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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Volgair
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
207
|
Posted - 2013.03.07 23:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
I will start by saying I am nothing short of a CCP fan boy, however the current marketing practices has me more then a little concerned. Dust is good, its certainly better then 90% of the other games in this market. What separates Dust from every other product in the top 10% of the market is what the Dust DEV's and CCP have said will be. It is not yet at Peter Molyneux levels of exaggeration but not far off. Right now we are plagued by clumsy menus, broken mail system, server lag, video chug, sticky hills, limited and frankly overplayed game modes. The one that saddens me the most, granted the aforementioned are worse, but this is IMO. Only a small fraction of the games projected release content is available for play.
Now on to the reason i titled the thread the way I did, it's because I am seeing more and more dust related adverts. That's fine, I can get behind bringing more people to Dust, but not just yet. Dust is still a BETA, and a rough one at that. The people that have been here since last April know that. New players coming in from a random banner add are not generally so accepting of that idea, and are being enticed on some what a false pretense. I am of the opinion that CCP should save its advert money for a more polished product. The more people that see this game as it is, opens a potential for future player's that are unwilling to give the game a second chance. Not to mention the general community opinion degradation, I want nothing more then Dust to succeed, but it seems like the marketing team is putting the cart before the horse. |
Sloth9230
Reaper Galactic
335
|
Posted - 2013.03.07 23:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
Volgair wrote: I am of the opinion that CCP should save its advert money for a more polished product. The more people that see this game as it is, opens a potential for future player's that are unwilling to give the game a second chance. QFT |
Altina McAlterson
TRUE TEA BAGGERS
382
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 00:07:00 -
[3] - Quote
I've wondered about his myself, actually. And I have to think that someone, somewhere is aware of that. I really can't believe that anyone on the DEV team would look at the game as it is currently and think it was ready for distribution. I assume they have some sort of plan or have a reason to believe that people will come back or something. That being said there is the lingering fear in the back of my mind that the open BETA is being pushed for the sole purpose of generating AUR sales.
I'm not an idiot and have a better understanding of business than most people so I know AUR sales were always a consideration. I'm referring to forcing the product before it is ready just for a quick influx of cash and then abandoning it or releasing a half-assed version just to satisfy contractual obligations before abandoning as a failure. Not saying that this is what they're doing, just a fear I have.
It could also be merely trying to make as much as possible before releasing a free to play game with the hope that the finished product will attract enough new people to compensate for those lost during the BETA. Also remember they have the EVE player base that will also be purchasing AUR to sell the items to mercs. AUR in EVE has been more or less a failure so far. And it also generated some really, really hilarious protests. |
Firestorm Zulu
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
166
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 00:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
This thread pleases me |
DUST Fiend
Immobile Infantry
1945
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Posted - 2013.03.08 00:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
GM Vegas deleted my post in another thread where I mentioned how absurd this advertising blitzkrieg is (to be fair, it was off topic lol), but I feel exactly the same thing.
I want to love this game and be a CCP fanboy but watching month after month go by with no changes as I'm being bombarded with "deals" for a product that is X amount of months (years?) away from actual release. It just puts a very bad taste in my mouth, and reminds me a whole lot of the "Greed is Good" scandal that got EVE players all up in arms to begin with.
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Winscar Shinobi
Better Hide R Die
74
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Posted - 2013.03.08 01:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Yeah I love having to tell my friends how great does is gonna be and then they play it, says its crap and to bring them back when all the stuff they read about (that got them interested in the game) is actually there. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1215
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 02:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
The consequences of being launched. The focus moves to marketing over content or balance. |
Skihids
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
1002
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 02:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
I get the same feeling.
It's a beta, a real beta, but it's being marketed as if it were a released product.
The discontinuity is palpable.
Every time I see another general audience ad or a special sale I have to work harder to remind myself that this isn't a real game yet and it's ok to have all these broken and missing parts.
And I've been here for nine months. The new guys don't have that experience as a counterweight. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
3029
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 03:01:00 -
[9] - Quote
Would like to note that I don't see any dust 514 advertisments on any website on a computer that had its cookies scrubbed and one I havent been to a dust 514 website before.
Not sure what advertising algorithms google uses to advert dust or eve but once I do they become overwhelming majority of the side ads.
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Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1216
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 03:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Would like to note that I don't see any dust 514 advertisments on any website on a computer that had its cookies scrubbed and one I havent been to a dust 514 website before.
Not sure what advertising algorithms google uses to advert dust or eve but once I do they become overwhelming majority of the side ads.
Then their advert strategy is even dumber, focusing on people already interested. |
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Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
3029
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 03:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Would like to note that I don't see any dust 514 advertisments on any website on a computer that had its cookies scrubbed and one I havent been to a dust 514 website before.
Not sure what advertising algorithms google uses to advert dust or eve but once I do they become overwhelming majority of the side ads.
Then their advert strategy is even dumber, focusing on people already interested.
That's google's or ad sense's fault mostly though....
Here let me google up tomb raider and see how often those ads pop up. |
Firestorm Zulu
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
166
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 04:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:The consequences of being launched. The focus moves to marketing over content or balance. who are you kidding? the focus of this game has never been content or balance lol |
Firestorm Zulu
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
166
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 04:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
Skihids wrote:I get the same feeling.
It's a beta, a real beta, but it's being marketed as if it were a released product.
The discontinuity is palpable.
Every time I see another general audience ad or a special sale I have to work harder to remind myself that this isn't a real game yet and it's ok to have all these broken and missing parts.
And I've been here for nine months. The new guys don't have that experience as a counterweight. NEWS FLASH: ITS NOT A REAL BETA
I have yet to see a single fix or improvement that other game betas were not capable of, the only difference here is CCP is slow to the punch and the beta is in 1+ year of 'development' And by development I mean, they ran out of cash and are now milking the hardcore fanbois for every cent they can get out of them b/c they can't get a releasable version in time. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
3029
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 04:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
Firestorm Zulu wrote:Skihids wrote:I get the same feeling.
It's a beta, a real beta, but it's being marketed as if it were a released product.
The discontinuity is palpable.
Every time I see another general audience ad or a special sale I have to work harder to remind myself that this isn't a real game yet and it's ok to have all these broken and missing parts.
And I've been here for nine months. The new guys don't have that experience as a counterweight. NEWS FLASH: ITS NOT A REAL BETA I have yet to see a single fix or improvement that other game betas were not capable of, the only difference here is CCP is slow to the punch and the beta is in 1+ year of 'development' And by development I mean, they ran out of cash and are now milking the hardcore fanbois for every cent they can get out of them b/c they can't get a releasable version in time.
We had a patch this morning... |
Sylvana Nightwind
Expert Intervention Caldari State
89
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 04:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ill wait for the next build to judge. |
Dr Debo Galaxy
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
215
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 07:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
From what I understand this is more of another gateway into the New Eden Galaxy. So EvE is the money maker and this is just playing around money. As I understand it this game could lose money and they would still be ahead. Eve started out with a very small development team and has grown in members every year. I beleive even WOW can't say this. THey have a small investor base, so they are not pumping money out to them, and (from what I've heard) putting the money back into the company. Also they are in beta and selling products in a free game.
I was also thinking the other day this is a free to play game but you could look at it like a 50 cent a month game. It costs 50 cents for a UVT which I feel most people can justify buying, which will add up. Then you factor in all the people who want this vanity suit or that, this game could be very profitable for CCP. Also there adverts are good to help get mor people in, to then pay more money for a game that isn't even released yet. And as I said it basically has EvE money paying for it. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
3030
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 07:18:00 -
[17] - Quote
Wow lost a million subs last year. |
Syther Shadows
CowTek
32
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 07:31:00 -
[18] - Quote
ok i saw something that really disturbed me
"I really can't believe that anyone on the DEV team would look at the game as it is currently and think it was ready for distribution"
The game is FTP
JESUS why are people still complaining about the game like ccp said its done and like they know how long it takes to make a game and have a half decent beta test
it's not like there sitting around doing nothing here they are working and you keep pushing them
do you want there end product to be a crappy half finished piece of junk due to the fact you keep pushing them ? just drop the case or stop playing until the game has gone through its so called full release at the moment they shouldn't have to make any promises
or meet any demands you don't have to pay them so you are not necessarily a consumer but you are supporting them
you will have to wait and if ccp knows what there doing they will not rush anything for a (quick fix) without thinking things through
nerfing buffing changing stuff can and most of the time do cause other problems
in one game (nerf this gun it works to well against this unit type) the class that uses that game becomes less effective and then the unit type it countered becomes more powerful against a unit type not even considers before hand
a lot of planing and thinking is going into this game give it some time |
Volgair
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
214
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 09:36:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dr Debo Galaxy wrote:From what I understand this is more of another gateway into the New Eden Galaxy. So EvE is the money maker and this is just playing around money. As I understand it this game could lose money and they would still be ahead. Eve started out with a very small development team and has grown in members every year. I beleive even WOW can't say this. THey have a small investor base, so they are not pumping money out to them, and (from what I've heard) putting the money back into the company. Also they are in beta and selling products in a free game.
I was also thinking the other day this is a free to play game but you could look at it like a 50 cent a month game. It costs 50 cents for a UVT which I feel most people can justify buying, which will add up. Then you factor in all the people who want this vanity suit or that, this game could be very profitable for CCP. Also there adverts are good to help get mor people in, to then pay more money for a game that isn't even released yet. And as I said it basically has EvE money paying for it.
CCP has invested a lot into this project, but isn't betting the whole farm on it just yet. If the game fails they cut it off like a petulant limb and stick with what they know will work EVE. The slow integration plan and promise from last years fan fest is evidence of that fact. I do not wish for Dust to be severed and left on the operating room floor. The potential it has is to great, although painfully unrealized.
Having said that, what do you consider the last build? Swings of the nerf hammer barely count. For me it feels nothing has significantly changed since September when they removed skirmish 1.0 and added the LAR, that was 5 months ago. Far more has been lost since then, from the removal of the larger variety vehicle modules to active scanners. Its taken a year but my patience has become thread bare. I like the game, the genera, New Eden but this is becoming a let down and getting to the point where even I am having trouble telling myself "its a Beta, it'll get better." Now that i see CCP has started mass advertisement for people to come partake of a truthfully unfinished game, it's causing me to loose patience. |
Bald Crusader Two
Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 10:10:00 -
[20] - Quote
Volgair wrote:CCP has invested a lot into this project, but isn't betting the whole farm on it just yet. If the game fails they cut it off like a petulant limb and stick with what they know will work EVE. The slow integration plan and promise from last years fan fest is evidence of that fact. I do not wish for Dust to be severed and left on the operating room floor. The potential it has is to great, although painfully unrealized.
Having said that, what do you consider the last build? Swings of the nerf hammer barely count. For me it feels nothing has significantly changed since September when they removed skirmish 1.0 and added the LAR, that was 5 months ago. Far more has been lost since then, from the removal of the larger variety vehicle modules to active scanners. Its taken a year but my patience has become thread bare. I like the game, the genera, New Eden but this is becoming a let down and getting to the point where even I am having trouble telling myself "its a Beta, it'll get better." Now that i see CCP has started mass advertisement for people to come partake of a truthfully unfinished game, it's causing me to loose patience. Hard to know what is going on besides trying to build false hype until fanfest.
I've been involved in several betas, closed and open for several triple-A titles and what I see here beggars belief.
It seems to be all about promises of a future, P2W items and advertising that seems to want to cash in on promo spots on well known gaming sites as opposed to just delivering.
It's like watching the shopping network where the bored unemployed queue for crap.
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Bald Crusader Two
Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 10:13:00 -
[21] - Quote
Syther Shadows wrote:ok i saw something that really disturbed me
"I really can't believe that anyone on the DEV team would look at the game as it is currently and think it was ready for distribution"
The game is FTP
JESUS why are people still complaining about the game like ccp said its done and like they know how long it takes to make a game and have a half decent beta test
it's not like there sitting around doing nothing here they are working and you keep pushing them
do you want there end product to be a crappy half finished piece of junk due to the fact you keep pushing them ? just drop the case or stop playing until the game has gone through its so called full release at the moment they shouldn't have to make any promises
or meet any demands you don't have to pay them so you are not necessarily a consumer but you are supporting them
you will have to wait and if ccp knows what there doing they will not rush anything for a (quick fix) without thinking things through
nerfing buffing changing stuff can and most of the time do cause other problems
in one game (nerf this gun it works to well against this unit type) the class that uses that game becomes less effective and then the unit type it countered becomes more powerful against a unit type not even considers before hand
a lot of planing and thinking is going into this game give it some time It's like Cormac McCarthy was consumed by an idiot. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1216
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 11:16:00 -
[22] - Quote
Point by point, shall we?
Syther Shadows wrote:ok i saw something that really disturbed me
"I really can't believe that anyone on the DEV team would look at the game as it is currently and think it was ready for distribution"
The game is FTP
Price has no bearing on quality, merely value. In this case, only the people who paid nothing have "gotten what they paid for".
Quote: JESUS why are people still complaining about the game like ccp said its done and like they know how long it takes to make a game and have a half decent beta test
it's not like there sitting around doing nothing here they are working and you keep pushing them
Actually, it really does feel like they are doing nothing. This game has been in development since before 2009. Hell, there was a working demo that had features working that we are missing now (like deployable structures, aerofighters, building interiors, layered objectives, more complete warbarge, etc).
Quote:
do you want there end product to be a crappy half finished piece of junk due to the fact you keep pushing them ? just drop the case or stop playing until the game has gone through its so called full release at the moment they shouldn't have to make any promises
Except, commercially speaking, this *is* the end product. We are launched and it is sorely underwhelming. Furthermore, by finalizing sales, they do have to make promises or those items have no future value, eliminating their revenue stream. If this is really all we have to look forward to, people will stop buying boosters. They won't care about the crazy expensive BPO's because they'd never get that value out of them if the game-hour content is so low.
Quote:
or meet any demands you don't have to pay them so you are not necessarily a consumer but you are supporting them
you will have to wait and if ccp knows what there doing they will not rush anything for a (quick fix) without thinking things through
But we ARE customers now. CCP chose to change the relationship from testers to customers when the game launched in January. I am all for them taking there time to get it right, but then they shouldn't be looking to sell stuff yet. What if they decide to remove BPOs? They would have a huge financial burden through refunds, not even touching on the merc pack stuff. This means the bottom line is going to get in the way of simple fixes.
Quote:
nerfing buffing changing stuff can and most of the time do cause other problems
in one game (nerf this gun it works to well against this unit type) the class that uses that game becomes less effective and then the unit type it countered becomes more powerful against a unit type not even considers before hand
a lot of planing and thinking is going into this game give it some time
I notice both you and I are getting repetitive at this point. But I honestly am not concerned about "balance" until we have core features. DUST as a lobby shooter is boring and pointless. CCP hasn't even started implementing district ownership mechanics, revealed by FoxFour's open polling of the community. I LOVE his enthusiasm and willingness to ask us what we want, but it's sad that we've been testing for almost a year and just now are they getting around to the true core features. |
Altina McAlterson
TRUE TEA BAGGERS
386
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 11:28:00 -
[23] - Quote
Syther Shadows wrote:ok i saw something that really disturbed me
"I really can't believe that anyone on the DEV team would look at the game as it is currently and think it was ready for distribution"
The game is FTP
JESUS why are people still complaining about the game like ccp said its done and like they know how long it takes to make a game and have a half decent beta test
it's not like there sitting around doing nothing here they are working and you keep pushing them
do you want there end product to be a crappy half finished piece of junk due to the fact you keep pushing them ? just drop the case or stop playing until the game has gone through its so called full release at the moment they shouldn't have to make any promises
or meet any demands you don't have to pay them so you are not necessarily a consumer but you are supporting them
you will have to wait and if ccp knows what there doing they will not rush anything for a (quick fix) without thinking things through
nerfing buffing changing stuff can and most of the time do cause other problems
in one game (nerf this gun it works to well against this unit type) the class that uses that game becomes less effective and then the unit type it countered becomes more powerful against a unit type not even considers before hand
a lot of planing and thinking is going into this game give it some time
I honestly have no idea what you're trying to say with this. So I've got no response to it until it can be deciphered. |
Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION
14
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 11:35:00 -
[24] - Quote
I honestly think we're closer to release than CCP is letting us believe. When a company advertises like that they're leading up to the release of the product. The silence of CCP on the next build and release along with the advertising strategies may in fact be a silent affirmation that the release of Dust514 is coming forthwith.
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Dalton Smithe
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
56
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Posted - 2013.03.08 11:38:00 -
[25] - Quote
Firestorm Zulu wrote:Skihids wrote:I get the same feeling.
It's a beta, a real beta, but it's being marketed as if it were a released product.
The discontinuity is palpable.
Every time I see another general audience ad or a special sale I have to work harder to remind myself that this isn't a real game yet and it's ok to have all these broken and missing parts.
And I've been here for nine months. The new guys don't have that experience as a counterweight. NEWS FLASH: ITS NOT A REAL BETA I have yet to see a single fix or improvement that other game betas were not capable of, the only difference here is CCP is slow to the punch and the beta is in 1+ year of 'development' And by development I mean, they ran out of cash and are now milking the hardcore fanbois for every cent they can get out of them b/c they can't get a releasable version in time.
Just because the fixes aren't implemented right now, doesn't mean that they aren't working on it. NEWS FLASH: YOU ARE NOT A PROGRAMMER
Shut up and let them do their job. When it gets closer to release, they will implement fixes and what not to make the game closer to what they planned. This isn't a real beta? WTF, haven't you read the top of the screen when you brought the game up, IT SAYS IT RIGHT THERE.
Just because games like BF3 and CoD want to release their games and do fixes as they are played(with a "finished" product) Doesn't mean that is what CCP wants to focus on. Give them time...yes it has been a year in Beta..but good things come to those who wait.... |
Midas Man ll
Talon Strike Force LTD Sleepless Knights Alliance
48
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 12:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Dalton Smithe wrote: Just because games like BF3 and CoD want to release their games and do fixes as they are played(with a "finished" product) Doesn't mean that is what CCP wants to focus on. Give them time...yes it has been a year in Beta..but good things come to those who wait....
But we are waiting and waiting, and what do we get. Work around fixes to issues with a vague we will fix it properly when we know how.......We have a plan......we are a long way away from release we have some special treats SOONtm. Follow by the inevitable.
ROLL UP ROLL UP QUICK GET YA MERC PACK -ú7.99 SPECIAL OFFER WITH A BONUS SUIT IF YOU BUY TODAY. ROLL UP.
Its like CCP have become the back street trader of the gaming industry.
Play this awesome game with awesome feature.
Gets home and gets game installed, Where are all these awesome features???? and why are paid for items being forced down my throat ??? In an unfinished/unreleased game thats a long way away from release????
Sorry but this marketing ploy isnt going to help in the long run I see alot of console gamers giving up in seconds because they are not used to "Real" beta. I say real in inverted comma's because in every other real beta I have played, there has been a goodidea of where the game is going by open beta, most of the feature are implemented (this is actually what an open beta should be feature complete stress test/bug hunt) So we should actually still be in closed beta if this was a real development cycle. Plus updates are few and far between and most are simply adding the new items that are available "ROLL UP ROLL UP QUICK GET YA MERC PACK -ú7.99 SPECIAL OFFER WITH A BONUS SUIT IF YOU BUY TODAY. ROLL UP."
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Panther Alpha
Blueberries United
98
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 12:31:00 -
[27] - Quote
Is all a big tease ...You know what i think ? they game is ready, or nearly ready, and CCP is just building up some momentum to shock everyone.
All this ; "What this game is going to be like when is finish ?" is making people talk about Dust 514, and generating interest.
If that is the case.... is a "Good Strategy". But stop the teasing already CCP !!! the anticipation is killing me!!! |
steadyhand amarr
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
339
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 12:49:00 -
[28] - Quote
I think the blunt truth is. If ccp does not deliver promised content or game modes next build which has to happen by the end of the month most people will declare this game "flagshipped" and move on to more promising ventures like defence and desternty. On an unrealted note what's with the lasted shoots all starting with the letter D lol |
Midas Man ll
Talon Strike Force LTD Sleepless Knights Alliance
48
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 13:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
steadyhand amarr wrote: On an unrealted note what's with the lasted shoots all starting with the letter D lol
Standard progresion
A = Alien Vs Preditor 1999 B = Battlefield - 2002 C = COD - 2003 D = TBC - recently released
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Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
3031
|
Posted - 2013.03.08 13:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
Midas Man ll wrote:steadyhand amarr wrote: On an unrealted note what's with the lasted shoots all starting with the letter D lol Standard progresion A = Alien Vs Preditor 1999 B = Battlefield - 2002 C = COD - 2003 D = TBC - recently released
Duke Nukem? |
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