lies at the heart of a lot of issues with tanks, there are no 'windows of opportunity' with a triple or double hardened tank.
abarkrishna WarRavens 294	Posted - 2014.02.13 11:56:00 - [6] - Quote We all know the problems with tanks. I am just looking for Dev input. I want to know what their plans are. Do they even have plans? No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 87	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:00:00 - [7] - Quote I don't think turrets are the problem as much as AV is the problem. You know there's something wrong when a proto swarm or AV grenade can't even take down a Militia tank. What really needs a fix are the Rail tanks that sit up in the mountains and virtually eliminate enemy vehicles from spawning for the rest of the match. Dropship pilots are really getting the shaft in 1.7 Please sign my 1.8 respec petition
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 296	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:03:00 - [8] - Quote As Sherlock Holmes said "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." CCP just don't care that's the truth War never changes
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4451	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:08:00 - [9] - Quote abarkrishna wrote: If you nerf them they will be useless against tanks. ...and the problem with having an anti-infantry that's useless against tanks is... what, exactly?
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES Legacy Rising 627	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:16:00 - [10] - Quote Guys the simple and by far best solution is to improve the performance of AV. Tanks are balanced in a lot of respects TOWARDS OTHER TANKS. Don't screw them up as tank game play is fun and interesting. AV needs to be buffed. That way tanks can still be fun. I dont know exact figures but I do know PROTO forges and swarms need less of a buff than standard and advanced gear - they need much more of a buff. I dont want tanks to be useless again, but I do think an increase of price is certainly something that needs to happen. As well as buffing AV, especially swarms and also forges.

Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1204	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:19:00 - [11] - Quote Problem? With tanks? [looks in tank, sees seat, checks turret, turret fine] No, no problwm here. I'm good! Rommel, you magnificent bastard, I read your book!
Aeon Amadi Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4883	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:21:00 - [12] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: Guys the simple and by far best solution is to improve the performance of AV. Tanks are balanced in a lot of respects TOWARDS OTHER TANKS. Don't screw them up as tank game play is fun and interesting. AV needs to be buffed. That way tanks can still be fun. I dont know exact figures but I do know PROTO forges and swarms need less of a buff than standard and advanced gear - they need much more of a buff. I dont want tanks to be useless again, but I do think an increase of price is certainly something that needs to happen. As well as buffing AV, especially swarms and also forges. I dunno about Tank vs Tank being fun and interesting. There are a lot of bugs with it. You've never been frustrated with the game until you've tried to turn on an armor hardener and realize it jams your blaster turret. Or if the enemy rolls ontop of your tank, that jams your turret. And while it's not a "bug" it's certainly not a good design in my book but a shield tanker throwing on a hardener shouldn't recharge through a Large Blaster damage, regardless of it's tier. It's sort of an 'I win' button when any damage applied is not only negated but completely regenerated. But... Yes. AV needs a boost. I remember running the numbers in a skype channel about vehicle rebalance and we discussed the 1.7 changes to tanks under the stipulation that AV wasn't being nerfed and it looked well balanced. Then they announced the AV nerf and there was a mutual feeling of "oh ****". Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
abarkrishna WarRavens 294	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:29:00 - [13] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: abarkrishna wrote: If you nerf them they will be useless against tanks. ...and the problem with having an anti-infantry weapon that's useless against tanks is... what, exactly? I personally do not have an issue with them being anti infantry. In fact i would like to see that however I can already hear all the scrubs whining about it. No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
Nikoli Gleimer Nex Miles Militis 5	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:32:00 - [14] - Quote Im going to talk from my dropship point of view. I have commented on this on alot of other posts too, but i will again if i have too. I think its absolutely ridiculous that a rail gun tank in the redline is so powerfull against things like dropships. I dont mind getting shot down by them, but what i do get mad at is when i get shot down by someone thats on basically on another map. I also dont get why tanks can be so powerfull and so cheap at the same time. IM also a proto gallente logi and they can get very pricy very quick. My suit is over 95k. I dont want them to make tanks Under powered like they were, but i also dont want them overpowered like they are right now. Another thing that i dont want is AV to get too powerfull. I think AV is fine right now, and the reason being, you have to have a few people to take a tank, down. You need to organise and plan your atacks which i like a lot. I dont think it would be fair, if a tank could get destroyed from one swarm launcher guy that was too lazy to actually squad with people to take him down. One of the biggest problems regarding tanks and dropships are the price. I think its absolutely hilarious that my dropship (assault) can get gunned down by a miltia tank in 2 hits if he has damage mods, let alone the jostling affect when you get hit, so you have to straighten yourself so you dont hit a wall or something. But say he kills me, i call in another assault dropship to take him out. I kill him, but only because he was an inexperienced tanker. He calls in another one. How is this fair that i lost all my profit in an entire match because of a guy who cant actually fight, and i kill him but he still make s a huge profit. tell me if im wrong, but i think tanks should go up in price about 50k for miltia tanks (without equiping it with stuff) and standard tanks should go up around 50k as well
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 683	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:32:00 - [15] - Quote abarkrishna wrote: There is no way to balance large blasters. If you nerf them they will be useless against tanks. If you do not nerf it they will be way to OP against infantry like we have currently. There is no middle ground. I am open to the idea but I have yet to hear an intelligent idea regarding a good way to nerf them. To be clear I am only speaking about large blasters. Small blasters can stay the way they are. I agree, you have to be careful. I'd say without touching damage the only other things you can touch are: 1) dispersion (already mentioned 2) ammo counts - currently very high... if you've ever run a tank you quickly understand how ammo expansion packs are never used. 3) heat buildup
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES Legacy Rising 627	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:33:00 - [16] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CommanderBolt wrote: Guys the simple and by far best solution is to improve the performance of AV. Tanks are balanced in a lot of respects TOWARDS OTHER TANKS. Don't screw them up as tank game play is fun and interesting. AV needs to be buffed. That way tanks can still be fun. I dont know exact figures but I do know PROTO forges and swarms need less of a buff than standard and advanced gear - they need much more of a buff. I dont want tanks to be useless again, but I do think an increase of price is certainly something that needs to happen. As well as buffing AV, especially swarms and also forges. I dunno about Tank vs Tank being fun and interesting. There are a lot of bugs with it. You've never been frustrated with the game until you've tried to turn on an armor hardener and realize it jams your blaster turret. Or if the enemy rolls ontop of your tank, that jams your turret. And while it's not a "bug" it's certainly not a good design in my book but a shield tanker throwing on a hardener shouldn't recharge through a Large Blaster damage, regardless of it's tier. It's sort of an 'I win' button when any damage applied is not only negated but completely regenerated. But... Yes. AV needs a boost. I remember running the numbers in a skype channel about vehicle rebalance and we discussed the 1.7 changes to tanks under the stipulation that AV wasn't being nerfed and it looked well balanced. Then they announced the AV nerf and there was a mutual feeling of "oh **". Well I did severely over simplify the case. I just mean to say dont make tanks st. The rail gun bugs out and 'fires' but deals no damage. There are invisible walls, places where you 'crash' into nothing and die. Sometimes the turret does not reload, sometimes you deal 0 damage even though you seem to be firing. I guess you are right man tanks still need work. Its CCP we are dealing with. The more time that passes the less seems to be being done. They cannot even release event rewards on time. They dont tell us much of anything. I think the only reason people play this game is for the occasional GREAT battle and more so, the vision of what this game could be. If 1.8 isn't great then I can foresee this game dying off. I am losing faith and I love the IP of the EVE universe. Even the hardcore members are starting to log in less and less. New players don't stick around. Every one of my friends that have tried this game in the past wont even come back to give it another try and I find myself with less and less to convince them otherwise. Tank spam ruins matches, especially ambush where the spawn system is terrible. (I have a picture I will upload to show this). Basically CCP needs to pull the proverbial finger out of its backside and work really hard for the next few months.
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1223	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:34:00 - [17] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: That would not be a great start. Nerfing them, for sure. But "Hey guys I have a great idea lets remove some of the already limited content in the game because I can't think of a better way of working it!" is stupid. Nerf them so they're either capable only of AI, and change them to AV when we get a medium vehicle class (so HAVs are heavy breaching and AV weapons) or just make them CQC AV par excellence. This is the way to do it. Im not a tank advocate, that much is probably well know. But even I disagree with removing blaster turrets, we want a full battlfiled, not 2 seperate ones. Nerf the Blaster by giving it dispersion, REAL dispersion. Then reduce tne DPS to approx 400 DPS and reduce optimal ramge to 80m and effective to 200m. It is now a CLOSE RANGE anti infantry turret. By reducing the DPS sentinels can now go toe to toe as expected. Buff Swarms, FG, Plc by 25% direct damage. Then increase charge time on hardners by 50% Sorted. AGREED. And one more thing: SLOW the tanks down!!! This is not Fast and Furious Tank 514 Abandon Ship!, Abandon Ship!! Jumps into escape pod! Selected destination Planet PS4.
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 2411	Posted - 2014.02.13 12:54:00 - [18] - Quote Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: SLOW the tanks down!!! This is not Fast and Furious Tank 514 Who asked for that anyways? What was the point? Their precious, well thought out, AV balance pass that they spent months on has been hilarious. I'm pretty sure Blam was fired for lesser offenses. I GÖú Kittens.
Sam Tektzby Better Hide R Die 137	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:08:00 - [19] - Quote Buff AV weapons - C'mon tankdrivers an shoot you from reeeeaaaaalyyyyyyyy looooong diiistaaaance like sharpshoter, give us real caldari SWARM like in lore - LONG DISTANCE/GREAT DAMAGE. Limit of vehicles on group - depending on type of game, through filter of most speced drivers Slow them/Tanks HELL down - I know its future and i know its "ZUPACYBERTECH", but tanks faster than rockets, like really..i saw RPGs..i run RPGs in my army times..i know how RPGs work normaly..DUST dont know how rocket propeled grenade working now for sure XD what else..hmm..got it Inoperable weapons - Behind enemy line, i know there is sometimes problem with redlinining, but what about implement something like two stage field behind redline, what i mean is basicaly filter where is weapons operable. Tank long way in red fiield of peace is really "Pain somewhere" sometimes. I dont know, if someone have more ideas or better implements just tell. Support - Tactician/Support Deteis - Orator
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 2511	Posted - 2014.02.13 13:17:00 - [20] - Quote looks down in dropship No i see no problem here Hang on Why is that infantry group firing there RR at it? Is that a locus nade? Intelligence is OP

The Attorney General 1940	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:01:00 - [21] - Quote This is just a thread of bads having a pity party. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 4627	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:03:00 - [22] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: This is just a thread of bads having a pity party. Kinda reminds me of your pre 1.7 posts. Want to know how to make a strike-through? [s[Example[/s] Now go my Forum Warriors. Use this new weapon for glory!
The Attorney General 1940	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:08:00 - [23] - Quote Atiim wrote: The Attorney General wrote: This is just a thread of bads having a pity party. Kinda reminds me of your pre 1.7 posts. Nice try, but you can go back to the start of uprising, where I am saying that tanks are fine, and that the only major change needs to be rendering fixes. Unlike you, I actually adapted, learned to thrive and then made posts. Also, I didn't have the experience of using a crutch like all the pre-uprising tankers did, so I was not spoiled by being OP. You were, and you can't help but long for the days when your OP weapon that did the work for you made you feel strong. Poor baby. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 4627	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:14:00 - [24] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: Atiim wrote: The Attorney General wrote: This is just a thread of bads having a pity party. Kinda reminds me of your pre 1.7 posts. Nice try, but you can go back to the start of uprising, where I am saying that tanks are fine, and that the only major change needs to be rendering fixes. Unlike you, I actually adapted, learned to thrive and then made posts. Also, I didn't have the experience of using a crutch like all the pre-uprising tankers did, so I was not spoiled by being OP. You were, and you can't help but long for the days when your OP weapon that did the work for you made you feel strong. Poor baby. I have also adapted. That's why I specced back into Particle Cannons. Your using a crutch right now, and your tank pretty much does all the work for you. What are you talking about? I think you should get some rest dude. Want to know how to make a strike-through? [s[Example[/s] Now go my Forum Warriors. Use this new weapon for glory!
The Attorney General 1940	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:20:00 - [25] - Quote Atiim wrote: I have also adapted. That's why I specced back into Particle Cannons. Your using a crutch right now, and your tank pretty much does all the work for you. What are you talking about? I think you should get some rest dude. So you went from one OP thing to another? Wow you are a shameless scrub. I was tanking before the changes, and I will be tanking after they get nerfed. Because I am a tanker. You on the other hand are just chasing whatever can make up for your lack of skill. BTW, there is still workable AV, you just refuse to spec into it. I guess you really are not an AV player like you want to pretend you are. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
Sir Snugglz Red Star. EoN. 388	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:22:00 - [26] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: looks down in dropship No i see no problem here Hang on Why is that infantry group firing there RR at it? Is that a locus nade? Took the words out of my mouth brah. Tanks pop just fine in my opinion. Most kills are not easy, yet not impossible either. I love popping tanks. More WP. -Luck is just one of my skills Just because I make flying look easy doesn't mean it is
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 380	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:23:00 - [27] - Quote straya fox wrote: I think stacking hardeners lies at the heart of a lot of issues with tanks, there are no 'windows of opportunity' with a triple or double hardened tank. They can still be destroyed ... it depends on the experience of the driver v.s the experience of the attacker .. basic. Future Caldari Heavy so watch out for this Sumo Shinobi with a Caldari HMG .
Alternate Insano SUICIDE SPITE SQUAD 33	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:25:00 - [28] - Quote I hate tanks. When I actually try to do well with my sentinel (as opposed to when I'm bored and just sit on obj A) a tank is pretty much the only thing that makes me duck for cover. Are tanks broken? Yes. Can you call in way too many in a match? Yes. Should something be done to stop it? No. Everyone tells me I'm wrong, but AUR sales drive this game. CCP is not some 'write off' company as such is a violation of every tax law in existence. The AUR vehicles and gear that sell let the rest of us play a semi crappy fps game for free rather than waste 40 bucks on it at Walmart. And stop comparing DUST to EVE. When EVE came out it had no competition and has never been a console game. The fps market is a console industry staple, is over saturated with titles, and is harsh to say the least. New Eden, welcome to PSN.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 380	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:50:00 - [29] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: This is just a thread of bads having a pity party. This guy is a beast. That is all .. just call it like I see it. Future Caldari Heavy so watch out for this Sumo Shinobi with a Caldari HMG .
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 4627	Posted - 2014.02.13 14:57:00 - [30] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: So you went from one OP thing to another? Wow you are a shameless scrub. I was tanking before the changes, and I will be tanking after they get nerfed. Because I am a tanker. You on the other hand are just chasing whatever can make up for your lack of skill. BTW, there is still workable AV, you just refuse to spec into it. I guess you really are not an AV player like you want to pretend you are. I've got both Missiles and Blasters too. But wasn't it tankers who said that the best AV should be another HAV? I was also tanking before the changes, and I will still tank after the changes. I'm not an AV player? Swarm Launchers & Plasma Cannons are specifically classified as AV weapons, so yes I am an AV player. Along with that, Gunnlogies are HAVs, and Particle Cannons and Neuron Blasters are also turrets, so yes I am also a tanker as well. It's rather hilarious. A tanker tells me to adapt, and I do. Then they come tell me about how they don't like the way I adapted. Could you please make up your mind already? Want to know how to make a strike-through? [s[Example[/s] Now go my Forum Warriors. Use this new weapon for glory!



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