First and most importantly, the number one balancing factor--period--is map design.

I've read the post about maps, and while I agree that the maps need major reworking, I do have a couple of problems. First, I've been playing this game since early in closed beta, and we average a new map about every 4-5 months. So waiting for new maps to be made and old to be redesigned is extremely unlikely. And second, making maps where you don't really need to deal with the problem, doesn't really solve the problem.

The problem is, when I get in my tank, I'm able to destroy everything in sight. There is nothing that can stop me, short of another tank. I usually go multiple matches back to back before I find one match that there is a group of people working together that can beat me. And I'm solo. I don't even have that much sp invested in tanks. I don't consider myself a tanker, but I think I'm over-powered. I usually get 250k to 450k isk per match, and lose nothing. If you make maps that I only have access to some of the infantry, I may have lower kills, but I'm still OP.

Some people seem to want to buff swarms to fight tanks, others seem to think they are only meant for LAVs. i'm ok either way, but they are currently very effective against LAVs. with proto swarms, cheap LAV's go down in 2 shots, and the best LAV's go down in 3. that seems reasonable to me, because they are extremely hard to escape if you stop for more than 1 second. But if you are going to buff swarm damage for tanks, I think LAVs need a buff to compensate. 1 shot to kill LAVs is a little ridiculous. if it still takes 2-3 shots after the buff, then no big deal.

I still like the delayed spawn time for tanks. 1 minute isn't that long to wait to instantly become the most OP person on the map. Maybe I'm just used to it. I've been playing competitive fps since Doom was on a dial up modem. First time I played with tanks was "Unreal Tournament" and even then you had to wait patiently for the tank. It seemed to work perfectly well, and we never just sat and did nothing while waited. You defend the point until it gets there - unless you call it into the safe zone, but that's your choice. If 1 minute is really too long, then make it 45 seconds. It's not carved in stone. but there should be some kind of sacrifice made to bring in the tank.

i would like to see different types of maps like 1 very dusty or foggy raining heavy snow grass maps would be nice maybe some trees i find it hard to believe the only maps CCP can come up with are deserts

I've been playing this game since early in closed beta, and we average a new map about every 4-5 months. So waiting for new maps to be made and old to be redesigned is extremely unlikely.

And second, making maps where you don't really need to deal with the problem, doesn't really solve the problem.

1 minute isn't that long to wait to instantly become the most OP person on the map.

Ooooh, one like vietnam. Heavy brush so you can barely see through it and BAM enemy. Well actually more like 'scan' there you are, but still, jungle would be a fun mash up too.

Wouldn't adding more cover and more CQC areas to the map solve the problem of the ostensibly OP sniper, without having to nerf the sniper's weapon?

There shouldn't be a minimum wait time to become the most OP person on the map.

but they havent made any maps all they down in take some old buildings off and put new ones on and cover it in snow thats not new that cheap

i would like to see different types of maps like 1 very dusty or foggy raining heavy snow grass maps would be nice maybe some trees i find it hard to believe the only maps CCP can come up with are deserts

anyone who thinks that two players running anti-vehicle fits should not be able to take out a tank being operated by one player In it Is obviously a tanker. Its obvious that you have no interest in a balanced and fair game, you just want your kill death ratio to be higher than other players, and you should just stop commenting now. on the same token if a player with a full skill tree for a swarm launcher goes against a tanker with little to no skills invested in his skill tree, its obvious that the swarm launcher should have no problem taking the him out. if you had it your way and tanks ruled this game from here on just like they do now, this game's player base would decrease just to tankers, and then you could play all by yourselfs. I personally have quit this game until this vehicle problem is fixed, which sucks because I really enjoyed it. I guess everything comes to an end sooner or later. On to PS4.

With all the drama here, I debated for days whether I should even bother posting, but the recent HMG buff actually gave me some hope for this game again. So I'll give it one more go.

It's enough evidence for me to know that tanks are OP because of the insane amount of spamming them on the battlefield. But I know that isn't enough for everyone, so let me explain further. Even mercs that are terrible team players, have little to no gun game, and no situational awareness are still extremely successful in a tank. Now put that tank in the hands of a player who is good at all of those things, and you have something that's beyond OP.

Why is it OP? You have created something that is technically able to withstand enemy attacks from an entire team at times (since most aren't even AV). It also has the ability to flee the scene at a high rate of speed at the first sign of danger. And it has the highest killing power of anything on the map. Any one of these is enough to consider it OP by some standards, but you have given tanks all 3. Imagine if an infantryman could run 10x faster than a tank, shoot it down in less than a second, all while being attacked by 3 other tanks and just shrugging them off. That is exactly how infantry feel right now, and that is why so many people are quitting. This is a competitive fps, and it should be played like one.

There are some good suggestions out there, and here are a few:

Return AV weapons to 1.6 stats. As a vehicle driver myself, I know how ineffective all of these weapons are at there current state. They've been nerfed to the point that they are just wasted skill points. Any tanker will tell you that Proto AV weapons with level 5 proficiency and stacked damage mods should be ineffective to a tank, but you need to use common sense and do what you know is right for this game.

Slow tanks down.... way down. Who decided tanks should be so fast anyway? In what world do tanks charge around the battlefield into the middle of every dangerous situation? Thrusters on a tank?! Did someone put NOS on that thing? I know this game isn't real, but there should be at least some small sense of realism.

EMP grenades - completely disable a tank for a brief period of time, leaving it vulnerable, unable to attack, and unable to retreat. only effective against vehicles. It sounds awesome, but I wouldn't expect something like that to be added until like version 3.0 or something.

Vulnerable point - maybe a small window to shoot the driver through. Not as bad as the giant open convertible that the poor LAV drivers have to put up with, but something that even non AV infantry have a chance at fighting back.

Stacking hardners - I understand that the active hardner should make a tank almost invulnerable for a short period of time, but my gunnlogi has 3 stacked and I can run them continuously with no cool down to worry about. This is clearly not as intended and the tank should be limited to 1.

Limit tanks to 1 or 2 per side at a time. During 1.6 and before, 2 tanks on a battlefield working together made an extremely difficult fight. Now that they are OP, 7 tanks per side is not uncommon and is beyond ridiculous. I personally would go even farther to say that you should only be allowed to spawn 1 tank yourself during a match. So if you lose it, you will have to wait until the next match to spawn another and it gives others on your team a chance to call in their own. Tank spamming should not be allowed.

Raise the price of tanks. I don't like this one. it's obvious, but it doesn't solve anything. And it just gives tankers an excuse to justify being OP. I personally like the low isk cost and sp requirements as it gives even new players a chance to try things out without a huge investment.

Increase the spread of all large turrets. This would essentially make them less useful against infantry, but still useful against other tanks, vehicles, installations, etc. The turrets are currently dead on accurate even from across the map. I've been hit many times by a rail turret from so far away that I could barely see it. You can literally shoot a rail turret tank from the blue side red zone and hit LAVs on the red side red zone in most of these maps.

Infantry only battle options. It would work, but I'm certain no infantry would join the regular battles unless they were running with tankers.

Edit - added 2 more ideas:
Prolonged deployment time for tanks. Make a lead time of some kind, maybe 1 minute after calling in a tank for it to be deployed. This would almost completely eliminate tank spamming without nerfs or buffs. It would give AV players a chance to eliminate 1 tank at a time without having that tank replaced in 10 seconds. It would give ambush players and all infantry a chance to establish themselves before getting dominated by tanks. It also requires the tanker to invest time to be the most OP person on the map.



And FYI, calling in another tank to deal with a tank still leaves an OP tank either way and is not really an appropriate solution, despite what tankers seem to believe.

just to clarify, tanks in real life are extremely fast - some faster than they are in this game, but thats why real life tanks are OP

tanks in video games should be EXTREMELY slow but have MUCH more health, coinciding with AV dmg getting a buff and ammo capacity increasing

Tanks are not OP, they are being spammed because they are actually useful and fixed and bad pilots will get easily whacked

Tanks are made to survive an AR shooting at it, if the enemy doesnt use AV then whos fault is it?

Tanks are fast, they can go fast in RL ya know

Proto AV is fine, it can easily kill tanks, stop shooting when the tank is glowing unless you have a FG which can cause enough damage to stop regen

Asking for realism in a game? okay then FG shouldnt exist because lolrealism, lolno tanks speed are fine and to use realism they can go pretty fast in RL, ask for webs or EWAR instead of nerf

lolno, in a tank in a pod i dont need a window, also there is a weak point on the tank already

Will you limit infantry with only 1 plate or repper or dmg mod? you taking sand out of my sandbox

lolno unless you limit infantry to only 2 assault/logi/heavy and the remain slots are filled with scouts/commandos, once again taking sand out of the sandbox

Im rich doesnt matter

Increase spread? why i have to aim more with a large turret than an AR because i dont get the benefits of Auto Aim

Give me a tank only mode

Another pointless nerf idea, lolno


So OP writes a post of bad ideas mainly and just asks for nerfs to a balanced class now

Wrong! Tanks are being spammed because they are an exploit now not because they are fixed/balanced.
If you want realism you shouldnt be able to repair damage to inorganic matter like tank shields and armor either.
Make better arguments please, you seem more interested in pointing out that the original poster is wrong.
The game is supposed to be futuristic, not fantasy. So realism is a must.
Future soldiers should not be get mowed down by tanks.
When tanks were first introduced decades ago you can understand why people would get mowed over.
But in the future that shouldnt be the case. Even right now a 14 year old kid can deal significant damage to a tank with a rocket launcher( I am just guessing).
Anyways don't just say OP is wrong make sound arguments.
The basic idea of the forge fun is very realistic.

This is a game, if something is spammed its not because its good its because its an exploit

Wrong

Realism lol this is sci fi futuristic stuff, it can repair itself because nanomachines

OP is wrong tho

Realism is not a must

Yes they should, my gun is bigger than you goo bag

No they cant, current MBT can survive mulitple RPG attacks

I did and OP is wrong

No its not

Proto AV is fine, it can easily kill tanks, stop shooting when the tank is glowing unless you have a FG which can cause enough damage to stop regen

Asking for realism in a game? okay then FG shouldnt exist because lolrealism, lolno tanks speed are fine and to use realism they can go pretty fast in RL, ask for webs or EWAR instead of nerf

You're entitled to your opinion. I respect that. Luckily you are in a minority.

Games don't need to be real, but there needs to be some sense of realism to keep it interesting. If you shot your weapon and your bullets went in the opposite direction, you probably wouldn't play very long.

Here is a video of a real tank driver and their view from inside the tank: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyPgHwB82xY

FYI, it takes one hidden mine, or one well placed remote explosive, or one person with an RPG to disable a real tank. One grenade down the barrel of a tank will likely ruin it and make it un-fireable. I'm not asking for this game to be realistic. But God mode tanks are not fun for anyone unless they are in the tank.

Here is a video of a small hand made explosive destroying a tank: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5C7Ec77YCkg

You want your easy win god-mode tank to be left alone. You even want FG removed because it's likely the only real threat you have (except other tanks).

I get it man. I have a kid. I hate taking away his favorite toy. But when he uses it to abuse his friends, well, sometimes a good parent has to make everyone play nice. Takahiro, you need a spanking. I hope CCP leaves some welts on your ass.

Wrong

Realism lol this is sci fi futuristic stuff, it can repair itself because nanomachines

OP is wrong tho

Realism is not a must

Yes they should, my gun is bigger than you goo bag

No they cant, current MBT can survive mulitple RPG attacks

I did and OP is wrong

No its not

With all the drama here, I debated for days whether I should even bother posting, but the recent HMG buff actually gave me some hope for this game again. So I'll give it one more go.

It's enough evidence for me to know that tanks are OP because of the insane amount of spamming them on the battlefield. But I know that isn't enough for everyone, so let me explain further. Even mercs that are terrible team players, have little to no gun game, and no situational awareness are still extremely successful in a tank. Now put that tank in the hands of a player who is good at all of those things, and you have something that's beyond OP.

Why is it OP? You have created something that is technically able to withstand enemy attacks from an entire team at times (since most aren't even AV). It also has the ability to flee the scene at a high rate of speed at the first sign of danger. And it has the highest killing power of anything on the map. Any one of these is enough to consider it OP by some standards, but you have given tanks all 3. Imagine if an infantryman could run 10x faster than a tank, shoot it down in less than a second, all while being attacked by 3 other tanks and just shrugging them off. That is exactly how infantry feel right now, and that is why so many people are quitting. This is a competitive fps, and it should be played like one.

There are some good suggestions out there, and here are a few:

Return AV weapons to 1.6 stats. As a vehicle driver myself, I know how ineffective all of these weapons are at there current state. They've been nerfed to the point that they are just wasted skill points. Any tanker will tell you that Proto AV weapons with level 5 proficiency and stacked damage mods should be ineffective to a tank, but you need to use common sense and do what you know is right for this game.

Slow tanks down.... way down. Who decided tanks should be so fast anyway? In what world do tanks charge around the battlefield into the middle of every dangerous situation? Thrusters on a tank?! Did someone put NOS on that thing? I know this game isn't real, but there should be at least some small sense of realism.

EMP grenades - completely disable a tank for a brief period of time, leaving it vulnerable, unable to attack, and unable to retreat. only effective against vehicles. It sounds awesome, but I wouldn't expect something like that to be added until like version 3.0 or something.

Vulnerable point - maybe a small window to shoot the driver through. Not as bad as the giant open convertible that the poor LAV drivers have to put up with, but something that even non AV infantry have a chance at fighting back.

Stacking hardners - I understand that the active hardner should make a tank almost invulnerable for a short period of time, but my gunnlogi has 3 stacked and I can run them continuously with no cool down to worry about. This is clearly not as intended and the tank should be limited to 1.

Limit tanks to 1 or 2 per side at a time. During 1.6 and before, 2 tanks on a battlefield working together made an extremely difficult fight. Now that they are OP, 7 tanks per side is not uncommon and is beyond ridiculous. I personally would go even farther to say that you should only be allowed to spawn 1 tank yourself during a match. So if you lose it, you will have to wait until the next match to spawn another and it gives others on your team a chance to call in their own. Tank spamming should not be allowed.

Raise the price of tanks. I don't like this one. it's obvious, but it doesn't solve anything. And it just gives tankers an excuse to justify being OP. I personally like the low isk cost and sp requirements as it gives even new players a chance to try things out without a huge investment.

Increase the spread of all large turrets. This would essentially make them less useful against infantry, but still useful against other tanks, vehicles, installations, etc. The turrets are currently dead on accurate even from across the map. I've been hit many times by a rail turret from so far away that I could barely see it. You can literally shoot a rail turret tank from the blue side red zone and hit LAVs on the red side red zone in most of these maps.

Infantry only battle options. It would work, but I'm certain no infantry would join the regular battles unless they were running with tankers.

Edit - added 2 more ideas:
Prolonged deployment time for tanks. Make a lead time of some kind, maybe 1 minute after calling in a tank for it to be deployed. This would almost completely eliminate tank spamming without nerfs or buffs. It would give AV players a chance to eliminate 1 tank at a time without having that tank replaced in 10 seconds. It would give ambush players and all infantry a chance to establish themselves before getting dominated by tanks. It also requires the tanker to invest time to be the most OP person on the map.

Symmetric decrease of fire power and defense of tanks. this would allow the same tank v tank battles while making them slightly less effective to everything else and more vulnerable to attacks. This is really just a nerf, but probably badly needed at this point.

And FYI, calling in another tank to deal with a tank still leaves an OP tank either way and is not really an appropriate solution, despite what tankers seem to believe.