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Silas Swakhammer
GamersForChrist Orion Empire
66
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Posted - 2013.08.13 04:06:00 -
[1] - Quote
bal-+ance noun - a state of equilibrium or equipoise
Removing the one thing LAVs excel at does not balance them; it simply renames them to LV. Adjustment to infantry collision damage is not the change LAVs need.
Contrary to popular belief, running into infantry does have adverse affects on a LAV, such as forcing a sudden stop, flipping the vehicle over, damage to the vehicle, or sometimes getting the vehicle stuck in terrain geometry.
I'm apprehensive about 1.4's changes and nerfs. I fear that the period between 1.4 and 1.5 will be grueling for us dedicated drivers. Like a few others, I've dumped a majority of my SP into vehicles and related mods (both reps, scanners, etc.). I try to use my vehicle to actually support my team, but such play style is a huge ISK sink. The only way to make up for those losses is by foregoing support for a couple of matches and doing the only thing that nets me WPs in a vehicle.
Oddly enough, one simple mechanic would dramatically change drivers' playstyle: a driver's locking mechanic. |
Mamertine Son
R.E.B.E.L.S
100
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Posted - 2013.08.13 04:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
I don't want your well earned SP you put into LAVs to turn to smoke with a nerf but I really really hate murder taxis.
So a vicious part of me wants your death machine to get nerfed into oblivion.
But more reasonably speaking, LAVs need to be reworked so they're still invaluable in battle but no longer clone bulldozers. |
CAELAN Andoril
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
66
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Posted - 2013.08.13 04:22:00 -
[3] - Quote
I support the LAV 'nerf' so that murder taxis finally end, but I say buff all vehicle users by adding more ways to make WP.
That would probably solve many problems.
So for more transportation-orientated vehicles [LAV, DS, upcoming MAV], add in a WP bonus for moving players. Some calculation involving distance travelled and how many players you're ferrying at once. Something else that would be fantastic: suppressing fire bonus. Just because you didn't kill a person when shooting at them doesn't mean you didn't contribute to the battle. |
TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
2628
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Posted - 2013.08.13 04:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
CAELAN Andoril wrote:I support the LAV 'nerf' so that murder taxis finally end, but I say buff all vehicle users by adding more ways to make WP.
That would probably solve many problems.
So for more transportation-orientated vehicles [LAV, DS, upcoming MAV], add in a WP bonus for moving players. Some calculation involving distance travelled and how many players you're ferrying at once. Something else that would be fantastic: suppressing fire bonus. Just because you didn't kill a person when shooting at them doesn't mean you didn't contribute to the battle. Make infantry repairers work in a bubble and provide WP's and we might start seeing squads in open fields being followed by LLAV's. |
Logi Stician
The Vanguardians
124
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 05:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:bal-+ance noun - a state of equilibrium or equipoise
Removing the one thing LAVs excel at does not balance them; it simply renames them to LV. Adjustment to infantry collision damage is not the change LAVs need.
Contrary to popular belief, running into infantry does have adverse affects on a LAV, such as forcing a sudden stop, flipping the vehicle over, damage to the vehicle, or sometimes getting the vehicle stuck in terrain geometry.
I'm apprehensive about 1.4's changes and nerfs. I fear that the period between 1.4 and 1.5 will be grueling for us dedicated drivers. Like a few others, I've dumped a majority of my SP into vehicles and related mods (both reps, scanners, etc.). I try to use my vehicle to actually support my team, but such play style is a huge ISK sink. The only way to make up for those losses is by foregoing support for a couple of matches and doing the only thing that nets me WPs in a vehicle.
Oddly enough, one simple mechanic would dramatically change drivers' playstyle: a driver's locking mechanic.
LV?? Wait, wait, wait, wait. If the, in my opinion, very stupid collision damage was nerfed, how would that take the "A" out of LAV? What is that gun looking thing on the back side of those things that I see mercs standing behind every so often? Is a gun of some kind? Does it work? Shoot confetti or something?
"Adverse effects?" More like minor inconveniences.
Now, I certainly do hope within the coming months that vehicles get the love they desperately deserve, but seriously, I have had to stop logiing and go AV for whole games because repping and sticking are just treating the symptom and not the cause. AV is super fun, its like big game hunting, but its not what I love, which is being a "force multiplier." Now, for many games, force multiplication involves trying to keep the murder taxi nuisance at bay.
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Logi Stician
The Vanguardians
124
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Posted - 2013.08.13 05:18:00 -
[6] - Quote
CAELAN Andoril wrote:I support the LAV 'nerf' so that murder taxis finally end, but I say buff all vehicle users by adding more ways to make WP.
That would probably solve many problems.
So for more transportation-orientated vehicles [LAV, DS, upcoming MAV], add in a WP bonus for moving players. Some calculation involving distance travelled and how many players you're ferrying at once. Something else that would be fantastic: suppressing fire bonus. Just because you didn't kill a person when shooting at them doesn't mean you didn't contribute to the battle.
Or perhaps WP when arriving at an enemy controlled destination. The reds have C, get the squad into a couple of LAVs and voom! 75 points for arrival, and maybe a 10 or 15 point passenger "assist." That's just off the top of my head. But I really would like to see a more Carpool 514 rather than Deathcab 514, where the wheels get you there and the gun that is on the vehicle does the brunt of the killing. |
Silas Swakhammer
GamersForChrist Orion Empire
67
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Posted - 2013.08.13 15:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
Logi Stician wrote:LV?? Wait, wait, wait, wait. If the, in my opinion, very stupid collision damage was nerfed, how would that take the "A" out of LAV? What is that gun looking thing on the back side of those things that I see mercs standing behind every so often? Is a gun of some kind? Does it work? Shoot confetti or something?
The small turret is near worthless. Talk to any dedicated driver and they'll tell you that they'd wish they can make a fit without a turret. Admittedly, I have a LLAV fit centered around a more powerful turret, but it's still mostly a psychological weapon, much like the sniper rifle.
How is a couple tonnes of vehicle running into someone and killing them stupid? Bear in mind that an adequate speed is necessary to accomplish that. |
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star. EoN.
831
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 16:06:00 -
[8] - Quote
99% of the community are retards
CCP took away 2 skills which increased shield/armor HP away from the vehicle tree and added the missing HP to all vehicles (except DS)
So basic vehicles got a buff, vehicle specialists got a nerf in my view (less to skill into to seperate the vehicle pilots from the scrubs) while tryhards got a better vehicle for no SP
All they have to do is take away the buff and give the 2 skills back to the vehicle tree |
Nemo Bluntz
TeamPlayers EoN.
268
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:10:00 -
[9] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:bal-+ance noun - a state of equilibrium or equipoise
Removing the one thing LAVs excel at does not balance them; it simply renames them to LV
You do realize that there's a gun on the back of those things, right? Not sure if you've ever sat in that particular seat. But that's where the "A" comes from.
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Silas Swakhammer
GamersForChrist Orion Empire
67
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
Nemo Bluntz wrote:Silas Swakhammer wrote:bal-+ance noun - a state of equilibrium or equipoise
Removing the one thing LAVs excel at does not balance them; it simply renames them to LV You do realize that there's a gun on the back of those things, right? Not sure if you've ever sat in that particular seat. But that's where the "A" comes from. The small LAV turret is not operable by the driver. The small LAV turret is near worthless, since it does so little damage and completely exposes anyone who uses it, with no freedom to move and dodge attack.
A LLAV and SLAV's method of attack is supposed to be through the infantry it supports. Which is a completely borked method. CCP, in their established good judgement, are seemingly taking away the only way to adequately attack with a LAV. |
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Thumb Green
Novashift
268
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:27:00 -
[11] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:I try to use my vehicle to actually support my team, but such play style is a huge ISK sink. The only way to make up for those losses is by foregoing support for a couple of matches and doing the only thing that nets me WPs in a vehicle.
Or you know, you could run as infantry in a free suit.
Silas Swakhammer wrote:Oddly enough, one simple mechanic would dramatically change drivers' playstyle: a driver's locking mechanic.
Oddly enough, that's BS and you know it.
The only thing you're apprehensive about is losing your crutch. |
Mamertine Son
R.E.B.E.L.S
105
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:
How is a couple tonnes of vehicle running into someone and killing them stupid? Bear in mind that an adequate speed is necessary to accomplish that.
Its not stupid or unrealistic and I try not to get too upset anyone driving an LAV because it is what it is and CCP put it there so if you skilled into it you might as well use it.
My problem with it is that I don't want to have to dodge out of the way of incoming vehicles all of the time. I simply don't like that game mechanic because it messes with the flow of battle and turns a fire fight into watch-out-for-the-murder-taxi fight.
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Nemo Bluntz
TeamPlayers EoN.
268
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:29:00 -
[13] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:Nemo Bluntz wrote:Silas Swakhammer wrote:bal-+ance noun - a state of equilibrium or equipoise
Removing the one thing LAVs excel at does not balance them; it simply renames them to LV You do realize that there's a gun on the back of those things, right? Not sure if you've ever sat in that particular seat. But that's where the "A" comes from. The small LAV turret is not operable by the driver. The small LAV turret is near worthless, since it does so little damage and completely exposes anyone who uses it, with no freedom to move and dodge attack. A LLAV and SLAV's method of attack is supposed to be through the infantry it supports. Which is a completely borked method. CCP, in their established good judgement, are seemingly taking away the only way to adequately attack with a LAV. You mean to use a vehicle weapon in a team game you need to use team work??!?!
I like that the 'fix' is to keep with the unintended battering ram instead of buffing the under-utilized turret. |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
507
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
LAV collision damage should be postponed until the vehicle balance pass, same way as the armor rep bug was postponed. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1634
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 16:40:00 -
[15] - Quote
This is why we need an Assault variant with a driver operated turret. An alternative to tank driving.
The turrets on the back of LAVs now are a complete joke, you hop up there and I just headshot you right off... there is no protection for LAV turret operators. |
low genius
the sound of freedom Renegade Alliance
285
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:42:00 -
[16] - Quote
just kill them. easy.
stop talking about balance when the full set of suits and vehicles is not yet available. |
Awesome Pantaloons
Tech Guard General Tso's Alliance
11
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:42:00 -
[17] - Quote
I grant this is a game but a little realism doesn't hurt. When have we ever heard of a military vehicle running down enemies??? The mounted gun is there for a reason. Get a good gunner, then you get plenty of WP for vehicle assists. :P If you don't want them to nerf your LAVs, tell CCP to allow infantry to load ourselves with explosives. You want to run me over? Go a-*******-head. My glorious death and the subsequent loss of your vehicle will make it worth tasting your bumper. |
stlcarlos989
SVER True Blood
464
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:45:00 -
[18] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:Logi Stician wrote:LV?? Wait, wait, wait, wait. If the, in my opinion, very stupid collision damage was nerfed, how would that take the "A" out of LAV? What is that gun looking thing on the back side of those things that I see mercs standing behind every so often? Is a gun of some kind? Does it work? Shoot confetti or something?
The small turret is near worthless. Talk to any dedicated driver and they'll tell you that they'd wish they can make a fit without a turret. Admittedly, I have a LLAV fit centered around a more powerful turret, but it's still mostly a psychological weapon, much like the sniper rifle. How is a couple tonnes of vehicle running into someone and killing them stupid? Bear in mind that an adequate speed is necessary to accomplish that. Not true at all
The LLAV has an inherent damage reduction to the turret which make it weaker, but the other LAVs don't.
Saga, ADV or Proto blaster, and two 10% damage mods
2 of my corpmates have this setup and I routinely go 25+ kills and the driver gets a ton of warpoints from assists and some kills from orbitals both the driver and gunner have to be skilled because the LAV can't take too much punishment but the blaster absolutely melts through people. A few days ago I went 48-1 gunning with the one death being a redline suicide when we got greeding trying to get a sniper. |
Logi Stician
The Vanguardians
125
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 16:51:00 -
[19] - Quote
Silas Swakhammer wrote:Logi Stician wrote:LV?? Wait, wait, wait, wait. If the, in my opinion, very stupid collision damage was nerfed, how would that take the "A" out of LAV? What is that gun looking thing on the back side of those things that I see mercs standing behind every so often? Is a gun of some kind? Does it work? Shoot confetti or something?
The small turret is near worthless. Talk to any dedicated driver and they'll tell you that they'd wish they can make a fit without a turret. Admittedly, I have a LLAV fit centered around a more powerful turret, but it's still mostly a psychological weapon, much like the sniper rifle. How is a couple tonnes of vehicle running into someone and killing them stupid? Bear in mind that an adequate speed is necessary to accomplish that.
Adequate? You mean barely graze? Literally driving a very short distance back and forth has great kill potential. Try again, sir. |
Mamertine Son
R.E.B.E.L.S
106
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 16:53:00 -
[20] - Quote
stlcarlos989 wrote:
2 of my corpmates have this setup and I routinely go 25+ kills and the driver gets a ton of warpoints from assists and some kills from orbitals both the driver and gunner have to be skilled because the LAV can't take too much punishment but the blaster absolutely melts through people. A few days ago I went 48-1 gunning with the one death being a redline suicide when we got greeding trying to get a sniper.
And that's what I want to see.
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Cosgar
ParagonX
4174
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills. |
stlcarlos989
SVER True Blood
466
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 16:59:00 -
[22] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills. Not necessary for the blaster; just use a adv or proto blaster with damage mods and the driver just has to stop for the gunner to get the kills, trust me it doesn't take long. |
THE TRAINSPOTTER
ROMANIA Renegades C0VEN
92
|
Posted - 2013.08.13 17:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
ive spent all my SP , 4 mil into LAV , if they become junk , oh well...bye , and no you cant have my stuff , i rather delete it
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THE TRAINSPOTTER
ROMANIA Renegades C0VEN
92
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:03:00 -
[24] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills.
for the last fukin time , the driver doesnt have time to use the fukin turret
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star. EoN.
832
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:18:00 -
[25] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:99% of the community are retards
CCP took away 2 skills which increased shield/armor HP away from the vehicle tree and added the missing HP to all vehicles (except DS)
So basic vehicles got a buff, vehicle specialists got a nerf in my view (less to skill into to seperate the vehicle pilots from the scrubs) while tryhards got a better vehicle for no SP
All they have to do is take away the buff and give the 2 skills back to the vehicle tree
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Nemo Bluntz
TeamPlayers EoN.
269
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:33:00 -
[26] - Quote
THE TRAINSPOTTER wrote:Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills. for the last fukin time , the driver doesnt have time to use the fukin turret
You shouldn't be driving alone if you want your LAV to be killing people. |
Mamertine Son
R.E.B.E.L.S
109
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:34:00 -
[27] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills.
That won't really stop the driver from utilizing the LAV like a bulldozer.
The driver will just grab a turret buddy and run down anyone his gunner can't kill himself. |
THE TRAINSPOTTER
ROMANIA Renegades C0VEN
92
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:39:00 -
[28] - Quote
Nemo Bluntz wrote:THE TRAINSPOTTER wrote:Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills. for the last fukin time , the driver doesnt have time to use the fukin turret You shouldn't be driving alone if you want your LAV to be killing people.
its not my fault people dont use my LAV turret , the only ppl using it are the newcomers who all they do is keep firing at the sky or teammates or at random stuff
you even have the option to spawn in my LAV and even so , ppl dont care so dont complain to me if i run you over instead of getting shoot by LAV turret
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THE TRAINSPOTTER
ROMANIA Renegades C0VEN
92
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:41:00 -
[29] - Quote
Mamertine Son wrote:Cosgar wrote:Buff small missles and give small blasters better aim-assist and people will use the turrets more than the bumper to get kills. That won't really stop the driver from utilizing the LAV like a bulldozer. The driver will just grab a turret buddy and run down anyone his gunner can't kill himself.
it makes perfect sense , if the enemy is too close to LAV killing him with the turret is not easy so you run him over if you can
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Nemo Bluntz
TeamPlayers EoN.
271
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:43:00 -
[30] - Quote
Haha, first time I've heard the I would totally let people use the turret instead of ramming them, but they just don't want to angle.
Ramming is more effective than the turret. That's the issue that we all seem to agree upon. But the taxi drivers really want it to stay that way. |
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