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Reasonable solutions to give slayers more WP?

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Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 979	Posted - 2014.10.08 01:59:00 - [31] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: I feel that as an Assault even though I'm putting myself on the frontlines keeping my support members safe and pushing the enemies off objectives I'm not rewarded enough. Now I understand that I'm just doing one job whilst the Logistics is doing everything but I feel that there's a problem when I go 25+ with less than 3 deaths and I'm down in 6th or 7th place and was barely paid anything. What I'm trying to say is that all roles should be efficient at gaining WP by itself. Keeping vehicles away is now rewarding, Logistics is rewarding if done right, vehicles are rewarded and transports are being looked at I believe. So I'll ask you guys if you think slaying is a viable WP role in itself and can something be done to encourage ripping apart enemies in rapid manner? firstly its scouts causeing problems.. secondly.. since logi are busy rezzing, repping , scanning and uplinking.. this could leave slayers to carrying ammo.. now the problem with hives.. you only get +10 points per person, now if it was +10 point per TICK or per nanite cluster used it would fair better.. only other option could be to run with the DUAL function hives (REP + Ammo) that way you can get triage and some resupply points TL;DR slayers run with Hives* which give armor as well as ammo Buff hive WP distribution to 10 per tick or 25 per person or something [[LogiBro in Training]]* Level 2 Forum Pariah
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 979	Posted - 2014.10.08 02:14:00 - [32] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: Kills 75, assists 50, killing someone hacking an objective 150, killing someone reviving a guy 100... Double points for killing a heavy while he's being repped, just because you earned it. But wp balance is off, logi/av/v get more wp than slayers/hackers/defenders... Needs a rework more than anything that's been hotfixed so far. bad ideas.. i run logi alot and its only when we get a "meat grinder" where its a "hotzone" when logi can really shine.. all other times we are only supported by random rezzes and kills and the odd triage on a heavy which is rarer and rarer as more people go FOTM(scout) real slayers can easly be top 3 where as a normal non meatgrinder for logi id say middle of the pack. hackers and counter hackers get enough points from that. defenders, main problem is you need to be ,1 in a squad with atleast 1 other, 2 have orders assigned to defend the point/player and 3, you only get defender poitns for killing a player who tries to hack (or attack points for killing a counter hacker).. the issue lays with the problems with squad commands and how they work... "defending" should be killing hostile players within a 0-50m radius of the cap point "attacking" simple enough.. bonus points for killing players with in 0-50m of the target these points im not sure if they would work when placed on a player.. maybe 1/2 the distance for the bonus points for "defending" a player (be with in 25m of the defendee.. ie a heavy defending a logi or vice versa. how ever they just need to run with injector for +60 or hives with ammo/rep on them (if ccp buffed/tweeked points for resupply) and then the major perpetrator is vehicle and installation kill assists.. vehicle kill = 150 + 50(driver) yet we only get 25 poitns for assisting.. this needs buffing to account for the vehicle too.. as atm its just +25 for the players killed in the vehicle and nothing for the vehicle its self. ps. RE = easy DOUBLEKILL on sent with logi in tow [[LogiBro in Training]] Level 2 Forum Pariah
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1936	Posted - 2014.10.08 08:15:00 - [33] - Quote What about suppression fire? Or spotting enemies? I feel like both of these activities should be rewarded with WP as well. Now with more evil.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7832	Posted - 2014.10.08 08:26:00 - [34] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: What about suppression fire? Or spotting enemies? I feel like both of these activities should be rewarded with WP as well. Anything to help. Especially spotting enemies. Suppreession fire might be a bit too hard for them to do but I would welcome anything to bring in more WP for actually doing something with a handheld weapon See you space cowboy...
bane sieg GalacticGuardians 514 3	Posted - 2014.10.08 13:10:00 - [35] - Quote As a logi myself, I would like to see revive points changed. Want to run with a 30 percent needle? 30 wp. 50 percent needle, maybe 45 wp, you want the full 60 points, stop troll reviving with a basic needle. Points for a repair tool are based on how much healing is given, so why shouldn't it be the same with needles? This would give the slayers a better shot at that top spot on the leader board. Problem solved.
Gyn Wallace OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 133	Posted - 2014.10.08 14:13:00 - [36] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Now I understand that I'm just doing one job whilst the Logistics is doing everything but I feel that there's a problem when I go 25+ with less than 3 deaths and I'm down in 6th or 7th place and was barely paid anything. ... So I'll ask you guys if you think slaying is a viable WP role in itself and can something be done to encourage ripping apart enemies in rapid manner? As a dedicated logi, I agree. Elswhere I've proposed reducing the WP for each repair tool tic, from +25 to +22, and increasing the WP for scanned enemy kills from +15 to +20. Its a small change, but in the right direction. Currently, I can top the WP board a little too easily. I don't need to have a spectacular game to get the most WP on my team. If I follow around the best slayer in the match, just repping him, he should get top WP score, and maybe I should be somewhere in the top half or top third. To beat the top slayer's WP score I should have to do a great job of balancing all my logi support roles, dropping uplinks and hives in good spots, repping, reviving, and even the occasional kill. It shouldn't be so easy to get WP that it discourages the people I'm supporting. I hope any change to fix this is a small iterative step in the right direction though; I hope it doesn't become pretty much impossible for a logi to top the WP list.
Soraya Xel Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 4072	Posted - 2014.10.08 14:28:00 - [37] - Quote I would like to see bonuses for killing defenders around enemy points, and I'd like to see bonuses for killing people hacking your point. Keeps the play objective-focused. CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game RUST415 1328	Posted - 2014.10.08 14:51:00 - [38] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: TheD1CK wrote: I would disagree with Killstreak WP, it encourages the proto farming we see all the time .... Do we really need to encourage that? So spending 2.7 mil on a proto suit and using it is wrong? I have 5 proto suits but rarely use them, however I do think that anyone can use what they're specced in to. That's what you're saving sp for, to spec into suits, weapons and modules to use them. As for proto farming you can't stop that and frankly I don't think it's a big problem. it's not so much about using the gear, as what the gear could do if we had Killstreak WP. It would reward a Proto merc for slayin through a team of MLT suits more than anything else So I would be against Killstreak WP, that and it smells distinctly like fish (COD) - WP for kills attacking objectives - WP for kills defending objectives - Savior WP - Killing a red after he takes 50% of a friendlies HP..?? - Equipment WP - balance between Spawn/Supply/Scans/Reps -Rep/Spawn too much WP, supply gives too low This would boost WP for all roles, while the HMG heavy or Assault should benefit more Anything else is not 100% needed imo but rewards for the above are overdue. INJECTORS!! It is about time I and many others recieved a bonus for running PRO INJECTOR We help more but make less WP than a Logi using dirty needle and reps .... Why!!!???!!?? I would like to see something like that in Echo; Bsc - 40wp; Adv - 50wp; Pro - 60wp Innapropriate Irrelevence... Welcome to the Dust Forum, hang around to see why everyone else left :/
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4148	Posted - 2014.10.08 15:40:00 - [39] - Quote FYI: Sadly the tiered WP for injectors is beyond current New Eden technology. Rattati actually tried to do it but ran into the usual unspecified "technical limitations." (The godfather of tactical logistics)
Cavani1EE7 Murphys-Law 311	Posted - 2014.10.08 16:36:00 - [40] - Quote CUSE TOWN333 wrote: each kill attacking around a red letter should give bonus WP and each kill defending a blue letter should give bonus WP. Kinda like MAG, would love to see this Take a bow

TheD1CK Dead Man's Game RUST415 1329	Posted - 2014.10.08 16:40:00 - [41] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: FYI: Sadly the tiered WP for injectors is beyond current New Eden technology. Rattati actually tried to do it but ran into the usual unspecified "technical limitations." really?? well thats awesome Puts away Wk Injector, samples Dirty needle Well that felt great, time to go share the fun and be rewarded for enemies slaying my 15%hp victims Innapropriate Irrelevence... Welcome to the Dust Forum, hang around to see why everyone else left :/
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4149	Posted - 2014.10.08 16:46:00 - [42] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: FYI: Sadly the tiered WP for injectors is beyond current New Eden technology. Rattati actually tried to do it but ran into the usual unspecified "technical limitations." really?? well thats awesome Puts away Wk Injector, samples Dirty needle Well that felt great, time to go share the fun and be rewarded for enemies slaying my 15%hp victims Well, he did make them restore shield HP instead. That's not a bad consolation prize. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
Ku Shala The Generals 966	Posted - 2014.10.08 17:02:00 - [43] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: I like the idea of a Kill Streak bonus but what about a rapid kill bonus? Like the more kills you get in a short amount of time = more points per kill? so you want to reward blueberries for following you around shooting at the last second to get kills? the problem with the current system is different roles score the same points for doing the same job. If logis only scored 25wp for a kill then you wouldnt have slayer logis ( just an example don't hate) Scout- bonus wp for hacking and remote explosive kills Assault-bonus wp for kills with light and sidearm weapons Logistics- bonus wp for equipment- reduced wp for kills with light and sidearm weapons commando- bonus wp for damage to vehicles/destruction, bonus wp for light weapon kills Heavy- bonus wp for heavy weapon kills, bonus wp for vehicle destruction, reduced wp for light weapon kills *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (Caldari Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist *Assault -Logistics-Sentinal-Scout-Commando Allround CK-0
The Master Race Immortal Guides 94	Posted - 2014.10.08 17:36:00 - [44] - Quote They should reduce kill damage to 25 wp and ad a multiplier to wins. Edit: or make it 0 New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Kaeru Nayiri Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 80	Posted - 2014.10.08 21:12:00 - [45] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: Risk vs Reward should definitely be the main factor here. But not the only one. Logis may not run a very risky playstyle, but they should continue to be heftily rewarded for their efforts. Because honestly, without the extra money/WP they get, the role would pretty much die off, and the loss of logis would heavily reverberate throughout the game. I am not sure about logis not running risk. I always always always aim for them first. The yellow color makes it painfully obvious (for them).
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 749	Posted - 2014.10.08 21:18:00 - [46] - Quote Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7837	Posted - 2014.10.08 21:35:00 - [47] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. See you space cowboy...
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3177	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:31:00 - [48] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: TheD1CK wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: FYI: Sadly the tiered WP for injectors is beyond current New Eden technology. Rattati actually tried to do it but ran into the usual unspecified "technical limitations." really?? well thats awesome Puts away Wk Injector, samples Dirty needle Well that felt great, time to go share the fun and be rewarded for enemies slaying my 15%hp victims Well, he did make them restore shield HP instead. That's not a bad consolation prize. Yep, so the weakest are 30% and 30% now. Still weak but much better than they were. I still really want the HP healed = WP earned ratio in game for Injectors and Rep Tools. But that won't happen without a client patch and we've all heard the story on where those stand currently. So we work with what we have. 0.02 ISK Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 754	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:36:00 - [49] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
hfderrtgvcd 702	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:38:00 - [50] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. I think the term you're looking for is defending You can't fight in here! This is the war room.

Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7839	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:44:00 - [51] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. I think the term you're looking for is defending Yeah....that sounds exactly like you're defending a point, god forbid you get points for doing that. See you space cowboy...
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3177	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:44:00 - [52] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. I think the term you're looking for is defending Only if it is a friendly objective, if it is a hostile objective which is now secured by friendly forces then that's camping. EDIT: So to avoid camping having the points only apply to the team who currently controls the objective (i.e it is currently their color) would be a good modification to the idea. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 2180	Posted - 2014.10.09 00:47:00 - [53] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: hfderrtgvcd wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. WP for killing Hackers and People near an Objective is a good start. There are definitely ways to encourage Objective based killing. Everything's not white and black. But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. I think the term you're looking for is defending Yeah....that sounds exactly like you're defending a point, god forbid you get points for doing that. I'd like to point out the obvious. You already do. The Universe is hostile, so impersonal Devour to survive So it is, so it's always been....
Atiim 12837	Posted - 2014.10.09 01:37:00 - [54] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Everyone and their mother is a slayer. I don't see why it's necessary to incentivise slaying more. Because primary slayers shouldn't have to get 50 kills just to have a payout that isn't crap? Pseudogenesis wrote: In fact, I would argue that an increase to slayer WP rewards would encourage less objective play, since you get much more from just fighting anyway. Playing objectively includes getting kills, and if you refuse to hack objectives than you'll lose every match provided that your enemies aren't dumb enough to spawn in the exact same spot 100-450 times. Alaika Arbosa wrote: I'd like to point out the obvious. You already do. You get points for getting Kills and Kill Assists, not for defending the point. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Atiim 12837	Posted - 2014.10.09 01:40:00 - [55] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. This strategy only works if the team you're facing isn't smart enough to check their surroundings before hacking. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7840	Posted - 2014.10.09 02:17:00 - [56] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: I'd like to point out the obvious. You already do. Well, you may want to point out the obvious but you obviously have failed. Looks around for a defender bonus Nope don't see any over here, nor over there. Headshot bonus, Kills, and Kill assists are it, there is no other bonus besides modifiers for squad orders. Unless you're talking about simply getting the WPs already in the game for killing and assisting (which this thread is talking about making more of) we are missing you point. See you space cowboy...
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7842	Posted - 2014.10.09 02:18:00 - [57] - Quote Atiim wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: But that encourages both objective camping and luring enemies into objectives, as opposed to just never letting them get near the objectives in the first place. This strategy only works if the team you're facing isn't smart enough to check their surroundings before hacking. And New Eden is a place where the stupid get punished. See you space cowboy...
Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 763	Posted - 2014.10.09 09:13:00 - [58] - Quote Also have to take into consideration Logis are stuck with the worst suit in the game, needs the one of the highest SP investments to fully optimize, and is the most expensive suit on the field. So yeah they need to be making that $$$. Vehicle users invest alot SP and are very expensive too. It doesn't take much SP or cost much to be an Assault.
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 134	Posted - 2014.10.09 13:45:00 - [59] - Quote I would simply lower kills and assists WP by 10 and add 20 to kills and assists around objectives wether your defending or attacking. This would motivate people to actually fight over the objective. Would also like to see players rewarded slightly for deaths while defending or attacking an objective. Some thing like 10 WP but I think that would require a client side update. It would however help get some of the new players to push the objective with the more skilled players and may help the problem with half your team turning sniper. The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 134	Posted - 2014.10.09 13:47:00 - [60] - Quote Justin Tymes wrote: Also have to take into consideration Logis are stuck with the worst suit in the game, needs the one of the highest SP investments to fully optimize, and is the most expensive suit on the field. So yeah they need to be making that $$$. Vehicle users invest alot SP and are very expensive too. It doesn't take much SP or cost much to be an Assault. I lost a lot of isk running assault due to the high mortality rate. When you are constantly pushing the line while the support roles are watching, and supporting like they should, you tend to die a lot, or at least I do. The Best Worst game you can't stop playing..... DUST



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