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Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2610
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
Why are they NOT being removed? Does CCP really lack the balls to give a small amount of refunds to fix a core problem with the game? |
Thor McStrut
Reckoners
267
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:Why are they NOT being removed? Does CCP really lack the balls to give a small amount of refunds to fix a core problem with the game?
Because they are not game breaking. The game is just broken, and unfinished. BPOs will work just fine once industry, PvE, and the market are introduced. |
True Adamance
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3531
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yup I hope they take my BPO and make them EVE BPO which I have to produce for my corp on my Indy character. |
ReGnYuM
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
1167
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
Thor McStrut wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Why are they NOT being removed? Does CCP really lack the balls to give a small amount of refunds to fix a core problem with the game? Because they are not game breaking. The game is just broken, and unfinished. BPOs will work just fine once industry, PvE, and the market are introduced.
BPO'a are game breaking to the economy and the overall progression of Dust 514 as a whole. If you can't see this, then you're part of the problem |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2610
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Thor McStrut wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Why are they NOT being removed? Does CCP really lack the balls to give a small amount of refunds to fix a core problem with the game? Because they are not game breaking. The game is just broken, and unfinished. BPOs will work just fine once industry, PvE, and the market are introduced.
I didn't define them as gamebreaking, CCP did. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
7166
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Posted - 2013.10.23 18:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
Oh noes, the enemy isn't paying for their militia gear
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Michael Cratar
Fenrir's Wolves DARKSTAR ARMY
256
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:Thor McStrut wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Why are they NOT being removed? Does CCP really lack the balls to give a small amount of refunds to fix a core problem with the game? Because they are not game breaking. The game is just broken, and unfinished. BPOs will work just fine once industry, PvE, and the market are introduced. BPO'a are game breaking to the economy and the overall progression of Dust 514 as a whole. If you can't see this, then you're part of the problem
YAY! ReGnYuM is back! |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
658
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
Maximus Stryker wrote:I think BPOs are important to new characters and a decent way to generate some AUR sales for CCP.
Thus, the simplest conclusion I can draw is to make BPOs Temporary
Just like we have boosters for a day/week/month, buy a BPO for a day/week/month.
Ex: Purchase an Exile assault rifle for 2000 AUR and get unlimited supply for 1 month Purchase an Exile assault rifle for 500 AUR and get unlimited supply for 1 week Purchase an Exile assault rifle for 100 AUR and get unlimited supply for 1 day
Maybe you need to change the name of them if the name BPO implies "unlimited to infinity forever" but I can't think of a reason this wouldn't work. Has anyone mentioned this idea already? I haven't been following the issue.
Thoughts?
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Kane Fyea
DUST University Ivy League
2108
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:34:00 -
[9] - Quote
It's because during closed beta BPOs were cheap as dirt so people had stocked up on them. If CCP were to give a refund then there would be people with over 500k aur while they only bought like 200k aur. |
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
280
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Unless Dust players get to produce and sell items BPOs will have no real impact on the Dust economy, and any impact they have on the EVE economy would practically be eclipsed by the relative income rates of EvE over Dust.
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Lynn Beck
Granite Mercenary Division
153
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
Just make it so you have to pay for each copy taken from the original. Isk farm solved, and you can sell copies of your bpos for more than it costs. There we have it. Entrepreneurship in dust! |
Takron Nistrom
eHarmony Inc.
97
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Posted - 2013.10.23 19:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
If SEE SEE PEE hadnt normalized gear and kept prices crazy, MLT gear wouldnt be an issue, but its cheap and it doesnt mean much. Get rid of normalized gear and MLT gear will go away. |
Sgt Buttscratch
R 0 N 1 N
926
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
there is no trade, therefore no economy. |
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
172
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. |
Skihids
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2324
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Takron Nistrom wrote:If SEE SEE PEE hadnt normalized gear and kept prices crazy, MLT gear wouldnt be an issue, but its cheap and it doesnt mean much. Get rid of normalized gear and MLT gear will go away.
This is the reason BPOs are an economic issue. In the past use would be time limited because a player who could skill into better gear would stop using the BPO. With diminished advantages of higher level gear and low TTK the MLT items are quite competitive. There is some advantage to the good stuff, but it's not worth the cost unless winning means a whole lot which isn't often.
You could solve the economic problem by dramatically increasing the advantage of winning, or by returning to the old advantages of higher meta levels. If CCP continues with tiericide neither of these options will work. |
Gorra Snell
the unholy legion of darkstar DARKSTAR ARMY
194
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:20:00 -
[16] - Quote
Something doesn't have to 'perfectly fine' or 'gamebreaking'...there's space inbetween. The existence of BPOs messes with the economic cycle of the game, but since they kept them restricted to STD and MLT gear, they only mess with it a bit. Surely, there were internal discussions where they weighed their options, and decided that removing sources of new BPOs would be better for the future of the game's economy without causing undue drama in the current playerbase, while removing the existing ones from everyone's inventories would start an epic ****storm.
I, for one, have bought a number of merc packs based on the BPOs included in them. Though it's almost certainly within their legal right to take those away, I would be pretty ****** irritated, and might stop playing. I get why they want to cut off the source, though, and I'm fine with that. I suspect a lot of players see things from a similar perspective. |
ReGnYuM
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
1171
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:21:00 -
[17] - Quote
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear.
Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended.
Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable
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Takron Nistrom
eHarmony Inc.
97
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:21:00 -
[18] - Quote
Skihids wrote:Takron Nistrom wrote:If SEE SEE PEE hadnt normalized gear and kept prices crazy, MLT gear wouldnt be an issue, but its cheap and it doesnt mean much. Get rid of normalized gear and MLT gear will go away. This is the reason BPOs are an economic issue. In the past use would be time limited because a player who could skill into better gear would stop using the BPO. With diminished advantages of higher level gear and low TTK the MLT items are quite competitive. There is some advantage to the good stuff, but it's not worth the cost unless winning means a whole lot which isn't often. You could solve the economic problem by dramatically increasing the advantage of winning, or by returning to the old advantages of higher meta levels. If CCP continues with tiericide neither of these options will work.
Agreed |
Rowdy Railgunner
TRUE TEA BAGGERS EoN.
76
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
You do gotta love the push to get people to buy all of the BPOs before they took them off the market, just to threaten us with their removal a week later. Signs of a game going places. |
Takron Nistrom
eHarmony Inc.
97
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:24:00 -
[20] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable
Or wat about this. Make how much isk u make be totally reliant on the gear u field and how well u do as an individual. Field high end gear, get paid more. |
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
7172
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:25:00 -
[21] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable My most used all BPO suit costs me 3,125 ISK if I payed for it
If you can't make a profit running that then you seriously need to reconsider your choice of game...
(not you, just people in general)
The only BPO doing any damage right now would be the LAV BPOs. Other than that....what's a couple thousand ISK between friends? |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
659
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable I agree with most of what you say but disagree with the underlined |
ReGnYuM
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
1171
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:27:00 -
[23] - Quote
Takron Nistrom wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable Or wat about this. Make how much isk u make be totally reliant on the gear u field and how well u do as an individual. Field high end gear, get paid more.
Players should be gravitating toward PC and FW for high ISK rewards. |
Takron Nistrom
eHarmony Inc.
97
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
Maximus Stryker wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable I agree with most of what you say but disagree with the underlined
It is very hard to make money in empire, as it should be. |
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
172
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:39:00 -
[25] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable My most used all BPO suit costs me 3,125 ISK if I payed for it If you can't make a profit running that then you seriously need to reconsider your choice of game... (not you, just people in general) The only BPO doing any damage right now would be the LAV BPOs. Other than that....what's a couple thousand ISK between friends?
This ^^^
For example lets say I make 180,000 isk a game. I die 5 times with a all BPO crap suit and make 180,000 isk profit totally see where you're going with that Reg and it not promoting higher level game play, but if die 5 times in the same crap isk equivalent suit I spend 20,000 isk and make only 160,000 isk profit, is that extra 20,000 isk profit a game breaker. In both examples I'm using cheap crap and mining it to maximize profit, the removal of the BPO does nothing to change the behavior that you don't like, the only difference is one guy spent $20 to make a measly extra 20,000 isk.
Removing the BPO will do nothing to change that behavior people will still use cheap crap, there are players that play an emergent style that only has to do with isk spent on their gear compared to what they destory that is not going to change. The only difference is they will not have an option to spend realy money to save chump change in fake money anymore. |
Caeli SineDeo
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
713
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 20:40:00 -
[26] - Quote
Simple Fix turn all BPOs into paint jobs. Bang people go back to buying suits. Then on their fit they can select the paint job they want to run. If it is a caldari assault BPO it should switch so millitant to proto gain the paint job. I do not think many people would mind this. Probably even enjoy this because they can show off the cool looks on their proto gear.
I know many of us told CCP BPOs where a bad idea when they first came out. Love how a year later they finally relize it. |
Rowdy Railgunner
TRUE TEA BAGGERS EoN.
77
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Posted - 2013.10.23 20:49:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP would have to refund me cold hard cash if they removed BPOs. |
ThePrinceOfNigeria
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
126
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 20:58:00 -
[28] - Quote
So BPO's are considered game breaking to the economy? Calling bullshit on that. You are what saving 600 ISK a pop? Also, they are the equivalent of Standard or Militia gear. Hardly overpowered. So somehow saving a couple thousand ISK a match is going to ruin the economy? If this is the case the economy for this game is going to be god awful and I want no part of it. |
ThePrinceOfNigeria
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
127
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Posted - 2013.10.23 21:02:00 -
[29] - Quote
ReGnYuM wrote:IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote:I don't understand how free MLT changes anything, you can make enough isk in most matches to supply 100's of MLT suits, so a bpo mlt armor rep that normally costs 100 isk is game breaking? it not like this stuff is ADV or PRO. Honestly i have more BPO crap going back to may of 2012 than i can even count, I haven't used any of it once your able to field better gear. Heres the problem. People would rather make money endlessly grinding pubs in free suits. Rather than pushing themselves to go into PC and actually develop how the game intended. Highsec should not be profitable BPO's make Highsex profitable
And yet Highsec in EVE Online is highly profitable... so there goes that theory. |
Kane Fyea
DUST University Ivy League
2110
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Posted - 2013.10.23 21:03:00 -
[30] - Quote
Rowdy Railgunner wrote:CCP would have to refund me cold hard cash if they removed BPOs. Sony doesn't allow refunds beyond PSN cash. |
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