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HOLY PERFECTION FINAL TRIBULATION 115	Posted - 2015.09.03 02:18:00 - [121] - Quote MythTanker wrote: My 1000 Officers Forge Guns are laughing at you all why? **Wise people learn from their mistakes, the wisest person learns from others mistakes. Unfortunately i am too hard head
HOLY PERFECTION FINAL TRIBULATION 117	Posted - 2015.09.03 03:02:00 - [122] - Quote E-Rock wrote: Vehicle users shouldn't complain about any AV users. Ohh your poooooor tanks and dropships. Cry me a river. Most tankers just come out of the red line with their dual armor gardeners kill a bunch of ground troops then return to the red line. As a ground troop I can 1v1 a tank of and only if I sneak up on them. The range on swarms is not as wonderful as it used to be and getting a lock on with swarms is not as simple as you might thing. Tanks are extremely strong. If you get got by a ground troop or troops, learn how to pilot vehicles better. Cry me a river, buddy. I don't hide in the redline, I'm a blaster Maddie and stay until I die. And cry me a river of blood you AV punk XD **Wise people learn from their mistakes, the wisest person learns from others mistakes. Unfortunately i am too hard head
Mikel Arias Challengers 506 192	Posted - 2015.09.03 04:36:00 - [123] - Quote HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: "I spent 1.2 million ISK, so I shouldn't die, ever." Honestly just make tanks the same price as dropsuits and make them soloable. The imbalance of power being validated by ISK cost is getting old and it doesn't benefit either side. NOT WHAT IM SAYING. im saying my tank should not be as easily taken out. by 2 swarmers if ima GV.0. Thats all im saying, im not trying to be invensible I have seen a single tank taking fire of 2 swarms and my plasma cannon (yeah, yeah, the plasma is for shields) and keep going as if nothing had happened. Of course, he had hardeners on (at least one). Now, swarms are a pain in the ass for shield tanks, because once the shield is out there is not enough armor to take one hit. And armor tanks, without hardeners do get wracked My point, with hardeners everything is a lot easier, but without them... I get now when people complain about swarms, but instead of nerfing them, there should be an increase of general HP to tanks while reducing hardeners effectiveness or not allowing to fit more than one. Maybe both. This way a tank could take more damage, requiring more players attacking it with AV weapons. And with the modifications to the hardeners, this module could become a piece to use more tactically (engaging multiple AV players, another tank) instead of using them to get in and out just like that (godmode, I recall some saying that once). Im pretty sure it sounds crazy, but with a buff in HP, tanks could stop relying so much in the hardeners, but for this this module needs to be changed in the way it works (as I was saying). So, an armor tank could be around 6000 armor hp. and with 2500 shield hp, while the shield tanks could be around 7000 shield hp and 1500 armor hp. And the hardeners, besides allowing just one module, could be changed to a 30%. Crazy, yes, but I think it could be really interesting.
HOLY PERFECTION FINAL TRIBULATION 117	Posted - 2015.09.03 10:46:00 - [124] - Quote Mikel Arias wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: "I spent 1.2 million ISK, so I shouldn't die, ever." Honestly just make tanks the same price as dropsuits and make them soloable. The imbalance of power being validated by ISK cost is getting old and it doesn't benefit either side. NOT WHAT IM SAYING. im saying my tank should not be as easily taken out. by 2 swarmers if ima GV.0. Thats all im saying, im not trying to be invensible I have seen a single tank taking fire of 2 swarms and my plasma cannon (yeah, yeah, the plasma is for shields) and keep going as if nothing had happened. Of course, he had hardeners on (at least one). Now, swarms are a pain in the ass for shield tanks, because once the shield is out there is not enough armor to take one hit. And armor tanks, without hardeners do get wracked My point, with hardeners everything is a lot easier, but without them... I get now when people complain about swarms, but instead of nerfing them, there should be an increase of general HP to tanks while reducing hardeners effectiveness or not allowing to fit more than one. Maybe both. This way a tank could take more damage, requiring more players attacking it with AV weapons. And with the modifications to the hardeners, this module could become a piece to use more tactically (engaging multiple AV players, another tank) instead of using them to get in and out just like that (godmode, I recall some saying that once). Im pretty sure it sounds crazy, but with a buff in HP, tanks could stop relying so much in the hardeners, but for this this module needs to be changed in the way it works (as I was saying). So, an armor tank could be around 6000 armor hp. and with 2500 shield hp, while the shield tanks could be around 7000 shield hp and 1500 armor hp. And the hardeners, besides allowing just one module, could be changed to a 30%. Crazy, yes, but I think it could be really interesting. Well that tells you something about swarms then. Tankers NEED hardeners to survive and that's sad. CCP said they wanted us to use hardeners, but I'm not sure they ment depend 24/7 on them. I say nerf the living crap out of av, then you can modify out tanks. Deal? **Wise people learn from their mistakes, the wisest person learns from others mistakes. Unfortunately i am too hard head
Echo 1991 Corrosive Synergy No Context 932	Posted - 2015.09.03 11:05:00 - [125] - Quote HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Mikel Arias wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: "I spent 1.2 million ISK, so I shouldn't die, ever." Honestly just make tanks the same price as dropsuits and make them soloable. The imbalance of power being validated by ISK cost is getting old and it doesn't benefit either side. NOT WHAT IM SAYING. im saying my tank should not be as easily taken out. by 2 swarmers if ima GV.0. Thats all im saying, im not trying to be invensible I have seen a single tank taking fire of 2 swarms and my plasma cannon (yeah, yeah, the plasma is for shields) and keep going as if nothing had happened. Of course, he had hardeners on (at least one). Now, swarms are a pain in the ass for shield tanks, because once the shield is out there is not enough armor to take one hit. And armor tanks, without hardeners do get wracked My point, with hardeners everything is a lot easier, but without them... I get now when people complain about swarms, but instead of nerfing them, there should be an increase of general HP to tanks while reducing hardeners effectiveness or not allowing to fit more than one. Maybe both. This way a tank could take more damage, requiring more players attacking it with AV weapons. And with the modifications to the hardeners, this module could become a piece to use more tactically (engaging multiple AV players, another tank) instead of using them to get in and out just like that (godmode, I recall some saying that once). Im pretty sure it sounds crazy, but with a buff in HP, tanks could stop relying so much in the hardeners, but for this this module needs to be changed in the way it works (as I was saying). So, an armor tank could be around 6000 armor hp. and with 2500 shield hp, while the shield tanks could be around 7000 shield hp and 1500 armor hp. And the hardeners, besides allowing just one module, could be changed to a 30%. Crazy, yes, but I think it could be really interesting. Well that tells you something about swarms then. Tankers NEED hardeners to survive and that's sad. CCP said they wanted us to use hardeners, but I'm not sure they ment depend 24/7 on them. I say nerf the living crap out of av, then you can modify out tanks. Deal? No it doesn't. It tells me that an armour tank with hardeners is God mode. Tanks should not be able to roll around at all times barely taking damage, if they did it would be stupid. This also tells you absolutely nothing about swarms, if your tank has any form of Hp you can drive away from a swarmer fairly easily. I will say though that tank HP shouldn't have been lowered like it was, it needs an increase and hardeners need a nerf. Wanna play eve?
HOLY PERFECTION FINAL TRIBULATION 118	Posted - 2015.09.03 11:12:00 - [126] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Mikel Arias wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: "I spent 1.2 million ISK, so I shouldn't die, ever." Honestly just make tanks the same price as dropsuits and make them soloable. The imbalance of power being validated by ISK cost is getting old and it doesn't benefit either side. NOT WHAT IM SAYING. im saying my tank should not be as easily taken out. by 2 swarmers if ima GV.0. Thats all im saying, im not trying to be invensible I have seen a single tank taking fire of 2 swarms and my plasma cannon (yeah, yeah, the plasma is for shields) and keep going as if nothing had happened. Of course, he had hardeners on (at least one). Now, swarms are a pain in the ass for shield tanks, because once the shield is out there is not enough armor to take one hit. And armor tanks, without hardeners do get wracked My point, with hardeners everything is a lot easier, but without them... I get now when people complain about swarms, but instead of nerfing them, there should be an increase of general HP to tanks while reducing hardeners effectiveness or not allowing to fit more than one. Maybe both. This way a tank could take more damage, requiring more players attacking it with AV weapons. And with the modifications to the hardeners, this module could become a piece to use more tactically (engaging multiple AV players, another tank) instead of using them to get in and out just like that (godmode, I recall some saying that once). Im pretty sure it sounds crazy, but with a buff in HP, tanks could stop relying so much in the hardeners, but for this this module needs to be changed in the way it works (as I was saying). So, an armor tank could be around 6000 armor hp. and with 2500 shield hp, while the shield tanks could be around 7000 shield hp and 1500 armor hp. And the hardeners, besides allowing just one module, could be changed to a 30%. Crazy, yes, but I think it could be really interesting. Well that tells you something about swarms then. Tankers NEED hardeners to survive and that's sad. CCP said they wanted us to use hardeners, but I'm not sure they ment depend 24/7 on them. I say nerf the living crap out of av, then you can modify out tanks. Deal? No it doesn't. It tells me that an armour tank with hardeners is God mode. Tanks should not be able to roll around at all times barely taking damage, if they did it would be stupid. This also tells you absolutely nothing about swarms, if your tank has any form of Hp you can drive away from a swarmer fairly easily. I will say though that tank HP shouldn't have been lowered like it was, it needs an increase and hardeners need a nerf. Ok drive a prototype tank for yourself, and if the tank was running away he probably did take some damage then. I would be coming after you if you shot me with a plc. You may have over exadurated it a lot. **Wise people learn from their mistakes, the wisest person learns from others mistakes. Unfortunately i am too hard head
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 1	Posted - 2015.09.03 11:39:00 - [127] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Zan Azikuchi wrote: So, if the tank's become more readily available (wouldn't complain, more tanks = more wp's for anyone popping them), then it would be better balanced? Okay i'll admit that I skimmed some of what was said, so i'm only taking scarce notes, i'll re-read them properly later, but if the vehicles costed very little say, 40k for a GV.0? and maybe +2k for each mods used, it could be better balanced and less stressful? (this is the jist im getting here, cause we're seriously getting absolutely no where here, the more people go back and forth in this thread, the more things stay the same, eventually this will have all become absolutely moot, so we need to come up with a compromise that both sides can be happy/okay with). read the pilot threads, of all the arguments that they trot out, even knowing that the Devs do not consider it a balancing factor: ISK. Vehicles are not sustainable for any appreciable length of time unless you're swimming in stupid levels of it. As long as a militia HAV costs about as much to fit fully as a prototype fatty forge, we're never going to hear the end of this idiotic Screaming match merry-go-round. Do I think HAVs should be as cheap as say, a dropsuit? No. But I'm more of the opinion that pricing should be based on utility: If an HAV is overall 4x more effective than the equivalent solo dropsuit, and 4x as difficult to kill? It should probably cost in the neighborhood of 4x the cost of the dropsuit, not 10x. Just to sort of echo this point, but from another angle (and wow this has been a ranty thread...) Isk should never be a factor. What is a factor however is the level of modules needed to have viable running vehicle. This just naturally pushes up the price of any vehicle. Where as you can compromise of dropsuit fits in accrodance with isk effeciency you cannot do it with vehicles. Hence the price of vehicles would always run up by comparision. I dont care how much your vehicle cost. You know the price before you run it. But i do worry when protoype levels of modules is the minimum required. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me. "I sometimes wonder why I share stuff "- CCP Rattati
Mikel Arias Challengers 506 192	Posted - 2015.09.03 16:35:00 - [128] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Mikel Arias wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: Sergeant Sazu wrote: "I spent 1.2 million ISK, so I shouldn't die, ever." Honestly just make tanks the same price as dropsuits and make them soloable. The imbalance of power being validated by ISK cost is getting old and it doesn't benefit either side. NOT WHAT IM SAYING. im saying my tank should not be as easily taken out. by 2 swarmers if ima GV.0. Thats all im saying, im not trying to be invensible I have seen a single tank taking fire of 2 swarms and my plasma cannon (yeah, yeah, the plasma is for shields) and keep going as if nothing had happened. Of course, he had hardeners on (at least one). Now, swarms are a pain in the ass for shield tanks, because once the shield is out there is not enough armor to take one hit. And armor tanks, without hardeners do get wracked My point, with hardeners everything is a lot easier, but without them... I get now when people complain about swarms, but instead of nerfing them, there should be an increase of general HP to tanks while reducing hardeners effectiveness or not allowing to fit more than one. Maybe both. This way a tank could take more damage, requiring more players attacking it with AV weapons. And with the modifications to the hardeners, this module could become a piece to use more tactically (engaging multiple AV players, another tank) instead of using them to get in and out just like that (godmode, I recall some saying that once). Im pretty sure it sounds crazy, but with a buff in HP, tanks could stop relying so much in the hardeners, but for this this module needs to be changed in the way it works (as I was saying). So, an armor tank could be around 6000 armor hp. and with 2500 shield hp, while the shield tanks could be around 7000 shield hp and 1500 armor hp. And the hardeners, besides allowing just one module, could be changed to a 30%. Crazy, yes, but I think it could be really interesting. Well that tells you something about swarms then. Tankers NEED hardeners to survive and that's sad. CCP said they wanted us to use hardeners, but I'm not sure they ment depend 24/7 on them. I say nerf the living crap out of av, then you can modify out tanks. Deal? No it doesn't. It tells me that an armour tank with hardeners is God mode. Tanks should not be able to roll around at all times barely taking damage, if they did it would be stupid. This also tells you absolutely nothing about swarms, if your tank has any form of Hp you can drive away from a swarmer fairly easily. I will say though that tank HP shouldn't have been lowered like it was, it needs an increase and hardeners need a nerf. Well, yeah, thats what I was saying (I tought it was clear). And yes, I dont think swarms need a nerf, but the tanks need a buf in terms of hp and then an modification to hardeners. Of course, this way dropships are still left alone, so for this I would propose that one of the already existing dropships skills affected the damage taken by dropships, as the sentinels do. That way a dropship could be faced with swarms while the pilot still has a chance to fight, instead of running away as it is in the moment; a swarm hits you and if you dont fly away right then, then you are already death.
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 2	Posted - 2015.09.04 05:01:00 - [129] - Quote HOLY PERFECTION wrote: no user error, The only real problem in my eyes. Why my proposal is the smart fire/dumb fire mechanic for swarms. - Press and release to instantly fire, scattering swarms in a roughly straight line - Hold to smart fire. Same as current, but with a longer lock time. Skilled players could aim the swarms effectively but with a chance to miss. Or alternatively, hold the lock and get the near 100% chance to hit. Real CPM Platform
HOLY PERFECTION FINAL TRIBULATION 118	Posted - 2015.09.05 16:41:00 - [130] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: HOLY PERFECTION wrote: no user error, The only real problem in my eyes. Why my proposal is the smart fire/dumb fire mechanic for swarms. - Press and release to instantly fire, scattering swarms in a roughly straight line - Hold to smart fire. Same as current, but with a longer lock time. Skilled players could aim the swarms effectively but with a chance to miss. Or alternatively, hold the lock and get the near 100% chance to hit. Exactly make you have to follow the target as it is airborne. **Wise people learn from their mistakes, the wisest person learns from others mistakes. Unfortunately i am too hard head



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