DUST Search - Dropship Perspective on a Swarm Launcher Problem

Jack McReady wrote:

DUST Fiend wrote:

Soraya Xel wrote:

How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast.

I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall.

You should probably just, not chime in on vehicle threads.

Do forges auto aim and auto track? Can you empty a forge clip as fast a swarm clip? Can you carry two forge guns at once? Do forge rounds follow you for nearly a minute? Do they go around buildings to hit you, or turn invisible?

Im sorry, but vehicle play =/= infantry play, and posts like this make me cringe at the thought of CPM existing at all.

do swarms instagib infantry? do swarms have 300m range allowing me to fire it in peace out of all combat action?

if I am about to lock on and someone jumps at me to kill me I am dead before I can even swtich my second weapon, not to mention a double swarm fit which is defenseless.

if am about to charge a forge gun to derp the dropship I simply point it at the attacker and insta derp him instead, huge sentinel HP allow me to switch to sidearm and still come out alive.

beside that, the last time I used dropships ( was last week) I could hear swarms being fired almost accross its whole lock on range. you wont hear a charging forge before it hits you.

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DUST Fiend Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 15546	Posted - 2015.01.15 16:31:00 - [1] - Quote There's no notification that youre being tracked by swarm missiles that have already been fired.-á Why is this a problem? Its simple, swarm flight duration is MASSIVE, and will follow you for a long time. Now, as youre doing your job as a pilot and running from that single swarmer, you're very likely to catch the attention of other swarmers along the way, who also toss rounds into the air as you fly by. However, there is virtually no way to know this unless you're hit by them. You usually can't hear them detonate behind you, you can't hear them traveling untill theyre hitting you, and you most certainly cant hear them being launched as you fly by. So, as you're running from one swarmer, a lot of times you'll pick up a couple extra pairs of swarms whicht will increase the amount of time needed to fly away, and there is currently no way to assess that information as a pilot since you're mostly in the dark. Give an on screen indicator that swarms are currently tracking you, (missiles already in flight, no indicator that you're being locked) and that will go a LONG way towards making piloting a more satisfying experience, while not touching swarm launchers in any way. Or at absolute least give us a rear view option so we can check for ourselves, since turning = hit by swarms. This however should be a general feature for all vehicles, and won't help pilots nearly as much when trying to evade fire and forget missiles. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
Kuruld Sengar RED 0MEN. 153	Posted - 2015.01.15 16:34:00 - [2] - Quote Mouse and keyboard users have a rear view mirror mapped to c I believe.
DUST Fiend Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 15546	Posted - 2015.01.15 16:36:00 - [3] - Quote Kuruld Sengar wrote: Mouse and keyboard users have a rear view mirror mapped to c I believe. Ive never played MKB, but if theres an option for this on controller then ive missed it for years haha, which knowing me is entirely possible. Hopefully it does exist, because that would be nice, but still wouldn't invalidate the need to notify pilots of incoming missiles. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
Kallas Hallytyr Skullbreakers 1250	Posted - 2015.01.15 16:43:00 - [4] - Quote Asking for anything as a pilot apparently means you're a scrub/only use shitfits/can't fly. Rabble rabble rabble! Seriously though, there is no good reason why we can't get a lock-on warning, at least while Swarms are so insanely simple to use. Alt of Halla Murr. Sentinel.
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2817	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:39:00 - [5] - Quote The person shooting the swarms should also have a marker over them as long as they have the lock plus 5 or so seconds after. Target acquisition is terrible for dropships. Just a thought. Dust is there! I was real! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 473	Posted - 2015.01.15 18:21:00 - [6] - Quote 1. We need countermeasures 2. Warning system should be standard in all vehicles 3. Possibly missile markers on your radar signalling direction?
XxBlazikenxX Y.A.M.A.H 27	Posted - 2015.01.15 18:57:00 - [7] - Quote I agree with this statement. Before anyone says that "Well if you SL lock on notifications, then what about forge guns of PLs? And I say, SLs are lock ons, FG and PLs are not. A proud member of Y.A.M.A.H Recruitment Don't fix what's not Baroque
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides Learning Alliance 5861	Posted - 2015.01.15 19:28:00 - [8] - Quote Swarm Missiles in the air within 100m: Flashing Yellow. Swarm Missiles in the air within 50m: Flashing Red. I also support a beep when someone has a lock on you. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6458	Posted - 2015.01.15 19:30:00 - [9] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: Swarm Missiles in the air within 100m: Flashing Yellow. Swarm Missiles in the air within 50m: Flashing Red. I also support a beep when someone has a lock on you. wonder if it would be possible to make the radar flash red when swarmlock happens give the projectiles a 200 db profile and can be detected at 150 Use the General Quarters Alarm Naval Ships are Neat Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2770	Posted - 2015.01.15 21:02:00 - [10] - Quote Kuruld Sengar wrote: Mouse and keyboard users have a rear view mirror mapped to c I believe. There is no "reverse look" for vehicles in Dust. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim

Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2822	Posted - 2015.01.15 21:19:00 - [11] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Kuruld Sengar wrote: Mouse and keyboard users have a rear view mirror mapped to c I believe. There is no "reverse look" for vehicles in Dust. There is for LAVs, but nothing else (which I would like). Dust is there! I was real! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 905	Posted - 2015.01.15 21:48:00 - [12] - Quote I guess making Swarm Missiles show up on the radar for vehicles sounds reasonable. Less for balancing reasons, more for immersion. It's just much more fun fighting a threat when you can see the threat creep up on you. Maybe the scan radius should be 50 meters. That way the pilot knows which direction the missiles came from, but he won't know where the swarmer is exactly. Much like a sniper bullet trail. I arrived at 50 meters like this: - When fleeing from the third swarm you'll be going 50 m/s, because that's the top speed of a DS. - At top speed a swarm missile will go 60 m/s. - From maximum detection radius to impact the missile will be on your radar for 5 seconds. - When standing still and being surprised by swarms there'll be barely any warning (less then a second) - much like with railguns or forges. This would also be a step towards allowing ADS to out-maneuver swarms. Right now this is very hard/impossible since you need to look at the missile to know when to dodge. Even then I think swarm missile turn rate is still too high, but it'd be a step in the right direction.
Alena Ventrallis Intara Direct Action Caldari State 2490	Posted - 2015.01.15 22:11:00 - [13] - Quote We need some sort of warning system, that's for sure. For balance, we could have all vehicles indicate a lock has been made, without indicating from where. This has one alarm sound. Once the missiles have been released, the system informs you, in blatant flashing red letters where the "you have been scanned" goes, "Incoming Missiles" while near the center-bottom of the screen, it tracks how close the closest swarm is in relation to your vehicle. Once that swarm lands/runs out, it tracks the next closest swarm, so on and so forth until you are no longer being chased. Forges have no warning at all, since there is no tracking mechanism. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
DUST Fiend Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 15552	Posted - 2015.01.15 22:36:00 - [14] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: We need some sort of warning system, that's for sure. For balance, we could have all vehicles indicate a lock has been made, without indicating from where. This has one alarm sound. Once the missiles have been released, the system informs you, in blatant flashing red letters where the "you have been scanned" goes, "Incoming Missiles" while near the center-bottom of the screen, it tracks how close the closest swarm is in relation to your vehicle. Once that swarm lands/runs out, it tracks the next closest swarm, so on and so forth until you are no longer being chased. Forges have no warning at all, since there is no tracking mechanism. While a distance tracker would be nice, I think its far from needed. I personally would like the warning indicator to be less intrusive, something smaller and towards the corner of the screen. Enough of our view is already taken up by the ship lol. As for the post above yours, while cool, I think it would be way more work than its worth, plus would cause a lot of clutter, and possibly lag. A simple warning should be more than enough My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
IZI doro Terminal Courtesy Proficiency V. 38	Posted - 2015.01.15 22:57:00 - [15] - Quote Would it be viable to render Swarms on the scanner? As suggested earlier by those before me, allow Swarms to have a detectable scan profile. Also, as the warheads get within a certain proximity, there should be an audible indicator of how close the missiles get. Perhaps use the same audio from proxies? Cable & Internetworking Technician in-training Studying for the CompTIA A+, N+, and CCNA Tips 'n Tricks appreciated!
Hector Carson G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 143	Posted - 2015.01.15 23:44:00 - [16] - Quote Dropships are a little easy to take out maybe adding counter measures should help survival rate increase for them OR Dropship pilots could just quit complaining and deal with what they got Assault c.k0 Proto Tankers
DUST Fiend Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 15554	Posted - 2015.01.16 01:03:00 - [17] - Quote Hector Carson wrote: Dropships are a little easy to take out maybe adding counter measures should help survival rate increase for them OR Dropship pilots could just quit complaining and deal with what they got We'll stop providing feedback when things are a bit more even. Its close, but still not there, and nevermind all the ways you can die as a pilot that are almost if not entirely out of your control. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2777	Posted - 2015.01.16 03:19:00 - [18] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Kuruld Sengar wrote: Mouse and keyboard users have a rear view mirror mapped to c I believe. There is no "reverse look" for vehicles in Dust. There is for LAVs, but nothing else (which I would like). No I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6473	Posted - 2015.01.16 08:16:00 - [19] - Quote I talked to IWS about giving swarms a Db profile, the missiles, not the launcher, that can be detected 150m out. We also discussed dynamic profiles so forge gunners charging might be more detectable further out. He said he'd talk to rattati and see if it's doable. AV always having no-warning first strike does seem a bit much to me. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 5405	Posted - 2015.01.16 15:41:00 - [20] - Quote How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.

DUST Fiend duna corp 15559	Posted - 2015.01.16 15:46:00 - [21] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You should probably just, not chime in on vehicle threads. Do forges auto aim and auto track? Can you empty a forge clip as fast a swarm clip? Can you carry two forge guns at once? Do forge rounds follow you for nearly a minute? Do they go around buildings to hit you, or turn invisible? Im sorry, but vehicle play =/= infantry play, and posts like this make me cringe at the thought of CPM existing at all. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
DarthJT5 Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 192	Posted - 2015.01.16 15:56:00 - [22] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You are extremely biased against all things vehicle, you know that right? Go ahead and admit it, you hate everyone who has ever driven a vehicle. You really shouldn't try to even engage in a conversation with vehicle users. Dedicated Shield Tanking vet since Open Beta. Up and coming Python pilot. The awnser is always XT missiles....
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1821	Posted - 2015.01.16 15:59:00 - [23] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You should probably just, not chime in on vehicle threads. Do forges auto aim and auto track? Can you empty a forge clip as fast a swarm clip? Can you carry two forge guns at once? Do forge rounds follow you for nearly a minute? Do they go around buildings to hit you, or turn invisible? Im sorry, but vehicle play =/= infantry play, and posts like this make me cringe at the thought of CPM existing at all. do swarms instagib infantry? do swarms have 300m range allowing me to fire it in peace out of all combat action? if I am about to lock on and someone jumps at me to kill me I am dead before I can even swtich my second weapon, not to mention a double swarm fit which is defenseless. if am about to charge a forge gun to derp the dropship I simply point it at the attacker and insta derp him instead, huge sentinel HP allow me to switch to sidearm and still come out alive. the last time I used dropships ( was last week) I could hear swarms being fired almost accross its whole lock on range. you wont hear a charging forge before it hits you. beside that, I call in a rail tank in the red line which you will most likely not notice. it costs less than my proto swarm fit and can cover pretty much all the objectives from dropships... swarms are a problem (to armor tanked vehicles) but actually there are bigger issues to solve first
DUST Fiend duna corp 15559	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:04:00 - [24] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You should probably just, not chime in on vehicle threads. Do forges auto aim and auto track? Can you empty a forge clip as fast a swarm clip? Can you carry two forge guns at once? Do forge rounds follow you for nearly a minute? Do they go around buildings to hit you, or turn invisible? Im sorry, but vehicle play =/= infantry play, and posts like this make me cringe at the thought of CPM existing at all. do swarms instagib infantry? do swarms have 300m range allowing me to fire it in peace out of all combat action? if I am about to lock on and someone jumps at me to kill me I am dead before I can even swtich my second weapon, not to mention a double swarm fit which is defenseless. if am about to charge a forge gun to derp the dropship I simply point it at the attacker and insta derp him instead, huge sentinel HP allow me to switch to sidearm and still come out alive. beside that, the last time I used dropships ( was last week) I could hear swarms being fired almost accross its whole lock on range. you wont hear a charging forge before it hits you. The forge gun doesnt aim or track on its own. Thats the issue. Ive logged hundreds if not thousands of hours flying, I can assure you that you will NOT always hear swarms firing, or even approaching. We're just lookimg for a notification saying hey, auto trackimg missiles are inbound from somewhere, you may want to gtfo bro. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1821	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:08:00 - [25] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: The forge gun doesnt aim or track on its own. Thats the issue. Ive logged hundreds if not thousands of hours flying, I can assure you that you will NOT always hear swarms firing, or even approaching. We're just lookimg for a notification saying hey, auto trackimg missiles are inbound from somewhere, you may want to gtfo bro. I am for it but you are sometimes focusing on the wrong points imho
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 5406	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:11:00 - [26] - Quote DarthJT5 wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You are extremely biased against all things vehicle, you know that right? Go ahead and admit it, you hate everyone who has ever driven a vehicle. You really shouldn't try to even engage in a conversation with vehicle users. I actually want vehicle/anti-vehicle gameplay to be engaging, fun, and fair for both sides. That means both sides die. There are several dedicated vehicle users who also want this. DUST Fiend is not one of them. Any time swarms are capable of killing a dropship at all, dropship users go out in full force to cry about it. While vehicles, are, in fact, still overpowered. Just a little less overpowered than they used to be. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 6703	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:13:00 - [27] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: While vehicles, are, in fact, still overpowered. Just a little less overpowered than they used to be. This is a true statement. The balance is getting there, but it isn't quite there yet. Just call me Ripple. Ripple Riley. @Ripley_Riley
DUST Fiend duna corp 15559	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:18:00 - [28] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: DarthJT5 wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: How does swarms have less warning than forge guns? Swarms have to be locked out in the open, take longer than a forge charge, and move about ten times slower than a forge blast. I don't get a nifty warning light before a shotgun blast plasters my guts across a wall. You are extremely biased against all things vehicle, you know that right? Go ahead and admit it, you hate everyone who has ever driven a vehicle. You really shouldn't try to even engage in a conversation with vehicle users. I actually want vehicle/anti-vehicle gameplay to be engaging, fun, and fair for both sides. That means both sides die. There are several dedicated vehicle users who also want this. DUST Fiend is not one of them. Any time swarms are capable of killing a dropship at all, dropship users go out in full force to cry about it. While vehicles, are, in fact, still overpowered. Just a little less overpowered than they used to be. You exemplify why CPM shouldn't existat all. Unless an idea is exactly in line with your own narrow vision, you just troll and spew nonsense and pretend to have any idea what you're talking about. I threw out my back this morning so im not in the mood to deal with you today, but kindly go troll someone else, or post something worth posting for a change My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 5406	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:26:00 - [29] - Quote Being CPM doesn't mean I'm not supposed to tell people they're wrong. o_o CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
DUST Fiend duna corp 15559	Posted - 2015.01.16 16:29:00 - [30] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Being CPM doesn't mean I'm not supposed to tell people they're wrong. o_o But it does mean you aren't supposed to assume you're right, as you're supposed to be a neutral party who discusses all Information at hand, not just the few cases that fit your narrow, unshiftable view. Seriously though, please post on topic or go away. My YouTube (currently inactive) Homeless Dropship Enthusiast "See You Space Cowboy"



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