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KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1950	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:14:00 - [1] - Quote To my suprise acquisition was really added as yet one more game type. That means player base is now split even more. There is no player count increase to justify this, the average weekly people online is now about 2000 per day, while until September 2014 it was closer to 3000. source: http://eve-offline.net/?server=dust We now have 18 different pools of players. How on earth? How it can be that many? Basic modes under each region: ( 4 Game modes (Ambush, Skirmish, Domination, Acquisition) 1 Academy ) Let's multiply: 3x regions (US, EU, Asia) And finally add non-server related: +2 FW (Amarr vs Minm, Gall vs Cald) +1 PC (although rare) (Not sure if academy gathers all juniors or is server specific.) That means each pool has about 111 people for matchmaking to work with. Not much. Well I'm not here just to be a doomsayer, I have a suggestion too to help the situation! [SUGGESTION:] Combine Skirmish and Domination under same queue selection! Let's face it: Dom is just an another variant of skirmish, only more stationary. Under skirmish there are already 3,4 and 5 point maps. One point map can be there as well. That would also lessen slightly the ease of "I'm gonna pad my kdr thru easy Dom sniping where all the targets will be there for my picking" Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 21263	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:15:00 - [2] - Quote This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Pseudogenesis Nos Nothi 2693	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:21:00 - [3] - Quote KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: [SUGGESTION:] Combine Skirmish and Domination under same queue selection! Do this and I will never play Skirm again. Domination plays absolutely nothing like Skirmish and doesn't deserve to be lumped in with it. Why would you not combine Dom and Acquisition instead? They're basically the same game mode. Please don't make Ambush the only game mode I want to queue for. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 1123	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:28:00 - [4] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Remember that FW has a very big issue with latency due to its match creation setup. At least I would be banned from skirmish due to this.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1951	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:30:00 - [5] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: [SUGGESTION:] Combine Skirmish and Domination under same queue selection! Do this and I will never play Skirm again. Domination plays absolutely nothing like Skirmish and doesn't deserve to be lumped in with it. Why would you not combine Dom and Acquisition instead? They're basically the same game mode. Please don't make Ambush the only game mode I want to queue for. I understand your point completely and also support the freedom of choice. But the hard fact is that there lies a problem in splintering the players. I'd say this is one of the situations where there are only not-so-great options to choose from. If I would have to choose, I'd pick - Matchmaking that works better' - lesser queue times (had yesterday several 20+ minute waits) Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.
DUST Fiend 16707	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:32:00 - [6] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts I'm not a huge fan of that only because Skirm is the only game mode I play, and as a solo pilot I'm not a huge fan of sitting in FW queue for 15 minutes just to get trolled by teammates :/ If Skirm and Dom were combined as the OP suggested I would simply leave Dom games as I joined them. *"My bitter is showing. I must retreat to the berry patch."* STUFF
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1997	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:33:00 - [7] - Quote KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: That would also lessen slightly the ease of "I'm gonna pad my kdr thru easy Dom sniping where all the targets will be there for my picking" I seen this myself for the first time yesterday and I haven't been playing doms that long .. just in the last month but I seen this in a match that I had and I was wondering why it was happening . That team had two PRO snipers , two HAV's sniping and a FG . We were winning but I guess they just broke the spirit of the team I was playing with and we lost but I couldn't understand how with 5 people playing from a distance . It was the snipers just sitting on the null . I should have dealt with them myself but I was trying to push and keep links on the field . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed . #PubsShouldBeRandomPlayers
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1951	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:38:00 - [8] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts I'm not a huge fan of that only because Skirm is the only game mode I play, and as a solo pilot I'm not a huge fan of sitting in FW queue for 15 minutes just to get trolled by teammates :/ If Skirm and Dom were combined as the OP suggested I would simply leave Dom games as I joined them. That is a risk, that leaving thing. One more reason for ppl to make an early leave. Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 9265	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:43:00 - [9] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Please don't make Ambush the only game mode I want to queue for. Ambush, eh? If you're like me, you'll play one or two rounds, then you'll turn off the game. This is coming from a guy who used to run Ambush all day. It hasn't been fun to play since the FW event. @ Queue Consolidation (another idea) Haerr wrote: We need fewer queues as we currently have too many for our small playerbase. Acquisition Ambush + Ambush OMS Domination Skirmish Caldari vs Gallente Amarr vs Minmatar PC ^ Plenty of different queues spreads out the playerbase too much, leading to ridiculous queue times and harder time for Scotty to do his matchmaking magic. If squad size is reduced to 4 and if we reduced the number of queues to [PUB] Solo queue GÇö Ambush, Ambush OMS [PUB] Squad (4) queue GÇö Acquisition, Domination, Skirmish Lite (3-point) [FW] Amarr&Caldari vs Gallente&Minmatar GÇö Skirmish Proper (5-point) [PC] GÇö Skirmish Proper (5-point) It would be quicker to find battles and the battles would be better since the playerbase would be condensed into fewer queues. Source Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Protected Void Nos Nothi 412	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:45:00 - [10] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: [SUGGESTION:] Combine Skirmish and Domination under same queue selection! Do this and I will never play Skirm again. Domination plays absolutely nothing like Skirmish and doesn't deserve to be lumped in with it. Why would you not combine Dom and Acquisition instead? They're basically the same game mode. Please don't make Ambush the only game mode I want to queue for. ^Pretty much this. Except that I loathe Ambush most of the time, so if pub Skirmish is removed, there's actually no pub game modes left that I enjoy playing. Well, I'll probably enjoy Acquisition more than Domination, but even with a changing point there will still not be nearly enough room for finesse, outmaneuvering your opponents, sneak hacks and basically all the interesting tactics I enjoy over brute force assaults. I'd much rather remove Domination altogether and replace it with Acquisition. After all, it seems like it's basically Domination the way it should've been implemented in the first place. I usually queue up for just Skirmish, only adding Domination if I experience several waits of 7+ minutes. With Acquisition, I'll probably queue up for Skirmish+Acquisition, presumably making the matchmaker's job a little easier.

KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1951	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:52:00 - [11] - Quote Why everybody is that "I play ONLY amb/skirm/dom" and "If MY game mode gets combined with another queue I gonna play NOTHING" or "If MY game mode gets transferred I QUIT playing" Why can't we accept that sometimes you get your favourite specific mode, sometimes you don't? We shouldn't expect to cherry pick every single match. Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.
DUST Fiend 16711	Posted - 2015.04.28 13:54:00 - [12] - Quote KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: Why everybody is that "I play ONLY amb/skirm/dom" and "If MY game mode gets combined with another queue I gonna play NOTHING" or "If MY game mode gets transferred I QUIT playing" Why can't we accept that sometimes you get your favourite specific mode, sometimes you don't? We shouldn't expect to cherry pick every single match. It's more like, I play video games for enjoyment. I only enjoy Skirmish because I'm a solo vehicle pilot and it's the only game mode that provides any fun. So, if I'm forced to play something I don't enjoy, I don't play. Seems like a simple concept to me. *"My bitter is showing. I must retreat to the berry patch."* STUFF
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 6243	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:02:00 - [13] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 21282	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:04:00 - [14] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 9265	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:06:00 - [15] - Quote KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: Why everybody is that "I play ONLY amb/skirm/dom" and "If MY game mode gets combined with another queue I gonna play NOTHING" or "If MY game mode gets transferred I QUIT playing" Why can't we accept that sometimes you get your favourite specific mode, sometimes you don't? We shouldn't expect to cherry pick every single match. Hating Ambush is pretty common. Hating Dom is pretty common. The folks who hate both play Skirm. If you take away Skirm (without improving Ambush or Dom), there's a chance those folks will quit. I don't think that lecturing them will improve our odds of retaining them. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1952	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:06:00 - [16] - Quote Good discussion here. More on the points: - to combine or not - which to combine - which, if any, to make FW only - leaver problems I derived a wild idea about what if matchmaker had the permission to sometimes put people on different modes when needed while taking account the votes. Thread here, please discuss it there Looking at both sides of the coin. Even Aurum one.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8273	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:07:00 - [17] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: [SUGGESTION:] Combine Skirmish and Domination under same queue selection! Do this and I will never play Skirm again. Domination plays absolutely nothing like Skirmish and doesn't deserve to be lumped in with it. Why would you not combine Dom and Acquisition instead? They're basically the same game mode. Please don't make Ambush the only game mode I want to queue for. Seconded. F*CK DOMINATION. I hate that game mode. AV
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8275	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:09:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. Unfortunately I only like Skirmish, and facwar isn't typically open during the mornings when I get off work till right before I go to bed. So yes I will cop to a horrendous bias here. Please do not remove the only mode I have liked since I joined closed beta. AV
DUST Fiend 16713	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:14:00 - [19] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. That may be true, but banishing Skirm to FW will totally change the experience. There are three reasons I don't play FW: - Massively long queue times - Queue synced try hard squads - Friendly fire None of these enhance the experience and just serve to make it significantly more frustrating and less enjoyable. Add in that I can only buy turrets for my dropship from LP store (assuming I fight for the faction I hate, Caldari), and there is basically 0 incentive for me to suffer through the negatives in order to enjoy no positives. *"My bitter is showing. I must retreat to the berry patch."* STUFF
Aidualc LATINOS KILLERS CORP RUST415 165	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:17:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Do it men !!! don't ask the scrubbys !!!! -- LKC -- Tomate Pote --

Francois Sanchez Prima Gallicus 403	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:28:00 - [21] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. I don't think domination will remain popular as the new mode does basically what domination does but ten times better. Outside a few campers I think nobody is gonna keep playing domination
DUST Fiend 16716	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:29:00 - [22] - Quote Francois Sanchez wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. I don't think domination will remain popular as the new mode does basically what domination does but ten times better. Outside a few campers I think nobody is gonna keep playing domination That depends largely on if Acquisition keeps putting points in the enemies redline. *"My bitter is showing. I must retreat to the berry patch."* STUFF
Edgar Reinhart Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 100	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:31:00 - [23] - Quote Having developed severe PTSD from playing ambush in my starter suit I now only really queue for Skirm and Dom in Pubs and the occasional FW if I'm awake at the right times. I think from this it is clear that Dom is by far the more popular as I probably end up in a Dom 4 in every 5 games or so so the initial thoughts of removing Skirmish make sense from that perspective. At the same time this highlights the problem of a limited player base split over a variety of different queues. I like Dom and I like Skirmish, I've yet to try Acquisition and would rather be able to play all of them in Pubs as FW is a bit hit and miss ti queue into especially it seems in Euro timezones. I personally would be OK seeing Dom, Skirm, Acquisition combined and would welcome the variety and shorter queue times thaty this would bring but understand others opposition to it. I also don't really think that there is a way to stop people dropping out of matches until they find the one they like, leading to potentially lopsided battles etc, and I can't blame them for wanting to do so either. I can see an argument for saying that the 5 point Skirmish maps can be reserved for FW/PC and just keeping the 3 point in pubs but personally I'd rather not see it go completely. There's a point in there somewhere I'm sure........
DUST Fiend 16716	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:34:00 - [24] - Quote I'm just not a fan of punishing some players for the game not having enough players *"My bitter is showing. I must retreat to the berry patch."* STUFF
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 9265	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:36:00 - [25] - Quote Recycled Ideas: * Remove battleserver toggle; group players by ping * Reduce squad size to 4 * Disable FW when headcounts drop below a given threshold Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 1127	Posted - 2015.04.28 14:38:00 - [26] - Quote Francois Sanchez wrote: I don't think domination will remain popular as the new mode does basically what domination does but ten times better. Outside a few campers I think nobody is gonna keep playing domination I agree. The popularity of dom may suffer a lot with the arrival of acquisition. I'm sure the devs will be looking into that. By the way, after giving it a good thought I've come to the conclusion that I'd much prefer skirmish to be made more accessible for pubs than being removed. Skirmish has a problem of many objectives causing uncoordinated players to scatter a lot. Remember that the original design for Skirmish 1.0 only had two simultaneous objectives during the first stage and 3 objectives during the second stage. I think public Skirmishes would work much better if they were limited to 3 objectives at a time. This brings the problem that many current maps wouldn't work very well with a 3 objective setup, so this isn't a definitive solution, but the take-away is that the main problem of Skirmishes in pubs - too small player density - can be much improved with available tools.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1998	Posted - 2015.04.28 15:02:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Domination is by far the most popular game mode. Not because it's the hardest and you should know that as long as you've been around . You have players who don't like hard .. they like things easy , you have one objective that's not hard to overcome . You camp or get camped , you don't have to travel far like in a skirmish , you don't have to cover multiple positions on the map and it's not much strategy involved , either you take or get took . Not much to do and definitely not hard to deal with and that's why it's popular . Skirm : Too much room , too much to do and scattering of forces makes the game tougher for those who have no strategic game . This is my fav mode . Dom : Rush to the objective and keep it or loose , not much to do and it keeps most of the team , much less .. squads around and in an in closed environment this doesn't make for hard fought matches on a continual basis . Yes you have good matches but it's not much strategy involved in such a confined area and you know where everyone is and where their going . Ambush : Random spawn , makes it hard for most ... lay links and get them popped because you just don't know where the enemy is coming from . Again , you can have nice matches but the random nature of this mode makes it hard for some . FW : Modes not guaranteed because of the wait times and the fact that players who play this mode times are coordinated and unpredictable , only good matches when people get together and involved and that's not on a consistent basis . Dom is not popular because it's a contest every match , it has short que times and most of the matches of late are not full and if anything , it doesn't have full matches as of late after the matchmaking changes . It's the que times and the fact that the strategy is easy , you know where your going and what you have to do and the whole team is in the same area . Not hard to understand . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed . #PubsShouldBeRandomPlayers
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides Learning Alliance 6436	Posted - 2015.04.28 15:10:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts My first reaction was No! But the more I think about it the more I like it... Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Void Echo Helix Order 2771	Posted - 2015.04.28 15:30:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: This is partly related to my thoughts about moving Skirmish completely over to FW and granting ISK payouts Skirmish is currently the only game people can rely on a decent experience with. There's no way this should be gated off to FacWar. If there's too many queues, kill Domination because it's now redundant if Acquisition plays well. the bias is strong in this one , "no kill the one that I hate instead of killing the one I like". Domination is by far the most popular game mode. That would be because even though we have skirmish and Dom checked we get qued for Dom 9/10 and it's annoying especially with that train map. Closed Beta Vet. CEO: Helix Order. I have the controlled anger, more dangerous than you.
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 787	Posted - 2015.04.28 17:00:00 - [30] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Recycled Ideas: * Remove battleserver toggle; group players by ping * Reduce squad size to 4 * Automatically disable/enable FW based upon current headcount * Merge FW AM/CA queue and GA/MN queue First two I fully agree with Second two (FW): Hell No



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