Weapon. 33hp is worth losing for a prototype weapon.

My Caldari suit has really crappy PG/CPU. Even with Electronics 5 and Engineering 4, I still run out of CPU.

To fit a Proto weapon, I have to give up my 4th Complex extender and the Enhanced one is... disappointing (33 HP instead of 66 is a big step behind).

What would you go for?

have u tried a cpu upgrade?

fit both and change something else....


seriously what on earth are you fitting to that thing that you even have to make this choice?

My Caldari suit has really crappy PG/CPU. Even with Electronics 5 and Engineering 4, I still run out of CPU.

To fit a Proto weapon, I have to give up my 4th Complex extender and the Enhanced one is... disappointing (33 HP instead of 66 is a big step behind).

What would you go for?

List your entire fitting and we might just help you...

Assault CK.0

-Duvolle Tactical Assault Rifle

-Submachine Gun

-M1 Locus Grenade

-3x Complex Shield Extender
-1x Enhanced Shield Extender

-2x Basic Armor Plate
-1x Basic Armor Repairer

-Enhanced Quantum Scanner

Weapon. 33hp is worth losing for a prototype weapon.

change rep to basic plate, change scanner to compact rep hive...

problem solved, now you have more EHP, reps and ammo and are you the official "slayer" fit the pros use. bonus points if you can shove core locus granades on there with the saved cpu

change rep to basic plate, change scanner to compact rep hive...

problem solved, now you have more EHP, reps and ammo and are you the official "slayer" fit the pros use. bonus points if you can shove core locus granades on there with the saved cpu

And why the hell am I helping you to get more deadly?

But I'm a dedicated flanker, I rely quite much on the scanner. I'm not the typical run-and-gunner.

Anyway, I really appreciate your suggestion.

Assault CK.0

-Duvolle Tactical Assault Rifle

-Submachine Gun

-M1 Locus Grenade

-3x Complex Shield Extender
-1x Enhanced Shield Extender

-2x Basic Armor Plate
-1x Basic Armor Repairer

-Enhanced Quantum Scanner

And why the hell am I helping you to get more deadly?

My friend, I know you and you're a solid player who plays smart. So I would say go for the most Alpha damage possible to insta-pop people with your TAR before they can shoot back.

how much CPU are you over by with both the extender and your proto weapon? there might be another way to make it fit (at the cost of SP)

Thanks. *blush* :D
But I think that wasn't for me.

I'd say go for as many CPU upgrades as you want and i say this because the idea of dual tanking burns my eyes. hell get CPU and PG upgrades in those low slots to get proto nades and proto SMG instead of dual tanking...

I'd say go for as many CPU upgrades as you want and i say this because the idea of dual tanking burns my eyes. hell get CPU and PG upgrades in those low slots to get proto nades and proto SMG instead of dual tanking...

I gotta fever and the only prescription is more proto weapons.

I'd say go for as many CPU upgrades as you want and i say this because the idea of dual tanking burns my eyes. hell get CPU and PG upgrades in those low slots to get proto nades and proto SMG instead of dual tanking...

Agreed.

Shield Energizer/recharger + Extenders + Regulators on a Caldari suit goes much further than a bunch of plates that slow you down. EHP isn't everything when you can pop into cover real quick and regen 2/3 of your max shields in a couple of seconds.

Shield Energizer/recharger + Extenders + Regulators on a Caldari suit goes much further than a bunch of plates that slow you down. EHP isn't everything when you can pop into cover real quick and regen 2/3 of your max shields in a couple of seconds.

I believe it's a matter of playstyle. I'm not looking forward to change my fitting that much, I do pretty good with my current one.

What I was asking is what do you think is more useful between +5% damage and 33 HP. So far I can't tell, they both work ok.

You fit is almost identical to mine, the H/L modules particularly.

I had the same dilemma. I decided to go with the GLU instead of the Duvolle because of two things:

1. The Duvolle gets you something like 3.5 extra damage a round for around 45 extra CPU. And while that kind of increase might be worth it on a high RPM weapon like the the AR, on the TAR it's not as much bang for your buck.

2. HP trumps damage output, always. More damage is good because you're better able to kill the other guy before he kills you. On the other hand, more HP is good because the other guy needs more time to kill you in a shootout. It's symmetric. But! Outside of this one on one scenario, extra damage output is useless. Your Duvolle with its extra damage isn't going to help you when you're being shot at by a HAV, nor a sniper, nor a forge gunner, nor a turret. It's not going to help you when somebody flanks you and starts shooting you in the back. It's not going to help you tank falling damage nor locus grenade damage. It's not going to help you when you're running away from a squad of reds, bullets whizzing around you. But having that extra HP definitely will help in all those situations!

Your core skills are basically maxed out, so no help there.

Why use the M1 grenades? If you use standard tier grenades, get that last level of Dropsuit Core Upgrades, put some points into Explosives or whatever for the CPU reduction, you might just have enough CPU for the Duvolle, the complex shield, and the standard grenades. You'd need to open up the fitting tool to see if that's doable, I'm just spitballing here.

PS Lol @ people advocating removing armor repper/bashing on dual tanking.

List your entire fitting and we might just help you...

List your entire fitting and we might just help you...

Drop the Scanner for a K-2 Hives, enhanced armor, enhanced regulator, and complex or enhanced kin cat.

I gotta fever and the only prescription is more proto weapons.

+1 if you get the reference

If you consider yourself a primary tanker IMO it's best to have more HP, as you'll probably find yourself alone more times than not. The GEK is still a formidable weapon and I don't think there is much of a difference in damage. Maybe you should just build two fittings, one with damage one with HP and run what you need at the time.

My role makes me the one who's "often alone but never REALLY alone" lol. So yes, I think there are times when those 33 HP would really make the difference.

As a very specialized flanker, I'm usuaully 20 meters behind the assault line of my squad, following them up close, but sometimes not close enough for them to protect me. Sometimes I have to move to the left or right side to cause disruption and I find myself too distant (it's necessary) to have my back covered. If the enemies decide I'm their priority, the rest of my team will push them, but the risk is very high for me.

Thanks for your input, it made me think. I'd rather use the GLU rather than the GEK, though, because of my role and my love for the TAC AR.

My Caldari suit has really crappy PG/CPU. Even with Electronics 5 and Engineering 4, I still run out of CPU.

To fit a Proto weapon, I have to give up my 4th Complex extender and the Enhanced one is... disappointing (33 HP instead of 66 is a big step behind).

What would you go for?

Tell me you play style and I will make you an uber fit right here right now

But I'm a dedicated flanker, I rely quite much on the scanner. I'm not the typical run-and-gunner.

Anyway, I really appreciate your suggestion.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

Assault CK.0

-Duvolle Tactical Assault Rifle

-Submachine Gun

-M1 Locus Grenade

-3x Complex Shield Extender
-1x Enhanced Shield Extender

-2x Basic Armor Plate
-1x Basic Armor Repairer

-Enhanced Quantum Scanner

Then drop the Plates and Rep for some dampening, speed and stamina.

If you are going to be engageing the enemy from a flank, you don't need to shield and dual tank as much. Focus more on mobility and stealth.

You're not a logi. Stop being a wp whor3 are equip better tank- not a scanner. That is our logo friend's job. Bring a stick to pick him up if qnything.
Also, you're not a caldari logi, so stop armor tanking and use shield regulators of fitting mods.

You have the wrong suit for what our trying to do. Either be an assault and shield tank itself like u can BC or a skirmisher with a TAR, or spec logi

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

I'm doing fine what I do. Why do some people insist I need to change my fitting to suit my playstyle? I feel very comfortable with high HP and the Scanner and I always end up with a good KDR.

I'm not looking for game-play advice.

And I'm not a wp wh*re lol. The scanner is part of me...

OP should be shield tanking

Op isnt just dual tanking - OP wants it all with no drawbacks.

If he is truly a flanker then he wouldnt need all of that tank and would even invest in a damage mod to increase his output though if he uses an AR... no need (CCP )

Every setup should have to make some tough choice and dropping down to an enhanced ext when he already has armor and multiple extenders is hardly a tradeoff.

Can't, sorry... The scanner really suits my playstyle and results in my most powerful weapon... Dropping it would be a downgrade to me.

I flank just fine with no scanner and dampeners with my Scrambler Rifle.

Questionable...

What about changing the M1 to Locus grenade and Armor repair to Basic Plate?
Would that free up enough CPU for you? Do you NEED the repair?

Also there's option to change the advanced scanner to flux active scanner.

And why the hell am I helping you to get more deadly?

Well, major problem with Shield Tanking at the moment is that there are quite a bit of weapons designed to kill shields. Both of the mainstay rifles (Assault and Scrambler) do more damage to shields than armor and with the Mass Driver bug making splash damage not tie into resistances, it's doing full damage against shields. Shotgun, Scrambler Pistol, etc...

I'm seeing a lot more people use the Shield Tanking role like frontline Armor Tankers instead of flankers. These people are usually the ones complaining that 'x' weapon is OP but it's playstyle, really. So many of them will take you on in the gun game, strafing back and forth and trying to kill you before you kill them... But they never seem to have any sense of self preservation - they never seem to understand that, being a shield tanker, you have to disengage for a bit to recover and come back when you have full health while the armor tanker is still trying to recover.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure about what you mean, but... is it a problem if the fitting is working for me? I know there is some QQ about AR's, but I didn't know this extends to the Tac. The Scrambler is better, if you ask me... but it's harder to fit.

Damn, I wish I didn't make this topic

I wasnt blaming you for carrying an AR (if you were), that was a dig at CCP.

Your setup is pretty stacked. You are quibbling about losing 33 HP when you are already well tanked. Worse yet you say that you are a flanker so if you are you would more than likely be looking to up your DPS and forego some HP.

The game is about putting your suit together anyway you want but the suit should have a limit and tradeoffs have to be made. Others have even suggested you could add a CPU mod but you are worrying about losing the basic rep and oh the humanity, having unused PG/CPU.

Your setup is great, there are ways you can tweak it that will be more to your strenghts and playstyle but you cant and shouldnt have it all.

Alternative is for CCP to blow up all classes and just let us build what we want given our SP

I've had a little bit of luck with the Ishukone SMGs vs Speedy Scouts.
http://i.imgur.com/vv3LSxV.jpg

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

No dampening mods. Every logi with a brain has them proto now so you WILL show up if someone is scanning. Even scouts maxed out are detected.

Regulators, kinkats, cardiac regs are your friends especially as a tar flanker.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

Dedicated Flanker, Tac AR/Scrambler specialist.

I follow my squad and I cause disruption moving around the enemies and engaging them from good positions. I rely on tactical advantages and try to avoid direct fights unless I'm out of my enemy's optimal range or I pick them unaware.

I also scan very much, both to hunt enemies and to prevent them from sneaking on me while I suppress the selected enemies.

I'm not aggressive: My life is more important than one kill. I don't rush, but when I think the situation favors me, I engage with decision.

I don't die much. 0-3 deaths most games, unless stomped by much more organized squads dominating the game.

Teach me, please, my master!

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

To answer your question I would go for the HP for the TAR and the weapon for the Scrambler(I would even swap out a shield for a damage mod with the scrambler).


I see a few options on how to get your ideal fitting to work:

You might be able to get both by swapping out the M1 to standard locus and the repairer for basic reactive plates if you get engineering to level 5.

Another option is to get your light weapon operation(and possibly sidearm operation and explosives) skilled up if you haven't(most people ignore these skills).

You may want to consider switching to the A-19 Stable Active Scanner and swapping to reactive plates instead of the repper plus getting a few CPU out of a skill upgrade.




Basic plates are still the best bang for your buck as far as fitting costs go. Two basic plates give you more armor than a single complex plate for a lower fitting cost. What's the point of using complex if you're going to need to use the spare slot for a cpu or PG upgrade?

I have a fitting much like this with my Scrambler rifle. Well I'd personally exhange one plate for a CPU uppgrade, so you'll lose roughly 50 HP but you also might get to fit better nades and/or sidearm.

so you'll lose roughly 50 HP but you also might get to fit better nades and/or sidearm.

you also might get to fit better nades and/or sidearm.

better nades.

Assault CK.0

-Duvolle Tactical Assault Rifle

-Submachine Gun

-M1 Locus Grenade

-3x Complex Shield Extender
-1x Enhanced Shield Extender

-2x Basic Armor Plate
-1x Basic Armor Repairer

-Enhanced Quantum Scanner

Hey Keri!

Thought i'd give you my 2 cents on the matter. I personally never like using PG or CPU mods because I feel that if you put em on you're not fitting your suit efficiently

BUT

In terms of the caldari suit and its shield tanking ability I feel differently. I tried this fit on the fitting tool and it only requires you to place 1 basic CPU mod and no changes in your equipment:

Assault Ck.0

Highs: 4x complex shield extenders
Lows: Basic plate, basic repper, basic CPU upgrade

L wep: Duvolle TAC
S wep: SMG

Grenade: M1 Locus

Equip: A-45 Quantum Active Scanner

On my fitting screen it shows 394/434 CPU and 74/75 PG with 553 shields and 240 armor

I think this fit will allow you to sacrifice a little bit of armor for more shields as opposed to sacrificing your weapon for more shields.

On top of all that I believe that you should look into regulators, a member of my permanent squad runs a shield tanked caldari with Complex extenders on the highs and regulators on the lows and; I cannot beat him, he is the best flanker/skirmisher i've ever had the pleasure to play with and with good use of cover and situational awareness you don't need any more armor or repping for that matter. He says that 150 armor goes away instantly anyway so his play style revolves around the enemy never getting down to his armor, and he dies at most twice in any game i play with him.

Don't let these people leave a bad taste in your mouth, I can attest to the fact that your play style and strategy is extremely effective since I've been on the receiving end of it. If you can make sure that you're in cover before they eat through your armor those regulators should kick in after a good few seconds and you'll have already moved positions to flank and pick off your opponent.

o7 Keri hope that helped in any way, we should squad up soon.

You are awesome, Tiberius. Thanks. I hope we will squad up soon as well.

EDITED:

Nevermind. I appreciate the good inputs, but the amount of off-topic answers is just too much and really I was just looking for some opinions about HP vs Damage; instead I receive comments about "I'm not playing my intended role", "you do it wrong", etc...

This is NOT what I was looking for.

Call me whatever you want, Assaulter, Flanker, Skirmisher, WP Wh*re, I really don't care about how you "identify" my role on the battlefield, but I know what I do and I do it with very appreciable results and I'm satisfied about my personal performances, I'm a decent player with some experience.

This is NOT a thread to discuss my fitting preferences.

Sorry.

---

My Caldari suit has really crappy PG/CPU. Even with Electronics 5 and Engineering 4, I still run out of CPU.

To fit a Proto weapon, I have to give up my 4th Complex extender and the Enhanced one is... disappointing (33 HP instead of 66 is a big step behind).

What would you go for?

change rep to basic plate, change scanner to compact rep hive...

problem solved, now you have more EHP, reps and ammo and are you the official "slayer" fit the pros use. bonus points if you can shove core locus granades on there with the saved cpu

Hello Keri,

I've just stumbled into your thread and, while I haven't read the replies yet, I understand your frustration with these forums. My sympathies.

You are awesome, Tiberius. Thanks. I hope we will squad up soon as well.

only if you pay me 1 million isk. I'm his self appointed agent.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

OK this is something very relevant to my interests.

OP is dual tanking, which is a playstyle I used to like, but with ordinary plates?

The way I see it there are multiple feasible and role based ways to fit a medium suit, one of which (shield tank callogi) is the currently the player favorite

However, I'm very interested in what the other shield based fits are and why they are suboptimal.

• Full extenders with plates/cpu upgrades in low
• Full extenders with max energizers in low
• Full extenders with max repair in low
• Dual tanking with shield extenders and repair, plates and armor repair

Can any proto/PC veterans comment on that, and maybe also on shield repair modules, I see most fits at 4 extenders

Then there are the bastard versions of plating to maintain speed/mobility (flanker).

• Full plates and repair+ kincat
• Blended reactives and plates
• Full ferroscales + repair

I have run all these fits to compare them, and I always end up with really similar stats when I have optimized within CPU/PG limits. I ended up running my gallente pro at complex dmg mods, and 3 ferroscales + repair because it was easier to manage.

I gotta fever and the only prescription is more proto weapons.

EDIT: +1 if you get the reference

Thanks.

I will try what you suggest with the DUST Fitting Tool (I can't play now, my PS3 is occupied). I guess I can give up the M1... I don't NEED the repair, but when they damage me heaviliy, I lose my potential high EHP because I have no regen.

I don't like the Flux Scanner, I'll stick to the Quantum because of its massive duration.