No. Grab a militia sica, fit it with two millita damage mods and pop the tanks.... Its so easy I won st least 5 matches today just busting tanks that were trying to slay my blueberrys while they were pressing objective. Even the dumbest of redberrys says " ah hell with it" after the get smoked two or three times then you recall And the match continues in peace.... Have not busted any of the big boys yet but this tactic works wonders on the scrub tankers and makes you a pile of WP and *gasp* your doing something good for your team.

Vehicles belong in this game. They have an entire skill tree and every thing. You want just infantry? Back to COD with you then. I like diversity and for craps sake being killed by a tank is still better than being reapeatedly raped by the damn duevolle AR over and over and over

Agreed, +1.

Other than a lack of anti-shield AV, REs/mines needing a buff and a need to fix draw distance so swarms can get a possible range buff tank/AV is about as balanced as it'll ever be. You rarely see militia tanks getting more thang 10-15 kills and you have to use timing to pop a tank. Basically, they made it harder for both sides to kill eachother.

Also, is something really OP if everyone can use it? I mainly play infantry but always keep a few tanks on hand just in case. This makes the game more dynamic and adds a dimension of combat that used to only be known by a select few. Anyone can tank now, but the ones that invest and practice will do it better.

though i agree to the tank speed being reduced and Armour hardeners should be limits

i do not agree with swarms being set back to 1.6 settings i am an assault/ AV player though yes swarms are a waste of SP right now hell all AV weapons are
i think if they slowed the tanks down and gave us swarms 300 per missile 1800 damage but kept the range of the swarms to 175m i think it will defo even the balance
if it turns out swarms become to OP though this fix drop them down to 250 damage per missile 1500 damage or make the target lock slower

there was talk in a post a few days ago in one of the threads about bringing flaylocks back purely for AV use quicker lock on 300 damage per shot 900 damage before reloading and good rate of fire but only has 100m range
i liked this idea most players do have flaylocks SP i know it wont do much damage but the rate of fire they gave out and with loads of people using them for AV it will defo give the tankers something to worry about

the idea was to make the flaylock shine again


not sure what you think of this?

i agree the passive repair is quicker then 1 proto swarm but team of 2 or 3 will defo give it a run for its money with the 35% damage plus the damage mods and proficiency put on each swarm may do over 2k damage

and the reason i brought up the flaylocks is because i think even now more people are speced into them more then a swarm launcher

You have to keep in mind this is a WIP. AV was probably scaled down since we only have standard vehicles and we don't have all the racial AV. Prices are probably lower to get as many tanks out there to collect data faster too. Once we get more content for both sides, we might see a clearer picture in balance. Right now, vehicles are much more accessible than in the past and that's a much needed change.

I suppose that this suggestion may be rather obvious, but here goes. Just because it is there, does not mean it needs to be engaged. If infantry stayed away from the tank the entire match how will it shoot anyone? Boredom is a great motivator to try something different (DS Pilots have fun).

focused av fire works well against tanks. but it requires the one thing most of ppl on this game probably know nothing about "teamwork"


although i havnt had much trouble destroying those mlt tanks u ppl say r op.


since most of them are unskilled drivers to begin with ive had a rather easy time poping them with my better fitted soma.as i went into the core skills for vehicles. although i do kinda regret wasting all that sp just to unlock the std large missile turrets i could have just went into blaster turrets instead and leveled up fitting optimization. and possibly unlocked std havs.

which i intend to do if im ever going to create my special anti tank fitting.


aside from all this it looks like all the ppl who say tanks r op r just focusing on mlt tanks only. right now id say tank vs tank combat is more balanced then ever. if u nerf mlt tanks to being paper thin again what do u think is going to happen?

instead of mlt tanks being spammed u will be dealing with even stronger ad much BETTER fitted maddies and gunlogis without any actual way to take them down for the simple fact that u nerfed the already weakest of the tanks to be even weaker and easier to destroy with the thought that this will make things easier for av.

it would make soloing mlt tanks easier. but it would make killing maddies and gunlogis next to impossible. and possibly more expensive.

and so the crying would get worse in the end.

ive also managed to kill many of those mlt tanks with adv cbr7 swarms and av nades.

its all about positioning then.

although to give tanks an actual weakness since current playstyle seems to be running away with active hardeners we could make hardeners slow the vehicle down or immobilize it for now and see what happens from there.

I agree with some of the OP suggestions and I took it to mean implement one or two and see how it goes. Here's a typical assault. A tank barrels into a scene guns blazing, every one on the other side runs and hides but one or two usually get taken out. If they have a swarm or forge they'll fire a few shots then the hardener comes on. While they're either hopelessly firing at the tank or waiting it out, the infantry roll out from behind the tank and start firing away. If by some miracle they're repelled and the hardener times-out the tank either resumes firing or races away at ludicrous speed just to start the process all over again. Meanwhile a lot of wasted ammo is used up while the tank enjoys unlimited ammo.

1. Slow them down.

2. Reduce the hardener time.

3. No ability to shoot while the hardener is activated.

4. Give tanks an ammo budget that can be reloaded at a vehicle depot.

Cheers

Just some thoughts. Cheers

I like it when math is used, but please use it right.

No one disagree that three swarms WILL kill a tank. If those 3 swarms hit him SIMULTANOUSLY!

And that will never happen in a realistic scenario.

In a real scenario you have time between shoots, ostacles, tank speed and other enemies that are not considered in your math.

range is good but if they ups the damage and kept the range it will defo help granted it may only be an extra 300 damage or so per swarm luancher but thats a lot better without it and with 1% proficency any 3 damage mods u looking at 500 to 600 per swarm

Reduce the rate and damage threshold that the shield/armor can repair for tanks.
create movement penalties for some of the modules damage mods, hardeners, shield extenders etc.( to create a sacrifice to movement)
increase the damage type downfalls for heavy turrets(to buff the turret role status)
Create a redline return to battle/kick system to eliminate rail tanks camping the redline all match.( specific to tanks make it like 4 mins to allow for calling it in, recalling it in the redline, restock in the redline. so like 4mins warning and then a 1-2 min final warning then kick.)

problem solved.

I guess I was looking at the combo of nearly impenetrable defense, high fire rate and ability to escape at a ridiculously high speed. I as a FG have good firepower against an unhardened tank but will die with 1-2 shots by them and can't run to save my life, literally. Sometimes I want a hover-board slogging around in a heavy suit. As I mentioned though, I've had 2nd thoughts as a team can take down even a hardened tank driver that gets pinned. I think the novelty has worn off as I'm seeing a lot less tanks to destroy. Take it easy.

i thought ccp had already reduced movement speed of them?

they feel much slower now than when i was driving them on day1..

id say our current tanks r fine.. well mlt feels fine any ways...

now since hardeners and other such modules are cycled with if they worked like this u have 3 shield hardeners on a gunlogi.

instead of being able to cycle them. the second u activate 1 of the hardeners the rest activate at the same time. this means no more permanent hardened tanks.

which could mean an end to this tank stomping.


although the only times ive brought out a tank was when i was having an extremely hard time trying to push an objective. or when there was an enemy tank prowling about trying to farm kills...

Uber +1 to those ideas, in all honesty. More so to the vulnerable point, than the EMP greande. Immobilizing a tank entirely as such would probably be a little too much. It'd just make it a fish in a barrel at that point. But as for the vulnerable point, I'm totes for it. Like...the window is a great idea, albeit small, or remote explosives could have a such effect that if they blow up underneath a tank, not only do they deal damage to the tank, but they can also break the tracks that the tanks roll on, therefore immobilizing the movement, but not the turret. And think, most people who use remote explosives drop them on crucial, and vital points in the map, specifically in the middle of the road. So if they immobilize that said tank in the middle of the road, next to an objective, then it turns out, you just made a deployed blaster/railgun/missle installation.
Edit: With that in mind, they can have as many hardeners as they want. If they can't move, I'm okay with a unremoveable speedbump in the middle of the road that can shoot at you.

These are good ideas however implementing all of these would reduce tanks to 1.6 cheese again.

Considering that tanks are weaker then 1.6 when hardeners are off...if you have 1 and it goes off.

Instead of introducing a bunch of new things, we should adjust what is out there to resemble some kind of sanity. CCP balances things with a sledge hammer. Introducing new things to kill tanks will make AV overpowered again and we'll just flip-flop between one or the other being OP forever.

Yes tanks, with hardeners, are god-mode. <--- if this is the problem, this should be addressed.

What exists needs to be balanced without the introduction of new things, which themselves will need to be balanced.

The "wave" idea is stupid. Eve has a decade of experience at vehicle combat/tanking and Dust has learned NOTHING from any of that. The Eve system works...why is it so impossible to say "Hey look, that works really well...maybe we should do that."

Too many radical changes will just take tanks from being OP to being completely useless. We need to look at smaller steps.

1) Reduce tank spam by making Tanks less viable for people who donGÇÖt specialise in tanks.

Nerf vehicle health by 25%, but add the +5% HP for each level of shield and amour skill. This is a 25% nerf to people who donGÇÖt have vehicle skills, while not effecting anyone with Vehicle Armour and Shield skills maxed.

2) Buff Swarm Launcher slightly.
Buff lock range by 25m. 175 + 25 = 200m (was 400m in 1.6)
Buff missel damage by 30. 220 + 30 = 250 (was 330 in 1.6)

Then lets test AV against dedicated tankers without the AV getting swarmed by militia tanks. Once we assess the situation without all the clutter, then we can discuss what else needs to be done. Trying to fix everything in one step is how tanks became OP in the first place.


Also:
- I donGÇÖt like making Militia tanks more expensive. A new merc can invest half a million skill points in vehicles if they want to specialise in tanking, but they donGÇÖt start with a lot of ISK.

- I donGÇÖt like capping the tanks at 2. The first two proto Infantry who spawn will call in militia tanks, and then the 22 million skill point tanker who spawns in after will be forced to run around in a militia starter suit until one of the militia tanks are killed.

Prolonged deployment time for tanks. Make a lead time of some kind, maybe 1 minute after calling in a tank for it to be deployed. This would almost completely eliminate tank spamming without nerfs or buffs. It would give AV players a chance to eliminate 1 tank at a time without having that tank replaced in 10 seconds. It would give ambush players and all infantry a chance to establish themselves before getting dominated by tanks. It also requires the tanker to invest time to be the most OP person on the map.

Symmetric decrease of fire power and defense of tanks. this would allow the same tank v tank battles while making them slightly less effective to everything else and more vulnerable to attacks. This is really just a nerf, but probably badly needed at this point.

Go play World of Tanks Stinker Butt

i'm gonna keep saying nerfing tanks or buffing AV untill there is a standing dedicated AV force will only break tanks again...

that does some what make sense but what if they up the damage on swarm luachers say 250 per missile thats 1000 for basic swarms and prototype has 1500

then put the shields on tanks like what you out of suits put a delay on them but say 30 seconds and then restrict the hardeners you have down to 1 hardener per tank i know a few people put 2 or 3 on when one runs out they switch to anther one and wait for first one to cool down then restrict the speed of the tank down so its not faster then an LAV

i read a post a few days ago i liked the idea of where tanks LAVs and drop ships will have swarms on them

tanks have anti air craft but will need to give up a slot for an extra player to use the AA gun and drop ships have anti vehicle on them i was thinking maybe an extra turret that comes out the bottom of the drop ship to give it best possible chance

I am not very sure what you guys mean by the "window", but this is what I think

A tank should be the sum of its parts, its not like the entire tank is one **** of metal.
A window should be like the door in which you enter a tank, maybe from behind.
A well placed RE or missile file should be able to blow up the window/door.
Even if the tank repairs to full health the door would remain open.
Maybe I am asking for too much as this game's engine is supposedly outdated.
I believe a PS3 game should be able to do this.

Also no matter what anyone says, TANKS ARE TOO FAST.
They should be like Heavys
They move like they are paperweight.
I said this before but tanks are doing ballet after their speed nerf
I saw two tanks on my team forming a triangle

Wouldn't adding more cover and more CQC areas to the map solve the problem of the ostensibly OP sniper, without having to nerf the sniper's weapon?

There shouldn't be a minimum wait time to become the most OP person on the map.

but they havent made any maps all they down in take some old buildings off and put new ones on and cover it in snow thats not new that cheap

i would like to see different types of maps like 1 very dusty or foggy raining heavy snow grass maps would be nice maybe some trees i find it hard to believe the only maps CCP can come up with are deserts

anyone who thinks that two players running anti-vehicle fits should not be able to take out a tank being operated by one player In it Is obviously a tanker. Its obvious that you have no interest in a balanced and fair game, you just want your kill death ratio to be higher than other players, and you should just stop commenting now. on the same token if a player with a full skill tree for a swarm launcher goes against a tanker with little to no skills invested in his skill tree, its obvious that the swarm launcher should have no problem taking the him out. if you had it your way and tanks ruled this game from here on just like they do now, this game's player base would decrease just to tankers, and then you could play all by yourselfs. I personally have quit this game until this vehicle problem is fixed, which sucks because I really enjoyed it. I guess everything comes to an end sooner or later. On to PS4.

Wrong

Realism lol this is sci fi futuristic stuff, it can repair itself because nanomachines

OP is wrong tho

Realism is not a must

Yes they should, my gun is bigger than you goo bag

No they cant, current MBT can survive mulitple RPG attacks

I did and OP is wrong

No its not

Proto AV is fine, it can easily kill tanks, stop shooting when the tank is glowing unless you have a FG which can cause enough damage to stop regen

Asking for realism in a game? okay then FG shouldnt exist because lolrealism, lolno tanks speed are fine and to use realism they can go pretty fast in RL, ask for webs or EWAR instead of nerf

Its not easy mode

AV is no longer easy mode

Its balanced mode

Well if you look at reality, the M1 Abrams that has been in use since just before the first gulf war is able to cruise at 60 mph over bumps and hills and can shoot VERY accurately while going at max speed... This post sounds like your just mad a 50 ton piece of equipment that is doing what it is supposed to do.... I suggest you find a good quiet corner and cryhard there for a while ok... Just saying....