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Apocalyptic Destroyerr Shining Flame Amarr Empire 349	Posted - 2015.06.18 18:28:00 - [1] - Quote Anyone else feel like the Logi is lacking ? I feel it's not where it should be. I rarely see them around at all. I'm talking about Bonuses and their Performance ! The Minmitar Logi I feel is working properly no change needed there. The bonuses it gets to the repair tool is a great bonus. This Logi I see always on the field, behind tanked out suits. The Amarr Logi is useless due to the bonus disappearing when you die. What's the point of this ? Do they expect you to stay alive 24/7 ? I feel this should be changed to if you die and change suits, the bonus disappears. Otherwise this Logi is Scrap. The Caldari Logi is what I feel is underperforming. Although it does get bonuses to basically all its equipment, but just about everybody carries either a needle or Nanohives on their suit. I don't know how to fix this. Now the Gal Logi is an interesting one, I can say its on par with with the Minmitar Logi as performaning properly. If fitted properly, this Logi can certainly help the team greatly win battles. This Logi is usually always seen.
Powerh8er Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 828	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:19:00 - [2] - Quote Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. Have you got anymore exploding carrots?
Radiant Pancake3 THE REBEL FEDERATION 159	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:21:00 - [3] - Quote Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. Agreed. I am the Clown of Ass or am I the Ass of Clown... o.O Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ Minmatar Loyalist Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:32:00 - [4] - Quote In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 850	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:50:00 - [5] - Quote Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. why not just give them more HP? seems like the more logical move seeing as how they are repurposed assault frames that need to be heavier to carry more equipment. Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. Wanna play eve?
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 850	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:53:00 - [6] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% or make it so all logis get bonuses to all equipment, logis shouldn't only get a bonus to one piece of equipment just because its racial. Wanna play eve?
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:57:00 - [7] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% or make it so all logis get bonuses to all equipment, logis shouldn't only get a bonus to one piece of equipment just because its racial. Yes they should because it fits every races warfare doctrines and design intent. With your line of reasoning I could easily go "well why cant caldari fit a proper armor tank on their suits! and don't tell me because its racial - if I want to fit a proper armor/shield tank on any race I should be able to" That line of reasoning quickly descends into loss of identity and silliness everywhere. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 850	Posted - 2015.06.18 19:58:00 - [8] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% or make it so all logis get bonuses to all equipment, logis shouldn't only get a bonus to one piece of equipment just because its racial. Yes they should because it fits every races warfare doctrines and design intent. With your line of reasoning I could easily go "well why cant caldari fit a proper armor tank on their suits! and don't tell me because its racial - if I want to fit a proper armor/shield tank on any race I should be able to" That line of reasoning quickly descends into loss of identity and silliness everywhere. so why does every logi in eve get a bonus to a remote repairer? Wanna play eve?
Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:03:00 - [9] - Quote the amarr logi bonus is lost while beeing death but it kicks back in as soon you respawn. The Cal. logi bonus is just plain useless to be honest. Nobody needs a bonus for nanohives when every 1 can carry 6 of them. Rudimentary Mercs of scrubs and incompetence. You touch my mind, fumbling in Ignorance, incapable of understanding.
Radiant Pancake3 THE REBEL FEDERATION 159	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:14:00 - [10] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: the amarr logi bonus is lost while beeing death but it kicks back in as soon you respawn. The Cal. logi bonus is just plain useless to be honest. Nobody needs a bonus for nanohives when every 1 can carry 6 of them. Sents can't carry hives. I am the Clown of Ass or am I the Ass of Clown... o.O Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ Minmatar Loyalist Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ

Mina Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:16:00 - [11] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% or make it so all logis get bonuses to all equipment, logis shouldn't only get a bonus to one piece of equipment just because its racial. Yes they should because it fits every races warfare doctrines and design intent. With your line of reasoning I could easily go "well why cant caldari fit a proper armor tank on their suits! and don't tell me because its racial - if I want to fit a proper armor/shield tank on any race I should be able to" That line of reasoning quickly descends into loss of identity and silliness everywhere. so why does every logi in eve get a bonus to a remote repairer? in fact the minmatar use remote shield boosters so why do they get a bonus to an armour rep tool? Logistics fill a different role in eve than they do in dust. Do not try to translate things directly from one game to another. Initially the minmatar carriers (all carriers were logistics ships++) had a bonus to capital remote shield reps OR capital remote armor reps. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 850	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:17:00 - [12] - Quote Radiant Pancake3 wrote: Bright Cloud wrote: the amarr logi bonus is lost while beeing death but it kicks back in as soon you respawn. The Cal. logi bonus is just plain useless to be honest. Nobody needs a bonus for nanohives when every 1 can carry 6 of them. Sents can't carry hives. obviously, but caldari should be best at using them is what he is getting at and they arent. maybe increase the bonus to 7.5% per level so that a triage hive gives 96 reps per second or even 10% per level so it does 100 Wanna play eve?
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 850	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:18:00 - [13] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: In regards to the amarr logi: Vae victus. Callogi would be in a better place if they nerfed the amount of carried nanohives for non callogi's by about 50% or make it so all logis get bonuses to all equipment, logis shouldn't only get a bonus to one piece of equipment just because its racial. Yes they should because it fits every races warfare doctrines and design intent. With your line of reasoning I could easily go "well why cant caldari fit a proper armor tank on their suits! and don't tell me because its racial - if I want to fit a proper armor/shield tank on any race I should be able to" That line of reasoning quickly descends into loss of identity and silliness everywhere. so why does every logi in eve get a bonus to a remote repairer? in fact the minmatar use remote shield boosters so why do they get a bonus to an armour rep tool? Logistics fill a different role in eve than they do in dust. Do not try to translate things directly from one game to another. Initially the minmatar carriers (all carriers were logistics ships++) had a bonus to capital remote shield reps OR capital remote armor reps. and now they have both, and logis barely have a different role. repair and resupply are the main roles of logistics in dust, so i'll ask again, why dont all logis have a repair tool bonus? Wanna play eve?
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:25:00 - [14] - Quote Because they don't need them or it doesn't fit their racial doctrine. Why don't assaults get a bonus to every light weapon ever? Why can't I fit a 5 slot armor tank on my cal-scout? Just because you see the only purpose of a logi being chained to a heavy repping them, doesn't mean that it's true. Caldari = Seige warfare, entrench and fortify - Nanohives & injectors fit this. Amarr = Armored warfare, bring bigger heavier suits than your opponent can - amarr logi shortens the supply lines required to do this. Gallente = Information warfare, know what your enemies intend to do and deny them information in return - active scanners fit this. Minmatar = Skirmish warfare, be able to relocate frequently - rep tools fit this by sustaining the 'weaker' but more versatile suits through fights they shouldn't straight up win with reps, allowing them to be everywhere. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 855	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:32:00 - [15] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Because they don't need them or it doesn't fit their racial doctrine. Why don't assaults get a bonus to every light weapon ever? Why can't I fit a 5 slot armor tank on my cal-scout? Just because you see the only purpose of a logi being chained to a heavy repping them, doesn't mean that it's true. Caldari = Seige warfare, entrench and fortify - Nanohives & injectors fit this. Amarr = Armored warfare, bring bigger heavier suits than your opponent can - amarr logi shortens the supply lines required to do this. Gallente = Information warfare, know what your enemies intend to do and deny them information in return - active scanners fit this. Minmatar = Skirmish warfare, be able to relocate frequently - rep tools fit this by sustaining the 'weaker' but more versatile suits through fights they shouldn't straight up win with reps, allowing them to be everywhere. Yet ALL of the races get a bonus to a remote repair of some sort. Wanna play eve?
Mina Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:34:00 - [16] - Quote Because eve is an entirely different game as I've **ing said and you cannot directly translate mechanics from one game to another. Otherwise I'd be running around in a caldari electronic warfare specialist making it so that no one else can even ing shoot their guns at me. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
Scheneighnay McBob Tribal Liberation Force Paramilitary 7	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:36:00 - [17] - Quote I doubt many people carry injectors anymore; I definitely don't. Revives are broken. Rule 34.6.1: every parody will have a crossover
Radiant Pancake3 THE REBEL FEDERATION 160	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:37:00 - [18] - Quote In any situation all logis should know one thing. TUNNEL SNAKES RULE I am the Clown of Ass or am I the Ass of Clown... o.O Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ Minmatar Loyalist Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 855	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:37:00 - [19] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Because eve is an entirely different game as I've **ing said and you cannot directly translate mechanics from one game to another. Otherwise I'd be running around in a caldari electronic warfare specialist making it so that no one else can even **ing shoot their guns at me. So why does the minmatar get a bonus to the repair tool if being a logi is an entirely different thing??? Dont tell me its different if one race can have and the others cant just because. Wanna play eve?
VAHZZ Corrosive Synergy No Context 2	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:40:00 - [20] - Quote We need the Patron Saint of Logi's to speak to us again. GÖ¢ Scouts United - Join the Scout channel. GÖ¢

Powerh8er Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 829	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:48:00 - [21] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. why not just give them more HP? seems like the more logical move seeing as how they are repurposed assault frames that need to be heavier to carry more equipment. Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. Well that would be good too because then you have the options of stacking speed moods instead of ****** ferroscale armorplates which many logis do now, but if the logis would got more hp then you probably see more of the infamous and much dreaded slayerlogi. Have you got anymore exploding carrots?
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 855	Posted - 2015.06.18 20:49:00 - [22] - Quote Powerh8er wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. why not just give them more HP? seems like the more logical move seeing as how they are repurposed assault frames that need to be heavier to carry more equipment. Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. Well that would be good too because then you have the options of stacking speed moods instead of ****** ferroscale armorplates which many logis do now, but if the logis would got more hp then you probably see more of the infamous and much dreaded slayerlogi. Speed > tank. Just look at min assaults Wanna play eve?
Scheneighnay McBob Tribal Liberation Force Paramilitary 7	Posted - 2015.06.18 21:10:00 - [23] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. why not just give them more HP? seems like the more logical move seeing as how they are repurposed assault frames that need to be heavier to carry more equipment. Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. Well that would be good too because then you have the options of stacking speed moods instead of ****** ferroscale armorplates which many logis do now, but if the logis would got more hp then you probably see more of the infamous and much dreaded slayerlogi. Speed > tank. Just look at min assaults Min assaults have versitility; that's more important than speed or tank Rule 34.6.1: every parody will have a crossover
maybe deadcatz Horizons' Edge No Context 183	Posted - 2015.06.18 21:16:00 - [24] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Because they don't need them or it doesn't fit their racial doctrine. Why don't assaults get a bonus to every light weapon ever? Why can't I fit a 5 slot armor tank on my cal-scout? Just because you see the only purpose of a logi being chained to a heavy repping them, doesn't mean that it's true. Caldari = Seige warfare, entrench and fortify - Nanohives & injectors fit this. Amarr = Armored warfare, bring bigger heavier suits than your opponent can - amarr logi shortens the supply lines required to do this. Gallente = Information warfare, know what your enemies intend to do and deny them information in return - active scanners fit this. Minmatar = Skirmish warfare, be able to relocate frequently - rep tools fit this by sustaining the 'weaker' but more versatile suits through fights they shouldn't straight up win with reps, allowing them to be everywhere. This guy. Just said the most inteligent thing ever. Too bad most of us are morons and stick to crutch methods and suits. Ewar? What's that? Some kind of new crutch? Learn how to use your eyes and ears you maggots. Batteskirts for the win!!
P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1	Posted - 2015.06.18 21:35:00 - [25] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. why not just give them more HP? seems like the more logical move seeing as how they are repurposed assault frames that need to be heavier to carry more equipment. Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. Assaults have a higher base HP. A max HP stacked logi will probably have the same speed/HP as a base assault after the speed swap.. Slayer logis will not return, not like they were anyways. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
el OPERATOR Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:01:00 - [26] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Just because you see the only purpose of a logi being chained to a heavy repping them, doesn't mean that it's true. Caldari = Seige warfare, entrench and fortify - Nanohives & injectors fit this. Amarr = Armored warfare, bring bigger heavier suits than your opponent can - amarr logi shortens the supply lines required to do this. Gallente = Information warfare, know what your enemies intend to do and deny them information in return - active scanners fit this. Minmatar = Skirmish warfare, be able to relocate frequently - rep tools fit this by sustaining the 'weaker' but more versatile suits through fights they shouldn't straight up win with reps, allowing them to be everywhere. One of the best breakdowns of Logi racial meta I've seen in a while. You should get this stickied for inclusion with w/e npe or intro to dust materials are being planned. Open-Beta Vet. CAPCRO Nomad. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR
REDBACK96USMC NORTH K0REA 208	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:12:00 - [27] - Quote I logibro'd my first full match the other night just because I was feeling lazy. 4500k in the Shaman suit no sweat 4/5/2.... Read what Mina posted also. Although I hate the common secrets being let out, follow those roles and you will easily top the board most matches. Well until the alcohol kicks in, you try to scramble pistol people only while supposedly being the logi of the group.... or jihad jeep dropships that fly too low.
Dzago Sevatarion DUST University Ivy League 27	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:15:00 - [28] - Quote Caldari logistics is something I play a lot of because I'm a masochist who makes bad life decisions, and while the bonuses aren't bad for my MMR (many games I'm one of the few with a nanohive) I'd prefer something like a shield repair tool bonus instead. Gallente and Minmatar bonuses are active (fun), Caldari and Amarr are far too passive (boring).
P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:38:00 - [29] - Quote REDBACK96USMC wrote: I logibro'd my first full match the other night just because I was feeling lazy. 4500k in the Shaman suit no sweat 4/5/2.... Read what Mina posted also. Although I hate the common secrets being let out, follow those roles and you will easily top the board most matches. Well until the alcohol kicks in, you try to scramble pistol people only while supposedly being the logi of the group.... or jihad jeep dropships that fly too low. You will only get those kinds of points with a min logi ramming a rep tool up a good heavy's @ss. Gal logis don't get points for scanning unless the squad is doing all the killing. Amarr logis have to stay alive and hope that people spawn on their equipment. Cal logis? Lol. I actually don't play a callogi, but nanohive spam is real, yet I never see callogis. Quick edit: I'm a pretty good logi, and I only average about 1500 wp a game in my amarr/gal. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
Radiant Pancake3 THE REBEL FEDERATION 162	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:45:00 - [30] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: REDBACK96USMC wrote: I logibro'd my first full match the other night just because I was feeling lazy. 4500k in the Shaman suit no sweat 4/5/2.... Read what Mina posted also. Although I hate the common secrets being let out, follow those roles and you will easily top the board most matches. Well until the alcohol kicks in, you try to scramble pistol people only while supposedly being the logi of the group.... or jihad jeep dropships that fly too low. You will only get those kinds of points with a min logi ramming a rep tool up a good heavy's @ss. Gal logis don't get points for scanning unless the squad is doing all the killing. Amarr logis have to stay alive and hope that people spawn on their equipment. Cal logis? Lol. I actually don't play a callogi, but nanohive spam is real, yet I never see callogis. Quick edit: I'm a pretty good logi, and I only average about 1500 wp a game in my amarr/gal. I got 4500 WP in a min logi without shoving my Rep tool up a heavy's arse. I am the Clown of Ass or am I the Ass of Clown... o.O Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ Minmatar Loyalist Gû¼Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉGòÉn¦ñ

P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1	Posted - 2015.06.18 22:50:00 - [31] - Quote Radiant Pancake3 wrote: I got 4500 WP in a min logi without shoving my Rep tool up a heavy's arse. You were still in a min logi. And I'm not saying that I haven't gotten 4500 wp before, actually my best is about 5800. Its not typical though, especially in anything other than a min logi. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
Dzago Sevatarion DUST University Ivy League 28	Posted - 2015.06.19 05:39:00 - [32] - Quote Tonight I skilled into Gallente scout and discovered the level 1 suit has as many equipment slots as the level 1 Caldari logistics suit. CCP pls. :camby: :scust:
Foo Fighting Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 381	Posted - 2015.06.19 08:08:00 - [33] - Quote Cal logis could benefit from an increase in bandwidth as a bonus along with an increase to nanohive deployed total. Then they could lay multiple rep and ammo hives. Amarr could benefit from an increase in deployed links and the bonus should only cancel on spawning in a different suit rather than on death. Gal and Min are fine. All could use increased movement speed.
jordy mack WarRavens 554	Posted - 2015.06.19 13:15:00 - [34] - Quote if wp are used to encorouge equip use, and any point-whoring logi with a rep tool will tell u... they are. this is how i imagine whoring each race: give cal logi an additional injector upgrade bonus, +%hp restored and +%points maybe. ammar just needs to be not broken. everyone would choose the half time links if they hung around. also maybe a uplink hp bonus? gal scanners get assists off anyone they scan for, but... :) when you're in squad = only your squad see the scan when your're not in a squad=everyone else who is not in a squad see your scans. maybe increase scan assist points? min logi is pretty cool, incoming speed buff should help survival. just gimme a decent vehicle rep tool ccp! Less QQ more PewPew
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 859	Posted - 2015.06.19 13:30:00 - [35] - Quote jordy mack wrote: if wp are used to encorouge equip use, and any point-whoring logi with a rep tool will tell u... they are. this is how i imagine whoring each race: give cal logi an additional injector upgrade bonus, +%hp restored and +%points maybe. ammar just needs to be not broken. everyone would choose the half time links if they hung around. also maybe a uplink hp bonus? gal scanners get assists off anyone they scan for, but... :) when you're in squad = only your squad see the scan when your're not in a squad=everyone else who is not in a squad see your scans. maybe increase scan assist points? min logi is pretty cool, incoming speed buff should help survival. just gimme a decent vehicle rep tool ccp! Or just give every logi a bonus to the rep tool with the min logi being the best to use it on. Wanna play eve?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 10	Posted - 2015.06.19 15:15:00 - [36] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. It's also the reason why assaults are going to get smacked. The point of Rattati's Speed / HP Curve is to ensure an inverse relationship between the two metrics. If Logis are to be slower than Assaults, they should have more HP than Assaults. If Logis are to maintain HP levels which are lower than Assaults, then they should be faster than Assaults. My two cents, of course. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 859	Posted - 2015.06.19 16:23:00 - [37] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Giving a suit the capacity to stack more HP than others whilst still being faster is the reason scouts got smacked. This is gonna lead to the same thing with logis. It's also the reason why assaults are going to get smacked. The point of Rattati's Speed / HP Curve is to ensure an inverse relationship between the two metrics. If Logis are to be slower than Assaults, they should have more HP than Assaults. If Logis are to maintain HP levels which are lower than Assaults, then they should be faster than Assaults. My two cents, of course. Which is why I want them to get more HP. Wanna play eve?
Boot Booter Dead Man's Game 1	Posted - 2015.06.19 16:48:00 - [38] - Quote Logis are fine as is. Lucky for you though ratatti has already mentioned a buff to their speed.
Baltazar Pontain Blauhelme E.B.O.L.A. 164	Posted - 2015.06.19 16:55:00 - [39] - Quote I play a lot logi. Amarr, Gallente and Minmatar At the moment I like Amarr logi most. It is so cool to support your team with ultra fast uplinks and also be able to fight well. A long time I played minmatar and was a rep slave but I needed a change badly. My personal opinion is that those logis are all fine. But I lack experience with caldari logi. I will skill him next and be curious how it performs.
Alcina Nektaria KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 27	Posted - 2015.06.19 17:10:00 - [40] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Radiant Pancake3 wrote: I got 4500 WP in a min logi without shoving my Rep tool up a heavy's arse. You were still in a min logi. And I'm not saying that I haven't gotten 4500 wp before, actually my best is about 5800. Its not typical though, especially in anything other than a min logi. I beg to differ. I'm a bred Gal Logi and before I started using other roles on the field, I would average roughly 4500-5500 wp just about every match. (Before the Logi nerf of Hotfix Echo - AKA the worst moment in Dust history) That average was purely from uplinks, nanohives, needles, and a somewhat decent amount of reps. My best wp score was 9900wp. (Even after hotfix Echo and on a really good day) On some other good days my following high scores ranged between 7200 and 8500. So to say that higher scores are not typical in anything other and a Min Logi is just extremely incorrect. Survivability of the Logi is what will make your ability to get higher wp totals. *KEQ Diplomat* Gallente Loyalist ... Come at me bro.

Alcina Nektaria KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 27	Posted - 2015.06.19 17:12:00 - [41] - Quote Baltazar Pontain wrote: I play a lot logi. Amarr, Gallente and Minmatar At the moment I like Amarr logi most. It is so cool to support your team with ultra fast uplinks and also be able to fight well. A long time I played minmatar and was a rep slave but I needed a change badly. My personal opinion is that those logis are all fine. But I lack experience with caldari logi. I will skill him next and be curious how it performs. I myself find that I hate when people think I'm their slave, only useful for reps. Good players don't really need a logi to be stuck up their ass, they need a logi to focus on the important things like uplinks, ammo, and scans with an occasional pickup or rep. *KEQ Diplomat* Gallente Loyalist ... Come at me bro.
Her Chosen Grade No.2 320	Posted - 2015.06.19 17:12:00 - [42] - Quote Apocalyptic Destroyerr wrote: Anyone else feel like the Logi is lacking ? I feel it's not where it should be. I rarely see them around at all. I'm talking about Bonuses and their Performance ! The Minmitar Logi I feel is working properly no change needed there. The bonuses it gets to the repair tool is a great bonus. This Logi I see always on the field, behind tanked out suits. The Amarr Logi is useless due to the bonus disappearing when you die. What's the point of this ? Do they expect you to stay alive 24/7 ? I feel this should be changed to if you die and change suits, the bonus disappears. Otherwise this Logi is Scrap. The Caldari Logi is what I feel is underperforming. Although it does get bonuses to basically all its equipment, but just about everybody carries either a needle or Nanohives on their suit. I don't know how to fix this. Now the Gal Logi is an interesting one, I can say its on par with with the Minmitar Logi as performaning properly. If fitted properly, this Logi can certainly help the team greatly win battles. This Logi is usually always seen. Honestly, this is what's wrong with logis! People like YOU. You're a support role, but all you want is to farm WP. THAT'S why you see Min Logis over most others. God forbid you play your role in your race and not get 5000 easy WP every match... Just because it's not a WP gluten doesn't mean its under-performing. Logis are in a good place balanced with the rest of the suits (save Commandos, those may need still work) For ever logi you think is good, there is a scrub out there. For every logi you say lacks, their is a superstar that does great with it. https://youtu.be/CK5iYkTGJZs That dark cloud Latest Upload
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 859	Posted - 2015.06.19 17:15:00 - [43] - Quote The minmatar logi is in a good place and the gal logi isn't far behind. Amarr and caldari logis are rather pointless. No one needs a cal logi cos everyone can carry godly numbers of hives and the amarr logi loses its bonus when dead. Why use them if they are sub par? Wanna play eve?
P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1	Posted - 2015.06.19 20:27:00 - [44] - Quote Alcina Nektaria wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Radiant Pancake3 wrote: I got 4500 WP in a min logi without shoving my Rep tool up a heavy's arse. You were still in a min logi. And I'm not saying that I haven't gotten 4500 wp before, actually my best is about 5800. Its not typical though, especially in anything other than a min logi. I beg to differ. I'm a bred Gal Logi and before I started using other roles on the field, I would average roughly 4500-5500 wp just about every match. (Before the Logi nerf of Hotfix Echo - AKA the worst moment in Dust history) That average was purely from uplinks, nanohives, needles, and a somewhat decent amount of reps. My best wp score was 9900wp. (Even after hotfix Echo and on a really good day) On some other good days my following high scores ranged between 7200 and 8500. So to say that higher scores are not typical in anything other and a Min Logi is just extremely incorrect. Survivability of the Logi is what will make your ability to get higher wp totals. Videos or it didn't happen. As of maybe 6 months ago, shayz posted a video of a 7200 wp game. He was tearin **** up the whole match. I can't see how you could be getting that every match. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
Sylwester Dziewiecki 479	Posted - 2015.06.19 21:33:00 - [45] - Quote Being Minmitar Logi is boring as ****, it's all about spawning in right spot, dropping Uplinks and starting to repair everything even if it is fully repair just to get some guardian points, and that's pretty much it to end of the match. There are matches were I will not shot a single bullet but end up on the top.. /boring G Speed Scout. MM Logi/Assault. EVE side of me: Nosum Hseebnrido
Her Chosen Grade No.2 322	Posted - 2015.06.19 21:44:00 - [46] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: The minmatar logi is in a good place and the gal logi isn't far behind. Amarr and caldari logis are rather pointless. No one needs a cal logi cos everyone can carry godly numbers of hives and the amarr logi loses its bonus when dead. Why use them if they are sub par? You mean the Amarr logi bonues is like all other bonuses? Only effective when alive... You can't use a scanner whilst dead, nor rep... The Amarr Logi carries the most HP and has a sidearm so as to not die as often as it's peers... If you're dying to much as a logi, that's your problem, not the game's as far as Cal logi... I love when there is one on the field. The fact that I can run through a nanohive just once, instead of staying in the bubble allows me to continue assaulting. Honestly, the cal logi is quite critical when used with the proper gank squad. That dark cloud Latest Upload
Georgia Xavier Y.A.M.A.H No Context 713	Posted - 2015.06.19 21:50:00 - [47] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Because eve is an entirely different game as I've **ing said and you cannot directly translate mechanics from one game to another. Otherwise I'd be running around in a caldari electronic warfare specialist making it so that no one else can even **ing shoot their guns at me. So why does the minmatar get a bonus to the repair tool if being a logi is an entirely different thing??? Dont tell me its different if one race can have and the others cant just because. See here you're comparing Ships to suits that in if itself is strange enough and what are you talking about? He is saying just because one game has it does not mean this game will be just as good with it. Again that is a ship battle, this is an fps Click me
jordy mack warravens 554	Posted - 2015.06.19 22:00:00 - [48] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: jordy mack wrote: if wp are used to encorouge equip use, and any point-whoring logi with a rep tool will tell u... they are. this is how i imagine whoring each race: give cal logi an additional injector upgrade bonus, +%hp restored and +%points maybe. ammar just needs to be not broken. everyone would choose the half time links if they hung around. also maybe a uplink hp bonus? gal scanners get assists off anyone they scan for, but... :) when you're in squad = only your squad see the scan when your're not in a squad=everyone else who is not in a squad see your scans. maybe increase scan assist points? min logi is pretty cool, incoming speed buff should help survival. just gimme a decent vehicle rep tool ccp! Or just give every logi a bonus to the rep tool with the min logi being the best to use it on. nah, sounds like u skilled into the wrong logi and are now jealous of minmatar. you'll get more sp dont worry. Less QQ more PewPew
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.19 23:44:00 - [49] - Quote jordy mack wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: jordy mack wrote: if wp are used to encorouge equip use, and any point-whoring logi with a rep tool will tell u... they are. this is how i imagine whoring each race: give cal logi an additional injector upgrade bonus, +%hp restored and +%points maybe. ammar just needs to be not broken. everyone would choose the half time links if they hung around. also maybe a uplink hp bonus? gal scanners get assists off anyone they scan for, but... :) when you're in squad = only your squad see the scan when your're not in a squad=everyone else who is not in a squad see your scans. maybe increase scan assist points? min logi is pretty cool, incoming speed buff should help survival. just gimme a decent vehicle rep tool ccp! Or just give every logi a bonus to the rep tool with the min logi being the best to use it on. nah, sounds like u skilled into the wrong logi and are now jealous of minmatar. you'll get more sp dont worry. Don't try be a ****. I have 3 logis. It makes little sense that a suit designed to keep players up and resupplied doesn't get a bonus to the main piece of equipment that does this. Wanna play eve?
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.19 23:50:00 - [50] - Quote Georgia Xavier wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Because eve is an entirely different game as I've **ing said and you cannot directly translate mechanics from one game to another. Otherwise I'd be running around in a caldari electronic warfare specialist making it so that no one else can even **ing shoot their guns at me. So why does the minmatar get a bonus to the repair tool if being a logi is an entirely different thing??? Dont tell me its different if one race can have and the others cant just because. See here you're comparing Ships to suits that in if itself is strange enough and what are you talking about? He is saying just because one game has it does not mean this game will be just as good with it. Again that is a ship battle, this is an fps So why does the min logi get the bonus then? Not a single person can explain why. I keep getting told it can't transfer over from a ship sim to an fps yet the min logi gets a bonus like the one in EVE. Don't you see the lack of logic in thta argument? Wanna play eve?

Dzago Sevatarion DUST University Ivy League 30	Posted - 2015.06.20 02:09:00 - [51] - Quote Flimsy justification, but Minmatar are hit and run fighters so giving them a repair tool bonus let's them ensure their team can go back to skirmishing with the enemy more quickly. Flimsy though, like I said. You could accomplish this same thematic goal by letting them give teammates kinetic catalyzer-type enhancements (perhaps at the cost of their own movement speed).
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 02:16:00 - [52] - Quote Dzago Sevatarion wrote: Flimsy justification, but Minmatar are hit and run fighters so giving them a repair tool bonus let's them ensure their team can go back to skirmishing with the enemy more quickly. Flimsy though, like I said. You could accomplish this same thematic goal by letting them give teammates kinetic catalyzer-type enhancements (perhaps at the cost of their own movement speed). Hit and run is not what the rep tool is for. The rep tool is for prolonged engagements. If you wanted justification for a decent hit and run bonus it would be self tank rep Wanna play eve?
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 02:43:00 - [53] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Georgia Xavier wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Because eve is an entirely different game as I've **ing said and you cannot directly translate mechanics from one game to another. Otherwise I'd be running around in a caldari electronic warfare specialist making it so that no one else can even *ing shoot their guns at me. So why does the minmatar get a bonus to the repair tool if being a logi is an entirely different thing??? Dont tell me its different if one race can have and the others cant just because. See here you're comparing Ships to suits that in if itself is strange enough and what are you talking about? He is saying just because one game has it does not mean this game will be just as good with it. Again that is a ship battle, this is an fps So why does the min logi get the bonus then? Not a single person can explain why. I keep getting told it can't transfer over from a ship sim to an fps yet the min logi gets a bonus like the one in EVE. Don't you see the lack of logic in thta argument? We have explained, you haven't listened to our explanation. To reiterate the min logi gets it because it most fits skirmish warfare aside from that you are seeing a parallel where it doesn't truly exist. Why do you feel that EVERY LOGI needs to have a rep tool bonus? I mean you can fit one anyways if you want to and all you miss out on is at most +20reps/sec and a few meters of range in exchange for specialization elsewhere. Logi's aren't about warpoint whoring. As a callogi I can toss down a state proto nanohive and completely restock a persons ammo in two cycles, using 4 nanites... of my ~108 nanites in that SINGULAR hive. I could literally keep anyone near me supplied with ammo and grenades for days. Echo 1991 wrote:* Hit and run is not what the rep tool is for. The rep tool is for prolonged engagements. If you wanted justification for a decent hit and run bonus it would be self tank rep Only if you're warpoint whoring. The (proto) rep tool is useful to help take someone who would normally not survive a fight and allow them to push through their opponents. The basic and adv rep tools are for repairing allies between fights (aka skirmishes). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Alcina Nektaria KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 28	Posted - 2015.06.20 13:57:00 - [54] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Alcina Nektaria wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Radiant Pancake3 wrote: I got 4500 WP in a min logi without shoving my Rep tool up a heavy's arse. You were still in a min logi. And I'm not saying that I haven't gotten 4500 wp before, actually my best is about 5800. Its not typical though, especially in anything other than a min logi. I beg to differ. I'm a bred Gal Logi and before I started using other roles on the field, I would average roughly 4500-5500 wp just about every match. (Before the Logi nerf of Hotfix Echo - AKA the worst moment in Dust history) That average was purely from uplinks, nanohives, needles, and a somewhat decent amount of reps. My best wp score was 9900wp. (Even after hotfix Echo and on a really good day) On some other good days my following high scores ranged between 7200 and 8500. So to say that higher scores are not typical in anything other and a Min Logi is just extremely incorrect. Survivability of the Logi is what will make your ability to get higher wp totals. Videos or it didn't happen. As of maybe 6 months ago, shayz posted a video of a 7200 wp game. He was tearin ** up the whole match. I can't see how you could be getting that every match. Unfortunately some of us don't have that capability. I'll find more of my pics for you though. I like the challenge of proving you even more wrong http://i.imgur.com/pGxeKDu.jpg KEQ Diplomat** Gallente Loyalist ... Come at me bro.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 14:01:00 - [55] - Quote Having your own decent self repair fits skirmish warfare better than having someone with a rep tool do it. And WP whoring aside, it makes the most sense that a suit that's main role is repairing and resupplying gets a bonus to the one piece of equipment that helps them to do that. I also think that all logis should get bonuses to all equipment so that every logi is better carrying out their role. The main bonus they get should make their racial equipment better on their suit and the others should get a smaller bonus so they are better than other suit that can carry equipment except that logi. I personally don't think a logi should be stuck to only being good at one thing. Wanna play eve?
postapo wastelander Corrosive Synergy No Context 1	Posted - 2015.06.20 14:06:00 - [56] - Quote Powerh8er wrote: Logis need more speed. Also the time it takes switching from rep tool to weapon is too damn long. Yup boyko we need, how i should help my squad if even heavies are faster than me XD "The Monolith of Corrosive Synergy"
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 15:06:00 - [57] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Having your own decent self repair fits skirmish warfare better than having someone with a rep tool do it. And WP whoring aside, it makes the most sense that a suit that's main role is repairing and resupplying gets a bonus to the one piece of equipment that helps them to do that. I also think that all logis should get bonuses to all equipment so that every logi is better carrying out their role. The main bonus they get should make their racial equipment better on their suit and the others should get a smaller bonus so they are better than other suit that can carry equipment except that logi. I personally don't think a logi should be stuck to only being good at one thing. So you're just largely going to ignore what other people have said then eh? Well, delocalized repping is better for skirmish warfare as it allows you to truly min-max your suits as you can rely on someone else for reps. This is something that's demonstrable in eve where a lot of the 'power' fleets rely on a handful of logi's to provide all the reps (and usually much better reps than any individual ship could mount), in exchange for not fitting local tanks (and instead fitting buffer) they can fit damage mods or the like. The logistics role is not about repairing or resupplying unless you are playing a minmatar or caldari logi. Minmatar are the rep logi's it is also a known fact that repair tools provide disproportionate WP gains. Caldari are the re-supply logi's. The universal bonus that makes logi's better than say assaults is the fitting cost reductions for equipment and the three to four equipment slots. You can use whatever equipment you choose, you do not need a bonus to it. If you don't like what a particular logi is oriented towards don't **ing skill into it. logi's are not just about repping people and warpoint whoring. claiming or believing that they are is an incredibly narrow viewpoint. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian.** I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 15:34:00 - [58] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Having your own decent self repair fits skirmish warfare better than having someone with a rep tool do it. And WP whoring aside, it makes the most sense that a suit that's main role is repairing and resupplying gets a bonus to the one piece of equipment that helps them to do that. I also think that all logis should get bonuses to all equipment so that every logi is better carrying out their role. The main bonus they get should make their racial equipment better on their suit and the others should get a smaller bonus so they are better than other suit that can carry equipment except that logi. I personally don't think a logi should be stuck to only being good at one thing. So you're just largely going to ignore what other people have said then eh? Well, delocalized repping is better for skirmish warfare as it allows you to truly min-max your suits as you can rely on someone else for reps. This is something that's demonstrable in eve where a lot of the 'power' fleets rely on a handful of logi's to provide all the reps (and usually much better reps than any individual ship could mount), in exchange for not fitting local tanks (and instead fitting buffer) they can fit damage mods or the like. The logistics role is not about repairing or resupplying unless you are playing a minmatar or caldari logi. Minmatar are the rep logi's it is also a known fact that repair tools provide disproportionate WP gains. Caldari are the re-supply logi's. The universal bonus that makes logi's better than say assaults is the fitting cost reductions for equipment and the three to four equipment slots. You can use whatever equipment you choose, you do not need a bonus to it. If you don't like what a particular logi is oriented towards don't **ing skill into it. logi's are not just about repping people and warpoint whoring**. claiming or believing that they are is an incredibly narrow viewpoint. I never said thats just what the logi is all that it is for, i said that resupplying and repairing are its main role. Keeping you alive and restocking your ammo. I want logis to have a clear advantage with the equipment they can carry so it is better than suits that aren't logis. A fitting bonus doesnt make your equipment better, you can just carry more. Each logi should be proficient at carrying different pieces of equipment not just one because it is racial. I dont care if the amont of WPs for repping is lowered, i dont care about them, I just feel that lois should get effeciency bonuses to all equipment as not to limit their functionality. Oh and repping has nothing to do with skirmish warfare. Thats all about speed an you wouldn't take a logi when it cant keep up. Wanna play eve?
Mina Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 15:49:00 - [59] - Quote "My narrow view is the only thing that's true". And you wonder why people are unwilling to engage with you on this subject? The short of it is that you're wrong, and you're too stubborn to even listen to people explain where and why you are wrong. So I have to say I'm leaving this thread here, because it's just going to be the same thing over and over otherwise, you're going to go "WELL LOGI'S SHOULD HAVE A BONUS TO ALL EQUIPMENT" and someone's going to go "This list of reasons is why that isn't the case" and you're going to go "WELL I STILL THINK THIS AND I'M GOING TO IGNORE WHATEVER U SAID". You might even resort to some more flawed parallels, or other inane failings of reasoning. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:08:00 - [60] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: "My narrow view is the only thing that's true". And you wonder why people are unwilling to engage with you on this subject? I haven't been like that, i've merely stated that i wanted logis to be better at using equipment than any of the other suits that can carry equipment. Which makes sense as they are meant to support the team. Wanna play eve?

Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:09:00 - [61] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: "My narrow view is the only thing that's true". And you wonder why people are unwilling to engage with you on this subject? The short of it is that you're wrong, and you're too stubborn to even listen to people explain where and why you are wrong. So I have to say I'm leaving this thread here, because it's just going to be the same thing over and over otherwise, you're going to go "WELL LOGI'S SHOULD HAVE A BONUS TO ALL EQUIPMENT" and someone's going to go "This list of reasons is why that isn't the case" and you're going to go "WELL I STILL THINK THIS AND I'M GOING TO IGNORE WHATEVER U SAID". You might even resort to some more flawed parallels, or other inane failings of reasoning. You havent listed reasons why they shoudn't, you've listed reasons why they get their current bonuses. Wanna play eve?
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:09:00 - [62] - Quote And we have explained that they are. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:24:00 - [63] - Quote Ok Mina, Actually explain why you feel Logis shouldnt be better at using equipment than other suits. Aside from the different warfare types which you got wrong, you havent tried to explain why they shouldnt. If you give valid reasons I'll drop it and i'll admit you are right. Wanna play eve?
Mina Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:33:00 - [64] - Quote ^lol. I got the different racial warfare types wrong? How? Literally, I am asking you to prove how I am wrong, cause I can point to a variety of ships in eve that get bonuses to specific warfare link types, and even to the specific patches that changed them from their single role bonuses (caldari = siege, amarr = armored, gallente = information, minmatar = skirmish) to when they were made to cover broader influences. I also provided a well reasoned explanation for how these 'doctrines' translate into dust. You are also misrepresenting my position. I have never said logi's shouldn't be better at using equipment than other suits. In fact what I have said is that they are better at using equipment than non-logi's. In short. I still don't need to prove you wrong, because you've yet to prove yourself right and a large number of people have been pointing out where your information is incorrect, relying upon flawed understanding or just poorly reasoned. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Echo 1991 Dead Man's Game 860	Posted - 2015.06.20 16:46:00 - [65] - Quote Logis are better at using one piece of equipment each, that can hardly be considered better than other suits just because it can use one thing better. If in EVE they dont have to have the bonuses just to one specific type, why should a logi be the same if they can do 2 or even 3 types of different warfare effectively? Wanna play eve?
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.06.20 17:31:00 - [66] - Quote Yes, logi's get a targeted specialization... they also get a cost reduction and three or four equipment slots and large increases in pg/cpu over other fits. So they're better by virtue of being able to fit a lot of good equipment without having to sacrifice a fit and having that targeted specialty. They don't also on top of that need to be able to use every piece of equipment better than a non-logi, that's unbalanced. Eve. Is. A. Different. Game. And. You. Cannot. Make. Accurate. Direct. Comparisons. To. Dust. With. It. Stop. Trying. To. In eve logi's are oriented around remote repair - as they have command ships for fleet boosting, covert ops for scanning, recons for ewar and etcetera. Dust does not have four types of 'medium frame' per race with 6 further specialized ships on top of that (2 Heavy assaults, 2 recons, 1 logistics, 1 heavy interdictor, not counting strategic cruisers either)... in fact there's something like uh, 40-60? ships per race in eve and most typically have very, very specialized roles. Dust does not have the same level of diversity or hyper-specialization, so stop trying to make direct ing comparisions between the two games as every single comparison you have made is ing wrong. I have to ask at this point, do you even PLAY eve? Have you ever? Because I started with eve back in 2007 and I've done *everything* in that game short of joining a nullsec alliance. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.


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