EDITORIAL NOTE: Copied directly from my post on the Feedback/Requests.

This build the AV/Tank balance is just ridiculous. Here's why.

Here's the stacking penalties on using more than one Shield Resistance on an HAV.

-25% 1 Shield Resist
-46.75% 2 Shield Resists
-61% 3 Shield Resists
-68% 4 Shield Resists
-82% 4 Shield Resists + Damage Control

Now, for the sake of argument, we're going to assume that a Sagaris with two resistances, a shield extender, a damage control, and a booster.

6000 (approximately) HP with 60.75% resistance.

Now we'll pit it against an Officer Forge Gun, which does 1080 damage - base - and with Weaponry 5 and Proficiency 3 would be an 24% increase to a grand total of 1340.

Now, we're going to take the resistances and apply it to our forge gun, which now makes it at 536.

6,000 divided by 536 = 11.19, approximately. This is about two magazines from your Officer Forge Gun.

This means that with two (officer) forge gunners firing at the same Tank, taking into account charge up times, it would take 10 Seconds for both gunners to exhaust their magazines and theoretically deplete the tank's shields. Round about's 20, for one gunner. In this time frame the tank has already disengaged the battle and has retreated to an area that it can use it's booster - all the while using a large array of weaponry to fire back at it's opponents.

Whatever happened in this build screwed over any balance there ever was between vehicles and Anti-Vehicle builds.

To counter the argument that Movement Nullifiers will "fix everything", you're very wrong. Movement Nullifiers will help but they won't solve the issue at hand - as this math is directed for -ONE TANK- and I have seen as many as five in a single match.

I'm curious as to what CCP was even thinking when they came out with the AV "hotfix" in the first place, to be honest. Reducing the speed on the tanks isn't the problem - it's their absolutely ridiculous invulnerability to conventional methods.

EDITORIAL NOTE: I know that the Officer Forge Gun has 6 rounds in the mag - but a Proto Forge Gun does about the same damage so it's a moot point.

well ive been sayin all along its not all tanks in general that are OP its just the shield tanks
swarms are more readily available and any suit can use em so armor tanks honestly arent a big of a deal

His calcs for resists are good

1st Module = 100%
2nd Module = 87%
Damage Controls are not affected by stacking penalties

25(1.00)%+25(0.87)%+14%=60.75%

Clearly you've never see an armor tank being remote repped properly. Remote armor reps are VERY good, far better than remote shield reps. Armor tanks also can be readily repaired by infantry with repair tools. Shield tanks are better for solo play, but with support the Armor tank wins hands down.

All these conversations about AV infantry vs Tanks; very few people seem to consider that drop ships should also be factored in. They already get blasted out of the air on a whim by pretty much everything, if you buff AV infantry more this is just going to get worse.

In conventional terms, tanks should be scared ****less of air power, at the moment they're not because it only takes one guy with a swarm launcher to scare the air power off.

Drop ship > Tank > Infantry > Drop ship ..... the cycle itself isn't balanced

All these conversations about AV infantry vs Tanks; very few people seem to consider that drop ships should also be factored in. They already get blasted out of the air on a whim by pretty much everything, if you buff AV infantry more this is just going to get worse.

In conventional terms, tanks should be scared ****less of air power, at the moment they're not because it only takes one guy with a swarm launcher to scare the air power off.

Drop ship > Tank > Infantry > Drop ship ..... the cycle itself isn't balanced

All these conversations about AV infantry vs Tanks; very few people seem to consider that drop ships should also be factored in. They already get blasted out of the air on a whim by pretty much everything, if you buff AV infantry more this is just going to get worse.

In conventional terms, tanks should be scared ****less of air power, at the moment they're not because it only takes one guy with a swarm launcher to scare the air power off.

Drop ship > Tank > Infantry > Drop ship ..... the cycle itself isn't balanced

Sure! lets buff a Myron! its not like I spent an entire match! shooting at one with my tanks railgun!!
Two guys with forge guns versus a sagaris??
Yeah those numbers sound bitching and leaves the poor forgegunners in slow heavy suits far behind versus the faster sagaris.
Yeah, yeah its not like the heavy can chase down the sagaris in a FREE MILITIA LAV right, right?......er wait!!

And its not like guys like Timesplitter can instapop my gunnlogi or three shot a sagaris......er wait!!

Hence why the thread is about Tanks being over-powered, not AV being under-powered.

So what YOU and others "want"??? is a heavy marauder tank that anyone can kill with a sidearm pistol??
Right since tanks are so "overpowered" that a tank driver can go AFK for a soda and the tank is still there with no damage instead of being insta toast the moment the tank stops moving??

Sure - Free Militia LAV that can be one-shotted by Swarm Launcher, Forge Gun, Tank, AV Grenade, Cavity Thukker, etc etc etc

Just another way to lose a perfectly good - albeit expensive - Proto-fit heavy suit because your suit has more defense than the damn vehicle your driving.

Are you stupid? The tank stops moving and he can survive long enough to still get out of there and boost the shields back to normal just by going to the edge of the map simply because he's got a faster top speed than the freaggin Scout suits - and don't even get me started skill-buffed shield recharge times.

Maybe we just want **** to go back to the way it was -BEFORE- this bullshit got out of hand, eh? Last build there was at least some balance with the only pressing vehicle issue being Dropships sitting at the top of Towers racking in spawn-kills - wasn't much complaints about the tanks; this build there is an obvious frakking issue and.... Ahem... YOU AND THE OTHERS can't seem to acknowledge the giant elephant in the room that has so obviously landed on the television.

Proto? dude! please!
Militia suit with basic assault forge gun and two buddies in same fits.
Militia lav with resists and extenders can survive unless its driven by a fool that decides to park it.

Noc Tempre drives up to my tank in a lav and jumps out and two shots my tank.

Yeah that 380 damage from each shot will totally bridge that gap - let me tell you. Even with three firing at the same time it would take a six shots, a magazine and a half from every single one of them, just to get through the shields. Provided they haven't died yet and aren't being suppressed to death from all the splash damage/camera jerk/movement reduction from every other gameplay mechanic currently going on.

LAV would do you a lot of good as well considering that you have to exit the damned thing in order to use these guns, assuming you survived the direct hit from the 1,500+ damage Railgun and two missile launchers which are sure to barrage the hell out of you being of your super-high profile on the minimap lighting you up like exactly what you are - a moving ****ing target.

Seriously, are you even thinking before you respond or are you just throwing **** out there to sound smart?

@ Tech Ohm Eaven i use buffer tanks mostly because it does let me afk for smoke brakes etc. Not lost a tank yet to smoking

What ifs and numbers sound cool.

I PREFER IN GAME RESULTS! instead of THEORY.
Results so far are my tanks die!!

Sorry if the results disagree with your THEORY.

Your horrible in tanks then. Not once has a corp mate of mine lost one of my tanks on his very first time in one to AV infantry.

I really mean that..the very very first time they have ever driven a tank and no I didnt babysit them with RR.

/me is now dead set on breaking that form !! Lol.

Your horrible in tanks then. Not once has a corp mate of mine lost one of my tanks on his very first time in one to AV infantry.

I really mean that..the very very first time they have ever driven a tank and no I didnt babysit them with RR.