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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
CLONE117
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
422
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:21:00 -
[31] - Quote
i think the bpos are just a cheap way to fit a suit with some decent std or mlt modules and equipment.
all those small numbers can add up over time and become expensive.
with a bpo.
that fitting cost has the potential of being reduced greatly in the eyes of a new player.
so i pretty much see bpos as the abillity to make a better fitting with reduced cost.
its better than the free default mlt suits.
as they seem to have more flexibility for fitting.
the main factor i see here is the fact it doesnt cost hardly any isk to run.
although it could be better in the long run.
where players running cheap non bpos r restocking more often then that player with the bpos.
and thus spending possible millions on isk restocking where the player running the bpos could only possibly be spending only a few 100 thousand isk.
this is just my perception on it though. |
IrishWebster
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
81
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:30:00 -
[32] - Quote
I'm starting to get the feeling that CCP Shanghai and main body CCP don't have the same views on open world entrepreneurship. In EVE, they give you tools and the PLAYER shapes his own experience. If they put BPOs on the market, they're on the market to be traded, sold, used in bait and switch schemes, etc.
New Eden has always been about creating opportunities, not LIMITING them. Why then is CCP Shanghai trying to hard to stop us from shaping our own experience?
It makes no sense.
+1 for free trade of any and everything that's on the market. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4580
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:38:00 -
[33] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:It's obvious original poster does not understand that games are not developed by democracy for good reason.
Yet, CCP is kind enough to get our feedback first. I understand this is not really a democracy and this thread is in no way intended to force CCP's hand in anything. This is just to give them an idea on what to do that is in the best interest of the players and the game given the current situation with the BPOs.
CCP Cmdr Wang made a similar public vote that made my initial efforts official and therefore players felt they have more power. But in the end, CCP is mainly a benevolent dictatorship. Meaning, every decision they make is final, but they do take into consideration what we are looking for. |
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster
1219
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:46:00 -
[34] - Quote
I just feel like when I asked for a refund for my BPO suits...they should have given it to me...before I speced into them just so I could get some use out of them. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4580
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:52:00 -
[35] - Quote
Cody Sietz wrote:I just feel like when I asked for a refund for my BPO suits...they should have given it to me...before I speced into them just so I could get some use out of them.
If you were around back then during the transition from closed beta to open beta, you would know why CCP had to NOT give the AURUM refund (except for UVTs and Boosters). A few elite players would have had tons of AURUM in their wallets magically appear without spending more cash. |
Canari Elphus
Pro Hic Immortalis
682
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 18:55:00 -
[36] - Quote
Vote #3 - Not Applicable - We will not get p2p trading before I decide to leave this game. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
272
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:04:00 -
[37] - Quote
Seems kinda messed up that we wouldn't be able to get rid of them, a lot of us bought several BPO's in closed beta while they were cheap with the intention of selling them for profit when the market opened up. It's one of those things that should be considered vital to the game and would be unfair to those that came into the game after BPO's were removed. If they become locked then it's basically giving those who have them an edge over those who don't, and that's not what I call balance. Sure there are going to be some people that don't have them and probably never will, but I think if a player wants to spend a substantial amount of ISK for a BPO that can no longer be acquired through the regular market, then let them do that. |
Soraya Xel
New Eden's Most Wanted Top Men.
682
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:05:00 -
[38] - Quote
My point, Maken, is that just because players want it, even overwhelmingly want it, doesn't mean it's actually a good idea. |
MassiveNine
0uter.Heaven
272
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:08:00 -
[39] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:My point, Maken, is that just because players want it, even overwhelmingly want it, doesn't mean it's actually a good idea.
If selling/trading BPO's is bad, why does it work so well in EVE? |
Seed Dren
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
110
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:20:00 -
[40] - Quote
Banning Hammer wrote:I know this may sound simplistic and not complicated enough .... But ,why can we just use ISK to restock BPO's ?.... i will be happy just having the cosmetic look. Maybe just a bit less ISK to restock them.
Put it on the feedback thread is a good idea. |
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Xaviah Reaper
Nyain San The Ascendancy
157
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:24:00 -
[41] - Quote
ATTENTION!
to fix the economy, force players to use proto AV and others to use Pythons and Eryxs .... I do and Im f*cking broke :) problem solved. |
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster
1219
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:25:00 -
[42] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Cody Sietz wrote:I just feel like when I asked for a refund for my BPO suits...they should have given it to me...before I speced into them just so I could get some use out of them. If you were around back then during the transition from closed beta to open beta, you would know why CCP had to NOT give the AURUM refund (except for UVTs and Boosters). A few elite players would have had tons of AURUM in their wallets magically appear without spending more cash. I was, and a few people I know got refunds. They sent in help tickets and CCP refunded their Aur. I did the same but CCP said no. So I speced Into scout. |
Fire of Prometheus
DUST University Ivy League
1181
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:27:00 -
[43] - Quote
If BPOs are character locked, how am I supposed to get a syndi SMG? |
XOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXO XOXOXOXOXOXO
Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State
436
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:27:00 -
[44] - Quote
hell yes to free trade
I dont want to have all these duplicates in my inventory
what a waste |
DJINN Marauder
Ancient Exiles
2108
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:30:00 -
[45] - Quote
Like farming |
Doc Noah
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
691
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:31:00 -
[46] - Quote
Personally I want hear what CCP wants to do with BPOs in the first place before I vote. My main assumption is that CCP is gonna implement a crafting + material system. While BPOs wont be the 100% free fit item like it is now, it'll be more cost effective to craft it vs buying the item straight from the marketplace. Thats not to mention they still retain their unique skin.
No more free fit, still more cost effective than buying from MP is what I'm hoping the direction they are going with this instead of a straightt removal of BPOs. They can also make the BPCs of the BPO tradeable via Player Market. |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
532
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:33:00 -
[47] - Quote
Back when the redeemable items window was limited to (I think) 20 items and people (myself included) began losing items that were being issued for participating in events I straight away assigned all my items to my main character so they had room to give me my stuff.
This combined with the fact that second and third character slots are rendered redundant by the free2play and the free PSN account and the passive sp gain restriction to 1 character making it not worth creating a second character, but instead creating a second PSN account.
And the fact that the Merc pack was the most economical method of buying boosters over the straight AUR packs, since you got a 30 day booster and enough AUR to buy (I think it was) 5 weeks of further boosters.
Leaves us with a situation where I (and I'm sure many others) have multiples of Exiles, Toxins, Skinweave sets, Dragonflies, I know people have multiple MAG sets from stocking up on boosters during that weekend and I don't doubt the list goes on with other 'event prize / Merc Pack bundle' BPOs.
If these aren't tradeable or at the VERY least donateable to corp hangers for new player recruites to make use of.
That's all related to them working in their current state, which CCP have said isn't good for the game, so all this about locking them to characters is the wrong topic to be discussed ... BPOs are blueprint originals ... a blueprint is a set of instructions that tell you how to make something ... it is not a box set of build your own IKEA bookshelf, there are no panels, no shelves, no stupid little jointing screws and no glue (ohh wait IKEA doesn't provide glue ... maybe their stuff would last more than 6 months if they did, but I digress).
Lt Royal made the only valid point in this thread, BPOs should be used with materials to install a manufacture job in your NPC station (as they do in Eve) ... you find or buy the materials off the market ... an NPC haulage corp can move them to your station at a small cost if you have no Eve access ... and you install the job, come back in 17 hours 24 minutes and 51 seconds and hey presto you have a batch of 100 Exiles for the low low cost of a few hundred isks worth of materials that you can use or sell on the market to others for a profit.
By the way I didn't vote since I don't contribute to like farms ... I only vote in official CCP voting threads when they want a consensus ... Lt Royal got my like for having the RIGHT idea.
PS. I will post this in the other thread also, before you ask. |
Soraya Xel
New Eden's Most Wanted Top Men.
683
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:34:00 -
[48] - Quote
MassiveNine wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:My point, Maken, is that just because players want it, even overwhelmingly want it, doesn't mean it's actually a good idea. If selling/trading BPO's is bad, why does it work so well in EVE?
Because BPO's in EVE are not even remotely similar in any fashion to BPO's in DUST?
Everything in EVE costs actual resources to create. A ship BPO doesn't mean you have infinite ships. It means you can create infinite ships with that BPO, for a resource cost, at a production facility, over a duration of production time. And those BPOs can be optimized to reduce resource cost, construction time, etc. But each ship costs resources to construct, and time to construct it. BPC's in EVE, meanwhile, let you build only a select number of things.
The problem with DUST BPO's, is they cost nothing to use. There is no cost of materials, it just spawns you items on the field.
This huge dissimilarity indicates why saying "It works in EVE!" is about as good of an argument as "Bananas are fruit!" Because if BPOs in EVE are bananas, than BPOs in DUST are the color three. There's simply no comparison there. |
A'Real Fury
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
399
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:38:00 -
[49] - Quote
I do not mind them being locked to my account so long as CCP does not change or restrict how I currently use them I.e. nothing changes. |
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster
1219
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:41:00 -
[50] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:MassiveNine wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:My point, Maken, is that just because players want it, even overwhelmingly want it, doesn't mean it's actually a good idea. If selling/trading BPO's is bad, why does it work so well in EVE? Because BPO's in EVE are not even remotely similar in any fashion to BPO's in DUST? Everything in EVE costs actual resources to create. A ship BPO doesn't mean you have infinite ships. It means you can create infinite ships with that BPO, for a resource cost, at a production facility, over a duration of production time. And those BPOs can be optimized to reduce resource cost, construction time, etc. But each ship costs resources to construct, and time to construct it. BPC's in EVE, meanwhile, let you build only a select number of things. The problem with DUST BPO's, is they cost nothing to use. There is no cost of materials, it just spawns you items on the field. This huge dissimilarity indicates why saying "It works in EVE!" is about as good of an argument as "Bananas are fruit!" Because if BPOs in EVE are bananas, than BPOs in DUST are the color three. There's simply no comparison there. I'd be fine with having to fit the bill to create my BPO suits. Beck, once that happens we can have that whole EVE guys sending us pre made suits or material. The player market would grow and maybe we would be able to offer something to EVE. Maybe even CCP will start making more BPOs.
Capture a production facility and make products cheaper.
Capture a warehouse and seize all the materials inside.
Let these bonuses extent to players in EVE and they will finally have a reason to deal with us dusties.
Also, let us salvage material from the battefield. |
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Soraya Xel
New Eden's Most Wanted Top Men.
683
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 19:50:00 -
[51] - Quote
Cody: That's all coming. Soon(TM). |
Aran Abbas
Goonfeet Top Men.
291
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:19:00 -
[52] - Quote
CCP Mintchip wrote:Hey! Thanks for this post. I do want to make clear that we are very aware and are at attention about this issue. This is something that we have been processing for a while and want to ultimately make a decision that is best for the game and you; the players! Please leave your feedback here! Voting is great, but articulated feedback is extremely appreciated! Thank you!
The problem with voting is that you learn what the majority of people want and then when you go and completely ignore the result it's obvious and you look bad. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4604
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:27:00 -
[53] - Quote
Needless Sacermendor wrote:Back when the redeemable items window was limited to (I think) 20 items and people (myself included) began losing items that were being issued for participating in events I straight away assigned all my items to my main character so they had room to give me my stuff.
This combined with the fact that second and third character slots are rendered redundant by the free2play and the free PSN account and the passive sp gain restriction to 1 character making it not worth creating a second character, but instead creating a second PSN account.
And the fact that the Merc pack was the most economical method of buying boosters over the straight AUR packs, since you got a 30 day booster and enough AUR to buy (I think it was) 5 weeks of further boosters.
Leaves us with a situation where I (and I'm sure many others) have multiples of Exiles, Toxins, Skinweave sets, Dragonflies, I know people have multiple MAG sets from stocking up on boosters during that weekend and I don't doubt the list goes on with other 'event prize / Merc Pack bundle' BPOs.
If these aren't tradeable or at the VERY least donateable to corp hangers for new player recruites to make use of.
That's all related to them working in their current state, which CCP have said isn't good for the game, so all this about locking them to characters is the wrong topic to be discussed ... BPOs are blueprint originals ... a blueprint is a set of instructions that tell you how to make something ... it is not a box set of build your own IKEA bookshelf, there are no panels, no shelves, no stupid little jointing screws and no glue (ohh wait IKEA doesn't provide glue ... maybe their stuff would last more than 6 months if they did, but I digress).
Lt Royal made the only valid point in this thread, BPOs should be used with materials to install a manufacture job in your NPC station (as they do in Eve) ... you find or buy the materials off the market ... an NPC haulage corp can move them to your station at a small cost if you have no Eve access ... and you install the job, come back in 17 hours 24 minutes and 51 seconds and hey presto you have a batch of 100 Exiles for the low low cost of a few hundred isks worth of materials that you can use or sell on the market to others for a profit.
By the way I didn't vote since I don't contribute to like farms ... I only vote in official CCP voting threads when they want a consensus ... Lt Royal got my like for having the RIGHT idea.
PS. I will post this in the other thread also, before you ask.
I see the point that you're making. I'm actually all for making the BPOs require some kind of material for production just like Eve Online BPOs, which means anyone who has them will be in a position of influence since the BPOs have unlimited runs compared to the copies and since there will be no more BPOs like them in the market. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4608
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:29:00 -
[54] - Quote
Aran Abbas wrote:CCP Mintchip wrote:Hey! Thanks for this post. I do want to make clear that we are very aware and are at attention about this issue. This is something that we have been processing for a while and want to ultimately make a decision that is best for the game and you; the players! Please leave your feedback here! Voting is great, but articulated feedback is extremely appreciated! Thank you! The problem with voting is that you learn what the majority of people want and then when you go and completely ignore the result it's obvious and you look bad.
On the other hand, constructive feedback can actually provide much more insight into the minds of the players compared to votes. However, it's nice to have both constructive feedback and tallied votes at the same time so that one can see the bigger picture. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
4608
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:32:00 -
[55] - Quote
Cody Sietz wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Cody Sietz wrote:I just feel like when I asked for a refund for my BPO suits...they should have given it to me...before I speced into them just so I could get some use out of them. If you were around back then during the transition from closed beta to open beta, you would know why CCP had to NOT give the AURUM refund (except for UVTs and Boosters). A few elite players would have had tons of AURUM in their wallets magically appear without spending more cash. I was, and a few people I know got refunds. They sent in help tickets and CCP refunded their Aur. I did the same but CCP said no. So I speced Into scout.
You probably missed a deadline or something. I don't know. |
Kazeno Rannaa
BIG BAD W0LVES
260
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:35:00 -
[56] - Quote
Thanks again Maken Tosch for doing this for the rest of us. |
Aqua-Regia
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
449
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:36:00 -
[57] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:========================VOTE===========================
OFFICIAL VOTE #1 = In favor of letting players freely trade their BPOs with other players once the secondary market arrives.
I vote on this no like for you |
Aqua-Regia
MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN.
449
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:38:00 -
[58] - Quote
Daemon Shotgun BPO Anyone! |
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster
1219
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:38:00 -
[59] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Cody Sietz wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Cody Sietz wrote:I just feel like when I asked for a refund for my BPO suits...they should have given it to me...before I speced into them just so I could get some use out of them. If you were around back then during the transition from closed beta to open beta, you would know why CCP had to NOT give the AURUM refund (except for UVTs and Boosters). A few elite players would have had tons of AURUM in their wallets magically appear without spending more cash. I was, and a few people I know got refunds. They sent in help tickets and CCP refunded their Aur. I did the same but CCP said no. So I speced Into scout. You probably missed a deadline or something. I don't know. nope, a old Tritan bud sent in his ticket same time as me and sure enough he got the refund I didn't.
it worked out well in the end since I know have proto racial scout suit, but I'm still stuck with a raven Caldari Assault suit and a Minmatar Logi I will never use since I'm purely Gallente speced.
|
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
532
|
Posted - 2013.10.21 20:39:00 -
[60] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:I see the point that you're making. I'm actually all for making the BPOs require some kind of material for production just like Eve Online BPOs, which means anyone who has them will be in a position of influence since the BPOs have unlimited runs compared to the copies and since there will be no more BPOs like them in the market. Yeah ... all this talk of buybacks n locking to character is just wrong ... simply leave them alone ... we don't have an economy to speak of anything 'being bad for', when we do why lock BPOs from sale if the intention is to make them manufacturable in the future ... people won't sell them when they realise they'll have an advantage in the industry market in future, unless they need an isk injection of a few hundred million.
These BPOs will be like the T2 BPOs of Eve ... highly sought after for their reduced manufacture costs and increased profit in industry. I completely agree with cutting their availability now they are plentyful, but in years to come when we have markets and industry and a sizeable playerbase they will be rare and sought after.
Edit : maybe with production facilities giving reduced material costs etc. they could be lost if the planet is taken, or there'd be a 25% chance to drop for the captors. |
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