I'm sort of surprised by the lack of response from corps who are hardcore PvP. I would think that being forced to be at least somewhat involved in PvE would warrant SOME sort of response. I'd think the Imps would have the most to say since they dis so many other corps as only good for PvE. Them having to either do PvE themselves or have to work with a corp that does should give them SOME pause.

Drone infestations... that means they are a danger to something... does that mean our districts will have to have members dedicated to pest control to prevent our defenses from being weakened? Because that would mean every corp would either have to maintain a certain level of PvE players, or hire other corps to come in and handle pest control.... which, if the proper mechanics were implemented, could also be used to ambush them when they are not paying attention and sabotage their operations. Possibly set bombs or traps to damage their structures, installations, vehicles, etc. during the next attack on that district to aid the attackers... that would be WICKED! Total subterfuge!

Imagine: Dust corp works as pest control for the universe, has great reputation, spies sneak in, sabotage target corp during pest extermination. Awesomeness ensues!

So, will PvE effect PvP CCP?

Hi all,

Moved this topic to feedback/request.

Thanks

its monday afternoon here...u want a response after 1 hour...give it time lol or bump it later

Moving this back

I personally am a large supporter of PvPvE in DUST, and I hope we come to see many game types in the future evolve around this concept. Having just plain PvE is important too, but having that mix would just be a crazy dynamic, so long as it wasn't too easy to take over drones (I'm thinking some kind of primary drone or structure that controls X amount of drones, can be hacked out of neutral or away from enemies).

Granted, I imagine the technical side of something like that must be a monster of a challenge, but as far as visions go, I personally would enjoy that very much. It would really help bring out the MMO feeling, and would make everything feel a lot more alive. This could also play very heavily into salvage, allowing us to physically loot destroyed drones for rare loot wanted in both Dust and Eve for top end manufacturing.

I can't really speak for the Eve side, but as far as down here on the ground, it would be great to sift through cool, sell-able , loot that I myself took the time to pull out of a drone wreck.

They will probably be the things you fight in unclaimed districts. Since there's no one to control them, they go rouge, and attack everything.

Make sense, no?

Yeah, but that would also mean that there is potentially a finite amount of PvE to be had. I think that down the road that could become an issue.

Edit: for those of you who read this later, finite means limited. It's the base word of infinite, which means unlimited. Just to avoid confusion.

I'm sure everyone on the forums is smart enough to know what finite means.... Right....right? Please say yes

On a side note: I love this possibility of being able to sabotage corps via PvE. Really, any form of being able to sabotage would be a cool idea.

Though it's unlikely that PvE will effect PvP, I would still like to see a serious connection between the two. There are too many games where PvE does not assist you in PvP in a meaningful way. Looking forward to an answer to whether or not they will effect each other in a FW or PC manner.

Planetary conquest is essentially slay

As such I'd imagine drones could inhibit a district from making clones until exterminated

That weakens defenses and destroys profit

Is that not essentially the core of pvp? Clones and profit?

As such I see it effecting pvp completely
At the same time it'll kil afk farming corps ;-)

Yeah, but that would also mean that there is potentially a finite amount of PvE to be had. I think that down the road that could become an issue.

Edit: for those of you who read this later, finite means limited. It's the base word of infinite, which means unlimited. Just to avoid confusion.

Planetary conquest is essentially slay

As such I'd imagine drones could inhibit a district from making clones until exterminated

That weakens defenses and destroys profit

Is that not essentially the core of pvp? Clones and profit?

As such I see it effecting pvp completely
At the same time it'll kil afk farming corps ;-)

This is exactly what I was thinking when I came into the thread.

Almost disappointed that someone beat me to it... almost. +1

I was thinking of it as every planet that has no previous occupants would have to be cleared via PvE before you could build in that district. Then, you would have to keep up with the pest control or the drones could eventually destroy things you build in a district, thereby weakening your defenses if you were to be attacked. I also think it would be cool if you attack a poorly kept district if the drones would help the attackers during battle, but that's most likely WAY further off that simple drone implementation into the district system.

Maybe not constant pest control, but something like random drone attacks.

Recently a new type of drone lairs have appeared, commonly called hulk lairs. It seems that when rogue drones manage to capture suitably large vessels, like large cargo freighters or cruisers, they donGÇÖt dismantle the ship completely, but instead start to incorporate the lair into the shipGÇÖs hull. Eventually these hulks break free from the drone lair that captured them and start drifting out of the asteroid field, sometimes even under their own accord; the propulsion system still being intact. Hulks like these have been found drifting in deep space, far from human settlements, but occasionally they drift close by settled planets or through space routes. This can cause severe problems for the populace and space farers, often requiring heavy military involvement to get rid of.

Source:
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rogue_Drones

Are you serious? If CCP did this, it would force PvPers to play PvE. I thought Eve was all about the freedom to play how you wanted to?

I know everyone is talking about rogue drones, but what about factional ones? Like hobgoblins in EvE? If we could build them, and then send them to attack a district, or protect one of your own while you are offline, it would begin to blur the lines between PvE & PvP.
Drone production however might require the "Industry" skill... but that's another topic.

Sort of. You can never be completely free from the constraints of the game you're playing. Even if I just handed you a blank page, you'd still have to use the words of some language or another to write a story. And the fact is, the only way to keep PvE out of PvP is to keep PvP out of PvE, effectively making them two separate games. And EVE never takes PvP entirely out of PvE. Nor does it really take PvE out of PvP completely: if you want to be competitive in PvP, you need the resources produced and developed by people who play PvE.

With the ideas being discussed here, if you don't want to PvE, you don't have to. Contract it out to someone else. Have people in your corp who like to PvE. In fact, if all you want to do is PvP, why are you even involved in planetary conquest? And if you're involved in planetary conquest, you already have non-PvP things to consider: district and clone management.

Bottom line: These ideas won't force anybody to do anything. They'll add interesting dimensions to planetary conquest and management. If all you really want to do is PvP, nobody's making you do anything else.

If you had drones protecting a district, would you still take the district if you won? That could lead to PvE being able to be used to capture districts. Will the hardcore PvPers be able to cope with that?

If there are similar limitations to what you have for clone attacks (transport attrition, limited numbers) and if the AI is smarter than RDVs, but still stupid, I can't see competent players losing against a PvE attack. Rogue Drones will be a horde mode equivalent, meaning that the threat is in numbers, not individual capabilities. If you're not significantly outnumbered, and you still lose, that's probably not the game's fault. Of course, sending in a wave of 200 drones to invade a district with only 25 clones left could be interesting...

i think that would be awesome. It would mean more incentive to just hop on whenever even if there isnt enough to run full squads for corp battle stuff . You could just hop on and kill some drones and protect one of your distrcits. +1

I can't imagine they'd allow PVE to take over a district. There's not a sufficient risk/reward balance, for one thing. PVE might influence PVP, but it shouldn't replace it.

I'm sort of surprised by the lack of response from corps who are hardcore PvP. I would think that being forced to be at least somewhat involved in PvE would warrant SOME sort of response. I'd think the Imps would have the most to say since they dis so many other corps as only good for PvE. Them having to either do PvE themselves or have to work with a corp that does should give them SOME pause.

we're hardcore PvP
doesnt mean we arent lookin to play the hell out of PvE as well
tbh pubs are fuckin boring and sometimes u just want a stress free way to gain ur SP and have some fun

i like ur idea somewhat of PvE affecting PC, FW etc
i see it a bit diff
if u leave ur district unattended then the income/resources u get from owning districts will start to degrade so this somewhat makes ur income more "active" than just totally passive

whats u guys thoughts on having to keep maintainence on ur districts?

I don't know about PvE, it sounds like a cool idea, but then again when someone in Eve says, hey you can earn millions an hour by MINING, doesn't that sound great?! No, no it doesnt. (Shoots guy who suggested it)

I can see doing Rogue Drones as training ops,

I could see doing some PvE opps to maybe try to get awesome Faction Equipments or BPCs (Not BPOs). But then again it reminds me of Raiding in WoW and that makes me depressed. So I gotta equip my faction gear to get enough DPS etc to join the PvE dungeon. Better grind some more DKP. This sounds like Incursions Drama and Wow fail (Shoots the miner guy who just respawned into a clone again)

In all honesty, I don't know how to mix any PvE into the PvP where I would really find myself wanting to participate in it. If I had a choice between fighting a corp over a planet or a bunch of mobs.. (Shoots the miner again so he runs out of clones and I win the round) I think you know my choice.

Whats missing is crosslinking of game modes.

I will post about a game mode about marketplace, infantry, vehicles, drones, PvP, PvE, Factional Warfare and District Control in Feedback.

Going to consider the details a few days then post about it in Feedback.

Also going to consider a carebear area in those modes.

Thanks.

I was thinking what if EvE ships started to get infested just by flying through space. A rogue drone spour would attach to there ship and they would get infested. They could then commission us dustiers to come and clear there ship for them. They could set there price or we could send in bids. This way you could sustain a PvE corp that would be kinda like the janitors of space, but since there would be tons of pilots needing the service you could make a decent buck off of it. This would also connect Dust and EvE even more.

I think PvE will help the noobs earn ISK so they can buy better guns. That way new players can stand a chance against older players. Plus PvE can help train the noobs and help them get better.

Moved back to General discussion. I'll guard this thread in order to avoid further movements ;) If something happen and I'm not in, please poke us a [email protected] and explain the situation.
Sorry again for the shaking.

Now THAT is an idea. Using drones as a weapon for finishing off weakened clones to save yourself resources... I'm wondering how this horde mode will be set up though. Will it be like most horde modes and have enemies come in in waves? Because in reality, that doesn't make much sense. Especially not if you are trying to wipe out the remnants of a district. You would send in all your drones at once.

I've had the same thoughts on degrading income when you don't perform regular maintenance.

My line of thought was centered around having the PvE BE the maintenance.

Drones randomly start building a presence in a district, and if you do not keep tabs on it, they can over run it.

This would decrease your districts ability to produce clones, it could steadily decrease your clone stock in a district, it could decrease your storage capacity for clones, it could even destroy structures you've built in your districts.

It would require corporations to be concerned with more than just acquiring new territory. Depending on how large they are and how well they will be able to maintain their property, it could limit how far some corporations could expand their empires.

Sounds fun, right?

For Rogue Drones, the idea would probably be a wave-based horde mode. We don't know anything for sure except that it's PvE and it's coming, but that's a reasonable assumption, and for AI that's gone off the rails and is attacking everything in sight, it makes sense for them to be spread out and to converge from various distances, thus effectively explaining the wave-based approach.

For player-deployed drones, it would make sense to have some kind of limitation on active drones in a district. You could explain that a Drone MCC can only maintain a limited number of drones active at a time, with whatever lore-based "to reduce the risk of them going rogue" excuse you want to come up with. Maybe you could have them show up at double the rate of the player clone count - so with 16 vs. 16 battles, a battle would allow for 32 drones to be active per side in battle.

And the idea wasn't as a replacement for PvP, but a supplement to it. The drones SHOULDN'T be a reliable method of offense, so unless you have practically unlimited resources, you're generally going to be better off attacking with clones instead.

Like I said, a 200 vs. 25 battle might hurt, but it shouldn't be a "proper" attack.

Also, because you're not sending any CLONES in a drone attack, wiping out the population wouldn't capture the district for you, it would merely empty it, meaning that the district becomes open for someone to claim (potentially being taken back immediately by the people who just lost it if they're fast enough).

Now THAT is an idea. Using drones as a weapon for finishing off weakened clones to save yourself resources... I'm wondering how this horde mode will be set up though. Will it be like most horde modes and have enemies come in in waves? Because in reality, that doesn't make much sense. Especially not if you are trying to wipe out the remnants of a district. You would send in all your drones at once.

Drone infestations... that means they are a danger to something... does that mean our districts will have to have members dedicated to pest control to prevent our defenses from being weakened? Because that would mean every corp would either have to maintain a certain level of PvE players, or hire other corps to come in and handle pest control.... which, if the proper mechanics were implemented, could also be used to ambush them when they are not paying attention and sabotage their operations. Possibly set bombs or traps to damage their structures, installations, vehicles, etc. during the next attack on that district to aid the attackers... that would be WICKED! Total subterfuge!

Imagine: Dust corp works as pest control for the universe, has great reputation, spies sneak in, sabotage target corp during pest extermination. Awesomeness ensues!

So, will PvE effect PvP CCP?

Another Idea would be using drones to tie up enemy resources, i.e. send drones to attack one district while clones attack another. Enemy clones can lolstomp the drones but while they're doing that you don't have to worry about them.

Would horde mode give you a clone count, or would it be a survival mode?

Will PvE have an effect on PvP? That is a very broad question. I mean, technically simply generating ISK from a PvE fight can have an effect on PvP because you have more ISK to spend on stuff... so... yea.

Being honest though, we don't know. There is a lot of discussion how the two play off of each other but I don't think we are ready to talk about that yet. Sorry.

Moved back to General discussion. I'll guard this thread in order to avoid further movements ;) If something happen and I'm not in, please poke us a [email protected] and explain the situation.
Sorry again for the shaking.

cause i read about this not getting any attention

bump

Are you serious? If CCP did this, it would force PvPers to play PvE. I thought Eve was all about the freedom to play how you wanted to?

Ha ha he, I appreciate the link and yeah I actually got to read you through a little while ago

Good stuff here and I've added you up on the PvE Database (really just a consolidation of all the PvE posts). If you see anything else please let me know. I search around every now and then ^^

The Home of PvE Discussion:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=49714&find=unread

As for content, absolutely agree that making allowing for a certain amount of attrition for planetary interaction so as to merit a default rate of Dust 514 contracting. However, in my mind this was connected to a much larger framework of the theoretical Eve Online "Colonies" that allow Alliances to establish actual Alliance zoning and build upon the current functions of PI in Eve. As a result, you would be faced with a larger colonial presence/NPC colonist population vs. higher chance of being bothered by NPC bad-guys (Pirates, Drones, Sleepers, Factions...etc.). We even considered the contract to fix a damaged reactor or rescue refugees from an invasion in there. In any case, running on of these colonies would require constant Dust 514 Merc-support and the solution would be to essentially allow a Mercenary Barracks (think of an embassy) and allow for a Merc-Corporation to establish residence and Infastructure for clones on your Alliances Colony.

Doing this would proportionately decrease your overall PvE "bad-events", but make PvE an optional activity for the Mercs stationed at the local barracks. As such, the Eve Colony can continue to grow so long as it continues to allow for more Merc support. While this may not be something entirely neccessary from either game (Dust mercs should be able to establish their own territory/ Eve Colonies should be allowed to grow independently), they would be both be taking substantial negatives in progress and ISK to do so (Eve Players would need to hire NPC's/ Dust Mercs would need to buy resources from market instead of mining them alongside Eve Colonies)

Colonies aside however, for the moment I believe PvE should be primarily focused on exploration and anomolies. This allows for both specialization towards PvE as well as what was stated earlier as PvPvE or simply put a PvE match that could be escalated by another group of Players into a PvP match at any given moment. I have loved this idea for a long time and while I think for the most part I'd like to see general PvE with high loot and salvage rewards for those who can find it, I'd like to allow for PvE to extend into Low-Sec Space. By bringing it out to low-sec, you would provide and boost in difficulty not only the Mission AI, but an additional layer of risk by allowing for a "back door" of sorts and making it completely possible to have PvP hunters that have already scanned down the site and are now laying in wait to ambush exploring mercs. Of course this makes it essential to move quickly and get really good at "Shoot and boogie" tactics, but it also adds a large wealth of reward-for-risk and could lead to some wonderfully high-paced conflicts of interest.

In any case, feel free to post anything you like back at the PvE Home and here's a toast: "To the future of PvE"

I personally am a large supporter of PvPvE in DUST, and I hope we come to see many game types in the future evolve around this concept. Having just plain PvE is important too, but having that mix would just be a crazy dynamic, so long as it wasn't too easy to take over drones (I'm thinking some kind of primary drone or structure that controls X amount of drones, can be hacked out of neutral or away from enemies).

Granted, I imagine the technical side of something like that must be a monster of a challenge, but as far as visions go, I personally would enjoy that very much. It would really help bring out the MMO feeling, and would make everything feel a lot more alive. This could also play very heavily into salvage, allowing us to physically loot destroyed drones for rare loot wanted in both Dust and Eve for top end manufacturing.

I can't really speak for the Eve side, but as far as down here on the ground, it would be great to sift through cool, sell-able , loot that I myself took the time to pull out of a drone wreck.

Quite an act of necromancy, this.