DUST Search - CCP is like a child

Asher Night wrote:

Killar-12 wrote:

Meh, I'd point at EVE to counter your point but I think that Dust might get repackaged and renamed before it's put on PS4 (If CCP wants people to buy it.)

Lol I cant tell you how tired I am of having to address this point. What you said is like saying "America beat Japan pretty devastatingly so they'll have no problem with the middle east".

Eve is pretty much the only space ship mmo you can go to - they completely dominate that market. If you hate EVE but love spaceship mmo's, you really don't have many options. On top of having that market cornered, who even tries to compete with them? It is also on PC and PC players have much, MUCH more patience than console players.

Dust is an FPS - one of many, many FPS's. If you don't like it, just wait a week for the next FPS to be released. Dust has nothing BUT competition. Its on a console - console players do not have anywhere near the amount of patience pc players do.

Ccp can't do what it did with EVE and expect Dust to succeed. Flipping a coin with the same hand will not always make it land on heads - especially when you are in a storm.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Mad Mav Brotherhood of the Commissioned 134	Posted - 2013.08.10 08:11:00 - [91] - Quote So how was reducing the WP an improvement then? Oh yea, CCP is "experimenting". If they would do less experimenting and actually listen to our feedback then they would know that reducing the WP was not the way to go.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7124	Posted - 2013.08.10 08:20:00 - [92] - Quote Bendtner92 wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Thing is the 'wall slam' experienced at 20k is exactly the same wall 'slam experienced' at amount of wall slam at 400 WP or (or 0 WP) even 10 million SP going into PC the first time. Hardly. There's a huge difference in being released for pub stomping after 1-2 matches or 50 matches. Sure you won't have much SP either way, but with 20k WP as the limit you would have a lot of battle experience before being released. You can also be fairly competitive in PC with 10 million SP. I "only" have 14 million and I can be pretty competitive in PC. Do you even know anything about PC anyway? I only know by proxy I don't ringer into those fights because they're at odd times I am unable to use the PS3 mostly. Few folks who I have talked with going into PC for the first time said its a world's difference in facing a coherent team.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7124	Posted - 2013.08.10 08:22:00 - [93] - Quote Mad Mav wrote: So how was reducing the WP an improvement then? Oh yea, CCP is "experimenting". If they would do less experimenting and actually listen to our feedback then they would know that reducing the WP was not the way to go. Well what are you suggestions and since you're so smart care to guess the numbers of people who graduated (earned enough war points to leave) the first iteration of the Battle Academy?
Bendtner92 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 849	Posted - 2013.08.10 08:24:00 - [94] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I only know by proxy I don't ringer into those fights because they're at odd times I am unable to use the PS3 mostly. Few folks who I have talked with going into PC for the first time said its a world's difference in facing a coherent team. That has nothing to do with SP though. Unless you have 5 million SP or less or something like that. That's because there's no place for practicing or anything like that before entering PC. If they had worked on FW instead of PC back in January and had made FW a place for organised fights, and then later on introduced PC/something similar it would have been much better. They practically skipped a step with the introduction of PC.
Asirius Medaius Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore 190	Posted - 2013.08.10 08:47:00 - [95] - Quote Asher Night wrote: Killar-12 wrote: Meh, I'd point at EVE to counter your point but I think that Dust might get repackaged and renamed before it's put on PS4 (If CCP wants people to buy it.) Lol I cant tell you how tired I am of having to address this point. What you said is like saying "America beat Japan pretty devastatingly so they'll have no problem with the middle east". Eve is pretty much the only space ship mmo you can go to - they completely dominate that market. If you hate EVE but love spaceship mmo's, you really don't have many options. On top of having that market cornered, who even tries to compete with them? It is also on PC and PC players have much, MUCH more patience than console players. Dust is an FPS - one of many, many FPS's. If you don't like it, just wait a week for the next FPS to be released. Dust has nothing BUT competition. Its on a console - console players do not have anywhere near the amount of patience pc players do. Ccp can't do what it did with EVE and expect Dust to succeed. Flipping a coin with the same hand will not always make it land on heads - especially when you are in a storm. I love you.
Asirius Medaius Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore 190	Posted - 2013.08.10 09:13:00 - [96] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: We could delete battle academy and go back to the days of not having it :P Either way the original 20k was apparently too much as well having new unique players quitting during that period. Yeah, sure, go ahead and take away the battle academy; Replace it with some PVE and you will have a huge influx of people who can actively get to know the game mechanics while shooting some Drone scum on a battlefield. However, if you keep progressing down this path (talking mostly to you CCP, and also all of you at CPM, who are equally as guilty for an underdeveloped game such as this) you are going to lose this game before Christmas. I mean it, this game is going to lose over 40 to 50 percent of its people if CCP doesn't pull their head AT LEAST halfway out of their a. You put in PVE, and you can take out your silly BA that is only racking more and more hate. Hell, you put in PVE, and you don't even really need matchmaking anymore, and then it could still be New Eden; Just give every player an option to cooperate with other people and make isk while they learn the damn game. Sometimes, I don't even know if CCP Shanghai or CPM has ever played EVE Online. When you start in the universe of EVE Online, you are given a small little rookie ship, and many choices whether you want to engage other people off-the-bat or not (depending if you like PVP or PVE). Also, remember that a large majority of EVE Online players (called "Carebears" by certain parts of the community) like to do mission running or anything that allows them to casually attack NPC enemies for good isk. Maybe I don't know how to run a profitable company, but at least I know how to prioritize st to generate enough diverse interests to keep this game afloat; and believe me CCP, the choices you are making right now are not going to save you from drowning, unless you change right now. Tl;Dr: Screw matchmaking and the Battle Academy, just scrap it, and replace all of it with PVE, which will allow people to get used to the game mechanics, make isk, and furthermore, allow an option for them to get battle-ready over time without forcing them to pit against other people. You can't assume everyone wants to PVP, unless you want your game to fail... Which by all means CCP, is under your control alone.
Mad Mav Brotherhood of the Commissioned 134	Posted - 2013.08.10 09:18:00 - [97] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Mad Mav wrote: So how was reducing the WP an improvement then? Oh yea, CCP is "experimenting". If they would do less experimenting and actually listen to our feedback then they would know that reducing the WP was not the way to go. Well what are you suggestions and since you're so smart care to guess the numbers of people who graduated (earned enough war points to leave) the first iteration of the Battle Academy? Alright, for starters we go back to the original 20K needed to graduate. That gave new players a bit of time to play with others of relatively the same experience level and gave them time to think about what they wanted to spec into. As is right now with the current 400 WP setup they have time to do neither. Might as well not have it . Setting it back though won't stop the inevitable protostomp that will occur once they graduate. At this point in the game there's really no way around it. Increasing the WP needed to graduate then sounds like an acceptable alternative. Still keeps players within the same relative experience level. That begs the question how much do you increase it by? Give it to little of a boost and what was really the point of increasing it? To much of a boost and then you have ADVStomping. So this next bit is more up to CCP. According by their data reducing the BA was a good idea(). With that in mind maybe they could scrounge up some data on the average maximum amount of WP a player has while still using STD gear but not being able to use ADV? If they could do that then setting that average as the needed amount of WP for graduation could work. No idea of they could get that data though and using the average a few players would be able to slip into the Academy with ADV gear but no system perfect As For a guess as to how many graduated the first iteration? Not sure if you mean in total or just the ones that still play. If going by the latter, with the number of players being stagnant for so long it couldn't be many.
R F Gyro Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 452	Posted - 2013.08.10 09:39:00 - [98] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Well what are you suggestions and since you're so smart care to guess the numbers of people who graduated (earned enough war points to leave) the first iteration of the Battle Academy? Ahh, that makes things a little clearer, thanks. So I'm guessing the main problem was that the majority of genuinely new players (I'm assuming CCP can distinguish between new alts and new accounts in BA) were getting bored of BA and quitting before they got to 10K WP, and therefore not experiencing the full game. A secondary problem is the "wall-slam" when moving from BA to general matches. CCP decided there is no easy fix to the wall-slam, but they can easily fix the "quitting before experiencing the full game" problem by dropping the limit to 400WP. I'm further assuming CCP are hoping that the new matchmaking system they are working on will solve the wall-slam.
R F Gyro Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 452	Posted - 2013.08.10 09:43:00 - [99] - Quote MlDDLE MANGEMENT wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: In this thread, the community expresses discontent with a change while the representative of the community claims we just don't understand. IWS isnt a representattive of the community why would anyone ever think that, he's always been a CCP apoligist and mouthpiece. You ever been caught in the middle of an argument between your girlfriend and your best mate? You try your hardest to help both sides understand the other's position and take some of the heat out of the discussion. But both your GF and your mate think you are siding with the other. You end up with everyone mad at you.
Bendtner92 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 849	Posted - 2013.08.10 09:53:00 - [100] - Quote New players should start out with a few millions of SP along with having the next few millions uncapped. I'm thinking something like they should start out with 2 million and have the next 3 million uncapped. Next thing is that everyone should have access to Instant Battles and everything else, but new players should have the Battle Academy as an option, but an option only. They shouldn't be forced into the BA. I'm thinking that players up until 3 million SP should have access to the "Rookie BA" which is then replaced with "Veteran BA" up until 5 million SP. After 5 million SP they no longer have access to any Battle Academy of any kind.

Mortedeamor Wraith Shadow Guards 147	Posted - 2013.08.10 12:00:00 - [101] - Quote i figured they gave up when they did the 400wp thing, i mean seriously ccp we tell you to extend the scrub academy graduation lines, and you shorten it wtf is wrong with yall? i mean really what kinda logic leads to making a choice like this ...trying to shorten the player base by quickly getting rid of every remotely new player? because that's all this will do toss scrubs into a **** storm they cannot possibly handle or cope with and force them to set dust 514 down earlier than they would have...trying to make it all end faster to avoid the forum mocking? lol
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 7127	Posted - 2013.08.10 20:01:00 - [102] - Quote R F Gyro wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Well what are you suggestions and since you're so smart care to guess the numbers of people who graduated (earned enough war points to leave) the first iteration of the Battle Academy? Ahh, that makes things a little clearer, thanks. So I'm guessing the main problem was that the majority of genuinely new players (I'm assuming CCP can distinguish between new alts and new accounts in BA) were getting bored of BA and quitting before they got to 10K WP, and therefore not experiencing the full game. A secondary problem is the "wall-slam" when moving from BA to general matches. CCP decided there is no easy fix to the wall-slam, but they can easily fix the "quitting before experiencing the full game" problem by dropping the limit to 400WP. I'm further assuming CCP are hoping that the new matchmaking system they are working on will solve the wall-slam. This man deserves a plate of internet cookies. He is able to step back and not think like a player.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2347	Posted - 2013.08.10 20:13:00 - [103] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: We could delete battle academy and go back to the days of not having it :P Either way the original 20k was apparently too much as well having new unique players quitting during that period. According to eve-offline, it didn't make one lick of difference at all. Not having BA, too long BA, too short BA. 10k new players a day and player base is shrinking... CCP's actions did NOT improve anything. Stop being an apologist, it's painful to watch.
MlDDLE MANGEMENT lMPurity 329	Posted - 2013.08.10 23:18:00 - [104] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: We could delete battle academy and go back to the days of not having it :P Either way the original 20k was apparently too much as well having new unique players quitting during that period. According to eve-offline, it didn't make one lick of difference at all. Not having BA, too long BA, too short BA. 10k new players a day and player base is shrinking... CCP's actions did NOT improve anything. Stop being an apologist, it's painful to watch. My shrinking tub of popcorn and chocolate beg to differ
R F Gyro Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 457	Posted - 2013.08.11 14:20:00 - [105] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: This man deserves a plate of internet cookies. He is able to step back and not think like a player. Thank you. Can I have some milk with that? However, while I think I understand CCP's reasoning, I don't really agree with it. Exposing new players to more of the game is only going to help if they'll be significantly more impressed with what they see outside BA than in it. I don't really see that being the case here. This change is simply "rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic" in my view, and I doubt it will have a significant impact on new player retention. We'll have to wait for proper matchmaking and for whatever else CCP has up its sleeve for the revamped new player experience to see that change.
R F Gyro Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 457	Posted - 2013.08.11 14:27:00 - [106] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: 10k new players a day and player base is shrinking... Actually, looking at the charts I'd say it has pretty much stabilised now. And, as trauma surgeons will attest, that's the most important thing for a critically injured patient.
Captain-Awesome Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 476	Posted - 2013.08.13 07:47:00 - [107] - Quote Ironwolf, I gotta disagree with your points. You say BA is unfair because vets are going in there and dominating.... Yet you are standing by CCP to putting newbies into a playlist where it is just veterans and elites. at least in the newbie matches, there are only 1-2 veterans (it's not their fault if they want to start an alt!) not only this but you guys seem to be only focusing on discussing the impact on the new players, negating the fact that it is very frustrating as a veteran to be paired up with a guy who is more interested in zooming in on his LAV. I want to win matches, not just be top of the boards.
Alldin Kan TeamPlayers EoN. 508	Posted - 2013.08.17 21:55:00 - [108] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: UPDATE 15-08-13: At downtime today we'll be increasing the Academy WP cap from 400 to 1500, to see what impact this has on our metrics. Characters who log in after downtime and have scored between 400 and 1500 War Points in their career to date will find themselves back in the Academy, which they'll leave (again!) when they accumulate 1500 total lifetime WP. I'm not sure if I can call this progress...
Tectonic Fusion The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 125	Posted - 2013.08.17 22:09:00 - [109] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: We could delete battle academy and go back to the days of not having it :P Either way the original 20k was apparently too much as well having new unique players quitting during that period. Took me 5 days of not really playing but getting over 1k WP a battle on my ALT Elitist Ultima :p


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