DUST Search - [REQUEST] All Skills Need an Innate Bonus

J Falcs wrote:

I was surprised to see the number of skills that only unlocked items with Uprising's deployment. However, I was happy to see that many skills improved the efficacy of modules. In my opinion, that was a good first step from making mercs too powerful through a saturation of always-on passives.

I am an infantry player, so this post will highlight infantry issues (I would appreciate a vehicle specialist doing the same).

Dropsuit Command Skills

Dropsuit Command - 1% increase in speed per level
All Basic Dropsuit Skills- The first bonus of a specialist suit should be tied to the level of the basic suit skill level, e.g., Minmatar Logistics first bonus of +1 Innate Armor Repair is contingent on the level of the Minmatar Medium Dropsuit Level.
All Basic Dropsuit Skills (part 2) - The basic suits should receive one bonus depending on the level of the basic dropsuit skill. It should be different from the specialist bonus.

Dropsuit Command

Dropsuit Upgrades - 1% increase to armor and shields per level
Nanocircuitry - 3% increase to nanohive clusters per level; 2% increase to nanite injector efficacy per level
Drop Uplink Deployment - -1% *additive* bonus to spawn time
Repair Tool Operation - 3% increase to repair tool efficacy (or range)
Active Scanner - 2% decrease to cooldown

Weaponry

Weaponry - 2% bonus to reload speed OR -1% CPU/PG weapon fitting requirement
Grenadier - +1 grenade per level , seriously though, I cannot think of anything outside of -1% CPU fitting requirement
Demolitions - +4% increase in blast radius

Obviously, feel free to add suggestions, tweaks, etc. I think I covered all of the infantry skills without any innate bonus outside of only unlocking skills. If I missed one, please let me know.

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J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 52	Posted - 2013.05.25 14:27:00 - [1] - Quote I was surprised to see the number of skills that only unlocked items with Uprising's deployment. However, I was happy to see that many skills improved the efficacy of modules. In my opinion, that was a good first step from making mercs too powerful through a saturation of always-on passives. I am an infantry player, so this post will highlight infantry issues (I would appreciate a vehicle specialist doing the same). Dropsuit Command Skills Dropsuit Command - 1% increase in speed per level All Basic Dropsuit Skills- The first bonus of a specialist suit should be tied to the level of the basic suit skill level, e.g., Minmatar Logistics first bonus of +1 Innate Armor Repair is contingent on the level of the Minmatar Medium Dropsuit Level. All Dropsuit Skillls (part 2) - The basic suits should receive one bonus depending on the level of the basic dropsuit skill. It should be different from the specialist bonus. Dropsuit Command Dropsuit Upgrades - 1% increase to armor and shields per level Nanocircuitry - 3% increase to nanohive clusters per level; 2% increase to nanite injector efficacy per level Drop Uplink Deployment - -1% additive bonus to spawn time Repair Tool Operation - 3% increase to repair tool efficacy (or range) Weaponry Weaponry - 2% bonus to reload speed OR -1% CPU/PG weapon fitting requirement Grenadier - +1 grenade per level , seriously though, I cannot think of anything outside of -1% CPU fitting requirement Demolitions - +4% increase in blast radius Obviously, feel free to add suggestions, tweaks, etc. I think I covered all of the infantry skills without any innate bonus outside of only unlocking skills. If I missed one, please let me know.
EXASTRA INVICTAS Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 29	Posted - 2013.05.25 14:34:00 - [2] - Quote On the Vehicle side, we currently have absolutely no reason to train any of the base vehicle skills beyond (now level 3) for the "T2" variants of the vehicles. We don't even have "advanced" or "prototype" base tanks, LAVs, or Dropships. So levels 4 and 5 on those respective vehicles are a complete and total waste of SP (and quite a bit of it at that). Vehicle Turret Upgrades only unlocks better class turret upgrades, it should offer a PG or CPU reduction to turret upgrade modules (or the turrets themselves) a la Electronics Upgrades/Engineering Upgrades/(Advanced) Weapon Upgrades skills in EVE. Remote repair systems and Vehicle Maneuvering are also bonusless, only unlocking equpiment. Also, the Vehicle Engineering skill is completely lackluster.
Sophie DV Amplitude. Reverberation Project 9	Posted - 2013.05.25 15:47:00 - [3] - Quote I also agree that every skill should have an innate bonus, even if it's minor. You can start by putting the 2% per level damage bonus back to weaponry and removing the recent 10% buff to all weapons!
J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 54	Posted - 2013.05.26 00:29:00 - [4] - Quote Sophie DV wrote: I also agree that every skill should have an innate bonus, even if it's minor. You can start by putting the 2% per level damage bonus back to weaponry and removing the recent 10% buff to all weapons! I thought about that when I decided what to do with Weaponry. But, since the 10% buff is already in place, I opted for something different.
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 178	Posted - 2013.05.26 01:27:00 - [5] - Quote Couldn't agree more! I think that for now it would be nice that all appropriate skills lower cpu/pg requirements, at the very least. Most skills can do something better obviously, such as your suggestion for more nanite clusters, that is a very good idea. It's important to keep in mind that most skills should not give you a direct advantage over another player, like extra weapon damage on a weapon you don't specialise in because then the advantage becomes even more based on SP as opposed to skill, fittings, tactics and squad play. With that said you should definitely receive bonuses for your specialisation, so if you're running nanite injectors you should be rewarded for doing that through your skills.
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. League of Infamy 370	Posted - 2013.05.26 01:30:00 - [6] - Quote I thought that this was one of the things CCP was promoting, that all skills needed to have some sort of bonus related to them like they do in EVE. I sense impending changes.
ladwar Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 498	Posted - 2013.05.26 02:26:00 - [7] - Quote well I do agree and they should be related to what the skill does.
Buster Friently Rosen Association 533	Posted - 2013.05.26 02:31:00 - [8] - Quote J Falcs wrote: I was surprised to see the number of skills that only unlocked items with Uprising's deployment. However, I was happy to see that many skills improved the efficacy of modules. In my opinion, that was a good first step from making mercs too powerful through a saturation of always-on passives. I am an infantry player, so this post will highlight infantry issues (I would appreciate a vehicle specialist doing the same). Dropsuit Command Skills Dropsuit Command - 1% increase in speed per level All Basic Dropsuit Skills- The first bonus of a specialist suit should be tied to the level of the basic suit skill level, e.g., Minmatar Logistics first bonus of +1 Innate Armor Repair is contingent on the level of the Minmatar Medium Dropsuit Level. All Basic Dropsuit Skills (part 2) - The basic suits should receive one bonus depending on the level of the basic dropsuit skill. It should be different from the specialist bonus. Dropsuit Command Dropsuit Upgrades - 1% increase to armor and shields per level Nanocircuitry - 3% increase to nanohive clusters per level; 2% increase to nanite injector efficacy per level Drop Uplink Deployment - -1% additive bonus to spawn time Repair Tool Operation - 3% increase to repair tool efficacy (or range) Active Scanner - 2% decrease to cooldown Weaponry Weaponry - 2% bonus to reload speed OR -1% CPU/PG weapon fitting requirement Grenadier - +1 grenade per level , seriously though, I cannot think of anything outside of -1% CPU fitting requirement Demolitions - +4% increase in blast radius Obviously, feel free to add suggestions, tweaks, etc. I think I covered all of the infantry skills without any innate bonus outside of only unlocking skills. If I missed one, please let me know. CCP. look here. We do need all of the skills to do something other than unlock. It doesn't have to be these things, but there should be no skill that only unlocks. This will negate a major criticism of the Dust skill system. Also, it's just a good idea.
Sontie Ill Omens EoN. 412	Posted - 2013.05.26 02:32:00 - [9] - Quote agreed, making a high sp militia fit better than a new clone.
RedBleach LeSanglant Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 262	Posted - 2013.05.26 04:12:00 - [10] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: I thought that this was one of the things CCP was promoting, that all skills needed to have some sort of bonus related to them like they do in EVE. I sense impending changes. I really thought I remember them saying this too. I was quite disappointed when I saw that they were not. Perhaps this will be included in part of their skill tree updates.

J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 58	Posted - 2013.05.26 14:55:00 - [11] - Quote If someone could do the same for vehicles in a similar format, I'd really appreciate it. I have 0 experience with vehicle fittings. As a logistics user, I am most interested in some sort of bonus to my equipment use. As a Minmatar Logistics, I sometimes do not have the luxury of using proto equipment (CPU/PG limitations), so I have little use of going all the way to level V on the equipment. But if I could make the ADV equipment more powerful, then that is a definite reason to skill further.
EXASTRA INVICTAS Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 35	Posted - 2013.05.26 15:30:00 - [12] - Quote Vehicle Command Vehicle Command - 1% increase in speed per level (Race) LAV- 2% to vehicle stability per level (Race) HAV - 1% to large turret tracking per level (Race) Dropship- 1% bonus to dropship agility per level Vehicle Upgrades Vehicle Upgrades - 1% increase to armor and shields per level Remote Armor Repair Systems - 2% reduction in powergrid need per level Vehicle Engineering- 3% bonus to vehicle powergrid per level (Doesn't have to be 5, CCP. Pleeeease fix this skill though) Vehicle Maneuvering - 1% bonus to vehicle acceleration per level Vehicle Turret Upgrades -3% reduction to Turret Upgrades CPU per level
J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 59	Posted - 2013.05.27 00:48:00 - [13] - Quote EXASTRA INVICTAS wrote: Vehicle Command Vehicle Command - 1% increase in speed per level (Race) LAV- 2% to vehicle stability per level (Race) HAV - 1% to large turret tracking per level (Race) Dropship- 1% bonus to dropship agility per level Vehicle Upgrades Vehicle Upgrades - 1% increase to armor and shields per level Remote Armor Repair Systems - 2% reduction in powergrid need per level Vehicle Engineering- 3% bonus to vehicle powergrid per level (Doesn't have to be 5, CCP. Pleeeease fix this skill though) Vehicle Maneuvering - 1% bonus to vehicle acceleration per level Vehicle Turret Upgrades -3% reduction to Turret Upgrades CPU per level Thank you, Exastra. Going to edit my original post.
J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 60	Posted - 2013.05.28 03:14:00 - [14] - Quote Bump for some new ideas.
Driftward Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 127	Posted - 2013.05.28 03:18:00 - [15] - Quote This has to be one off the most sensible posts that I've seen in a long while. I hope a dev takes some interest while its at the front of the page.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 413	Posted - 2013.05.28 03:51:00 - [16] - Quote Small matter perhaps, but this highlights another problem in game - many of the skills that are only skills aren't worth your time. I'm referring of course to the reload/ammo/optimization skills. Many of them provide extremely marginal to non-existent benefits (like the PG on the Flaylock) due to keeping the fixed percentages pre-uprising. Many of the skills are effectively without purpose, but extremely high cost at the same time. It might behoove them to look at some of those while adding other skills (as there's already some skills that are just skills gathering dust).
Buster Friently Rosen Association 550	Posted - 2013.05.29 05:37:00 - [17] - Quote Bump.
Cosgar's Alt Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 1	Posted - 2013.05.29 05:40:00 - [18] - Quote We just got out of this problem in Chrome. SP used to be an "I win button" because you could easily stack passives and become overpowered. I like the idea of more passives, but in the direction of Uprising, where the skills are tied to their respective suits, modules, equipment, and weapons.
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 182	Posted - 2013.05.29 06:58:00 - [19] - Quote Cosgar's Alt wrote: We just got out of this problem in Chrome. SP used to be an "I win button" because you could easily stack passives and become overpowered. I like the idea of more passives, but in the direction of Uprising, where the skills are tied to their respective suits, modules, equipment, and weapons. Well said. Adding efficacy bonuses for modules has been a great move on CCP's part. I think skill bonuses more in line of reducing CPU/PG requirements are always helpful, or things like scan range or extra nanites in nanohives. I would like to see nanocircuitry give a capacity bonus of the hives instead of clusters, so you could carry an extra hive or two.
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 182	Posted - 2013.05.29 12:50:00 - [20] - Quote How about this? Maybe some skills could offer benefits to WP accrual? Maybe have these as a proficiency skill?

J Falcs Bojo's School of the Trades 66	Posted - 2013.05.29 13:03:00 - [21] - Quote Hi all, thanks for the feedback. I am definitely for efficacy bonuses, but some of the skills are so generalized that they require a general bonus. For those skills, I kept them at 1 - 2% bonus. As for WP accrual, do you mean bonus WP accrual or a benefit triggered after x amount of WP accrual based on the proficiency skill?
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 781	Posted - 2013.05.29 13:45:00 - [22] - Quote No, all skills do not need efficacy bonuses, that will just add lots of bonuses (harder to balance, etc) with no real point.
RINON114 B.S.A.A. General Tso's Alliance 182	Posted - 2013.05.30 05:27:00 - [23] - Quote J Falcs wrote: Hi all, thanks for the feedback. I am definitely for efficacy bonuses, but some of the skills are so generalized that they require a general bonus. For those skills, I kept them at 1 - 2% bonus. As for WP accrual, do you mean bonus WP accrual or a benefit triggered after x amount of WP accrual based on the proficiency skill? A bonus based on what you already get, so if the skill gave +10% at level 5, then a revive would give 66 points instead of 60.


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