Unlike Mr. Tosch here, I AM a dedicated Logi (Also a pilot, Assault, Scout, and Heavy! :D), and I say yay to this.

Another problem is the stupid freaking Medic fit. If this doesn't happen once per match, it's a good day:

-Get killed by AR, and then guy who killed you gets sniped.
-Triage Unit 5 meters away and no enemies nearby.
-Triage Unit 1 meter away and still no enemies.
-Turns out he was just getting over your body so he could get to the supply depot on the other side of the room.
-Triage Unit within 0 meters.
-Looks like he was just leaving the room.

90% of Amarr/Caldari blueberries run that suit because it has an SMG on it, and we all know it. I'd like it if maybe CCP switched out the injector for a rep tool? Honestly, they're easier to use than a Nanite Injector, and people don't feel like cutting you if you don't rez them. :D

I've nothing against trying to earn a few extra war points, I'm just concerned that people throwing down everything they have at the supply depot will cause CCP to hit logis with the nerf bat yet again.

Why the logi needs the extra low, I do not know, but they do.

If spam is really a problem, fluxes will clear out everything. Just put your own nanohive under you and flux away.

I really don't hear complaints like this, only once has a person been suspicious of my logistics suit, wondering if I used it as a logi assault, but really I never hear "oh great a logi suit, he's probably not gonna do anything useful or give logis a bad name in some other fashion".

Because of the CPU/PG requirements of proto equipment. I have a proto Minmatar logi (4 high/4 low) with an advanced weapon and 4 pieces of advanced equipment and I still have to put a CPU upgrade on the suit, and the PG is at it's limit (and yes, I do have both Electronics and Engineering at level 5). Once I max out my equipment skills I'll have put a PG upgrade on the suit, plus I'll probably have to use a more expensive CPU upgrade

Unlike Mr. Tosch here, I AM a dedicated Logi (Also a pilot, Assault, Scout, and Heavy! :D), and I say yay to this.

Another problem is the stupid freaking Medic fit. If this doesn't happen once per match, it's a good day:

-Get killed by AR, and then guy who killed you gets sniped.
-Triage Unit 5 meters away and no enemies nearby.
-Triage Unit 1 meter away and still no enemies.
-Turns out he was just getting over your body so he could get to the supply depot on the other side of the room.
-Triage Unit within 0 meters.
-Looks like he was just leaving the room.

90% of Gallente/Minmatar blueberries run that suit because it has an SMG on it, and we all know it. I'd like it if maybe CCP switched out the injector for a rep tool? Honestly, they're easier to use than a Nanite Injector, and people don't feel like cutting you if you don't rez them. :D

Sorry have to edit, and there you go, correct races inserted. No need to thank me.

My issue isn't with the logis capability to logi, it's that, due to the fact that logis are given more slots, they are basically mega assaults.

This is a non-issue. I dont even understand why you felt the need to write that down.

Hive spamming ensures instant ammo replentishment, supply depots are important logistic and strategic points.

If you however feel the need to spam a square meter in the middle of nowhere with hives and uplinks, more power to you, maybe its your strategy. Maybe its also your strategy to deprive your own team of useful ressources.

My issue isn't with the logis capability to logi, it's that, due to the fact that logis are given more slots, they are basically mega assaults.

While at STD, this issue is less apparent, however, looking at proto or ADV, logis win in the HP/slots battle most definitely.

From my memory, I remember the Gal logi having 5 lows, and 3 highs, whereas its assault counterpart, (the one that is supposed to be dealing/taking the damage!) has a 3/4 setup.

Why the logi needs the extra low, I do not know, but they do. Even though, due to its bonus, it actually should have either less or similar slots to its assault version (It doesn't need to fit a repper.)

Normalize the specialization hi/lo slot layouts.

If the logi has 3/5, the assault should have the same thing.

The special slots and the bonuses should make out the difference from logi to assault.

Assault-
+Sidearm
+Combat Oriented bonuses
-Few equipment
-Less opportunities for war point accruation

Logistics
+Many equipment
+Somewhat more flexible due to above
-No sidearm
-Less combat capabilities then the Assault.

tl;dr (and stuff I didn't feel like write a paragraph about!), Normalize Slots, and all other base stats between Logi and Assault. Change the sidearm, bonuses and equipment slots to tailor more towards the support or the combat archetype.

You do realize taht we are given those slots for cpu and pg upgrades right?

Yes, but do you fit CPU and PG upgrades?

Wow the Great Wall of texts lol

90% of Text Walls are Ghost-Manufactured.

You can buy your TextWall(TM) License today, for the low price of 100 million ISK!

Seriously though, most of the text walls in this thread are by me because people think that the Logi should be useless in combat. :(

I'm not a LogiBro or play one on TV but I think you are making some good points, Ghost.

I do like the idea of making the Assault and Logi suit bonus more noticable and relevant. I could see something along the lines of tiered "perks" vs a linear percentage bump to an attribute.

Example:
Caldari Assault LVL 1 & 2 - 5% increase in Shield extender effeciency per level; LVL 3 - 5% increase in Shield recharge; LVL 4 - 5% increase in hacking speed; and LVL 5 - 3% damage increase on all weapons/grenades.

Minmatar Logi LVL 1 & 2 - 3% increase in effectivness of Needles and Hives per level; LVL 3 - 5% decrease in spawn time for dropped uplinks; LVL 4 - 3% increase in sidearm damage; LVL 5 - 6% increase in rep tool effectiveness

90% of Text Walls are Ghost-Manufactured.

You can buy your TextWall(TM) License today, for the low price of 100 million ISK!

Seriously though, most of the text walls in this thread are by me because people think that the Logi should be useless in combat. :(

What your saying isn't the issue any of us have with logis.

It's the fact, due to imbalanced slot layouts, that logis have way more EHP, and therefore preform assault roles better then assaults.

The nerfs that have been proposed really don't hurt your class at all. It hurts the assault logis.

Another problem with this is the lag it causes. Too much junk piled in a small area makes the frame rate slow down. It was so bad in one match that a member of my squad started reffering to the area around the supply depot as 'The Hall of Lag'.
No, this was not done by logis, it was done by someone rapidly switching fits to chuck out as much equipment as possible in the hopes of skimming some war points off people headed towards the supply depot anyway.

the reason assault get less WP is because they decided to not play as a team and be a selfish self sufficient KDR *****

I apologize for the Wall of text, however I won't tldr this.
Too much stuff to go over

Also, I'm pretty sure I copyrighted TextWalls(TM)... You'll be seeing my lawyer.

The reason Assaults get less WP is because they aren't the ones plopping down Hives, Reps, and Revives. The Assault does the bulk of the fighting, and we keep them alive to do so.

And as for Meeko Fent, I can see what you mean, and I'l trying to say that we're SUPPOSED to tank all out. C-Logis are supposed to stack a load of shield extenders, regulators, etc. G-Logis are supposed to stack armor plates, damage mods, etc. Now, I'm not saying that this is how it should be for all playstyles, but high survivability definitely is required for Logistics. If you think they should be going on-par with Assaults, then I can definitely see why you think that, and I almost agree. They don't need a nerf as much as they need a slight tweaking. I can't think of anything off of the top of my head, but I know that in some eyes, we're severely OP.

I'm just trying to point out that we're not OP, we're doing our job. Like the Specialist or Logistics in most other games, we have the most health and the most utility. I think maybe they should reduce some slot counts though, absolutely. Primarily the C-Logi. The G-Logi has 5 lows and 3 highs, while the C-Logi has 5 highs and 4 lows. My only suggestion is that we balance that out by reducing the low cound of C-Logis by one.

Other than that, I'd say we're fine. I'd say yes to a buff for Assaults, or maybe Assault-Specific modules that decrease movement speed for more health/damage/etc. Or vice versa. But in my opinion, Logistics are fine. If anything, the Assault is a tad under-powered until PRO level. I use the G-Assault G-1, and I may as well be using the Advanced Basic Frame. Although I suppose part of that is the lack of a good bonus for the G-Assault...

I understand that, however I fail to see as having more HP then the assaults as balanced.

If they had similar potential HP values, I'd shut up

To the guy above... I just wanted to point this out.

Using the Gallente as an example, you can't get the Gallente Assault to more than a Gallente Logistics. Do the math if you'd like, but you can't make a Proto-Assault more Tanky than a Proto-Logi. There's a reason we have more slots.

I'll get math to you in a bit.

I'll rez ya to use ya as a human shield.

Right, right. I could see why you think they are OP. But really, if you play it for a while, and hard-core it up, spec into advanced Logi, you'll see that we're balanced. Because even with that extra health, we CAN die just as quick. But in 1v1, it's still balanced because they have a sidearm to go to, and we have more tank.

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