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suggestion for team killers in FW

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dustwaffle Xer Cloud Consortium 729	Posted - 2013.12.19 06:09:00 - [31] - Quote I would rather be flashy red logi <3
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1725	Posted - 2013.12.19 07:06:00 - [32] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: personally I don't think bans should exist at all... I think it goes against the kind of environment ccp is trying to create and has created in eve. just like in eve, this mechanic in dust wouldn't be a life long sentence... you could work off your negative staus in some way, so if it happened by accident you could redeem yourself.... but lets face it, a few kills here or there is a mistake.... a few kills every match isn't.... if it is... then you really need to improve and should still be flagged as a free for all target as incentive to improve. I'd prefer that too. The important difference to eve is though that one traitor/griefer during combat can only do so much damage before he's blapped by a fleet of BS/DN at point blank and needs to get a new ship running, buy a new clone, undock yadda yadda before being able to do any more damage. A dust merc however can kill three people, get killed by a former teammate -costing the team 4clones already and immediately respawn. The potential damage a single merc can do without some kind of kick mechanic is pretty damn high. well I don't have all the details ironed out, and you pose a valid point. I would guess however that since both teams can then kill you you would find many situations where both reds and blues are working together to kill "purples" since they are now targetable by everyone. between the potential hit to k/d (lets face it many mercs care about it) the possible isk hit for the lost suits and if done enough the inability to go into a match without having possibly 31 mercs against them would make people who don't want that kind of heat think twice.... of course there would be those who do love the challenge/role and yeah they could do a lot of dmg...but they could also get insta killed every time they spawn as well if they make to big a name for them selves forcing them to change their ways... stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi
Mortedeamor Wraith Shadow Guards D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1014	Posted - 2013.12.19 14:00:00 - [33] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Mortedeamor wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: in true CCP fashion this would really spice up FW... make teamkillers PURPLE. purple dots can be legally killed by both sides for points. I don't want to iron out the details of how a merc becomes purple, but the general idea is if you kill or destroy team deployables at a certain point instead of getting lolbanned you turn purple and become a target to everyone. do this to often in to many different matches you stay purple in all matches until you redeem yourself. thank you, I know this is a genius idea.... +1 but only if for purple people everyone renders as red and they become pve rogues omg... I don't actually mean their body turns purple... I mean purple dots, names, chevrons... I seriously hope the purple people posters are trolling..... i get what you mean what i am saying is if someone is a purple dot then they are a tking rogue and everyone should be redots for them when they deploy to fw..they should be able to kill anyone with no consequence like a bandit or a raider a rogue
Mortedeamor Wraith Shadow Guards D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1014	Posted - 2013.12.19 14:01:00 - [34] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: personally I don't think bans should exist at all... I think it goes against the kind of environment ccp is trying to create and has created in eve. just like in eve, this mechanic in dust wouldn't be a life long sentence... you could work off your negative staus in some way, so if it happened by accident you could redeem yourself.... but lets face it, a few kills here or there is a mistake.... a few kills every match isn't.... if it is... then you really need to improve and should still be flagged as a free for all target as incentive to improve. I'd prefer that too. The important difference to eve is though that one traitor/griefer during combat can only do so much damage before he's blapped by a fleet of BS/DN at point blank and needs to get a new ship running, buy a new clone, undock yadda yadda before being able to do any more damage. A dust merc however can kill three people, get killed by a former teammate -costing the team 4clones already and immediately respawn. The potential damage a single merc can do without some kind of kick mechanic is pretty damn high. well I don't have all the details ironed out, and you pose a valid point. I would guess however that since both teams can then kill you you would find many situations where both reds and blues are working together to kill "purples" since they are now targetable by everyone. between the potential hit to k/d (lets face it many mercs care about it) the possible isk hit for the lost suits and if done enough the inability to go into a match without having possibly 31 mercs against them would make people who don't want that kind of heat think twice.... of course there would be those who do love the challenge/role and yeah they could do a lot of dmg...but they could also get insta killed every time they spawn as well if they make to big a name for them selves forcing them to change their ways... personally if they implemented this i would drop all allegiances and become a terrorist picking off blues and reds alike and sabotaging whichever side i choose merely to be an ass
Kierkegaard Soren Scions of Athra 40	Posted - 2013.12.19 14:13:00 - [35] - Quote "Turning Purple" (or whatever colour we choose to designate TKers) causes you to lose all access to uplinks and letter spawns; dieing gives you the MCC to spawn at, and nothingn else. And since the amount of potential opponenents has doubled from one team to two, you earn only 25wp for a kill. Essentially, TK should be a tactic that forces you to sacrifice earnings and standings for the ability to cause some serious carnage.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1727	Posted - 2013.12.19 16:14:00 - [36] - Quote Mortedeamor wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Mortedeamor wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: in true CCP fashion this would really spice up FW... make teamkillers PURPLE. purple dots can be legally killed by both sides for points. I don't want to iron out the details of how a merc becomes purple, but the general idea is if you kill or destroy team deployables at a certain point instead of getting lolbanned you turn purple and become a target to everyone. do this to often in to many different matches you stay purple in all matches until you redeem yourself. thank you, I know this is a genius idea.... +1 but only if for purple people everyone renders as red and they become pve rogues omg... I don't actually mean their body turns purple... I mean purple dots, names, chevrons... I seriously hope the purple people posters are trolling..... i get what you mean what i am saying is if someone is a purple dot then they are a tking rogue and everyone should be redots for them when they deploy to fw..they should be able to kill anyone with no consequence like a bandit or a raider a rogue not only no consequence, but once purple, actually rewarded for it stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 426	Posted - 2013.12.19 16:26:00 - [37] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: NOTE: This is assuming they fix the stupid issues with "dealing" FF damage while being run over by a friendly tank in your LAV, and where blowing up your REs counts as you killing them, etc. Destroying equipment no longer counts toward the FF totals. Read this discussion https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1628008#post1628008 Note! To traverse from DEV post to DEV post click on the blue tag that says DEV attached to their Avatar. This will whisk you away to the next in-sequence post to evaluate. If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
CLONE117 planetary retaliation organisation 523	Posted - 2013.12.19 16:29:00 - [38] - Quote what if they had to pay for our stuff instead?
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 5947	Posted - 2013.12.19 16:41:00 - [39] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: NOTE: This is assuming they fix the stupid issues with "dealing" FF damage while being run over by a friendly tank in your LAV, and where blowing up your REs counts as you killing them, etc. CCP Nullarbor has confirmed that the recent hotfix that deployed yesterday has addressed that issue. Source: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=130180&find=unread Quote: It is safe to use RE's in faction warfare with a couple of exceptions which you should be aware of: - Remote explosives will still do damage to friendly vehicles and dropsuits so if you damage friendlies it will be tracked. We did however fix the damage tracking calculations which were going haywire and recording far too much damage. - Friendlies can still detonate your remote explosives by shooting them and killing themselves. They can then punish you for it. We have not changed this. We also fixed vehicle collision which was also causing way too much damage. Hope that helps. CCP Nullarbor wrote: Maximus Stryker wrote: so can we place proxy mine next to each other? Previously, once one was set off, it would blow up neighboring mines and count towards your damage and thus kick you. Can I now lay 5 proxy mines next to each other for a tank trap? We no longer track damage to any equipment including remote explosives and proxy mines. Quote: Actually that is another exception I forgot to mention, if you grenade your own dropsuit or shoot your own vehicle that will NOT count towards the damage threshold. The ownership of vehicles does not change if a different driver gets in, so if someone on your own team steals your car and shoots it then that is tracked. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved?
Mortedeamor Wraith Shadow Guards D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1015	Posted - 2013.12.19 17:10:00 - [40] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Mortedeamor wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Mortedeamor wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: in true CCP fashion this would really spice up FW... make teamkillers PURPLE. purple dots can be legally killed by both sides for points. I don't want to iron out the details of how a merc becomes purple, but the general idea is if you kill or destroy team deployables at a certain point instead of getting lolbanned you turn purple and become a target to everyone. do this to often in to many different matches you stay purple in all matches until you redeem yourself. thank you, I know this is a genius idea.... +1 but only if for purple people everyone renders as red and they become pve rogues omg... I don't actually mean their body turns purple... I mean purple dots, names, chevrons... I seriously hope the purple people posters are trolling..... i get what you mean what i am saying is if someone is a purple dot then they are a tking rogue and everyone should be redots for them when they deploy to fw..they should be able to kill anyone with no consequence like a bandit or a raider a rogue not only no consequence, but once purple, actually rewarded for it yes thats it at that point everyone is your enemy if there are 30 scrubs on the other side could u imagine the devastation 2 badass rogues could do and get nice sexy high scores...

Hobo on Fire Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 91	Posted - 2013.12.19 18:00:00 - [41] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: "Turning Purple" (or whatever colour we choose to designate TKers) causes you to lose all access to uplinks and letter spawns; dieing gives you the MCC to spawn at, and nothingn else. And since the amount of potential opponenents has doubled from one team to two, you earn only 25wp for a kill. Essentially, TK should be a tactic that forces you to sacrifice earnings and standings for the ability to cause some serious carnage. I would argue that they should have access to uplinks (perhaps only uplinks deployed by their squad?) but not the MCC. If your own team has flagged you as hostile, why would they give you access to what should be a restricted area? Rewarding TKers for every kill, regardless of color, is a brilliant idea, and reducing WP earned would be a fair trade-off for the extra targets.
Darius Ashran Bragian Order Amarr Empire 26	Posted - 2013.12.19 19:08:00 - [42] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Garrett Blacknova wrote: If you manage to "accidentally" take out 7 players with Orbital Strikes AND they all choose to punish you, then you didn't communicate your intentions very well. if you manage to deal over 10,000 FF damage in a single day, you're obviously doing something wrong. NOTE: This is assuming they fix the stupid issues with "dealing" FF damage while being run over by a friendly tank in your LAV, and where blowing up your REs counts as you killing them, etc. I only have to get 3 punished TKs over the course of three days to be purple for the next three days. A fully manned, tank chose retreat through your OB target area? There goes your ambitions to play some FW for the next three days( assuming they didn't like it which they probably did not). Continuing to play can only prolong this to 7 days if something happens again and you are probably purple/orange for the match already or at least close, meaning that you might aswell just bail from the match when someone in there likes killing neutrals. You squad cannot protect you against those vigilantes either so your (ok, my ) screwup affects them aswell. Even with the fixes. That's pretty harsh consequences for mere incompetence and -and this is the important part - won't deter proper full time griefers since: A: Alts B: Being purple makes their life a little harder, not impossible. I do like the purple/orange dot idea. But it would be better off being an added mechanic to our current booting system so that people can get some fun out of TKers by fighting back before the worst offenders are simply removed from FW for the day. personally I don't think bans should exist at all... I think it goes against the kind of environment ccp is trying to create and has created in eve. just like in eve, this mechanic in dust wouldn't be a life long sentence... you could work off your negative staus in some way, so if it happened by accident you could redeem yourself.... but lets face it, a few kills here or there is a mistake.... a few kills every match isn't.... if it is... then you really need to improve and should still be flagged as a free for all target as incentive to improve. I agree completely Seymor . I think a proper system that created consequences for actions across games is much more in line with the universe and with the idea that your actions as a player are yours. And not just some random event. Will it deter hardcore greifers? Not entirely. Probably not much at all. Will it help to identify immediately hardcore greifers? Yes. Will it make legit players be more careful of friendly fire? Imo yes. Will it be useful for corporations if this status is visible on a players profile information on recruitment? Defiantly. This would not only work for corporations looking to reject such behavior but also for those looking to embrace and foster it creating the outlaw/law abiding dynamic. Recognition of both player styles in the New Eden universe is important to the choice and consequence atmosphere CCP has tried to foster. Banning however does not. Short of outright exploitation or abuse of another player this is not helpful to the game. I think it should be taken a step further though. Not only have the Purple/orange color indicator on the map but some form of easily definable tag next to the actual avatar as part of the active HUD otherwise this feature could simply prompt TKing more then allow the ability to target malicious players. TBH if the devs don't start acting more in line with thoughtful development that the title needs I will really start to have to question what the hell CCP HQ in Iceland is doing with the Shanghai office. I mean to a point I already do but even more so if they cant see the need for such changes. Surely the Dust dev team has to see the merit in this idea.Whoever is overseeing the operation at this point already has done enough PR damage to the company's image and the average consumers who has tangled with Dust514 and should have been reassigned if not out right fired. But baring that lets at least see some forward thinking so mistakes are not repeated. Concept and Vision are great CCP but you can let those two key points override the need to maintain good faith with the consumers who are and have always been CCPs greatest source of advertisementn to other gamers. And I say this knowing full well about the intended add campaign planned for after may. Even so its a very strong point worth consideration. I think with us quickly approaching the 1 year mark on 5/6/2014 and or 5/14/2014 take your pick. That CCP has a very limited amount of time to really bring home the concept of this game. Smaller alterations such as this that would not overstress the existing development schedule would be a good way to keep the game fresh while they work on primary content and features. Thoughts from forum peoples/ and or maybe a rogue dev?
Bunny Demon Scions of Athra 28	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:07:00 - [43] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Bunny Demon wrote: That's actually quite a good idea apart from snipers who could still tk without much consequence, or BPO people who would just suicide into anyone proto (tbh I'd do that on an alt ) yeah but they are still worth points when you kill them... and it adds a new dimension to battles... a 3rd team in a way Who would they capture points for? Or would they be kicked from being able to hack? What about squad WP? Donate isk to the guy above ^ (Or me, whichever you prefer)
Darius Ashran Bragian Order Amarr Empire 26	Posted - 2013.12.19 23:56:00 - [44] - Quote Bunny Demon wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Bunny Demon wrote: That's actually quite a good idea apart from snipers who could still tk without much consequence, or BPO people who would just suicide into anyone proto (tbh I'd do that on an alt ) yeah but they are still worth points when you kill them... and it adds a new dimension to battles... a 3rd team in a way Who would they capture points for? Or would they be kicked from being able to hack? What about squad WP? When they hack an object it could turn it neutral. This could also count for vehicle hacks as well as facilities and points.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1737	Posted - 2013.12.20 00:44:00 - [45] - Quote Darius Ashran wrote: Bunny Demon wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Bunny Demon wrote: That's actually quite a good idea apart from snipers who could still tk without much consequence, or BPO people who would just suicide into anyone proto (tbh I'd do that on an alt ) yeah but they are still worth points when you kill them... and it adds a new dimension to battles... a 3rd team in a way Who would they capture points for? Or would they be kicked from being able to hack? What about squad WP? When they hack an object it could turn it neutral. This could also count for vehicle hacks as well as facilities and points. that's a cool idea... hack it neutral...nice or even be able to choose what color to hack it to? stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi
ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 708	Posted - 2013.12.20 01:02:00 - [46] - Quote I'm in it for SP, so i'd probably try to become purple immediately. CCP, Geth Infiltrator is OP! plz nerf.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1739	Posted - 2013.12.20 13:32:00 - [47] - Quote ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: I'm in it for SP, so i'd probably try to become purple immediately. seems like this idea has a lot of support. keep posting and liking to get ccp's attention on this. stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi
Artificer Ghost Bojo's School of the Trades 738	Posted - 2013.12.20 23:19:00 - [48] - Quote Making them gold (Universal neutral in DUST, for installations, objectives, etc...) would make more sense. ~Art, CEO and Director of Educations at Bojo's School of The Trades, Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
Darius Ashran Bragian Order Amarr Empire 29	Posted - 2013.12.22 18:55:00 - [49] - Quote Artificer Ghost wrote: Making them gold (Universal neutral in DUST, for installations, objectives, etc...) would make more sense. If we do that i think they should call it independent instead of neutral. As players under this status would obviously not be neutral. I agree however using the existing color mechanics i think would be a very wise and easily distinguishable option. And I would assume even lower on the technical implementation side considering at least elements of the recognition of neutral assets are already in the game. It would also be easier for new players to readily understand and identify the consequences of that status with. I think we can all agree rapid information assimilation is defiantly a good things for the new players and the more we can streamline it the better. Intuitive conceptualization =D We need to get some CCP input on this concept. Because tbh players who want to greif are going to greif. And the ban system as it is does not even work right. I state again i can only imagine this being a far simpler process to implement and set right rather then that horrible ban system we have now that does not even work right. Lets try and spread this around and keep it on the front page. More inputs !
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1760	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:26:00 - [50] - Quote Darius Ashran wrote: Artificer Ghost wrote: Making them gold (Universal neutral in DUST, for installations, objectives, etc...) would make more sense. If we do that i think they should call it independent instead of neutral. As players under this status would obviously not be neutral. I agree however using the existing color mechanics i think would be a very wise and easily distinguishable option. And I would assume even lower on the technical implementation side considering at least elements of the recognition of neutral assets are already in the game. It would also be easier for new players to readily understand and identify the consequences of that status with. I think we can all agree rapid information assimilation is defiantly a good things for the new players and the more we can streamline it the better. Intuitive conceptualization =D We need to get some CCP input on this concept. Because tbh players who want to greif are going to greif. And the ban system as it is does not even work right. I state again i can only imagine this being a far simpler process to implement and set right rather then that horrible ban system we have now that does not even work right. Lets try and spread this around and keep it on the front page. More inputs ! so how about it ccp? thoughts? comments? stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi

Hobo on Fire Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 94	Posted - 2013.12.24 18:42:00 - [51] - Quote Darius Ashran wrote: Artificer Ghost wrote: Making them gold (Universal neutral in DUST, for installations, objectives, etc...) would make more sense. If we do that i think they should call it independent instead of neutral. As players under this status would obviously not be neutral. I agree however using the existing color mechanics i think would be a very wise and easily distinguishable option. And I would assume even lower on the technical implementation side considering at least elements of the recognition of neutral assets are already in the game. It would also be easier for new players to readily understand and identify the consequences of that status with. I think we can all agree rapid information assimilation is defiantly a good things for the new players and the more we can streamline it the better. Intuitive conceptualization =D While the ability to re-use existing game UI elements is tempting, I think there should be a visual distinction between "neutral" objects (null cannons and turrets who shoot at nobody) and "independant" players who potentially shoot at everybody. We already have blue UI elements for friendlies, green for squad members, yellow for neutrals, red for enemies, and sort of a glowing orange for scanned enemies. A recolor for an existing UI object is one thing CCP's art department should be able to push out quickly. If they take the time to code in a color change for TKers, punching in "TKer icon changes to new color 1" is no more difficult than "TKer icon changes to old color 3."


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