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Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
460
   |
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say?
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
LudiKure ninda
Dead Man's Game
RUST415
172
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sentinel Buff 
( -í° -£-û -í°)
SCAN ATTEMPT PREVENTED
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gustavo acosta
Capital Acquisitions LLC
General Tso's Alliance
563
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:36:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,)
GimmeDatSuhWeet isk
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Regnier Feros
G0DS AM0NG MEN
General Tso's Alliance
135
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
Make a list of their strengths & weaknesses , then decide whether to nerf their strengths or buff their weaknesses.
If that doesn't work there's always Breakin Stuff's proposal.
I like pie do you like pie because i hate pie & I like muffins.
|
Robocop Junior
research lab
831
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Breach Assault HMGs.
If strength were all, tiger would not fear scorpion.
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Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
461
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:43:00 -
[6] - Quote
gustavo acosta wrote:Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,)
It's with HMG sentinels that people are mostly complaining about.
The HMG in itself is a gun with little to no drawbacks. It has the same effectiev range as the AR and the heat build up is barely there. Accompany that with it's huge RPM and you get a very powerful gun.
Now the suits don't need a nerf.
They are slow enough already (unless someone decides to put Kinkats on them)
Plus any nerf to the suits will make the Minmatar Sentinels very UP.
I think a few changes to the HMG will make tourist Sentinels stay away from it.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
6476
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
I think removal of the explosive resistance and an increase to hip fire dispersion is a good place to start.
Thunderbolt. verb and noun.
"James thunderbolted in his pants."
"I lit a bag of thunderbolt on fire on CCP's doorway"
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calvin b
Sinq Laison Gendarmes
Gallente Federation
2274
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
Sorry I run all suits and I can tell you a heavy against a fast suit is no match. HMG has only so much range, I have caught scouts from behind and should have killed them. Nope, hit detection and speed, I watch as my bullets bounced off as they ran out of my range only to be killed by them a few seconds later. I will even make this interesting, I will use my new toy, my Min Assault and you can use an advanced heavy with any HMG you choose. I run as fast or faster than most scouts, and I will out DPS easily with my weapon. So I have range and speed over you. The heavy is a niche role and if you force the heavy to play outside that role they will lose. Stop taking a heavy head on, distance, speed, and flanking is key to dropping most heavies.
Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
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Crimson ShieId
Sinq Laison Gendarmes
Gallente Federation
1574
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:53:00 -
[9] - Quote
And when distance, speed, and flanking aren't enough, for everything else, there's RE's.
I want to punch.
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gustavo acosta
Capital Acquisitions LLC
General Tso's Alliance
564
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 22:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Crimson ShieId wrote:And when distance, speed, and flanking aren't enough, for everything else, there's RE's.
You're right good ole' REs
Wait they're going to be nerfed? uh well we still have sentinels as a counter to sentinels right?
GimmeDatSuhWeet isk
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Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
462
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:02:00 -
[11] - Quote
calvin b wrote:Sorry I run all suits and I can tell you a heavy against a fast suit is no match. HMG has only so much range, I have caught scouts from behind and should have killed them. Nope, hit detection and speed, I watch as my bullets bounced off as they ran out of my range only to be killed by them a few seconds later. I will even make this interesting, I will use my new toy, my Min Assault and you can use an advanced heavy with any HMG you choose. I run as fast or faster than most scouts, and I will out DPS easily with my weapon. So I have range and speed over you. The heavy is a niche role and if you force the heavy to play outside that role they will lose. Stop taking a heavy head on, distance, speed, and flanking is key to dropping most heavies.
The thing is. I don't even take heavies head on 
My style of gameplay consists of flanking and outmaneuvering my enemy.
But every day I am noticing an increasing number in the Sentinel population. now every turner I run into there is a freaking Sentinel waiting for me. You can say that I could have seen them coming, but for some reason they don't show up 70% of the time in my TACNET.
This is not about nerfing the heavy as a whole. This is about taking control of it's increasing use in the game.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Edau Skir2
Krullefor Organization
Minmatar Republic
37
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:33:00 -
[12] - Quote
You think the Sentinels are OP? Stop your crying. I run Sentinel as a standard heavy suit and any ComR, BrAr, ScR absolutely destroys us. Clearly you've been using the wrong weapon against them. |
Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
5401
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:42:00 -
[13] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:I think removal of the explosive resistance and an increase to hip fire dispersion is a good place to start.
Explosive resistance for sure. Maybe turn sped nerf too.
I wish my avatar was Minmatar.
|
Forlorn Destrier
Havok Dynasty
3074
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:44:00 -
[14] - Quote
No, it's time to look at assaults.
I am the Forgotten Warhorse, the Lord of Lightning
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Stupid Blueberry
Hyasyoda Terrestrial Acquisitions Firm
688
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:46:00 -
[15] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say?
No, it's time to look at vehicles.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Haajakin Kalen.
|
Stupid Blueberry
Hyasyoda Terrestrial Acquisitions Firm
688
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:47:00 -
[16] - Quote
Edau Skir2 wrote:You think the Sentinels are OP? Stop your crying. I run Sentinel as a standard heavy suit and any ComR, BrAr, ScR absolutely destroys us. Clearly you've been using the wrong weapon against them.
You're fitting your sentinel wrong.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Haajakin Kalen.
|
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
11665
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
The hotfix echo plate nerf will likely make the situation more tolerable https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=183623&find=unread
Gû¦Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum altGû+
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
1023
|
Posted - 2014.12.09 23:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Or we could wait a few days to see how this all shakes out.
WHY WOULD WE DO THAT! THATS JUST STUPID! NERF NERF NERF NERF NERF!
just stfu for a day and enjoy the circus of patch day.
Fack it, might as well board the hype-train again. At least there's tracks this time.
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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
6351
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
No. Sentinels are not OP. Anyways, if you nerf them then you will nerf logis, then Assaults, then scouts again. It's an ignorant cycle.
Put your flags up in the sky.
And wave them side to side.
Show the world where you're from.
Show the world we are one.
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Mejt0
Fat'Kids are Hard to Kidnap
568
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:04:00 -
[20] - Quote
Suit itself don't need a nerf [unless we will talk about splash resistance].
But HMG needs to change.
And people [calvin b], don't bring speed, flanking, etc as an argument.
How do you want to use speed and flanking in towns?
Where every fight is at 30m range and everyone [but scouts] is glowing on tancent.
I'm a good slayer [scout,assault] and i [as others] can deal with them like with everything else.
But majority can't.
Caldari Loyalist
Markiplier fan.
Got 6815 WP only on wrecking tanks with Ion Cannon.
|
Meee One
Amakakeru-Ryu-no-Hirameki
1384
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
Forlorn Destrier wrote:No, it's time to look at assaults.
+1
Official Blueberry of the Forums.
Title given by my #1 fan Sgt Kirk.
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Meeko Fent
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
2247
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:28:00 -
[22] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:
Most likely.
I am the bluedot. And I will rise again.
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Big miku
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
354
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:42:00 -
[23] - Quote
Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube. |
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
VEHICLEBUSTERS Demolitions and Logistics Corp .
1523
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:43:00 -
[24] - Quote
gustavo acosta wrote:Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,)
Nerf the range and make a spool up time but leave there speed of self alone .
There already the slowest and most visible but yes , a little more reliance on there side arm wouldn't be bad .
Screw with there speed and scouts would have more of a field day with them and I'm sure you know better .
I see comments like that and I think about cloaked shot gunning , the scrub glitch .
Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
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Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
VEHICLEBUSTERS Demolitions and Logistics Corp .
1523
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:45:00 -
[25] - Quote
Big miku wrote:Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube.
True but it might work .
I use HMG's but I do see the spam , same with light suits and scouts .
It's the e-war game baby .
Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
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LUGMOS
YELLOW JESUS EXP FORCE
1068
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:48:00 -
[26] - Quote
Big miku wrote:Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube.
In real life there aren't plasma rifles/cannons/pistols, laser rifles/pistols, you get my argument.
And should we remove RR and BP spool up? Cuz in real life they most likely wouldn't need to charge. Its a freaking electric railgun...
Official QuafeGäó Advocate
Anti-FoTM Prof. V
Forum Scavenger Prof. V
|
castba
Rogue Instincts
674
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:55:00 -
[27] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:gustavo acosta wrote:Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,) It's with HMG sentinels that people are mostly complaining about. The HMG in itself is a gun with little to no drawbacks. It has the same effectiev range as the AR and the heat build up is barely there. Accompany that with it's huge RPM and you get a very powerful gun. Now the suits don't need a nerf. They are slow enough already (unless someone decides to put Kinkats on them) Plus any nerf to the suits will make the Minmatar Sentinels very UP. I think a few changes to the HMG will make tourist Sentinels stay away from it.
I hope you mean the standard variant HMG?
The burst certainly needs no further nerfs and is borderline detrimental if encountering 2 or more people.
"When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti
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castba
Rogue Instincts
674
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 00:58:00 -
[28] - Quote
Big miku wrote:Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube.
Liked because I have not heard someone called a "nit" since the 80's.
Awesome!
"When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti
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gustavo acosta
Capital Acquisitions LLC
General Tso's Alliance
566
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 01:49:00 -
[29] - Quote
Big miku wrote:Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube.
Ewww you're one of those gits that compares real life balance to games ewww
GimmeDatSuhWeet isk
|
Bahirae Serugiusu
Vendetta Reactionary Force
338
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 01:51:00 -
[30] - Quote
Heavies are easy-mode (don't try to say otherwise). But all it takes is a Militia Heavy and a Militia Forge Gun and you send them to the kitchen or running for the hills.
The State will always survive.
|
Ghost Kaisar
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
8723
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 02:03:00 -
[31] - Quote
Edau Skir2 wrote:You think the Sentinels are OP? Stop your crying. I run Sentinel as a standard heavy suit and any ComR, BrAr, ScR absolutely destroys us. Clearly you've been using the wrong weapon against them.
Clearly you've never PC'd
You can't stop the heavy spam without
A.) More heavies
B.) RE's
Born Deteis Caldari. Rejected by my Kinsman.
Found a new family in the Vherokior Tribe.
Nobody messes with my family
|
Edau Skir2
Krullefor Organization
Minmatar Republic
39
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 05:13:00 -
[32] - Quote
Ghost Kaisar wrote:Edau Skir2 wrote:You think the Sentinels are OP? Stop your crying. I run Sentinel as a standard heavy suit and any ComR, BrAr, ScR absolutely destroys us. Clearly you've been using the wrong weapon against them. Clearly you've never PC'd You can't stop the heavy spam without A.) More heavies B.) RE's
You'd be correct. But this is due to being fairly new and not knowing which corps still play pc. Otherwise I'd of tried joining one by now |
Ace Boone
Capital Acquisitions LLC
551
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 05:19:00 -
[33] - Quote
If you complain about how much you get wrecked when you wear a suit with 1000+ HP, 25% damage resistance and THE highest DPS weapon in the game, just uninstall the game.
Anytime I want to pad my KDR, I just bring out a speed heavy and just dominate any other frame in my way. If you get 1v1'd by an assault, I just feel bad for you.
Only loyal to the republic.
I'm nothing more than bittervet without a PS3.
|
Edau Skir2
Krullefor Organization
Minmatar Republic
39
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 05:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
Obviously, some weapons are better against them than others depending on the Race it belongs to. I run Minmatar Sentinel, and the ScR hurts the most. Leads to a lot of revenge killings with the proto HMG fit if it happens too much |
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
467
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 07:18:00 -
[35] - Quote
Edau Skir2 wrote:You think the Sentinels are OP? Stop your crying. I run Sentinel as a standard heavy suit and any ComR, BrAr, ScR absolutely destroys us. Clearly you've been using the wrong weapon against them.
If you read more carefully what I typed in the thread, it is more about making the HMG taking skill to use.
The suit itself is fine.
But HMG sentinels are too easy to use and are currently being spammed a lot.
Hell, almost never have I seen such heavy use of militia heavies with HMGs ever since the Sentinel spam started. Now everyone wants a play turn and they use whatever heavy suit they have at their disposal to try and remain a bit competitive against the constant spam.
So read better. No where did I mentioned that Sentinels are OP. If anything more, they are too easy to use. That's all.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
467
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 07:20:00 -
[36] - Quote
castba wrote:Buwaro Draemon wrote:gustavo acosta wrote:Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,) It's with HMG sentinels that people are mostly complaining about. The HMG in itself is a gun with little to no drawbacks. It has the same effectiev range as the AR and the heat build up is barely there. Accompany that with it's huge RPM and you get a very powerful gun. Now the suits don't need a nerf. They are slow enough already (unless someone decides to put Kinkats on them) Plus any nerf to the suits will make the Minmatar Sentinels very UP. I think a few changes to the HMG will make tourist Sentinels stay away from it. I hope you mean the standard variant HMG? The burst certainly needs no further nerfs and is borderline detrimental if encountering 2 or more people.
Yeah I was talking about the standard variant HMG.
If I was also talking about the other variants, I would have included them.
PS: And as of now the Burst HMG is my favorite HMG. Not because it can kill fast but because there is a big penalty for it if you get too trigger happy. Which I like! Takes a little bit of skill to use now.
No wonder they stopped being heavily used since they were changed
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
467
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 07:26:00 -
[37] - Quote
Edau Skir2 wrote:Obviously, some weapons are better against them than others depending on the Race it belongs to. I run Minmatar Sentinel, and the ScR hurts the most. Leads to a lot of revenge killings with the proto HMG fit if it happens too much
Minmatar Sentinel as well. And I back this up. But the difference between Minmatar Sentinel and the other's is that stacking HP mods on it would hinder you. As your eHP is still too low to be a good point defense shooting behemoth.
So one of the few choices most Minmatar Sentinels have is to Speed tank (like I do. And man is it fun to see them med frames run away when I come charging with them with my HMG almost as fast as they are  ) and use the highs for damage mods.
Or speed tank it and use the highs for shield mods so at least you can survive a little longer.
Compared to most of the heavies?
Gallente, Amarr and Caldari can just brick tank theirs and not have to worry about almost nothing. Especially if they have a logi on them.
Since Minmatar is too squishy and weak either speed tanking it or brick tanking it, many people don't use it. Because people speccing into Sentinels just want to stand in one spot and get those kills. While you can't do that with the Minmatar one which takes a little bit of skill to use.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
oldhero
Titans of Phoenix
19
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 07:35:00 -
[38] - Quote
LUGMOS wrote:Big miku wrote:Real life Miniguns do not require a "spool up". Do a little research you nit. Just look on youtube. In real life there aren't plasma rifles/cannons/pistols, laser rifles/pistols, you get my argument. And should we remove RR and BP spool up? Cuz in real life they most likely wouldn't need to charge. Its a freaking electric railgun... EDIT: Who says nit? Just say nitwit...
Do you even know how the concept of a rail gun works? To have a rail gun is to accelerate a projectile at extreme speeds and a little touch of electricity would not be enough you need a massive amount for just 1 round and then there's the matter with the HMG it is NOT in any for considered a rail type weapon its a conventional gunpowder gun just like all other minmitar weapons are
The Black Reaper
Employed as a angeloid guardian
Pray you don't cross paths whit me
|
Assert Dominance
Ahrendee Mercenaries
690
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 08:35:00 -
[39] - Quote
The sentinels are annoying, but fine. They arent as powerful as chromosome with their ridiculous sharpshooter range and dps but not as bad as the uprising launch when they were basically glorified build a bear models that shot cotton balls. Heavies are in a good place atm. Useful, not OP. I run a speed fit sentinel gk0 and can say you can dominate in a heavy and get destroyed just as easy.
LogicGäó
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Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
468
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 08:54:00 -
[40] - Quote
Assert Dominance wrote:The sentinels are annoying, but fine. They arent as powerful as chromosome with their ridiculous sharpshooter range and dps but not as bad as the uprising launch when they were basically glorified build a bear models that shot cotton balls. Heavies are in a good place atm. Useful, not OP. I run a speed fit sentinel gk0 and can say you can dominate in a heavy and get destroyed just as easy.
It's the constatn spam that keeps people whining and calling in for the nerf hammer to hit the Sentinel.
I have no problem going up against a heavy in one-on-one situation. If I killed him, I was smarter than him and out maneuvered him. If he killed me, I had it coming for taking a Sentinel head on.
But when every single corner I turn to there is a sentinel, I try to run away from the objective because it has been taken by a legion of enemy sentinels only to find more sentinels awaiting for me at the destination I was hoping to arrive t=to?
It is a problem.
And not only to me. It is to every other med-frame or for god sakes the scout suits.
There are various of ways that Sentinels can stay the way they are with no nerf of a little bit of change of play style.
How?
Stop spamming them on every match!
But we know how this community is and they will spam the heavy suit until it is no longer the "eas-fit" it is now.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
xavier zor
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
379
|
Posted - 2014.12.10 09:08:00 -
[41] - Quote
As OP asked, sentinal pros and cons
Pros:
Resistance to explosive damage
Uses high DPS weapon
Uses a weapon with a large clip
Has the most HP of any suit in the game
Wins 1v1 any suit (unless you are a shotgun scout scrub)
Can be repped (meaning there is a larger window at which the heavy has enough armor to back away from a fight and be repped....like a warning signal)
Cons:
Slow
Bad regeneration statistics
Bad eWar statistics
bad biotic statistics
If you find anymore, tell me
My to-do list when i return to dust:
Logi my own way to an OB, and never use the cloak on my minja!
And have some ISK!
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Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
468
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 00:46:00 -
[42] - Quote
xavier zor wrote:As OP asked, sentinal pros and cons
Pros:
Resistance to explosive damage
Uses high DPS weapon
Uses a weapon with a large clip
Has the most HP of any suit in the game
Wins 1v1 any suit (unless you are a shotgun scout scrub)
Can be repped (meaning there is a larger window at which the heavy has enough armor to back away from a fight and be repped....like a warning signal)
Cons:
Slow
Bad regeneration statistics
Bad eWar statistics
bad biotic statistics
If you find anymore, tell me
Can't think of any more cons
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
J0hlss0n
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
203
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 11:05:00 -
[43] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:xavier zor wrote:As OP asked, sentinal pros and cons
Pros:
Resistance to explosive damage
Uses high DPS weapon
Uses a weapon with a large clip
Has the most HP of any suit in the game
Wins 1v1 any suit (unless you are a shotgun scout scrub)
Can be repped (meaning there is a larger window at which the heavy has enough armor to back away from a fight and be repped....like a warning signal)
Cons:
Slow
Bad regeneration statistics
Bad eWar statistics
bad biotic statistics
If you find anymore, tell me Can't think of any more cons
A huge hitbox? |
4lbert Wesker
WESKER S.T.A.R.S
15
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 11:21:00 -
[44] - Quote
Bohohoooo Sentinels are killing me !!!
Bohoooo let's nerf them bohoooo !!!
Bohohooooo HMG is so OP!!
Same old story over and over and over and over again...100% of time i run with Caldari Sentinel and since Rail gun CQC is nerfed I came across at dudes with Assault rifles 70% of time and with few shots they halve my shield.Did you see me complaining?What about Snipers at redline and MCC's that cant be seen but they can see you?What about ultra fast scouts with cloak and Shotgun?Main reason you are complaining is that Sentinels with cheap ass standard fit(6000 ISK) can devastate your fat proto ass.
I punched camel once,and it meows at me
|
thehellisgoingon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar
DARKSTAR ARMY
42
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 11:25:00 -
[45] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say?
A bk42 with proficiency will destroy any armor in the game. And can be held by a invisible scout. Or hey an assault with more hp then this sentinel you speak off. The mediums and small have small hitbox.
You wanna talk about the six kin now?
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
469
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 21:59:00 -
[46] - Quote
4lbert Wesker wrote:Bohohoooo Sentinels are killing me !!!
Bohoooo let's nerf them bohoooo !!!
Bohohooooo HMG is so OP!!
Same old story over and over and over and over again...100% of time i run with Caldari Sentinel and since Rail gun CQC is nerfed I came across at dudes with Assault rifles 70% of time and with few shots they halve my shield.Did you see me complaining?What about Snipers at redline and MCC's that cant be seen but they can see you?What about ultra fast scouts with cloak and Shotgun?Main reason you are complaining is that Sentinels with cheap ass standard fit(6000 ISK) can devastate your fat proto ass.
This reply of yours shows your ignorance and incompetence to read.
I said that Sentinels are being spammed left and right everywhere now.
There is not a single match that I join that I don't see 8+ heavies on each side.
When did I said that Sentinels are OP?
When did I said that the HMG is OP?
All I said that the role is too easy to use and would to see some actual skill be implemented to it.
Because using an Assault suit against 8+ heavies targetting you is not exactly fair play. Especially on onjective based gamemodes.
I protested against the scouts, and now I am doing the same with Sentinels.
I seek game balance and fun for everyone in the game.
Not just because "I got killed, IMMA GO WHINE ABOUT IN THE FORUMS"
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
469
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 22:10:00 -
[47] - Quote
thehellisgoingon wrote:Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say? A bk42 with proficiency will destroy any armor in the game. And can be held by a invisible scout. Or hey an assault with more hp then this sentinel you speak off. The mediums and small have small hitbox. You wanna talk about the six kin CR now?
With the upcoming nerfs to armor plates, I think it would be fair for CCP to also nerf a little the damage done by Rail Rifles and Combat Rifles.
or else Armor tanking will be dead.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Sequal Rise
Les Desanusseurs
420
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 23:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
The suits are fine (maybe not the bonuses but it's not really the thing here).
The problem is with the HMG. It deals way too much damages over a way to high range (40m isn't right at all). Even at close range they just rekt everything. I know it's what they are supposed to do, but doing so while requiring NO skill isn't tolerable.
Heat build up is good now IMO and doesn't need to be changed. I propose a range reduction to 20m max and a .8s charge up time making it work as a real mini gun.
Assault, Logi, Scout, Heavy.. What do you need?
|
Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
475
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 00:31:00 -
[49] - Quote
xavier zor wrote:As OP asked, sentinal pros and cons
Pros:
Resistance to explosive damage
Uses high DPS weapon
Uses a weapon with a large clip
Has the most HP of any suit in the game
Wins 1v1 any suit (unless you are a shotgun scout scrub)
Can be repped (meaning there is a larger window at which the heavy has enough armor to back away from a fight and be repped....like a warning signal)
Cons:
Slow
Bad regeneration statistics
Bad eWar statistics
bad biotic statistics
If you find anymore, tell me
Are you guys serious? This is how y'all view heavies?
Here is a pro:
Easily spawns from uplinks anywhere so can return to the fight just as fast as a scout.
or
Most objectives sit in CQC where heavy weaknesses are nullified.
or
Usually have a logi stuck to them super repping -- and now logi gets an ewar bonus (which is shared) effectively nullifying the heavy being blind weakness.
Heavies are the only suit in the game who has their weaknesses nullified consistently by situation. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
3076
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 03:18:00 -
[50] - Quote
GREATLY increase HMG dispersion, so that you can't hit anything until after about a second or so of firing.
Reduce range.
Reduce RoF and damage.
Reduce Am and Gal sentinel shield HP; Reduce Cal and Min armor HP.
"Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
|
castba
Rogue Instincts
682
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 04:47:00 -
[51] - Quote
Just bring back the Chromosome pricing of ALL dropsuits.
I seems to recall proto heavies costing over 250,000isk although I don't remember if that was the fitted or naked price.
Would stop a lot of spamming.
"When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti
|
Robocop Junior
research lab
878
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 05:59:00 -
[52] - Quote
Jeez louise, this is getting heavy :/
If strength were all, tiger would not fear scorpion.
|
SoTa PoP
Titans of Phoenix
5263
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 06:11:00 -
[53] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say?
I can't tell if you mean this or not.
Firstly, EWAR hasn't changed enough that a heavy can reliably run solo. It is still a group orientated suit because of the many weaknesses it has, range, hit box, speed, ect. The only way to make up for this is use vehicles or stick close to a corner - one method is easily hard countered with out a lot of SP investment, and even then still countered, and the EWAR value of the other suits makes camping just sorta dumb.
The maps are designed for multiple paths to objectives - this gives the advantage EWAR suits, or plainly every suit but a speed heavy. (lol)
And if your going to give me a spool up time then I'd like for my much larger shots fired from a much stronger guns bullets to reach past 40m. Otherwise your suggestion is ridiculous and isn't considering the heavy plight at all. We're meant to hold objectives - not give you a chance at a 1v1. You shouldn't be winning your 1v1's versus us in our optimal - PERIOD. We have limitations to our movement and hitboxes for a REASON.
What you've been noticing in Pubs is that if enough heavies are spammed it can lead to one side getting overwhelmed. That isn't because the suit or the gun - it's players being bad.
And I thank them for it - because, unlike you it seems, I adapted. Heavies are nothing more then fodder. I will teach them all how a heavy suit is really used, then enjoy the hate mails afterwords as they realize they can't replicate it.
n+ÅS¦¦Gùò GÇ+GÇ+ GùòS¦¦n++ I watch anime for the plot
|
SoTa PoP
Titans of Phoenix
5263
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 06:14:00 -
[54] - Quote
xavier zor wrote:As OP asked, sentinal pros and cons
Pros:
Resistance to explosive damage
Uses high DPS weapon
Uses a weapon with a large clip
Has the most HP of any suit in the game
Wins 1v1 any suit (unless you are a shotgun scout scrub) you forgot RE's and vehicles, larger hit box means easier target for tanks
Can be repped (meaning there is a larger window at which the heavy has enough armor to back away from a fight and be repped....like a warning signal)
Cons:
Slow
Bad regeneration statistics
Bad eWar statistics
bad biotic statistics
large head hitbox
large body hitbox
less slots for versatility
Specialized weapon have no range, forcing them to use light to compete in many instances
requires more SP investment
If you find anymore, tell me
n+ÅS¦¦Gùò GÇ+GÇ+ GùòS¦¦n++ I watch anime for the plot
|
Joel II X
Bacon with a bottle of Quafe
5043
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 07:01:00 -
[55] - Quote
Needs more bobble head like, err, heads. |
Dauth Jenkins
Titans of Phoenix
610
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 16:03:00 -
[56] - Quote
calvin b wrote:Sorry I run all suits and I can tell you a heavy against a fast suit is no match. HMG has only so much range, I have caught scouts from behind and should have killed them. Nope, hit detection and speed, I watch as my bullets bounced off as they ran out of my range only to be killed by them a few seconds later. I will even make this interesting, I will use my new toy, my Min Assault and you can use an advanced heavy with any HMG you choose. I run as fast or faster than most scouts, and I will out DPS easily with my weapon. So I have range and speed over you. The heavy is a niche role and if you force the heavy to play outside that role they will lose. Stop taking a heavy head on, distance, speed, and flanking is key to dropping most heavies.
the problem is that most fights take place im CQC ranges, where the heavy is dominant. heavies do have a niche of short range point defence, but for most players, all their fights tend to occur within the heavies niche.
-Sincerely
--The Dual Swarm Commando
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
6378
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 16:09:00 -
[57] - Quote
Thats pretty much all the heavy has going for it.
A beasty hp suit with a beasty weapon and resistances to match.
I am GJRs Renfield.
You heard it here first, I told you so.
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
6378
|
Posted - 2014.12.12 16:11:00 -
[58] - Quote
castba wrote:Just bring back the Chromosome pricing of ALL dropsuits.
I seems to recall proto heavies costing over 250,000isk although I don't remember if that was the fitted or naked price.
Would stop a lot of spamming.
That was naked price, dropsuit only..
No that would make it only spammable for vets.
I am GJRs Renfield.
You heard it here first, I told you so.
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
471
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 19:36:00 -
[59] - Quote
SoTa PoP wrote:Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say? I can't tell if you mean this or not. Firstly, EWAR hasn't changed enough that a heavy can reliably run solo. It is still a group orientated suit because of the many weaknesses it has, range, hit box, speed, ect. The only way to make up for this is use vehicles or stick close to a corner - one method is easily hard countered with out a lot of SP investment, and even then still countered, and the EWAR value of the other suits makes camping just sorta dumb. The maps are designed for multiple paths to objectives - this gives the advantage EWAR suits, or plainly every suit but a speed heavy. (lol) And if your going to give me a spool up time then I'd like for my much larger shots fired from a much stronger guns bullets to reach past 40m. Otherwise your suggestion is ridiculous and isn't considering the heavy plight at all. We're meant to hold objectives - not give you a chance at a 1v1. You shouldn't be winning your 1v1's versus us in our optimal - PERIOD. We have limitations to our movement and hitboxes for a REASON. What you've been noticing in Pubs is that if enough heavies are spammed it can lead to one side getting overwhelmed. That isn't because the suit or the gun - it's players being bad. And I thank them for it - because, unlike you it seems, I adapted. Heavies are nothing more then fodder. I will teach them all how a heavy suit is really used, then enjoy the hate mails afterwords as they realize they can't replicate it.
*sigh*
Where did I stated that I would love to 1v1 heaviee? If anything I try to run out of his range whenever I see one.
my complaint is about the spam. I run away from one and I find another in a corner, I get away from there only to find more on the other direction I am heading.
And I dont know.
Most objectives are in an enclosed area with 2 or 3 ways to get in it.
Unless it is the objective that is at the rail walks in the Gallente Research racility where there are like 5 ways to get in.
But other than that, most objectives offer 2 or 3 entry points (accesible by foot and not uplinks on rooftops of course)
And I would also like to see the role get the skill it used to have back.
Changing the suita can break the Sentinel so I proposer HMG changes. So a Sentinel won't get too trigger happy and unleash a hell of bullets.
Which is why I love the Burst HMG. Powerful but you need to learn how to manage heat and ammo because that thing runs out of ammo fast.
Regular HMG can just keep firing for a long while. Making little to no heat management skill to apply. And it also carries a huge mag so anyone can slap it on their Heavy/Sentinel and get a multitude of skill.
A gun that powerful shouldnt be that easy to use.
I dont see the spool up time to be added to it so how about an increase in heat for it?
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Indy Strizer
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
210
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:02:00 -
[60] - Quote
I think heavies shouldn't be both nimble and powerful in CQC- it seems to be dominanting the realm of CQC too much. I think the HMG should turn the heavy into a powerful human turret that is great for point defense and locking down flanks, but not very ideal for advancing down hallways and reacting to enemies appearing around corners quickly and such. I've suggested giving a massive spool time with the ability for players to "pre-charge" by holding L1 on the feedback section before. |
Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2279
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:06:00 -
[61] - Quote
HMG is in a good place DPS and range wise. So if its OP, why not adjust its dispersion? Simply decrease its max accuracy, meaning less bullets impact a target at range.
Do not go gentle into that good night;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
|
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
Learning Alliance
5444
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:26:00 -
[62] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:They are far too easy to use for them to absorb that much damage and be able to use out the highest DPS of any gun in the whole game.
A few EWAR changes here and there and I am seeing a slight decrease in the scout population, but heavies, mostly Sentinels are going at it strong. Being spammed all across the game and the drive-by Heavies.
The best thing to do in my opinion here is to make some changes to the HMG, make it have a little bit more faster heat build up, reduce the RPM, and maybe even give the HMG a spool up time. Like real mini-guns, that need to spin a little before the rounds start firing.
This will add at least some gun game to the HMG users and will require a little bit more skill.
I could give out numbers on how heat, RPM and spool up time will work on the different HMGs but I am in no way good with numbers.
What do you guys say?
You have laid out your argument for a nerf to the HMG in a very reasonable and considered way.
- The base model HMG does seem to be a bit too easy to use. The heat increase helped, but I don't advocate any more heat buildup nerfs, as that would make it feel too much like the Burst HMG. I had suggested a slightly reduced turn speed for the base model HMG, but spool-up time might work too.
- I think the Burst HMG is fine right now. (It is good, but dam hard to use.)
- The Assault HMG is actually slightly UP, but only needs a slight dispersion reduction to be able to reach out a little farther. It's DPS is low in CQC, which is how it should be. In the 20m to 30m range it is very effective. If it was adjusted to widen that to very effective at 20m to 40m then it would be perfect.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
|
7th Son 7
United Logistics Division
9
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:32:00 -
[63] - Quote
I say you must not play w/a heavy or you would be well aware of their shortcomings. |
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
Learning Alliance
5445
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:35:00 -
[64] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:gustavo acosta wrote:Sentinels are too OP and no amount of heat build-up nerfs will stop their reign. Just nerf the sentinels movement speed enough so they HAVE to do their job of point defense, and nerf HMG range to like 10-20 meters.(it'll stop car heavies also because they won't be able to get to hit you if you run away,) It's with HMG sentinels that people are mostly complaining about. The HMG in itself is a gun with little to no drawbacks. It has the same effectiev range as the AR and the heat build up is barely there. Accompany that with it's huge RPM and you get a very powerful gun. Now the suits don't need a nerf. They are slow enough already (unless someone decides to put Kinkats on them) Plus any nerf to the suits will make the Minmatar Sentinels very UP. I think a few changes to the HMG will make tourist Sentinels stay away from it.
The heat buildup was increased recently, so it is at least noticeable now.
The effective rang is miss-leading as dispersion reduces damage to nearly nothing well before its "effective range". I consider it a great accomplishment to get a kill at 40m, and that only happens if my target was on death's door before I started shooting.
Other than those two point I agree with you.
I am warming to the concept of a spool-up time where the RPM starts low and takes a fraction of a second to get up to full speed.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
|
TechMechMeds
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
6411
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 20:37:00 -
[65] - Quote
All the heavy has going for it is HP and dps.
Everything else can do a lot more and even do what other suits can do but just not as well.
If you nerf the heavy using your logic, it would be a suit that is only useful inside a room and has just enough range to reach the doorway..........
Its a fking heavy with a hmg, deal with it.
I can proto everything in the game across 3 chars btw so I'm about as unbiased as you can get. Well I only have commando at ADV actually but still.
I am GJRs Renfield.
You heard it here first, I told you so.
|
Copharus Arkana
Seykal Expeditionary Group
Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 21:29:00 -
[66] - Quote
Why dos no one understand this? Heavys need to be removed from the game. Do none of you see how much of a crutch they are? |
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
472
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 23:20:00 -
[67] - Quote
7th Son 7 wrote:I say you must not play w/a heavy or you would be well aware of their shortcomings.
I do. Minmatar Sentinel level 3 with Burst HMG.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Buwaro Draemon
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
472
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 23:22:00 -
[68] - Quote
TechMechMeds wrote:All the heavy has going for it is HP and dps.
Everything else can do a lot more and even do what other suits can do but just not as well.
If you nerf the heavy using your logic, it would be a suit that is only useful inside a room and has just enough range to reach the doorway..........
Its a fking heavy with a hmg, deal with it.
I can proto everything in the game across 3 chars btw so I'm about as unbiased as you can get. Well I only have commando at ADV actually but still.
How is increasing heat build up or adding a spool time making the heavy useful only inside a room?
In any case this will scare away the spammers and you can finally tell the difference between a dedicated heavy and a tourist heavy.
Side effects of playing Dust:
Emotional trauma, Anger Management issues, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and Depression
|
Sequal Rise
Les Desanusseurs
458
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 23:35:00 -
[69] - Quote
I just thought about smt, make the HMG hit harder when it heats a lot (lire Laser Rifles) and divide its base damage by 2. So the instablap HMG heavy will have to wait a little (mostly if firing at range) in order to deal its full damage. And he'll have to care about the overheat!
It would actually require some skill to use the weapon then^^ What do you guys think about that?
(Talking about normal variant HMG mostly).
Assault, Logi, Scout, Heavy.. What do you need?
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