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Please keep squad stacking and proto-stomping to FW

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Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1779	Posted - 2013.11.27 20:55:00 - [1] - Quote Isn't that why we have FW contracts atm? We all have somewhere we can q sync and proto our hearts out; can we not just leave pub matches to the less overtly OP tactics? I keep seeing 8+ members of the same corps in ambushes, dominations and skirmishes and they absolutely crush the opposition, who more often than not has no organised squads. Sometimes I'm the enemy to these teams, sometimes I'm a teammate but regardless the matches are totally one-sided and redlines are boring. But I recognise that some people want to run max proto gear and run 7 or more players together and that's fine, you can do that no problem but please do it in FW. That way players who just want to run solo or small squads and the lower level players can have a slightly safer place to enjoy the game. Surely this is the best solution until we get actually working matchmaking? I know this is New Eden and all but until New Eden is working in a reasonable manner for all, can we please just try to behave reasonably ourselves? Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
CONCORD TAX SERVICE Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2013.11.27 20:58:00 - [2] - Quote If only we had some sort of gear/skillpoint level matchmaking. Or even a solo only gamemode. Just about anything is better than what we have now.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Dust2Dust. Top Men. 247	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:00:00 - [3] - Quote Stomping is currently the quickest way to earn both ISK and SP. I don't blame the stompers as much as I blame the system. Preeminent Scrambler Rifle User & Dropship Enthusiast
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 1261	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:01:00 - [4] - Quote Yes come into my domain i will gladly relieve you of your protosuits. For the Empire Dual tanking is a sin BPO's are bad for economy, Respec's are bad for the game. Want to fight about it?
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1780	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:03:00 - [5] - Quote Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Stomping is currently the quickest way to earn both ISK and SP. I don't blame the stompers as much as I blame the system. Totally understand that but there's no reason the stompers can't keep to a specific area like FW. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Darth-Carbonite GIO Dust2Dust. Top Men. 249	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:10:00 - [6] - Quote I agree, and it would be a better game for it. At the end of the day though, this is New Eden. flashes back to when he was a noob *The horror...* Preeminent Scrambler Rifle User & Dropship Enthusiast
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 1989	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:15:00 - [7] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Darth-Carbonite GIO wrote: Stomping is currently the quickest way to earn both ISK and SP. I don't blame the stompers as much as I blame the system. Totally understand that but there's no reason the stompers can't keep to a specific area like FW. They have to be encouraged. I wrote up an idea in the Feedback section about gradually reducing rewards in high sec as your skill points progress and having separate low sec public matches for those not interested in FW. You want to encourage them to move on? Stop giving them WP, SP, ISK or counting towards their precious KDR when hanging out in high sec. // Logistics / Scout / Dropship Crash Tester // https://twitter.com/reesnoturana
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 1395	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:15:00 - [8] - Quote I've been trying to keep the good stuff for FW (since I don't PC), but I haven't seen a full match in a month. Instead, all of the good competition is in pubs trying to look awesome wiping out 30+ MLT and STD fits and ******** about it. So, pubs it is - and I'll let the Player List decide what I deploy in. Cheeseburgers.
Jadd Hatchen Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 75	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:16:00 - [9] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Isn't that why we have FW contracts atm? We all have somewhere we can q sync and proto our hearts out; can we not just leave pub matches to the less overtly OP tactics? I keep seeing 8+ members of the same corps in ambushes, dominations and skirmishes and they absolutely crush the opposition, who more often than not has no organised squads. Sometimes I'm the enemy to these teams, sometimes I'm a teammate but regardless the matches are totally one-sided and redlines are boring. But I recognise that some people want to run max proto gear and run 7 or more players together and that's fine, you can do that no problem but please do it in FW. That way players who just want to run solo or small squads and the lower level players can have a slightly safer place to enjoy the game. Surely this is the best solution until we get actually working matchmaking? I know this is New Eden and all but until New Eden is working in a reasonable manner for all, can we please just try to behave reasonably ourselves? Ok, two problems with this. First, FW was not developed for that. FW was developed to support an NPC faction in the EVE universe and receive loyalty points from them. There are many corps/alliances that are not allied with any specific NPC faction and thus don't give a **** about them or fighting for them. Worse, some members of a corp may want the loyalty rewards from one faction while others may want another. But by fighting for anyone faction to build up standing with them, that player eventually precludes themselves from fighting for the opposing faction. Thus those corps will ONLY be able to squad up and participate as a corp in NON-FW matches when that occurs. Second, instead of restricting this behavior (squading and platooning up and encouraging players to actually cooperate in play) to just some fiction case that doesn't exist in the game. How about instead make it more readily available to all the random pubbies in the random matches? Then things become more even and both sides can enjoy the benefits of full cooperative gameplay rather then some e-honor system that will never exist.
Thanatus Sleep 34	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:20:00 - [10] - Quote why? so nub ass BPO corp that can't pub stomp on FW can be safe in public contract. Hell no *Im a sad merc* Aq-Rg SAY YES TO BPO REMOVALS ON 1.7 PATCH

Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1781	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:26:00 - [11] - Quote Jadd Hatchen wrote: Ok, two problems with this. First, FW was not developed for that. FW was developed to support an NPC faction in the EVE universe and receive loyalty points from them. There are many corps/alliances that are not allied with any specific NPC faction and thus don't give a **** about them or fighting for them. Worse, some members of a corp may want the loyalty rewards from one faction while others may want another. But by fighting for anyone faction to build up standing with them, that player eventually precludes themselves from fighting for the opposing faction. Thus those corps will ONLY be able to squad up and participate as a corp in NON-FW matches when that occurs. Second, instead of restricting this behavior (squading and platooning up and encouraging players to actually cooperate in play) to just some fiction case that doesn't exist in the game. How about instead make it more readily available to all the random pubbies in the random matches? Then things become more even and both sides can enjoy the benefits of full cooperative gameplay rather then some e-honor system that will never exist. Firstly, the FW changes have not come in yet and we've not been given any date when it will do - though rumours point to 1.7 but we'll see. But currently you get no standings and no LP for playing FW, so it's the perfect place for people who want to play hardcore but have no access to PC. Secondly, "random pubbies" in "random matches" often don't know how to squad or otherwise don't want to squad up, which is equally their perogative. Also, just squading up does not necessarily even things up. 16 randoms in 3 squads still won't play in an organised manner, most will not have voice chat on and will still get demolished by 10 players from the same corp with 6 other randoms. Now I understand and agree that there are other things that can and should be done by the devs to alleviate the problems in pub matches but there are also these things that we as players can do until what needs to be done by CCP is done. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1781	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:28:00 - [12] - Quote Thanatus Sleep wrote: why? so nub ass BPO corp that can't pub stomp on FW can be safe in public contract. Hell no Can anyone translate this? I think it's agreeing with me but not entirely sure... Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
True Adamance Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 4381	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:29:00 - [13] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Isn't that why we have FW contracts atm? We all have somewhere we can q sync and proto our hearts out; can we not just leave pub matches to the less overtly OP tactics? I keep seeing 8+ members of the same corps in ambushes, dominations and skirmishes and they absolutely crush the opposition, who more often than not has no organised squads. Sometimes I'm the enemy to these teams, sometimes I'm a teammate but regardless the matches are totally one-sided and redlines are boring. But I recognise that some people want to run max proto gear and run 7 or more players together and that's fine, you can do that no problem but please do it in FW. That way players who just want to run solo or small squads and the lower level players can have a slightly safer place to enjoy the game. Surely this is the best solution until we get actually working matchmaking? I know this is New Eden and all but until New Eden is working in a reasonable manner for all, can we please just try to behave reasonably ourselves? Nope FW is about affecting the overwar. Sure you can Proto stomp...its gets you nothing when I am sticking a Templar ScR up your ass and taking those beautiful proto suits away from you. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 756	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:31:00 - [14] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Isn't that why we have FW contracts atm? We all have somewhere we can q sync and proto our hearts out; can we not just leave pub matches to the less overtly OP tactics? I keep seeing 8+ members of the same corps in ambushes, dominations and skirmishes and they absolutely crush the opposition, who more often than not has no organised squads. Sometimes I'm the enemy to these teams, sometimes I'm a teammate but regardless the matches are totally one-sided and redlines are boring. But I recognise that some people want to run max proto gear and run 7 or more players together and that's fine, you can do that no problem but please do it in FW. That way players who just want to run solo or small squads and the lower level players can have a slightly safer place to enjoy the game. Surely this is the best solution until we get actually working matchmaking? I know this is New Eden and all but until New Eden is working in a reasonable manner for all, can we please just try to behave reasonably ourselves? No, stop doing threads like this. You are going to ruin my master plan! This game has to die before next Fall or I lose money! "It's made with bits of real Gallente. So you know it's good." -GÇö Brian Fantana paraphrased
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1782	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:38:00 - [15] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Nope FW is about affecting the overwar. Sure you can Proto stomp...its gets you nothing when I am sticking a Templar ScR up your ass and taking those beautiful proto suits away from you. True, FW does affect the 'overwar' but until CCP gives us somewhere else we can play our hearts out, that's really all there is. And if these people who want to play this way don't want to affect the 'overwar' or take any particular faction's side, they can tick all the boxes and play for whoever's paying - afterall we are mercs, right? Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1782	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:41:00 - [16] - Quote Operative 1171 Aajli wrote: No, stop doing threads like this. You are going to ruin my master plan! This game has to die before next Fall or I lose money! Sorry to break it to you but CCP is never going to let this game die. They're not the type of company to just throw in the towel when things aren't going well. They'll keep plugging away at this game until it is good and then they'll keep making it better and eventually one day we'll see that cool ad from fanfest 2013 showing on our tellyboxes! Dust isn't going away anytime mate. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Kaughst 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 52	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:48:00 - [17] - Quote Your ideas are very diluted. You should instead attempt to come up with a matchmaking algorithm while you are at it. Step 1: Take Districts Step 2: ??? Step 3: Profit Cow for Kaughst
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1783	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:06:00 - [18] - Quote Kaughst wrote: Your ideas are very diluted. You should instead attempt to come up with a matchmaking algorithm while you are at it. There are many many matchmaking algorithms that could be used but the best would be an ELO system. The simplest would be to make sure that squads are always placed evenly on opposite sides - I don't understand how hard it can be to make this happen but squad stacking in pub matches should effectively be impossible because you'd always end up on opposite sides when you tried. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution 1780	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:24:00 - [19] - Quote I just think that you shouldn't be able to qsync into pub matches. If it happens randomly, fine, but me and Ken were in a match yesterday with 3 squads on the other team, 2 of them full of the same corp =/ When I'm depressed, I cut myself......A BIG SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE!
Jadd Hatchen Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 77	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:28:00 - [20] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Firstly, the FW changes have not come in yet and we've not been given any date when it will do - though rumours point to 1.7 but we'll see. But currently you get no standings and no LP for playing FW, so it's the perfect place for people who want to play hardcore but have no access to PC. Secondly, "random pubbies" in "random matches" often don't know how to squad or otherwise don't want to squad up, which is equally their perogative. Also, just squading up does not necessarily even things up. 16 randoms in 3 squads still won't play in an organised manner, most will not have voice chat on and will still get demolished by 10 players from the same corp with 6 other randoms. Now I understand and agree that there are other things that can and should be done by the devs to alleviate the problems in pub matches but there are also these things that we as players can do until what needs to be done by CCP is done. It doesn't matter when they implement them. The fact is they will. And when they do, the situation I pointed out will occur. This is the downfall of your theory that FW is for squads etc while the rest is for not squads. That is all wrong! The entire game is about cooperative MMO play. Meaning that if you choose to be solo, then you live with that choice and know that you will be at a disadvantage against a squad of cooperative players. If you didn't want to work with other players in an online FPS, then you shouldn't be in one that is completely based on this concept. You should instead be playing Borderlands 2 offline. I agree that 16 random pubbies pitted against 3 squads of coordinated players is gonna loose every single time. That is how the game works. Functioning as intended. Rewarding people that do not squad is counter to this idea. Why would you reward someone for doing something that is wrong? Squading up is a good thing and thus you get a benefit for it (orbital support) in addition the inherent concept of cooperating to begin with. You are operating on the idea that people should be rewarded for playing less than their abilities. This leads people to do the wrong thing in the long run. It's like giving the winners' trophy to the losing team. Why play the game? And "public matches" are still fighting for NPC's just fighting for NPC corporations instead of NPC factions. It's like the difference between hiring on to fight for a corporation (public match) and hiring on to fight for a nation (faction warfare). Once people get that one very pertinent fact straight in thier heads, then maybe we can progress to actual ideas that can advance the game. Also, if you are saying that we as "responsible players" that want to make the game better have to give back to the community in some way to ensure that the game continues, then ok I'll bite on that one... Instead of nerfing people's play styles that are there because they are supposed to be there to encourage the proper tactics for winning. Why don't you instead take the time to contact those struggling players that haven't figured out how to squad up or use a mic and guide them in the proper way to do it? This would be of way more benefit than nerfing the game to make it into a children's themepark.

ratamaq doc Edge Regiment 153	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:33:00 - [21] - Quote Scotty has been messing FW up quite a bit lately. Several times over the past few weeks I've been in queue syncing squads that could not get into a FW battle, said screw it lets do a pub, then magically landed in the same game on the same side.
True Adamance Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 4381	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:43:00 - [22] - Quote Django Quik wrote: True Adamance wrote: Nope FW is about affecting the overwar. Sure you can Proto stomp...its gets you nothing when I am sticking a Templar ScR up your ass and taking those beautiful proto suits away from you. True, FW does affect the 'overwar' but until CCP gives us somewhere else we can play our hearts out, that's really all there is. And if these people who want to play this way don't want to affect the 'overwar' or take any particular faction's side, they can tick all the boxes and play for whoever's paying - afterall we are mercs, right? Most "merc" corps eve side don't run FW because it affects standings with the associated factions meaning travel within that empires space is more difficult. Yes you can tick all boxes and say "mercenary" but you can just as easily do that in pub matches and be a real mercenary. FW is about loyalty and lining your pockets with factionalised items. I seriously hope one day CCP places meaningful modifiers on FW. E.G- Fight for the Amarr too much and you cannot fight for the Minmatar unless you either pay heavy reparations or complete a serious grind out of PvE for the Minmatar. You cannot travel into their space when locality becomes important, a sign up militia system that prevents you fighting for another empire while you are in anothers Militia etc. Real meaningful reasons that discourage faction hopping and reward loyalty to a single faction. FW is not for mercs....in the traditional sense, its for loyalists. "All things were created by the Divine, and so the glory of our faith is inherent to us all"
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1787	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:25:00 - [23] - Quote @Jadd - you seem to have missed my point entirely. I never said anything like don't allow squads in pub matches; my whole post is about not squad stacking in pub matches. Squad play is entirely valid and should be very much encouraged but people should not be going out of their way to make matches multiple squads against none by means of queue syncing. It's even easier to do in FW, so people are clearly purposely going out of their way so they can dominate pub games like this. That is simply not on and very poor gamemanship. @True - honestly Im only suggesting FW currently because there's nowhere else to go and the game mechanics aren't there to facilitate matches for squad stacking or tiered gameplay. And this only really applies to those corps who are squad stacking pub games. They're bad places to practice for PC because every match is a stomping, so the only reason to stack squads in pubs is to stomp and ego boost, which is really quite sad. Go somewhere where you're more likely to face a challenge - i.e. FW. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
KING CHECKMATE AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS 2464	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:31:00 - [24] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Isn't that why we have FW contracts atm? We all have somewhere we can q sync and proto our hearts out; can we not just leave pub matches to the less overtly OP tactics? I keep seeing 8+ members of the same corps in ambushes, dominations and skirmishes and they absolutely crush the opposition, who more often than not has no organised squads. Sometimes I'm the enemy to these teams, sometimes I'm a teammate but regardless the matches are totally one-sided and redlines are boring. But I recognise that some people want to run max proto gear and run 7 or more players together and that's fine, you can do that no problem but please do it in FW. That way players who just want to run solo or small squads and the lower level players can have a slightly safer place to enjoy the game. Surely this is the best solution until we get actually working matchmaking? I know this is New Eden and all but until New Eden is working in a reasonable manner for all, can we please just try to behave reasonably ourselves? I agree and will give you the like BUT.I think the Main problem is many of these corps that ''proto-squad stomp'', like STB , They dont really have a choice BUT to do it in pub mtches since their Corp is composed of marcs loyal to DIFFERENT FACTIONS, there by, they cannoy play ALL together because there will always be someone against placing certain FW... etc... I know i WOULDNT play vs Amarr or Cal.... The Best Damage Mod, its a Headshot....
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1788	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:34:00 - [25] - Quote I've nade a suggestion thread for revamped corp contracts that could provide another way for people to have higher end matches with as many players as they like here https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=123838&find=unread however, as i previously mentioned, it seems quite clear there people don't want decent competitive matches, so really the only solution is for matchmaking to prevent squad stacking being able to happen in pub matches full stop. Until then, the reasonable players here can stack FW and the unreasonable saddoes can just continue to stomp pubs. I hope your egos are full and souls empty. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
abarkrishna WarRavens 81	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:46:00 - [26] - Quote This is a fairly simple concept so I will spell it out for you. This game penalizes solo play. That is right folks. If you play alone you are put at a large disadvantage. I see you all complaining about squads farming OB's, I see you complaining about proto stomping. Now it is my turn. Why are you guys always dying? Why do you never go positive? Why do you keep getting shot in the back? How can you help your team or get helped by your team if there in no communication? This is war. If you run out alone without squads you deserve to die a lot. Basically what I am saying is that if you do not like getting stomped join a real corp and practice tactics and work as a squad. That is really as simple as it gets And any Qsyncing in pub matches is purely coincidence. They call me the C.L.I.T commander.
KING CHECKMATE AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS 2465	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:50:00 - [27] - Quote abarkrishna wrote: This is a fairly simple concept so I will spell it out for you. This game penalizes solo play. That is right folks. If you play alone you are put at a large disadvantage. I see you all complaining about squads farming OB's, I see you complaining about proto stomping. Now it is my turn. Why are you guys always dying? Why do you never go positive? Why do you keep getting shot in the back? How can you help your team or get helped by your team if there in no communication? This is war. If you run out alone without squads you deserve to die a lot. Basically what I am saying is that if you do not like getting stomped join a real corp and practice tactics and work as a squad. That is really as simple as it gets And any Qsyncing in pub matches is purely coincidence. I play solo 95% of the time. I dont do too bad... The Best Damage Mod, its a Headshot....
Leithe Askarii Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 43	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:50:00 - [28] - Quote Django Quik wrote: @True - honestly Im only suggesting FW currently because there's nowhere else to go and the game mechanics aren't there to facilitate matches for squad stacking or tiered gameplay. And this only really applies to those corps who are squad stacking pub games. They're bad places to practice for PC because every match is a stomping, so the only reason to stack squads in pubs is to stomp and ego boost, which is really quite sad. Go somewhere where you're more likely to face a challenge - i.e. FW. Don't ask to keep stomping in FW, why ruin someone elses game type to preserve your own? FW is not the place to find challenge or stomping grounds, its the place where you fight for something more than just ISK. I've been on the front lines of the Amarr for a very long time, we have crushed corps who though FW was an easy stomp fest. You should not encourage stomping in any mode.
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2770	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:54:00 - [29] - Quote My friends and I will play in whatever mode we damn well please.
Leithe Askarii Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 43	Posted - 2013.11.27 23:56:00 - [30] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: My friends and I will play in whatever mode we damn well please. Never seen Subdreddit Pubstomp ....always been on your side... that might colour my opinion somewhat.



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