Did you even read my post or did you just see the word "sniper" and assume I was talking about snipers?

lol

I'm talking about how the assault rifle has the accuracy of the sniper rifle, and should have some more spread so that you can't hit players with dead-on accuracy from halfway across the map.



Like I said in my post, the range of the Assualt rifle has nothing to do with this. The problem I'm referring to here is spread and the lack of it. I don't care if I get hit with a couple of bullets from halfway across the map, but not every single one in the enemies clip because they are so precise.



Do I seriously have to repeat myself 3 times? I'm talking about spread. SPREAD. The range should actually be longer, but that's just me.

Exactly, because the weapon excels in all areas (instead of being just "good"), but isn't amazing in anything and has hardly no disadvantages of using it.

Laser rifle is bad at close range
HMG is bad at long range
Mass driver deals splash damage to yourself and is weak vs shields
Snipers are restricted to long range
but the AR? It just doesn't specialize.

All good and no bad.

Exactly, because the weapon excels in all areas (instead of being just "good"), but isn't amazing in anything and has hardly no disadvantages of using it.

Laser rifle is bad at close range
HMG is bad at long range
Mass driver deals splash damage to yourself and is weak vs shields
Snipers are restricted to long range
but the AR? It just doesn't specialize.

All good and no bad.

But really, what did you expect making a thread about why the AR is broken? A lot of AR users cling to their AR like a bad rendition of 'Full Metal Jacket'.

Most people using AR's don't fire them fully automatic. outside of hipfire scenarios. Most people fire AR's at range on semi. This dramatically improves accuracy. Crouch and doing this makes the hipfire crosshair barely even move, so with ADS it's probably even more. Never mind that a lot of people probably have AR skills making them even better. However, AR's still lose to basically every other gun in it's own conditions. Shotguns and SMG's beat it close, and LR's beat it at range, and it's only within that strange limbo between SMG's and LR's that AR's are the primo choice. Sniper rifles in theory out range LR's but there's no real reason for them in the game, in terms of range.

But every gun in this game is pretty much hitscan, so so everything is accurate as balls. Especially with careful, accurate firing.

SMG 22 versus 31 AR and WIN! for AR.

EDIT: This thread is about the inexsistant spread of the AR while aiming down sights. Not about the range of the AR, not about how it compares to snipers, and not about sniper rifles.
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What other game allows you to snipe players across the map with a fully automatic assault rifle simply by aiming down the sights without a scope?

Snipers have to crouch and sit still before they are able to get that precision, so why does the AR have this advantage even when strafing back and forth while aiming? I mean, the unsteadiness from movement should be enough to give the AR some inaccuracy.

The damage is fine, the range is fine, the kick/recoil kind of works, but the spread/dispersion only works properly in this game when you are hip-firing. Aiming down the scope lets you hit the exact mark almost every time even at it's max range, which doesn't make sense.
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Am I the only one that sees this? Because EVERY time that I see a thread about the AR it's about the recoil, or the damage, or the range, or some other factor that is working as an assault rifle should work.

Yet the lack of spread/dispersion/inaccuracy is never mentioned.

I mean, every other game has this in some form or another. Halo doesn't let you scope with the regular AR, Resistance has it, Most other shooters don't have big enough maps for this to be a problem, and even then trying to snipe with a weapon without a scope is almost impossible.

Except that you're ignoring the fire rates, in which the SMG has an advantage, and the fact that the SMG is more CQC-friendly and also less impacted by lag because of the spread. It's the same principle that makes a Shotgun more effective in CQC, but taken to less of an extreme.

Fire rates?
At the SMG optimal 25 to 30 m versus an AR:

Most SMG rounds are going to MISS
Most AR rounds are going to HIT

DEAD SMG user.

Fire rates?
At the SMG optimal 25 to 30 m versus an AR:

Most SMG rounds are going to MISS
Most AR rounds are going to HIT

DEAD SMG user.

EDIT: This thread is about the inexsistant spread of the AR while aiming down sights. Not about the range of the AR, not about how it compares to snipers, and not about sniper rifles.
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What other game allows you to snipe players across the map with a fully automatic assault rifle simply by aiming down the sights without a scope?

Snipers have to crouch and sit still before they are able to get that precision, so why does the AR have this advantage even when strafing back and forth while aiming? I mean, the unsteadiness from movement should be enough to give the AR some inaccuracy.

The damage is fine, the range is fine, the kick/recoil kind of works, but the spread/dispersion only works properly in this game when you are hip-firing. Aiming down the scope lets you hit the exact mark almost every time even at it's max range, which doesn't make sense.
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Am I the only one that sees this? Because EVERY time that I see a thread about the AR it's about the recoil, or the damage, or the range, or some other factor that is working as an assault rifle should work.

Yet the lack of spread/dispersion/inaccuracy is never mentioned.

I mean, every other game has this in some form or another. Halo doesn't let you scope with the regular AR, Resistance has it, Most other shooters don't have big enough maps for this to be a problem, and even then trying to snipe with a weapon without a scope is almost impossible.

Assuming equal skill at aim and no skill at evading fire from either player.

Also assuming no ADS with either. I can land consistent hits with intermittent headshots at 20 - 25m with my SMG.

If you're in actual CQC - which, as mentioned, is where the SMG does best - then you're NOT going to have an advantage trying to hit targets with the AR, and the SMG will damage you faster than your AR damages them. I can use a Toxin SMG on a Dragonfly suit with no damage mods and gun down AR Assaults using Prototype weapons faster than they can kill me. In the right scenario, SMG wins. If you're using it wrong, AR slaughters it.

Moral of story: lrn2SMG

Because 75 percent of the population of New Eden uses the AR.

There was already a consensus on other thread that the Duvolle outdps (is that a word?) a proto SMG at CQC unless you use a flux, not by much (around 0.13 DPS) so... nay. There is a reason why I forced myself away from ARs, since I wanted an honest KDR for myself, but yeah, I tried the exile with just Weaponry V and AR Ops at 1, blitzed from a 24-4 to 32-1. And I know my smg, used them 90% of the time last build. I always got easy headshots on people and I couldnt lay my finger on why, and well OP makes sense. If you can hold your ground on CQC with an SMG vs a same tier AR, says more about the player and less bout the gun, more power to you, but your point its skewed. Also lets face it, a decent AR player its gonna ADS at least 45% of the time

Because 75 percent of the population of New Eden uses the AR.

CQC is about EVASION more than straight damage, and the SMG is more effective as a counter to enemy evasive actions than the AR. I frequently avoid the majority of damage being dealt by an AR user - even one with Proto gear - until they run out of ammo and have to SWITCH TO THEIR SMG TO KILL ME.

Also, you're not accounting for the fact that the SMG is still a Sidearm, you can bring Shotgun or AR with your SMG. You can't bring two ARs or a Shotgun/AR combo (except on the Black Eagle suit). That in itself is an advantage to the SMG.


And how many non-Logi AR fittings have SMGs vs. Scrambler Pistols as their SIdearm, do you suppose?

Also comes into "why do you need to evade in CQC?" the answer would be "If I dont, that AR its gonna outdps me" Also consider that some AR have huge clip sizes, fairly close to some smgs.

Regardless of weapons, two SMGs, two ARs, damage modded GEK-38 vs. no-mods on an Exile, if you're in CQC and only one of you is playing the evasion game, that player will win more often than not.

If an enemy's SMG deals more damage to me in 0.5 seconds of CQC than their AR dealt in the preceding 2 seconds, I'm inclined to believe the SMG is the better CQC weapon.

Again you are harkoning back into skills an personal tactics, of course if one evades on CQC and the other doesnt there is a easy winner, thats not the point. What happens if neither evade or both evade at a similar level?

it comes down to gun vs gun, and the AR wins, either by range or dps alone, when it should be a toss up (range OR dps), I could understand that the AR is the only gun with a "vs shield" bonus, I could understand that the gun can do well in all ranges, hell even if it didnt had spread I could live with that... but not all 3 simultaneously.

In CQC, when both are evading, the SMG has a better chance of hitting with each shot, and each miss is less of a reduciton in dps because of the nature of how CQC happens.


If you're looking at POTENTIAL DPS, then the AR wins, if you're looking at practical scenarios with both players evading, the SMG will put out damage faster than the AR.