DUST Search - Balance issues ( The Story So Far / Episode 1 )

Panther Alpha wrote:

After 2 weeks playing Dust 514, here are my recommendations for better balance :

Heavies / HMG

1- Mobility : Heavies are build like a tank with legs, they should move as such. They shouldn't be allow to run, or jump. Their mobility should be seriously restricted ; Turning circle speed, should be the same as a mounted gun.

2- Aim : A powerful autocannon, should be slow to aim, and hard to control at full Rpm.

3- Damage : A HMG should be terrifying at close to medium range, and destroy everything in close quarters. But should have a high bullet spread, making them useless at medium to long range.

Snipers

1- Mobility : Snipers are not scouts, they carry a big, long, heavy weapon with them. The sniper rifle should have a weight penalty, slowing down their speed and overall mobility when running.

2- Aim : Autoaim should be remove from the sniper rifle, and only accurate, precise shoots should register.

3- Damage : Should be restricted to areas ; Head 100% damage / Upper body 45% damage / Lower body 20% damage.

Shotgun

A shotgun should be powerful enough, to destroy the armor of a dropsuit instantly, but should be ineffective breaking through the shields.

-Armor damage: Very High
-Shield damage : Low

AR ( Assault Rifle )

Should be a versatile gun, but not over powering in one specific area.

-Armor damage : Average
-Shield damage : Average

SMG / Pistol

Perhaps the only weapons, that i can't see any significant balance issues.

Forge gun

Powerful, high damage, devastating gun. But such high power should be hard to control.

-High cold down circle after each shot.
-No aim reference, needs to be shoot in a similar manner as a grenade.

Does are the most immediate balance issues that should be fix.

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Panther Alpha Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.02.13 17:33:00 - [1] - Quote After 2 weeks playing Dust 514, here are my recommendations for better balance : Heavies / HMG 1- Mobility : Heavies are build like a tank with legs, they should move as such. They shouldn't be allow to run, or jump. Their mobility should be seriously restricted ; Turning circle speed, should be the same as a mounted gun. 2- Aim : A powerful autocannon, should be slow to aim, and hard to control at full Rpm. 3- Damage : A HMG should be terrifying at close to medium range, and destroy everything in close quarters. But should have a high bullet spread, making them useless at medium to long range. Snipers 1- Mobility : Snipers are not scouts, they carry a big, long, heavy weapon with them. The sniper rifle should have a weight penalty, slowing down their speed and overall mobility when running. 2- Aim : Autoaim should be remove from the sniper rifle, and only accurate, precise shoots should register. 3- Damage : Should be restricted to areas ; Head 100% damage / Upper body 45% damage / Lower body 20% damage. Shotgun A shotgun should be powerful enough, to destroy the armor of a dropsuit instantly, but should be ineffective breaking through the shields. -Armor damage: Very High -Shield damage : Low AR ( Assault Rifle ) Should be a versatile gun, but not over powering in one specific area. -Armor damage : Average -Shield damage : Average SMG / Pistol Perhaps the only weapons, that i can't see any significant balance issues. Forge gun Powerful, high damage, devastating gun. But such high power should be hard to control. -High cold down circle after each shot. -No aim reference, needs to be shoot in a similar manner as a grenade. Does are the most immediate balance issues that should be fix.
Shouper of BHD Better Hide R Die 37	Posted - 2013.02.13 17:43:00 - [2] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: After 2 weeks playing Dust 514, here are my recommendations for better balance : Heavies / HMG 1- Mobility : Heavies are build like a tank with legs, they should move as such. They shouldn't be allow to run, or jump. Their mobility should be seriously restricted ; Turning circle speed, should be the same as a mounted gun. 2- Aim : A powerful autocannon, should be slow to aim, and hard to control at full Rpm. 3- Damage : A HMG should be terrifying at close to medium range, and destroy everything in close quarters. But should have a high bullet spread, making them useless at medium to long range. Snipers 1- Mobility : Snipers are not scouts, they carry a big, long, heavy weapon with them. The sniper rifle should have a weight penalty, slowing down their speed and overall mobility when running. 2- Aim : Autoaim should be remove from the sniper rifle, and only accurate, precise shoots should register. 3- Damage : Should be restricted to areas ; Head 100% damage / Upper body 45% damage / Lower body 20% damage. Shotgun A shotgun should be powerful enough, to destroy the armor of a dropsuit instantly, but should be ineffective breaking through the shields. -Armor damage: Very High -Shield damage : Low AR ( Assault Rifle ) Should be a versatile gun, but not over powering in one specific area. -Armor damage : Average -Shield damage : Average SMG / Pistol Perhaps the only weapons, that i can't see any significant balance issues. Forge gun Powerful, high damage, devastating gun. But such high power should be hard to control. -High cold down circle after each shot. -No aim reference, needs to be shoot in a similar manner as a grenade. Does are the most immediate balance issues that should be fix. in my opinion the HMG/ heavy is fine BUT must agree on the range, from a distance the HMG needs more spread out shots (except for the burst), I actully fear and HMG as much as the swarmer (as a all out pilot) since some of the HMGs shoot at me sometimes killing my gunners and doing great damage even after I pulled out (way to accuret of range after a pulled out, as for my gunners thats becuse i fly low and slow). the Shot Gun (SG) seems good where it is, I use the milita and slap 1 damage modifier on and its still good, as for the sheild/ armor HP it might be the ammo, I made a prediction back in E3 build in liek the 2-3 rd week of beta called "the user market" predicting that the guns we use will be makible, by using damage modifiers, tracking and other modules we can make the stats of a gun (imagine a AR as a Dropship, it allready does damage but a low ammoun of evrything, by adding modules it changes the stats durasticly...btw side arms you can comapre to the LAV and HMGs you can compare to the HAV ) it seems that prediction can be true... in fact we can costimize are ARs to have scopes instead of iron sights (soon) so why not ammo type? bullets made from iron or metal are good for armor peircing while plasma is good for sheilds since its a repeded burn drawing energy from the sheild consitently.
Val'herik Dorn CrimeWave Syndicate 264	Posted - 2013.02.13 18:26:00 - [3] - Quote If your close enough for the HMG to hit you... and do that much damage your doing it extremely wrong... extremely extremely wrong... The heavy has the worst movement/sprint speed and the lowest stamina so jumping and running in one suck they are slooooowwwww and even slower when aiming so that isn't an issue. (those barriers you and your assault suit vault over?) LOL not in a heavy suit its the long way for you. Forge already isn't allowed to iron sight so basically you just fire in a general direction with relatively unpredictable arcs in flight (literally the projectile seems drunk at times) Those are my only real qualms with your post leave my mobile cover alone logis need heavies for survival!!!!
Panther Alpha Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.02.14 09:45:00 - [4] - Quote Val'herik Dorn wrote: If your close enough for the HMG to hit you... and do that much damage your doing it extremely wrong... extremely extremely wrong... The heavy has the worst movement/sprint speed and the lowest stamina so jumping and running in one suck they are slooooowwwww and even slower when aiming so that isn't an issue. (those barriers you and your assault suit vault over?) LOL not in a heavy suit its the long way for you. Forge already isn't allowed to iron sight so basically you just fire in a general direction with relatively unpredictable arcs in flight (literally the projectile seems drunk at times) Those are my only real qualms with your post leave my mobile cover alone logis need heavies for survival!!!! I played as a heavy for a well, to see what is like. - Far to easy to move around, in proportion to the amount of damage a heavy can do. Heavies are like a mini squad by their own, yet they only move a "bit" slower then an assault trooper. Also climbing ladders with a huge autocannon, and a massive dropsuit is a bit unrealistic. - The range and precision of a HMG, is "about" the same as an AR, but they do 3x more damage. Again... very unrealistic. ( I seen heavies sniping with a HMG from the top of a roof ) you have no idea how stupid that really sounds. About the Forge gun i mean : "No crosshair" and "autoaim" .... such a powerful gun with that two things is...... yes you guessed..... UNREALISTIC. Ps. and i mean "unrealistic", not as in REAL life, but as for in a First Person Shooter.
Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 151	Posted - 2013.02.14 12:00:00 - [5] - Quote You've got the shotty's damage reversed and the ar not as effective against shields anymore, maybe when you've been playing months you'll realize nothing is wrong
Panther Alpha Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.02.14 13:00:00 - [6] - Quote Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei wrote: You've got the shotty's damage reversed and the ar not as effective against shields anymore, maybe when you've been playing months you'll realize nothing is wrong Remember that my observations are base on " Two Weeks" of game play. Obviously in a month time, i will improve my "core" skills a bit more, and this things will became least problematic. ( I leave all that for Episode 2 ) But at the moment, every shotgun i come across, drops my full shields and armor in 1 or 2 shoots.
Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 151	Posted - 2013.02.14 13:21:00 - [7] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei wrote: You've got the shotty's damage reversed and the ar not as effective against shields anymore, maybe when you've been playing months you'll realize nothing is wrong Remember that my observations are base on " Two Weeks" of game play. Obviously in a month time, i will improve my "core" skills a bit more, and this things will became least problematic. ( I leave all that for Episode 2 ) But at the moment, every shotgun i come across, drops my full shields and armor in 1 or 2 shoots. Sp isn't the thing that separates closed beta and open beta players, it's proven knowledge om how the game works
Panther Alpha Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.02.16 09:18:00 - [8] - Quote Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: Vermaak 'Fatal' Kuvakei wrote: You've got the shotty's damage reversed and the ar not as effective against shields anymore, maybe when you've been playing months you'll realize nothing is wrong Remember that my observations are base on " Two Weeks" of game play. Obviously in a month time, i will improve my "core" skills a bit more, and this things will became least problematic. ( I leave all that for Episode 2 ) But at the moment, every shotgun i come across, drops my full shields and armor in 1 or 2 shoots. Sp isn't the thing that separates closed beta and open beta players, it's proven knowledge om how the game works I disagree, SP makes a huge difference. Seems the 190,000 SP a week, cap implementation, i been investing SP on improving my shields and armor "Core" skills, and i already seen a big difference. My durability in battle is much, much better. - Been a "bit" harder to kill, makes a huge difference.
CarloArmato2991 RED COLONIAL MARINES Covert Intervention 20	Posted - 2013.02.16 09:37:00 - [9] - Quote I'm sorry, but I must quote CCP Frame... Quote: Hello, Please use search forum function first for any similar feedback/suggestions. If there is no thread already, please post 1 feedback/suggestion = 1 thread, so we can easily keep track of those. Making a list of feedback and suggestions may prove to be counter-productive as some important things may be overlooked. Thank you!
Lonnar KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 15	Posted - 2013.02.16 09:58:00 - [10] - Quote CarloArmato2991 wrote: I'm sorry, but I must quote CCP Frame... Quote: Hello, Please use search forum function first for any similar feedback/suggestions. If there is no thread already, please post 1 feedback/suggestion = 1 thread, so we can easily keep track of those. Making a list of feedback and suggestions may prove to be counter-productive as some important things may be overlooked. Thank you! This ^

trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 165	Posted - 2013.02.16 15:14:00 - [11] - Quote Disagree on all points except for sniper damage restrictions (where more appropriate numbers would be 300 head, 80 torso, 50 legs.) Shotgun needs to bust through shield rather than armor (shield Duracell bunnies need a close range counter). Shotgun is fine as is, though. Ar is fine. Forge gun is fine and needs the firing rate for AV purposes. Splash reduction if any nerf needed. SMG needs a minuscule buff, perhaps a fitting reduction for higher end smg.
Jotun Hiem Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 412	Posted - 2013.02.16 18:02:00 - [12] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: After 2 weeks playing Dust 514, here are my recommendations for better balance : Heavies / HMG 1- Mobility : Heavies are build like a tank with legs, they should move as such. They shouldn't be allow to run, or jump. Their mobility should be seriously restricted ; Turning circle speed, should be the same as a mounted gun. 2- Aim : A powerful autocannon, should be slow to aim, and hard to control at full Rpm. 3- Damage : A HMG should be terrifying at close to medium range, and destroy everything in close quarters. But should have a high bullet spread, making them useless at medium to long range. The Heavy only sprints as fast as the assault walks. It can't jump over any of the obstacles. At close range both assault and scout suits strafe faster than its turning speed. It's a machine gun, not an autocannon. It fires bullets. Real life multi-barrel guns are insanely accurate. Also, seeing as it's supposed to be a hardcore area denial weapon, it wouldn't make any sense for the HMG to be relegated to shotgun status. Any gun useless at medium range has no business being on the slowest suit in the game, especially when that suit is designed to hold down an area from attack. Quote: Snipers 1- Mobility : Snipers are not scouts, they carry a big, long, heavy weapon with them. The sniper rifle should have a weight penalty, slowing down their speed and overall mobility when running. 2- Aim : Autoaim should be remove from the sniper rifle, and only accurate, precise shoots should register. 3- Damage : Should be restricted to areas ; Head 100% damage / Upper body 45% damage / Lower body 20% damage. Snipers in the field rely on stealth and mobility to not get their asses killed. This has pretty much always been true. The game doesn't have auto aim, it slows down your aiming just a little when you move over an enemy, but it doesn't aim for you. The damage idea is just bad. Quote: Shotgun A shotgun should be powerful enough, to destroy the armor of a dropsuit instantly, but should be ineffective breaking through the shields. -Armor damage: Very High -Shield damage : Low The shotgun is a hybrid weapon, as such it deals equal damage to both. You'll have to wait until racial variants come out for something more specialized. Quote: AR ( Assault Rifle ) Should be a versatile gun, but not over powering in one specific area. -Armor damage : Average -Shield damage : Average ARs are hybrid-type weapons, this is exactly what they do already. Quote: Forge gun Powerful, high damage, devastating gun. But such high power should be hard to control. -High cold down circle after each shot. -No aim reference, needs to be shoot in a similar manner as a grenade. Does are the most immediate balance issues that should be fix. Forge Guns are anti-vehicle rail guns intended to be used at extremely long ranges. Getting rid of the aiming reticule would gimp them beyond belief. Also, the Forge gun already suffers from decreased mobility while charging and a charge timer that prevents instantaneous shots. Only the proto Forge Guns can one-shot infantry with their splash damage, but even then it only applies to militia fits, and they still suffer from low RoF.
Jotun Hiem Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 412	Posted - 2013.02.16 18:05:00 - [13] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: I disagree, SP makes a huge difference. Seems the 190,000 SP a week, cap implementation, i been investing SP on improving my shields and armor "Core" skills, and i already seen a big difference. My durability in battle is much, much better. - Been a "bit" harder to kill, makes a huge difference. Actually, he's right. Closed beta players don't actually have an SP advantage over anyone who started soon after the open beta started up.
Panther Alpha Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 44	Posted - 2013.02.16 23:36:00 - [14] - Quote ROFL! I knew i'll get framed for this.... I know you guys are enjoying your OP killing rampages ( 30 kills / 0 death ), hell i starting to enjoy that my self too..... But we need some perspective here. The full game is OP : Snipers: OP Heavies: OP Forge guns: OP Shotguns: OP Grenades: OP And so on, and on, and on.......... Even that i getting very good scores now, with my OP skills, and OP guns, and my OP dropsuit. I'm adult enough to see that this is unrealistic, and after a well if just going to be lots of Veterans playing, with the occasional "new" guy, playing for a couple of hours, and then saying ; F**** this!. Everything needs to come back down to earth big time. More balance, least OP. *OP : Over Powering .... just in case i get frame for that too.
xXl DeathDealer lXx Intara Direct Action Caldari State 2	Posted - 2013.02.17 17:17:00 - [15] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: After 2 weeks playing Dust 514, here are my recommendations for better balance : Heavies / HMG 1- Mobility : Heavies are build like a tank with legs, they should move as such. They shouldn't be allow to run, or jump. Their mobility should be seriously restricted ; Turning circle speed, should be the same as a mounted gun. 2- Aim : A powerful autocannon, should be slow to aim, and hard to control at full Rpm. 3- Damage : A HMG should be terrifying at close to medium range, and destroy everything in close quarters. But should have a high bullet spread, making them useless at medium to long range. Snipers 1- Mobility : Snipers are not scouts, they carry a big, long, heavy weapon with them. The sniper rifle should have a weight penalty, slowing down their speed and overall mobility when running. 2- Aim : Autoaim should be remove from the sniper rifle, and only accurate, precise shoots should register. 3- Damage : Should be restricted to areas ; Head 100% damage / Upper body 45% damage / Lower body 20% damage. Shotgun A shotgun should be powerful enough, to destroy the armor of a dropsuit instantly, but should be ineffective breaking through the shields. -Armor damage: Very High -Shield damage : Low AR ( Assault Rifle ) Should be a versatile gun, but not over powering in one specific area. -Armor damage : Average -Shield damage : Average SMG / Pistol Perhaps the only weapons, that i can't see any significant balance issues. Forge gun Powerful, high damage, devastating gun. But such high power should be hard to control. -High cold down circle after each shot. -No aim reference, needs to be shoot in a similar manner as a grenade. Does are the most immediate balance issues that should be fix. I agree, but I don't think that the gun is the problem with the heavy drop-suit class. The armor that the heavy class wears is the real problem. Any class no matte how powerful the weapon is can be defeated with smart use of cover. But because the heavy weapon has such stupid high armor, this is not the case. 650 armor is what you get with the first heavy drop-suit that can be purchased. That is 50 higher than the armor that the Saga has and it is a light vehicle. If I get the drop on a guy and shoot my entire clip into his body, then he should die, period. Do this to a heavy drop-suit class and he turn around, smile, and blow you away. NOTE that you can switch to assault rifles with the heavy drop-suit class so nerfing the LMG won't do a thing. Same tank, different weapon.


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