<3

Please fix unfair OP Minmatar hack and speed and stamina bonuses.

Then make kin cats and myofibs give move speed Rattati...

.. the only problem was scouts.

Gameplay over lore really, I just want Sentinels to have a weakness so that an Assault can stand a chance by headshotting. Right now, the Sentinel wins 99% of the time.

Using a mass calculation (substituting HP for mass), the sentinel simply moves to fast comparative to other frames. Without hurting those that don't armor stack and also making it a chore to play heavies, this was my proposal.

Extenders were thrown into the mix because of the HP=Mass idea. I still don't understand the hubbub, obviously it would be less than plates, and similar as reactives as they give similar HP.

Gameplay over lore really, I just want Sentinels to have a weakness so that an Assault can stand a chance by headshotting. Right now, the Sentinel wins 99% of the time.

Using a mass calculation (substituting HP for mass), the sentinel simply moves to fast comparative to other frames. Without hurting those that don't armor stack and also making it a chore to play heavies, this was my proposal.

Extenders were thrown into the mix because of the HP=Mass idea. I still don't understand the hubbub, obviously it would be less than plates, and similar as reactives as they give similar HP.

Gameplay over lore really, I just want Sentinels to have a weakness so that an Assault can stand a chance by headshotting. Right now, the Sentinel wins 99% of the time.

Using a mass calculation (substituting HP for mass), the sentinel simply moves to fast comparative to other frames. Without hurting those that don't armor stack and also making it a chore to play heavies, this was my proposal.

Extenders were thrown into the mix because of the HP=Mass idea. I still don't understand the hubbub, obviously it would be less than plates, and similar as reactives as they give similar HP.

Extenders were thrown into the mix because of the HP=Mass idea. I still don't understand the hubbub, obviously it would be less than plates, and similar as reactives as they give similar HP.

When extenders give the exact same penalty as armor, why fit anything but armor? Armor gets more HP anyway. This will further drive the armor metagame. Can we please give the infantry shield tankers SOMETHING?!

Thank you for understanding this, I still have Faith in CCP only because of you.

Why dont you add that strafe penalty only to sentinels and scouts, this will slow sentinels that stack hp and will nerf tanking scouts.

Also Rattati please can you provide us more datas about most used suit in PC and pubs? (like the datas you have us about best killers of PC)

Also, making tanked scouts strafe slower won't fix their dominance in pubs. As long as they can see an enemy coming from Xm away, both on their radar and on tacnet, and have a weapon that can kill even a heavy with 1200+HP in 1-3 hits, you will not fix their effectiveness. Especially in pubs, because the only viable countermeasure to scouts right now is running in blobs of people that actually pay attention, which is rare in pubs.

Agreeeeed, there are other threads though discussing revamps of the scanning system which may provide a mechanics based counter to them, just go there and drop a message in there to make sure no suits get to drop under the highest precisions in the game and it will go a long way to getting the whole shotgun scout dominance crap fixed.

When extenders give the exact same penalty as armor, why fit anything but armor? Armor gets more HP anyway. This will further drive the armor metagame. Can we please give the infantry shield tankers SOMETHING?!

I am in those threads. In all of them.

And scans that can not be avoided are gross!

It has to become easier to avoid scans!

But enough of that. This is OT.

The speed penalty will be scaled to the HP of the module, so extenders will get ~half the penalty of the armor plate (a complex shield extender, 66hp, will have less penalty than a basic armor plate, 85hp). At least thats how I read the proposed changes. And to those saying this will encourage dual tanking: sure if you want to have insane movement penalties, why not. But my money is on that kind of fit being a really dumb idea if these changes are implemented.

The only thing shield tankers need in this game is a tightening of the scrambler rifle damage profiles so it doesnt feel like a nuclear strike hit your shield every time you get shot a couple times by it.

Having the same penalty for two different modules only encourages that both modules be used since you are already taking the hit for one of them. It will encourage even more brick-tank style play and not diversify the module usage like CCP is hoping for. Instead they need to come up with a different penalty for the shields. That way if you do both armor AND shields you get two different penalties and not just one that you can overcome by being a better statistician than CCP is.

Having the same penalty for two different modules only encourages that both modules be used since you are already taking the hit for one of them. It will encourage even more brick-tank style play and not diversify the module usage like CCP is hoping for. Instead they need to come up with a different penalty for the shields. That way if you do both armor AND shields you get two different penalties and not just one that you can overcome by being a better statistician than CCP is.

Extenders were thrown into the mix because of the HP=Mass idea. I still don't understand the hubbub, obviously it would be less than plates, and similar as reactives as they give similar HP.

Gameplay over lore really, I just want Sentinels to have a weakness so that an Assault can stand a chance by headshotting. Right now, the Sentinel wins 99% of the time.

Im not sure how adding penalties to HP modules will encourage brick tank play. Its already a pretty dubious choice as it is, why do you think putting penalties on the modules would somehow magically make it more attractive?

yeah.

I predict the people who believe that dual bricking will be the best way to go after the change are going to have a very bad day

I remember dual tanking with 10% movement penalties on armor. Hilarity will ensue because penalties do NOT have stacking penalties.

Please re-read... I said putting the SAME penalty on two DIFFERENT types of tanking will only encourages the usage of BOTH of them not one. Earlier I detailed this here:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2479861#post2479861

Read the threads, everyone can avoid the longer ranged scans more easily, but every suit will have a stronger inner circle of scan defense that should reveal much more, and for high scan precision suits should (in my opinion) reveal anything. If you really have an issue with shotgun scouts 3 shotting heavies (not to mention making assaults and commandos useless), having suits that can dampen under anything and maintain high speed and decent scanning is the source of the problem, and it needs to be counterable by something in the game, strong short range scans are the natural balanced way of doing that. Consider it maybe.

Why should you ever expect to have the luxury to see an enemies every step on a radar?

How is it acceptable that one guy on the enemy team can *blip* for one second and reveal my position to his whole team?

How is it acceptable that one guy can see me coming from +30m away, relay this information to his whole squad, and do all that without even using a single module?

Anticipating your enemies next step should be a skill that you have to learn after many hours of playing a game, not a built-in feature.

With scans that are too strong 1vs1 fights are boring because you can see exactly what you opponent is up to, and it is close to impossible to disengage.

I don't have a problem with shotgun scouts 3-shotting heavies, if they have earned it through clever gameplay instead of waiting around a corner until the red arrow moves into range.

At least give people the choice to avoid being scanned! Right now, as a Medium suit you don't have a choice because there is no way you can stop a Gal Logi with a proto scanner (not even focused) to reveal your position to the entire enemy team. If there is a Gal Logi on the enemy team, go HP or die!

And people are still complaining that Gal Logi is useless because he can't easily scan scouts who actually care and devote their fitting towards not being scanned.

I know they don't however once you reach a point it no longer matters as much if you are a fraction slower than you were before.

Well I dont think you have much of a point here, we'll see how the penalty breaks out. If you are Amar going 70% speed with 1k HP from armor tanking only and then stacking 3 extenders on top or whatever which takes you down to 55-60% speed, I think thats a big difference and probably doesnt have as much utility as throwing 3 damage mods in your highs.

It all depends on what the numbers are, but I still think that adding penalties to something isnt going to make it more attractive. Just because you are going slower doesnt mean what speed you still have somehow has no value.

Personally I've always thought speed penalties were pretty ineffective and I'd like them to just implement straight up stacking penalties to HP mods (each additional HP mod grants less HP total), but whatever, we'll see what happens.

You're still not getting it... You say, "I still think that adding penalties to something isnt going to make it more attractive" *I* never said it makes it more attractive. I said that by only having one penalty, then thee is no difference between using shield tanking, armor tanking, and BOTH. Thus using BOTH is just as "attractive" as using only one or the other. Now if they had DIFFERENT penalties, then you would incur BOTH of those and then things become an actual trade-off as is often used in most game design theory. This is how choices and game balance is maintained in many games. I believe that if CCP does this change to BOTH armor and shields, then they remove that CHOICE from the game and upset one of the balancing points of the game-play.