DUST Search - Income source for tankers?

iceyburnz wrote:

Actually tanks in dust are tougher than thier real counterparts. There are no "disabled" tanks in dust, this happens in real warfare you can guess that a "destroyed tank' in Dust is representative of a whole range of things that can happen to a tank in the real world that takes it out of the fight.

The common sense assumption that tanks are somehow totally bad ass. But the reality of it is tanks havn't been bad ass since they first appeared in WW1 then people learned to deal with them.

I think the balance on tanks is okay. And fiddling with it, might ruin the equilibrium we have.

You should read this. And tell me if they made "tanks" more "realistic" (not as they stand now) would you still want to call one.

Anti Tank Warfare

Im sure snipers and heavies would love to have this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_97_20_mm_anti-tank_rifle

Im sure the dust equivilent of this weapon would pentrate armour and shields and kill the crew. Or simple penetrate the reactor and cause a catacrophic explosion.

The truth is most actual anti-tank weapons can disable a tank with a single to a handful of direct hits.

While I know dust 514 isn't the real world it is meant to simulate a world of advanced technology. If you use today as an analog its suggestes offensive technology has fallen way behind defensive.

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Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1868	Posted - 2013.06.09 06:43:00 - [61] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I find that surviving matches is a key to earning profits in an HAV. Also knowing when to call one down or not or when to recall them. You certainly know you're doing your job when you have half a team go after you with anti-vehicle. You don't get tanking. They are unsupportable in equal skill and SP contests. You have to choose between being a pansy and being useful. And pray there is no rain (OBs).
Eris Ernaga Super Nerds 172	Posted - 2013.06.09 06:43:00 - [62] - Quote Tanks aren't broken they are nerfed Dust needs a larger source of income for new and older players both and it needs to fit every profession. We need some kind of PVE for vehicles, dropsuits, and CO-OPs that is all there is to it drone infestation will be one of these things.
ladwar Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 598	Posted - 2013.06.09 06:56:00 - [63] - Quote Darken-Sol wrote: ladwar wrote: Rusty Shallows wrote: The charge-to-fire-time on my Assault Forge is over nine times longer than a large rail cannon. It has a range limit, sixteen shots (make 'em count), weapon shake, no zoom (much less an aiming mode), and best of all I get to rely on my sub-machine gun when some shot-gunner scout with the crazy eyes comes hunting. rails have RoF limiter that forge don't have btw thats 1.8 seconds till the next shot so go HTFU with your nine times BS. you can fire just as fast with maxed skills. all the while your two other turrets are unloading on us. i have to reload....... well sometimes. that takes time. most tanks die running. i fought one guy who had a mean blaster turret, took me about 800k worth of gear to pop him. i would guess it was because he stayed and played. my buddy madru ghanza rocks a MLT with 2300 sheilds and less armor. havnt seen it popped yet. theres good tankers out there. i'd love to know how he remove shields/armor from his HAV. btw its not like those turrets fire on their own so that's like saying there is more av shooting at the HAV. just means more people doing something means nothing. if it cost you that much then your doing it wrong or you lost a HAV which still is doing it wrong. I can run a base sica and score some 25 kills but I could run on the ground and score the same amount of kills for much less risk and ISK and score more warpoints and make a profit everytime. av is easy mode but no one likes to do it right which is beyond me, people see shooter and means I need to have an assault rifle in my hands or a sidearm only.
Rusty Shallows Black Jackals 94	Posted - 2013.06.09 07:15:00 - [64] - Quote ladwar wrote: Rusty Shallows wrote: The charge-to-fire-time on my Assault Forge is over nine times longer than a large rail cannon. It has a range limit, sixteen shots (make 'em count), weapon shake, no zoom (much less an aiming mode), and best of all I get to rely on my sub-machine gun when some shot-gunner scout with the crazy eyes comes hunting. rails have RoF limiter that forge don't have btw thats 1.8 seconds till the next shot so go HTFU with your nine times BS. you can fire just as fast with maxed skills. LOL a HTFU jab. 2.5 X 0.75 / 0.2 = 9.375 hence the nine times faster-to-charge comment. You can't call math BS, it is statistics people like to abuse. You do have a point about the limiter. So the RoF of the Large Rail is slower with my maxed forge gun skills by 0.125 seconds. However I'm very vulnerable during those 1.875 seconds (doubly so if I have to crouch to aim) while that other guy is still in a very mobile and combat ready in a tank whether it be 0.2 seconds to charge-to-fire or the 1.8 seconds limiter. So basically we can safely say the Forge Gun has better damage and RoF (over a series of four shots) while the HAV has everything else. Not a bad deal for the tank. The only question is the isk HAV drivers are paying worth the difference. Of which I have no opinion.
Eurydice Itzhak Militaires Sans Jeux 60	Posted - 2013.06.09 08:07:00 - [65] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: I find that surviving matches is a key to earning profits in an HAV. Also knowing when to call one down or not or when to recall them. You certainly know you're doing your job when you have half a team go after you with anti-vehicle. You don't get tanking. They are unsupportable in equal skill and SP contests. You have to choose between being a pansy and being useful. And pray there is no rain (OBs). And there is the heart of the matter. The best tankers are the ones who are best at running away. Armor tanks are great in pubs, ALMOST useful in PC. Shield tanks are lolpubs and lolpc.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 816	Posted - 2013.06.09 09:39:00 - [66] - Quote Well since they've taken away the shared skills between Dropsuits and Vehicles, it's become a lot harder to go without your vehicles in random matches. That being said, it's also impossible to remain profitable in the long run with HAVs if you meet moderate AV resistance since a single HAV loss will kill your profit for about 3 matches. WIth that said I basically refuse to call my HAVs in so I can conserve and amass ISK to buy them for PC battles. I've basically come to the conclusion that you have 2 options for HAV pilots to use to generate ISK. 1. Death Taxi Logistics LAV Yes everyone hates them, but you might as well put your vehicle support skills to use. Just wear a Skinweave heavy suit so it's harder to shoot you out of the driver seat. These generally cost 150-200k ISK each, so even if you lose one you're breaking even most of the time for the match...and if you're smart you generally never lose one. 2. SVER Logistics Suit This is what I usually do now, because it's entirely free with BPO modules and super cheap without. Not the best loadout but hey it gives me something do while I make money. This suit can be put together with zero fitting skills which makes it ideal for vehicle pilots. Only SP investment is the skills to get Minmatar Logistics Lvl 1, which honestly isn't THAT bad. 'Sever' Minmatar Logistics Suit Militia Shield Extender Militia Shield Extender Militia Armor Plate Militia Armor Repairer Militia Repair Tool Militia Nanite Injector (Not like you ever get to use it, but hey you're trying) Militia Nanohive (Yes they suck but they have some limited usefulness) Militia Locus Grenade 'Exile' Assault Rifle EDIT: Obviously you don't HAVE to go Logistics, but I already had the suit from the previous builds and I enjoy playing Logi.
NovaSpree Always playing to AFK 1	Posted - 2013.06.09 09:40:00 - [67] - Quote Tanks are like heavies once robust and strong breeds that got nerfed into the ground because they could not be killed by the average medium suit. Now the average medium suit can carry AV mini nuke grenades and have light slot guns that can out dps and range the HMG while tanking 1000+HP, behold the win all to what used to be Rock Paper Scissors.
Gunner Needed The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION 144	Posted - 2013.06.09 10:03:00 - [68] - Quote as a dropship pilot this makes me lol
Djheffer O.Q.R.D. 19	Posted - 2013.06.09 10:06:00 - [69] - Quote Darken-Sol wrote: ladwar wrote: Rusty Shallows wrote: The charge-to-fire-time on my Assault Forge is over nine times longer than a large rail cannon. It has a range limit, sixteen shots (make 'em count), weapon shake, no zoom (much less an aiming mode), and best of all I get to rely on my sub-machine gun when some shot-gunner scout with the crazy eyes comes hunting. rails have RoF limiter that forge don't have btw thats 1.8 seconds till the next shot so go HTFU with your nine times BS. you can fire just as fast with maxed skills. all the while your two other turrets are unloading on us. i have to reload....... well sometimes. that takes time. most tanks die running. i fought one guy who had a mean blaster turret, took me about 800k worth of gear to pop him. i would guess it was because he stayed and played. my buddy madru ghanza rocks a MLT with 2300 sheilds and less armor. havnt seen it popped yet. theres good tankers out there. Agreed, theres good AVs out there.
EnglishSnake Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1192	Posted - 2013.06.09 10:57:00 - [70] - Quote Logi LAVs tbh

Karl Koekwaus Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 86	Posted - 2013.06.09 11:22:00 - [71] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Who are you to say what tanks are "meant for". I can say infantry are meant for being targets fory blaster but that doesn'take me right. Seeing Im not the one whining about 'oh no tanks are too expensive', Proto suits are expensive too do I whine about there cost when the only thing I do is solo running them? Maybe the fact that they cost so much says something about how they should be used? But than again, the only thing tankers can do is whine about there cost and not think about why they are so expensive. knight of 6 wrote: and what exactly might you propose tankers do when not in their tanks? their skills don't transfer to dropsuits and tanks are rather SP intensive so they can't be infantry, dropships suck and are a bigger isk sink that tanks, and lavs require 2 people... unless your a murder taxi ________. Shoot stuff in suits. It's not the non-tankers fault you put your deliberately SP into something that is really expensive to run. Or run them in a full squad, so you don't lose them as often and make a profit using them. Like they're designed for. couldn't think of that on your own?
iceyburnz Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 616	Posted - 2013.06.09 11:37:00 - [72] - Quote Actually tanks in dust are tougher than thier real counterparts. There are no "disabled" tanks in dust, this happens in real warfare you can guess that a "destroyed tank' in Dust is representative of a whole range of things that can happen to a tank in the real world that takes it out of the fight. The common sense assumption that tanks are somehow totally bad ass. But the reality of it is tanks havn't been bad ass since they first appeared in WW1 then people learned to deal with them. I think the balance on tanks is okay. And fiddling with it, might ruin the equilibrium we have. You should read this. And tell me if they made "tanks" more "realistic" (not as they stand now) would you still want to call one. Anti Tank Warfare Im sure snipers and heavies would love to have this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_97_20_mm_anti-tank_rifle Im sure the dust equivilent of this weapon would pentrate armour and shields and kill the crew. Or simple penetrate the reactor and cause a catacrophic explosion. The truth is most actual anti-tank weapons can disable a tank with a single to a handful of direct hits. While I know dust 514 isn't the real world it is meant to simulate a world of advanced technology. If you use today as an analog its suggestes offensive technology has fallen way behind defensive.
The legend345 Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 150	Posted - 2013.06.09 16:56:00 - [73] - Quote iceyburnz wrote: Actually tanks in dust are tougher than thier real counterparts. There are no "disabled" tanks in dust, this happens in real warfare you can guess that a "destroyed tank' in Dust is representative of a whole range of things that can happen to a tank in the real world that takes it out of the fight. The common sense assumption that tanks are somehow totally bad ass. But the reality of it is tanks havn't been bad ass since they first appeared in WW1 then people learned to deal with them. I think the balance on tanks is okay. And fiddling with it, might ruin the equilibrium we have. You should read this. And tell me if they made "tanks" more "realistic" (not as they stand now) would you still want to call one. Anti Tank Warfare Im sure snipers and heavies would love to have this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_97_20_mm_anti-tank_rifle Im sure the dust equivilent of this weapon would pentrate armour and shields and kill the crew. Or simple penetrate the reactor and cause a catacrophic explosion. The truth is most actual anti-tank weapons can disable a tank with a single to a handful of direct hits. While I know dust 514 isn't the real world it is meant to simulate a world of advanced technology. If you use today as an analog its suggestes offensive technology has fallen way behind defensive. If you want realism find a different game (if you even can find one that has 100 percent realism).
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 336	Posted - 2013.06.09 17:04:00 - [74] - Quote I would even be cool with HAVs getting 5x their current EHP if we could only disable them. Make it an insane grind to kill them, but give us the ability to force them to sit still.
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 103	Posted - 2013.06.10 02:04:00 - [75] - Quote ladwar wrote: yet they do rain down like skittles, more so in PC matches. well, yeah. PC battles are pretty much the prestigiest part of dust right now.


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