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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.09 07:40:00 -
[31] - Quote
Indeed we should keep it alive - but it also should be moved to the Feedback section. Maybe even copy and paste the subject there - though I don't see any reason to discuss this further - everyone seems to be of one mind on this issue now. |
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Umbat Boki
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
157
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Posted - 2013.01.09 07:52:00 -
[32] - Quote
I think CCP considered this idea. If I remember this correctly, they told that "SP pool" was a solution they discussed.
So, they obviously didn't like it. Why? I think because 27k SP cap is quite small and they want everyone to play every day instead of playing just one day. If you receive 10k SP every match, it's only 16 matches to get weekly cap. This is easily done in one day. Therefore if SP pool is implemented, there won't be enough reasons to play every day as you can easily reach the weekly cap in one day.
Also, if I understand this right, by getting passive SP booster you get about the same amount of SP by not playing at all as a player who grind every day, but without any boosters.
This is tough, yes, but get real, DUST is a business project which must provide some income.
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Sha Kharn Clone
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
1087
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Posted - 2013.01.09 08:08:00 -
[33] - Quote
Best idea and it baffles me that ccp have not done this. |
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries Legacy Rising
886
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Posted - 2013.01.09 08:11:00 -
[34] - Quote
This is a blend of the new system and what we have grown accustomed to in Codex. This is the better idea.....would be better if there was no weekly reset so that if you came in 1 month late, you can still catch up. |
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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.09 08:13:00 -
[35] - Quote
Umbat Boki wrote:I think CCP considered this idea. If I remember this correctly, they told that "SP pool" was a solution they discussed.
So, they obviously didn't like it. Why? I think because 27k SP cap is quite small and they want everyone to play every day instead of playing just one day. If you receive 10k SP every match, it's only 16 matches to get weekly cap. This is easily done in one day. Therefore if SP pool is implemented, there won't be enough reasons to play every day as you can easily reach the weekly cap in one day.
Also, if I understand this right, by getting passive SP booster you get about the same amount of SP by not playing at all as a player who grind every day, but without any boosters.
This is tough, yes, but get real, DUST is a business project which must provide some income.
This i why I want CCP to state there intent with some of these changes they're making. This thread wouldn't exist if CCP came forth and said what you just did - wouldn't even take 5 minutes to type it up. Looking at there other posts - doubt it would even take them 2 minutes.
Subsiding these wants really take nothng - most people just want to understand - and if they can't then they come up with there own theories and work with that. And those theories leads to discussions CCP probably finds pointless while we think it's productive. But how are we to know? |
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Odiain Suliis
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
112
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Posted - 2013.01.09 08:21:00 -
[36] - Quote
Added this to my above post:
And for the argument of what about those players that come 6 moths later or 1 year later to game?
My opinion is though luck. And more to the point is this misconstruded opinion that one needs to 'catch up' in SP to the max levels to be competetive.
No they don't.
All you need is to have certain ammount of SP to level those critical skills that give +X% dmg, +XHP and weapon of choice proficiencie skill. These skills are 'core skills'. After one has trained these up, it's all about ones versatility and adaptability to different situations in battlefield.
In other words, low SP charachters compete with spceialication. High SP charachters have versatility advantage in battle, but not advantage of superior gear. (Once one has leveled up those 'core skills') |
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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.09 08:57:00 -
[37] - Quote
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=49107
above link is a thread is in the feedback section - if you supported this thread then go support that one as well. |
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fred orpaul
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
213
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Posted - 2013.01.09 10:26:00 -
[38] - Quote
you would still have complaints because those who cant long in the last few days would miss out on sp. that said Ive been saying this for a while with a rolling deletion. So basically you delete one weeks worth of unearned SP, from two weeks ago, every week. that way you never have one day where you have to play to keep from losing sp. |
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fred orpaul
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
213
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Posted - 2013.01.09 10:29:00 -
[39] - Quote
Odiain Suliis wrote: Added this to my above post:
And for the argument of what about those players that come 6 moths later or 1 year later to game?
My opinion is though luck. And more to the point is this misconstruded opinion that one needs to 'catch up' in SP to the max levels to be competetive.
No they don't.
All you need is to have certain ammount of SP to level those critical skills that give +X% dmg, +XHP and weapon of choice proficiencie skill. These skills are 'core skills'. After one has trained these up, it's all about ones versatility and adaptability to different situations in battlefield.
In other words, low SP charachters compete with spceialication. High SP charachters have versatility advantage in battle, but not advantage of superior gear. (Once one has leveled up those 'core skills')
yes and no, but hopefully with open beta coming, there will be enough people that they can run low, mid, and high skill matches like they did a couplea builds ago.
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Big Popa Smurff
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
104
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Posted - 2013.01.09 14:07:00 -
[40] - Quote
So lets say you play dust for a year and someone else starts to play a year later, will that player start earning a years worth without getting capped, or is it once the week cap hits they've lost out, sorry if its a stupid question, trying to get my head around this roll over business...
EDIT: Sorry didnt see the post above me, ^^^ |
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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.09 14:09:00 -
[41] - Quote
Big Popa Smurff wrote:So lets say you play dust for a year and someone else starts to play a year later, will that player start earning a years worth without getting capped, or is it once the week cap hits they've lost out, sorry if its a stupid question, trying to get my head around this roll over business... All possible SP you were capable of earning that week would get deleted as the new week comes. |
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Gunner Visari
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
163
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Posted - 2013.01.09 14:49:00 -
[42] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Off topic but... Does anyone remember Cingular Wireless?
Yeah. That.
Cingular was bought by MCI which was then bought by AT&T |
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trollsroyce
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
165
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Posted - 2013.01.09 15:00:00 -
[43] - Quote
Agree on OP |
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GM Unicorn
Game Masters C C P Alliance
320
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Posted - 2013.01.09 17:02:00 -
[44] - Quote
Moved to Feedback. Thanks for sharing your opinion guys! |
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KryptixX
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
321
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Posted - 2013.01.09 17:04:00 -
[45] - Quote
Only reason i could see CCP not doing this is because of people exploiting the boosters (waiting till the last day and using a 1 day booster to get the full week in that 1 day)
This could be prevented by not allowing the rollover SP to be affected by the boosters. |
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AmlSeb
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
7
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Posted - 2013.01.09 17:08:00 -
[46] - Quote
Isn-Št it better to add the remaining SP just from the last week, instead of resetting the whole cap? |
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Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis
775
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Posted - 2013.01.09 21:21:00 -
[47] - Quote
Having the roll over be time based rather than date based would help the situation IMO. Additionally if it were on 30 day cycles from the date of either A)Character creation, or B) end of last cycle for that character. That would keep SP growth somewhat flexible and normalized while not creating artificial spikes and troughs in sever population load.
I could be mistaken but since CCP already uses a mechanic of this type in EVE it doesn't seem like adding one for Dust would be that resource intensive.
0.02 ISK Cross
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Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
393
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Posted - 2013.01.09 21:23:00 -
[48] - Quote
why not just forget the cap system?
Currently: Passive SP = 24,000 SP per day Active SP Cap = 27,200 per day - Warpoints earned are converted into skillpoints (1 WP = 1 SP) - Time spent in battle grants SP (1 second = 5 SP)
Suggestion 1: Passive SP = 35,000 SP per day Active SP is not cap'd - Warpoints earned are converted into skillpoints (2 WP = 1 SP) - Time spent in battle grants SP (1 seconds = 1 SP)
Suggestion 2: Passive SP = 40,000 SP per day Active SP is not cap'd - Warpoints earned are converted into skillpoints (3 WP = 1 SP) - Time spent in battle grants SP (1 seconds = 1 SP) |
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KEROSIINI-TERO
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
248
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Posted - 2013.01.10 01:31:00 -
[49] - Quote
Perhaps this is suggested in this thread before but I'm in a hurry so sorry for that:
OP mentioned a "Rolling bank of ungained SP". but he said it would reset on a certain weekday.
Rather than that, it would be better to have the same bank but it having a maximum amount it can hold in. The amount could be any one of these: 1day, 2day or a week. Week would be best as most people on this planet do live by a weekly cycle.
Furthermore, there was a wild idea of having the bank as an AUR implant......... MMMmmmmkay. |
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Overlord Ulath
Doomheim
85
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Posted - 2013.01.10 01:45:00 -
[50] - Quote
All of that would be negated if we just go back to the weekly cap but keep the same math for SP accumulation we have now. You get lower SP per match so you hit the cap slower than we did before, but at the same time you could reach the cap any time that week if you put in enough effort.
The whole issue would be resolved however if you have an overall global cap starting from the day you make your new character. If you miss a week or two due to some emergency, you will still be getting around 6k SP per match, but don't reach the cap until you reach the amount of SP you would have had if you hadn't missed that week or two. You'd never reach the level of people who have been around from the beginning, but you would always be able to make up for SP you missed.
Of course, this has all been said over and over, but I still see no CCP response. |
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Odiain Suliis
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
112
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Posted - 2013.01.10 06:51:00 -
[51] - Quote
Overlord Ulath wrote:All of that would be negated if we just go back to the weekly cap but keep the same math for SP accumulation we have now. You get lower SP per match so you hit the cap slower than we did before, but at the same time you could reach the cap any time that week if you put in enough effort.
The whole issue would be resolved however if you have an overall global cap starting from the day you make your new character. If you miss a week or two due to some emergency, you will still be getting around 6k SP per match, but don't reach the cap until you reach the amount of SP you would have had if you hadn't missed that week or two. You'd never reach the level of people who have been around from the beginning, but you would always be able to make up for SP you missed.
Of course, this has all been said over and over, but I still see no CCP response.
Issue with this 'global cap' as suggested above is that, it leads to situation where if one wants to do things in optimal way then all 3 char slots need to be used, even tho one only uses 1 char. Because if one didn't create those 2 others one would be missing out SP accrual to those chars. Those alts would be there for no other reason than to just-in-case. |
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Overlord Ulath
Doomheim
85
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Posted - 2013.01.10 07:27:00 -
[52] - Quote
Odiain Suliis wrote:Overlord Ulath wrote:All of that would be negated if we just go back to the weekly cap but keep the same math for SP accumulation we have now. You get lower SP per match so you hit the cap slower than we did before, but at the same time you could reach the cap any time that week if you put in enough effort.
The whole issue would be resolved however if you have an overall global cap starting from the day you make your new character. If you miss a week or two due to some emergency, you will still be getting around 6k SP per match, but don't reach the cap until you reach the amount of SP you would have had if you hadn't missed that week or two. You'd never reach the level of people who have been around from the beginning, but you would always be able to make up for SP you missed.
Of course, this has all been said over and over, but I still see no CCP response. Issue with this 'global cap' as suggested above is that, it leads to situation where if one wants to do things in optimal way then all 3 char slots need to be used, even tho one only uses 1 char. Because if one didn't create those 2 others one would be missing out SP accrual to those chars. Those alts would be there for no other reason than to just-in-case. That is the issue with any situation where we have a cap, including the one we are in now. Since there is a cap, the only way to keep building up SP is to have multiple characters and USE those alts since passive SP can only build for one of your characters.
The counter balance to this, weak though it is, is that though you stop gaining SP, you are still building up WP, win/loss ratio, K/D and kills for both yourself and your corp on the leaderboards. When you have multiple characters, those points are all split up so your place in the boards is much lower than it would be if you were to keep playing on the same character.
So unless they ditch the cap, a global cap is the best solution for making sure people don't miss out on any SP they could have gained. |
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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.11 19:42:00 -
[53] - Quote
If the idea I'm reading here is a global SP cap all your toons share - then I'm terrified :O |
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Moonracer2000
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
315
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Posted - 2013.01.11 20:41:00 -
[54] - Quote
I think some sort of rollover system would be great. I also like the idea of a sort of global SP cap. But not perfect. So new players six months or a year from now can catch up to some degree but never reach the potential that veterans have.
I think it should not be 100% effective. So if I miss a week I can catch up but I will not be able to gain all of the SP I could have potentially earned had I played that week. Say only 75% of the week missed? The longer I don't play the less of that week I will be able to get back.
I guess a problem with any system like this might be how to calculate boosters. Should boosters affect these buffered potential SP? |
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SoTa PoP
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
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Posted - 2013.01.11 21:20:00 -
[55] - Quote
how bout if the roll back gave diminishing returns when it adds to the next day? Or perhaps even week. This gives newbs a chance to get out of militia at least somewhat quickly and let them explore a bit without giving everyone a big dose of SP. |
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JACKAL ZER0
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
17
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Posted - 2013.01.11 21:32:00 -
[56] - Quote
D'Finn Rhedlyne wrote:New players coming in should be separated by the matchmaking system. Thus making them equal with their counterparts.
I'll double that.
Edit: Also, More SP. Frack it if we max out our specialty, We still gotta earn isk! |
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Snakey Snake
Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2013.01.11 22:24:00 -
[57] - Quote
You put into words things I cannot. Good Job! ^_^ |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2013.01.14 11:38:00 -
[58] - Quote
Best idea for the SP system. |
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Lycuo
On The Brink
5
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Posted - 2013.01.16 15:31:00 -
[59] - Quote
I Like it, Its like "Roll Over" minutes on a phone. |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2013.01.19 11:58:00 -
[60] - Quote
Best SP idea. |
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